D.O.C.

Sun on Lost

Tonight’s episode looks to focus on Sun and what effects the island may have on her pregnancy; based on what has already happened to Claire and with Juliet in the picture, things should get interesting in this week’s Lost episode “D.O.C.”

Also, we will find out more about the mysterious parachutist, what her connection to Desmond is, and what her role will be.

Caution, spoilers!

The April 20th podcast told us that we will find out who the real father of Sun’s baby is, and it was revealed that D.O.C. is the acronym for Date of Conception. The last few episodes have spent considerable time making us aware that pregnancy on the island is fatal, with the lone exception being Claire.

Here’s the official description from abc.com for the new Lost episode “D.O.C.”

“D.O.C” – After discovering that all of “The Others'” pregnant women died before giving birth on the island, an extremely reticent Sun allows Juliet to examine her — and uncovers the identity of the unborn child’s father. Meanwhile, Desmond allows an unlikely nemesis to help save the life of a new, mysterious island inhabitant. “Lost” Wednesday, April 25 at 10/9c on the ABC television network.

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340 Responses to D.O.C.

  1. Will says:

    Going into tonight’s show there are really 3 possibilities as it relates to who the father actually is:

    *Jin
    *Jae Lee
    *Total Surprise

    The date of conception matters for a couple of reasons. If the DOC is prior to the crash, then the father is probably Jae Lee because we know that Jin was infertile.

    However, if the DOC took place on the Island, after the crash, then the father could be Jin. This is definitely a possibility given the Island’s propensity to miraculously cure (Locke, Rose, etc.).

    If it’s the third (total surprise), then your guess is as good as mine!

  2. Hammer says:

    Maybe Michael. They bonded early on, but didn’t show an actual affair.

  3. Tasha says:

    The total surprise is…..Sun had been kidnapped and impregnated by the Others after she had drank some Dharma Orange Juice.

  4. JohnCML says:

    And of course, the concequences as they relate to the Date of Conception. If Jin, (who we hopeless romantics want to be the father), then will Sun have the same problems with pregnancy as The Others? If the D.O.C. is pre-island (making it an illegitimate child from an affair), Sun may survive and give birth, but not to Jin’s child.

    Love this show…

  5. Tina says:

    I vote total surprise: implantation of Benry’s sperm creating a superother baby.

  6. Joi says:

    I think it’ll be Jin’s baby, but I’d shoot straight through the roof if it were Michael’s. I’d kill for a “back story” revealing a little hanky panky, castaway style.

  7. Hammer says:

    I’m going with Jin on this one. It supports the island’s mysterious healing powers, gives a reason to rethink red herrings (why tell us about Jae?, etc.), and sets up the Others’ need for researching an outsider that got preggers on the island, and may even give a way to eliminate Sun’s character (what would a drama be without death?).

    If it’s Jae’s, it doesn’t help the story line because we already know that a baby conceived off the island will not kill the mom (Claire).

    If it’s a suprise, all we get is soap opera-ish crap.

  8. MasterPo says:

    I go with Jin too.

    I think Claire and her baby survived because she was soooo far along in the pregnancy when she came to the island. Same with Alex (the french woman’s daughter – she said she was born shortly after they came to the island).

    The real question is: What exactly is it that happens to the fetus as to be fatal to it AND the mother? Something causing it to die in utero, a spontaneous abortion or a still birth is one thing. But something that kills child and mother very early in pregnancy is something very strange.

    I have a suspicion what it might be. A throw back to an old (and freaky) sci-fi movie. But I’m not going to say at this time. Hope I’m wrong.

  9. Other 218 says:

    I am going with *Total Surprise. We saw that Dr. Ethan Rom was doing ‘unauthorized’ work when he was pumping Claire full of experimental drugs. He may have made his way into Sun’s business too. After Ethan, my second choice is Kelvin. Seems like him getting busy with Juliet was a bit of an Easter Egg moment from the writers. No third choice – Ben seems to be running a (creepy) stud farm, but is probably not up to doing the deed himself.

  10. Nick says:

    [quote comment="53047"]I’m going with Jin on this one. It supports the island’s mysterious healing powers, gives a reason to rethink red herrings (why tell us about Jae?, etc.), and sets up the Others’ need for researching an outsider that got preggers on the island, and may even give a way to eliminate Sun’s character (what would a drama be without death?).

    If it’s Jae’s, it doesn’t help the story line because we already know that a baby conceived off the island will not kill the mom (Claire).

    If it’s a suprise, all we get is soap opera-ish crap.[/quote]

    I’m with Hammer, I also think that it’s Jin’s baby. Having said that, our new favorite traitor, Juliet, has to be the one to save her right? Or at least attempt to.

  11. LostDamery says:

    Well after digging in my pockets, all I have is 2 cents. So here it goes:
    1) Sun is pregnant by the island! (You can gasp, it is a shocker).
    2) What actually happens is Jin and Sun have “relations” before flying and the once dead sperm come alive after the crash and find the egg but they bring death as much as life. That is why Claire never really needed help she already had the baby formed. The island regenerated sperm is a micro monster on a smaller scale and it ties to the People beneath the island. (read earlier ramblings)

  12. Mabry says:

    Interesting that they would choose DOC – my first thought was DOA (dead on arrival) so I figured the acronym was for dead on conception. I am thinking that we will find out Sun cheated on Jin just because I just can’t see them killing Sun off. I think Baldy is the dad – whatever the guy’s name was, the hotel heir. :)

  13. carebare2115 says:

    other218, Juliet wasn’t getting busy with Kelvin (the button pusher before Des), but with Goodwin (the one Ana Lucia killed) and Goodwin wouldn’t have had the opportunity to meet Sun, what with all his spying on the tailies.
    i’m torn on who i think it is… although, from the first season i thought, “is there a little sumpin sumpin going on with Sun and Michael?”… i think it could get a litte soapy if it turns out to be that Jae guy… but Jin would be too lame (aside from the Sun might die outcome of that)… i don’t know!

  14. MasterPo says:

    Two points:

    1) We only have Juliet’s word on it that Ethan was doing unauthorized experiments. She lies just like the rest and can’t be trusted.

    2) Re: People underground – As rambling as that was (no offense) there may be a kernal of fact to it. Everytime we’ve seen the smoke monster appear when it’s chasing someone it seems to “burst” out of the ground. Also, last season when coming back from the Black Rock, locke was trapped or snared by something (a rope? a cable? a vine? a tentacle??) that was pulling him underground with a very mechanical sound. It only let go when Jack dropped a stick of dynamite into the whole (which Locke didn’t want him to do but he did anyway).

  15. Hammer says:

    Master – Not that Ben is that credible either, but he did mention that the drugs Juliet needed to complete the manipulation would be at “Ethan’s old drop point”. Which eludes to where Ethan was getting his drugs from.

  16. MasterPo says:

    Hammer – He also said Claire’s illness was mechanically induced by something they put into her (proving Ben and the other Others knew of Ethan’s work, that it wasn’t unknown or unauthorized!).

    I took what Ben said to mean that the drugs would be chemicals that would turn off whatever the device inside her was. Or be a counter agent for whatever the device released into her. Or the drugs could just be inhert placebos and the real thing is the long needle needed to reach into Claire and physically switch off the device.

  17. Other 218 says:

    [quote comment="53064"]other218, Juliet wasn’t getting busy with Kelvin, but with Goodwin[/quote]
    Yes, totally my bad, saw his face in my mind, and dropped the wrong label on it. I don’t do soap operas and do poorly at name-games (insane in the membrain/membrane). Delete Kelvin – replace Goodwin in my blathering.

  18. Hammer says:

    Master – Not that Ben is that credible either, but he did mention that the drugs Juliet needed to complete the manipulation would be at “Ethan’s old drop point”. Which eludes to where Ethan was getting his drugs from.[quote comment="53070"]Hammer – He also said Claire’s illness was mechanically induced by something they put into her (proving Ben and the other Others knew of Ethan’s work, that it wasn’t unknown or unauthorized!).

    I took what Ben said to mean that the drugs would be chemicals that would turn off whatever the device inside her was. Or be a counter agent for whatever the device released into her. Or the drugs could just be inhert placebos and the real thing is the long needle needed to reach into Claire and physically switch off the device.[/quote]
    Ahh, I see what you’re saying.

  19. Bizzy says:

    First, I take credit for comparing the evolution of the third season into a soap opera, viz the softer Sawyer, the aloof Jack, the inactive Sayid, and the coward Desmond who willing accepts this characterization from his fiance and brother superior (see the Catch-22 thread), accompanied by the emergence of the strong plot leaders: Kate, Juliet.

    Second, Will, your assertion that the xy contributor could be Jin, Jae Lee, or any other thing else is conveniently patently noncomittal. Your 3 possibilities are *all* possibilites.

    Third, Sun was not kidnapped by the Others–that was Charlie.

    Fourth, according to my understanding of why conception on the island produces a fatal result for both mother and fetus, is that somehow the the placental barrier is breeched and the mother’s immune system is activated against the fetus which is recognized as foreign tissue, precipitating a strong auto-immune reaction by the mother, thereby affecting both. This is something like how strep throat can cause rheumatic fever leading to heart failure. During the One of Us episode Juliet mistakenly says that her treatment would prevent Claire’s immune system from shutting down. Jack should have picked up on the fact that the correct treatment would have been an immunosuppressive as is used in allo-transplant patients.

  20. carebare2115 says:

    that is totally brilliant you guys! you’re right, how would they know about all the stuff ethan was doing if he was improvising and doing something that wasn’t approved… i mean, other others (hehe) were helping him, including alex (well, in her case, “helping”). someone must have said it was okay for him to kidnap claire and do all that stuff, i mean, i doubt all those people would go against this Jacob character; he doesn’t seem like one they want to cross.

    other218: i thought you probably just got the names mixed up since they don’t look alike and since kelvin wasn’t an other (that we know of), in addition to kelvin being dead by the time the losties crashed…. anyway, it would be interesting if Sun’s baby turned out to be someone crazy like an other. or if Juliet was pregnant (i mean, knowing all the risks, she sure did take a huge chance foolin around whilst on the island. although, i guess when you gots the urge…)

  21. MasterPo says:

    Bizzy:

    As for what Juliet said, NOTHING she says from now on can be trusted. This is obviously a whole big deception and manipulation. Why is the question. But I wouldn’t tust what Juliet says about immunological responses to the pregnancy. That can also happen in real life (don’t know the medical term for it) and they put the mother on immuno suppressents for as long as possible before enducing labor. So unless the immuno response is sooooooo much more amplified on the island, that explanation doesn’t make sense. Further, even if true, yes the fetus dies but why the mother too? The scene we saw was of a woman dying on the operating table. Not the kind of thing an infectcious response would cause, unless they had to surgically remove the fetus and maybe uterus too and she died during the procedure. That can happen during any operationt too.

  22. Hammer says:

    I’ll bite.

    First, thanks for violating the no spoiler rule.

    Second, what’s wrong with offering possibilities?

    Third, Tasha was saying that Sun being kidnapped would be a revelation, not something we saw.

    Fourth, since Jack now knows the others are doing crazy experiments, maybe give him a break on not knowing what she claims would be possible?

  23. Nick says:

    To comment on the unauthorized part of Ethan’s “experiment” or whatever you want to call it. If you were to believe Juliet in this one instance, she said the kidnapping was the only “unauthorized” part.

    MasterPo is on it.
    [quote comment="53070"]
    Hammer – He also said Claire’s illness was mechanically induced by something they put into her (proving Ben and the other Others knew of Ethan’s work, that it wasn’t unknown or unauthorized!).
    I took what Ben said to mean that the drugs would be chemicals that would turn off whatever the device inside her was. Or be a counter agent for whatever the device released into her. Or the drugs could just be inhert placebos and the real thing is the long needle needed to reach into Claire and physically switch off the device.
    [/quote]

  24. Will says:

    Bizzy – I appreciate your commentary and think you add a lot to the discussions that take place within this blog, but please refrain from using spoilers, it is unnecessary.

    My opinion is that the baby is Jin’s, for many of the same reasons that have already been posted. It furthers along the plot of the Island’s healing power, it provides for speculation as to whether or not Sun can survive the pregnancy, and will provide for the ability of Juliet engraining herself moreso with the Losties.

    And it accomplishes this without the “jump the shark” factor that could arise from the father being a “surprise” third party.

    My next thought would be, given that the seasons basically cover 4-6 weeks, it probably makes sense that this pregnancy will ultimately mean the demise of Sun, and that the actual birth of the baby is irrelevant to the series.

    Unless the Island’s powers that be can speed up the course of a given pregnancy, which would make for a good story arc as well.

  25. Mabry says:

    Again and again I have seen people use the term “jump the shark” when talking about this season of LOST here on this blog. I am not familiar at all with this expression – could someone please explain what that means?

    Thanks :)
    Mabry

  26. Will says:

    [quote comment="53106"]Again and again I have seen people use the term “jump the shark” when talking about this season of LOST here on this blog. I am not familiar at all with this expression – could someone please explain what that means?

    Thanks :)
    Mabry[/quote]
    Mabry, I would try, but I could not explain better than this :)

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jump_the_shark

  27. Lesley says:

    Although I like the idea that the island was involved in Sun’s pregancy (I think that Jacob is the island) it makes more sense if Jin is the father for all the reasons everyone has listed above. How unfortunate for Sun, unless there is a reason the Hostile women had problems that does not involve the island but what the Hostiles are participating in/practicing on the isalnd. I also agree with the theories that neither Ben nor Juliet speak any truths unless it furthers their selfish cause so who knows what is true and what isn’t if if originated from either one of them.

  28. Other 218 says:

    alternate JTS (jump the shark) references include;

    “Juliet The Subversive”,
    “Jack The Surgeon”,
    “Jin The Sterile”,
    “James The Sawyer”,
    “Jacob The Savior”,
    “John (Locke) The Sage”…

    hey – just funnin’ – its’ game day – date night!

  29. poopypants says:

    [quote comment="52996"]Maybe Michael. They bonded early on, but didn’t show an actual affair.[/quote]

    Wasn’t Michael a teacher,hmmm can’t remember.I agree the father of Suns baby is Jae,why else show them in bed together but if it turns out the English teacher is the father and it turns out the teacher is someone we have seen before(like michael)that would be another twist in the show to chew on for awhile,thoughts?It might also explain why Sun says in the promo that she loses either way.If the baby dies she loses and if its Michaels and it survives birth then she loses Jin,thoughts?

  30. MonkeyBoy says:

    It seems obvious to me that the black smoke is the father. That’s why it killed Eko, it was jealous because he carried around the photo of Sun at the top of this post…*meeeeooooowww*

  31. lost chicka says:

    - i think Sun’s preggers with jae lee’s baby otherwise there’s no point in telling us that she had an affair with jae.

    – if she’s preggers with Jin’s baby i say she won’t die because she’s a good person and the others all die because they’re evil and the island won’t let their children or them live.

    – michael is NOT the father. girls can be friends with guys & not get caught up in the moment, alright! michael was her friend, not her lover! they would’ve shown it to add more drama.

    – Zeke or whatever his name is was in Claire’s flashbacks to. Another way you can tell that taking Claire was authorized: a room FULL of doctors was in the back when Alex took her

    – i hope the big twist at the end is that Julliete is preggers.

    – talking about being preggers & babies, how old is aaron now? 2 months?

  32. Will says:

    [quote comment="53146"]-

    – talking about being preggers & babies, how old is aaron now? 2 months?[/quote]
    I believe Aaron is right around 6 weeks old at this point.

  33. Austin says:

    umm, will. can you please just delete any posts that have spoilers in them. i have this strange feeling that for some stupid reason people are forgetting.

    for those who enjoy reading spoilers, i understand. lost is soo friggin complex and it is extremely enticing to want to know what will happen next. But please don’t tell us here. The persons who usually has the hottest and best theory are usually the persons who can REMEMBER what has happened all throughout the show the most and can analyze it meticulously. just getting one fact from the next show can do a little for your theory, but if it doesn’t work out without that tid-bit then you have not done your homework. This is the place to discuss theories based on observations, not what you read on other, lower grade blogs.

  34. Lesley says:

    Ann – TPTB debunked the purgatory theory a long time ago. In addition, here is a no spoiler policy on this sight. I do not want to know what happens next until an episode airs.

  35. lost chicka says:

    [quote comment="53152"]umm, will. can you please just delete any posts that have spoilers in them. i have this strange feeling that for some stupid reason people are forgetting.

    for those who enjoy reading spoilers, i understand. lost is soo friggin complex and it is extremely enticing to want to know what will happen next. But please don’t tell us here. The persons who usually has the hottest and best theory are usually the persons who can REMEMBER what has happened all throughout the show the most and can analyze it meticulously. just getting one fact from the next show can do a little for your theory, but if it doesn’t work out without that tid-bit then you have not done your homework. This is the place to discuss theories based on observations, not what you read on other, lower grade blogs.[/quote]

    please do! go to another site to read & talk about spoilers, just don’t bring ‘em up here!

  36. MongoBongo says:

    If someone has already seen the show, is it a spoiler if they start to talk about the show (here) after they have seen? In the US we see the airing on Wed. But East Coast sees it 3 hrs ahead of West Coast. So do we wait (no). We all see it ahead of Alaska/Hawaii. Many of our neighbors and euro friends don’t see it until Friday, do we wait? (no). If you are so intimidated about heresay news, don’t surf into this blog. On the other hand, if you are dropping rumor/theory in here, and you have not seen the episode, that is your foul. BTW, a chest-tube in para-chick does not spoil anything. Saying who is the father of Suns’ baby does. Telling us what para-chick knows about 815 – if you really saw it, feel free to talk about, if it is rumored, save it until the show airs.

  37. Will says:

    To all – I have removed what may be construed as spoiler-like information from the comments so far related to this post; however, I would agree with Mongo Bongo’s assertation that time differences will cause discrepancies in postings, so some of this will be unavoidable.

  38. lost chicka says:

    great episode!!! last line is a real jaw dropper! lots of thoughts! lots of questions!

    – naomi is either with the Others and this is one elaborate hoax with her & told her to say that (people on flight 815 are dead) OR the Others set up a fake 815 plane so people quit looking for em & that’s the one they (dead people) were on.

    – how damn stupid can des be? keep patchy, send hurley or somebody to go get Sayid, let him do what he wants, and then take naomi back to the beach.

    – the lung’ll heel in a day(1/2)? that explains how these people can get shot, stabbed, tortured, knocked out, etc. and be perfectly fine the next day ;). but what causes it? boone, libby, & fbi guy died pretty slowly so y will she heel fast? cause she’s an other? cause jack tried to step in on their heeling process which means he doesn’t have faith in the island so it took longer?

    – so she is there to find out about everybody’s fertility! evil little good for nothin other! i HATE her!!!!!

    – about julliette’s “i hate you” comment. her & ben definitely had a relationship, 1 night stand at the least. or she’s just pissed that she hasn’t seen her sister in 3 years.

    – so where is naomi from? she spoke every known language in this episode!

    – is patchy the indestructible other? y didn’t they just shoot him or go get sayid!

    – so jin’s mama was a hooker. is the guy in the asian dharma video jin’s daddy?

    – y the heck is Charlie & Jin the only one with brains?

    – they took the mothers to that room to DIE???

  39. Tasha says:

    Okay lost chika…

    I think that it was all staged. I have had those thoughts before. I don’t know! How can they all be dead??????

    I think Julliete hates ben because she really is a good person trapped in a bad situation.

  40. Tasha says:

    Also, I guess it is TOTALLY possible now for Kate to be preggers. It was all a set up!

    Did you here what Patchy said about the wound? He said wounds are different here. Is that going back to the time thing? By a half a day maybe since he said instead of a day a day and a half?

    Men are 5 times more fertile on the island….so what about Goodwin?

  41. Jono says:

    Last 10 seconds: Wow.

    That is all I can say.

  42. Jake says:

    I’m leaning toward purgatory. I know that the producers said they weren’t. But, faith and religion are recurring themes. We are constantly being pounded with Locke’s faith mantra. Recently, many new characters with biblical names are being introduced.

    Some other thoughts…

    Possibly only the others heal quickly.

    Why was Mikhail not afraid to die? He showed no fear of death on three seperate occations.

  43. Toeknee says:

    Whoah! I’m gonna have to watch that again.

    A couple of “Holy S—!” moments – one, when Mikhail appears, two “They were all dead”.

    Not sure what to make of Mikhail being alive. Was he faking when he went through the sonic fence a few weeks ago? If so, that’s some elaborate deception. Or is this one of the island’s powers – helping people recover quickly from injuries inflicted by the fence? Maybe this means Ms. Klugh is still alive too.

    Also, my apologies to all those whom I doubted when they said they thought Mikhail was still alive. You were right, I was wrong.

    (But I’m still not buying into the “Danielle is an Other” theory…..yet)

  44. meathead says:

    I love this show. BUT, for every answer I get, I also have 10 more questions.

    C’mon writers/producers. We need more answers.

  45. Toeknee says:

    [quote comment="53178"]Men are 5 times more fertile on the island….so what about Goodwin?[/quote]
    I bet Juliet insisted on using protection of some sort, knowing the fate of women who conceive on the island.

  46. Tasha says:

    Well Goodwin was an other and he died. After he was dead for awhile, Ecko and Jin saw him dead. That would also make Ethan still be alive. I don’t think it’s just the Others. There are reasons people are healed. Locke can walk, Rose was cured. I don’t think you have to be an Other.

  47. lost chicka says:

    i was wrong about patchy! i was so sure that he was dead but he’s still alive! like i said he’s the indestructable other! him being alive makes me wonder if the fence was even real. i mean, it could just be to scare other people off.

  48. Bizzy says:

    The only worthwhile part of this episode occurred in the last 20 seconds. The rest was filler.

    On a scale of 1 to 10, I’d give it a 2.

  49. Jake says:

    [quote comment="53187"]Well Goodwin was an other and he died. After he was dead for awhile, Ecko and Jin saw him dead. That would also make Ethan still be alive. I don’t think it’s just the Others. There are reasons people are healed. Locke can walk, Rose was cured. I don’t think you have to be an Other.[/quote]

    Do you think it has something to do with faith?

  50. Toeknee says:

    I don’t think the parachutist (notice they still didn’t reveal her name on the show) is a plant by the Others. As with Ben last season, it seems like a very risky way to get someone to infiltrate the Losties. She could very well have died while hanging in the tree if noone came along soon enough, or if Mikhail hadn’t come along. (or maybe that was part of the deception? Hmmmmm)

    Besides, why would they need her to infiltrate the Losties – they already have Juliet in there.

  51. A Kelly says:

    [quote comment="53057"]I am going with *Total Surprise. We saw that Dr. Ethan Rom was doing ‘unauthorized’ work when he was pumping Claire full of experimental drugs. He may have made his way into Sun’s business too. After Ethan, my second choice is Kelvin. Seems like him getting busy with Juliet was a bit of an Easter Egg moment from the writers. No third choice – Ben seems to be running a (creepy) stud farm, but is probably not up to doing the deed himself.[/quote]

    Perhaps Juliet is pregnant too and that is why she is so desperate to leave the island.

  52. lost chicka says:

    [quote comment="53194"]I don’t think the parachutist (notice they still didn’t reveal her name on the show) is a plant by the Others. As with Ben last season, it seems like a very risky way to get someone to infiltrate the Losties. She could very well have died while hanging in the tree if noone came along soon enough, or if Mikhail hadn’t come along. (or maybe that was part of the deception? Hmmmmm)

    Besides, why would they need her to infiltrate the Losties – they already have Juliet in there.[/quote]

    julliette REALLY hates Ben. she said it into the recorder, she asked Jack to kill him. they might not trust her & are sending back up just incase she tries to screws it up for em.

  53. Toeknee says:

    I think Juliet must have told Jack at least a little about the problem pregnant women have on the island. Thus, his concern about Sun. But I don’t think he’s completely in on Juliet’s plan (get samples from women, leave in a week), as others here have speculated.

  54. Tasha says:

    [quote comment="53192"][quote comment="53187"]Well Goodwin was an other and he died. After he was dead for awhile, Ecko and Jin saw him dead. That would also make Ethan still be alive. I don’t think it’s just the Others. There are reasons people are healed. Locke can walk, Rose was cured. I don’t think you have to be an Other.[/quote]

    Do you think it has something to do with faith?[/quote]

    It’s totally possible. I just don’t think you have to be an Other to heal. I would believe it if next week Goodwin and Ethan came running out of the woods. Julliette did look at the grave strange in the episode where Hurley told her where he was buried.

    I am so confused right now. I am totally LOST!

  55. lost chicka says:

    oh and to add on to my last comment, nobody thought ethan, benry, or julliette was untill it was to late.

  56. Big A says:

    Very interesting episode. I think that the plane crash being found is a set-up by the Others. Either they planted another plane to be found or they are making it up. The Italian/Spanish/Whatever woman is up to something in my opinion. If anyone caught it she before they let Mikhail go she said something along the lines of “Are we ready” in Spanish (Era listamos) if I understood her correctly. Mikhail said she said “thank you” but that is not correct at all. If that is the case she was asking Mikhail if the Others were ready for some sort of strike and her story about the plane crash is meant as a psychological warfare tactic or to throw off anyone searching for them.

  57. Tasha says:

    How come she choose to speak in English to Hurley?? Is that the translation Big A? I really would like to know if someone knows what she said. Patchy kinda looked like he was lying when he said she said “Thank You.”

  58. cazzie says:

    now they could be dead???? dont like it!!!! now that theory will just make for a huge filler, going back and forth not knowing whats going on. Like the episode but just added more HUGE questions and not many answers……why lost why?

  59. Toeknee says:

    [quote comment="53198"]
    julliette REALLY hates Ben. she said it into the recorder, she asked Jack to kill him. they might not trust her & are sending back up just incase she tries to screws it up for em.[/quote]
    [quote comment="53201"]oh and to add on to my last comment, nobody thought ethan, benry, or julliette was untill it was to late.[/quote]
    These are all good points. It’s certainly possible she’s working with the Others. But, it just seems like too much of a stretch that they would choose this method for her to be taken into the Losties camp. They easily could have left this person behind with Juliet if they wanted someone to “keep an eye on” Juliet.

  60. A Kelly says:

    [quote comment="53204"]now they could be dead???? dont like it!!!! now that theory will just make for a huge filler, going back and forth not knowing whats going on. Like the episode but just added more HUGE questions and not many answers……why lost why?[/quote]

    certainly they are not dead… that would be to cheap. I agree that the Other’s must of made some sort of cover up so they could study their newly arrived lab rats withouth worry of peopole coming to look for them.

  61. Big A says:

    I definitely know she didn’t say thank you. That would have been “Gracias”, and she clearly didn’t say that. She probably spoke Italian/Spanish (almost the same phonetically) to Mikhail in order to not be understood by Des and the gang. I have no idea why she spoke English to Hurley. That is a very good question. Probably a minor detail, but that always ends up being the key to a mystery.

  62. Toeknee says:

    [quote comment="53202"]Very interesting episode. I think that the plane crash being found is a set-up by the Others. Either they planted another plane to be found or they are making it up. The Italian/Spanish/Whatever woman is up to something in my opinion. If anyone caught it she before they let Mikhail go she said something along the lines of “Are we ready” in Spanish (Era listamos) if I understood her correctly. Mikhail said she said “thank you” but that is not correct at all. If that is the case she was asking Mikhail if the Others were ready for some sort of strike and her story about the plane crash is meant as a psychological warfare tactic or to throw off anyone searching for them.[/quote]
    That is a good catch. I’ll have to pay close attention next time I watch. I had the closed captioning on during the show, and for most of what she said, the words were written in the language she was speaking, except for that bit at the end, where I believe the CC said something like “(mumbles)”. The producers may have specifically told the CC people not to print the exact words she was mumbling, soas not to give away anything.

  63. FMGreenSteve says:

    Another excellent episode. Even Son’s story was enjoyable. Yet again we are shown that Son is tough and is not afraid to assert herself.

    I’ll sit back and read now, this episode will surely generate some great discussion.

    Oh, as most people seem to skip right past this when actually replying…now they’ll see it here:

    Read all comments before commenting. If something has already been said, there is no need to say it again.

    Stay on topic. If your comment is about last week’s episode it belongs in that comment thread. Search and find the right post.

    Be constructive, don’t complain about Lost unless you want to discuss your complaint.

    No spoilers or discussion of episode previews!

    Be kind and helpful.

  64. Tasha says:

    [quote comment="53207"][quote comment="53204"]now they could be dead???? dont like it!!!! now that theory will just make for a huge filler, going back and forth not knowing whats going on. Like the episode but just added more HUGE questions and not many answers……why lost why?[/quote]

    certainly they are not dead… that would be to cheap. I agree that the Other’s must of made some sort of cover up so they could study their newly arrived lab rats withouth worry of peopole coming to look for them.[/quote]

    How do you make a cover up though of a plane that crashes and people are found dead? They would most likely need to be identified somehow, unless they were all cloned. Something does not add up with just Ben planting all this. I mean I believe the Others are behind the crash of 815, but if it is a setup, I don’t see how something like that could be setup without identical planes and people.

  65. A Kelly says:

    so what it is it with jack.. it seems like the other’s plastered some self satisfied smirk permenantly on Jack’s face. How much does he know about the pregnancy problem, and do you think he knows or at has at least figured out kate’s possible pregnancy?

  66. Lesley says:

    Wow! Wow! So the first question is do I watch it again now or wait until tomorrow. It appears the Others actually had a hand in making it appear to be a total fatality situation with the crash of 815. Yikes! The Others have truly entered the realm of sinister IMHO. So the incongruity is that pregnant women die but certain wounds heal quickly and Mikhail actually came back from the dead???!!!! Whoa! So does the sonic fence merely screw with one’s equilibrium and eardrums or was Patchy’s death staged to allow him to get away? Was the fence originally constructed just to keep smokey out? And how is Juliet going to get Kate into the medical station? Well it certainly appears more likely that flygirl is there to find Desmond. I agree it is a bit much to think that she is an Other but…. you never know. I got goosebumps when Jules was leaving the message for Ben and I loved the I hate you line. Does that mean in a week the Others are coming for all the women? I think the finale will seriously kick our asses.

  67. A Kelly says:

    Tasha:

    I agree it would be hard to cover it up, but they have managed to cover up an entire island and several other random disappearances (Des, The Black Rock, possibly the entire Dharma Initiave).

    Another idea has been posted earlier, that perhaps it is an attack on the survivors’ psyche make them more suceptable to an Others attack.

    I just hate for it to be so bland is they are all dead. They mine as well be saying the whole thing was a dream if that is the case.

  68. Toeknee says:

    [quote comment="53211"]Another excellent episode. Even Son’s story was enjoyable. Yet again we are shown that Son is tough and is not afraid to assert herself.

    I’ll sit back and read now, this episode will surely generate some great discussion.

    Oh, as most people seem to skip right past this when actually replying…now they’ll see it here:

    Read all comments before commenting. If something has already been said, there is no need to say it again.

    Stay on topic. If your comment is about last week’s episode it belongs in that comment thread. Search and find the right post.

    Be constructive, don’t complain about Lost unless you want to discuss your complaint.

    No spoilers or discussion of episode previews!

    Be kind and helpful.[/quote]
    Great reminder, FMGreenSteve.

    BTW, did anyone notice the woman in the picture on the monk’s desk was the old lady from the jewelry store in one of Desmond’s flashbacks? :)

  69. A Kelly says:

    [quote comment="53219"][quote comment="53211"]
    Great reminder, FMGreenSteve.

    BTW, did anyone notice the woman in the picture on the monk’s desk was the old lady from the jewelry store in one of Desmond’s flashbacks? :)[/quote]

    doesnt that belong on last week’s thread? ha ha just teasin’…

  70. A Kelly says:

    by the way this is my first episode to post on, but i have been reading for a while now, and i love the discussion that goes on here. I hope to make a worthy contribution to this great group of analytical minds.

  71. FMGreenSteve says:

    [quote comment="53219"]Great reminder, FMGreenSteve.

    BTW, did anyone notice the woman in the picture on the monk’s desk was the old lady from the jewelry store in one of Desmond’s flashbacks? :)[/quote]

    Why I oughta…!

    Do you all remember back in November/December when we all thought Season 3 was going to be the worst yet? I’d say the show has redeemed itself quite well since that point! I’m happier with Season 3 than I was with Season 2. Season 1 is untouchable though. ;-)

  72. Other 218 says:

    Juliet said to tape recorder Ben… “I Hate You” -true. BUT the tape recorder was OFF – NOT RUNNING. They made a point of showing that the recorder was NOT running when she said that.
    I think this was a ‘filler’ epsiode too. Not bad, but we know that May is ‘sweeps’ month (along with Nov & Feb)… they had to run this ep to fill the story arc. just look at what we have ahead – a Charlie, Ben and 2 Jack – centric episodes. this (DOC) set the tone for the rest of S3. Good Job Lost Robot produc.

  73. Lesley says:

    Another possibility is that in real time everyone is already dead. But since time travels more slowly on the island perhaps they just have not died yet. That would mean the end of the series is rescue showing up and finding… everyone dead? the island? the crash and remains? Hmmmmmm I have always thought that the end of the series would show the Losties being the new Others in charge on the island. My brain hurts. I cannot wait to read everyone’s thoughts tomorrow!

  74. Toeknee says:

    [quote comment="53222"]
    Do you all remember back in November/December when we all thought Season 3 was going to be the worst yet? I’d say the show has redeemed itself quite well since that point! I’m happier with Season 3 than I was with Season 2. Season 1 is untouchable though. ;-)[/quote]
    I agree – this has been a great season, despite not getting as many answers as most people would like, and despite getting more and more questions. To me, that’s what makes the show so enjoyable.

    I think those first 6 episodes would have been received better if there wasn’t that long break. I do hope the rumors are true that Season 4 won’t start until January and will run uninterrupted until May.

  75. A Kelly says:

    [quote comment="53226"]Another possibility is that in real time everyone is already dead. But since time travels more slowly on the island perhaps they just have not died yet. That would mean the end of the series is rescue showing up and finding… everyone dead? the island? the crash and remains? Hmmmmmm I have always thought that the end of the series would show the Losties being the new Others in charge on the island. My brain hurts. I cannot wait to read everyone’s thoughts tomorrow![/quote]

    this is a very good theory. when the pilot was saying it was impossible about 815 i was certain she was about to say something along the lines that that was years ago…

    but this ties that together.

  76. lost chicka says:

    naomi spoke just about every language out there: spanish, italian, chinese…
    but if she was speaking spanish y didn’t hurley translate? he can speak spanish & is hispanic (reyes).

    i’m begining to think that the fence is just a way to scare people off and doesn’t hurt/kill you at all. if anything it probably just knocks u out.

    i agree with Kelley that the Others have obviously done the whole cover up thing before with Des & Danielle & her friends so they’re probably good at it.

    i’m dying to find out more about naomi! she could definitely be an other, but this seems really big even for them. but then again it’s the Others here. mikhail showed up at the exact time needed to save her.

    i hate to repeat myself [ok, i luv to ;D] but is Charlie & Jin the only ones with brains here? y didn’t somebody go get sayid if they didn’t think they had enough people to watch a prisoner or just shoot patchy!

  77. lost chicka says:

    [quote comment="53226"]Another possibility is that in real time everyone is already dead. But since time travels more slowly on the island perhaps they just have not died yet. That would mean the end of the series is rescue showing up and finding… everyone dead? the island? the crash and remains? Hmmmmmm I have always thought that the end of the series would show the Losties being the new Others in charge on the island. My brain hurts. I cannot wait to read everyone’s thoughts tomorrow![/quote]

    that would be an awesome ending – losties turning into the new others. i don’t think (hope) that the writers would really kill EVERYONE off the island at the end of the series.

  78. Tasha says:

    This is what Lostpedia says about the translation of what Naomi says.

    When Mikhail tells Desmond that Naomi said “Thank you.” (or something along those lines.) It sounds like she’s speaking Portuguese and she’s saying,”Eu não estou só,” which translates to “I’m not the only,” which is close to “Eu não estou sozinha,” meaning “I’m not alone.”

    Don’t know how accurate that is….

  79. A Kelly says:

    lost chicka wrote:
    i hate to repeat myself [ok, i luv to ;D] but is Charlie & Jin the only ones with brains here? y didn’t somebody go get sayid if they didn’t think they had enough people to watch a prisoner or just shoot patchy!

    Sayid has made it clear that he will not torture anyone else. I think Desmond had some strong points about the others. While they are very manipulative and shady, at this point the survivors have killed a lot more Others than vice versa.

    it was nice to see someone actually see that retaining an other is not always the best choice for that situation. if anyone shoud know it is Hurley. He was taken and then released by the Others with nere a scratch.

  80. A Kelly says:

    [quote comment="53234"]This is what Lostpedia says about the translation of what Naomi says.

    When Mikhail tells Desmond that Naomi said “Thank you.” (or something along those lines.) It sounds like she’s speaking Portuguese and she’s saying,”Eu não estou só,” which translates to “I’m not the only,” which is close to “Eu não estou sozinha,” meaning “I’m not alone.”

    Don’t know how accurate that is….[/quote]

    weren’t the techies who called Penny at the end of season two Porteguese?

  81. lost chicka says:

    sayid’s said he ain’t gonna torture anybody about once everyseason and he always seems to do it again anyways. maybe he’ll stick to it for once tho this time.

    but even if he didn’t torture him, he’s a REALLY good judge of character and can tell when somebody’s lying and he was in the republican guard. plus remember that one episode after boone got killed off & sayid asked locke about how boone died & the hatch? never laid a finger on him and still got answeres. held a gun to his head but still didn’t touch him!

  82. A Kelly says:

    [quote comment="53246"]sayid’s said he ain’t gonna torture anybody about once everyseason and he always seems to do it again anyways. maybe he’ll stick to it for once tho this time.

    but even if he didn’t torture him, he’s a REALLY good judge of character and can tell when somebody’s lying and he was in the republican guard. plus remember that one episode after boone got killed off & sayid asked locke about how boone died & the hatch? never laid a finger on him and still got answeres. held a gun to his head but still didn’t touch him![/quote]

    fair enough… still, i have thought for a while that both desmond and jack have a personal connection to the island which allows them to be more intuitive to the Other’s wavelength. Both he (Des) and Locke have set him “free” in one way or the other. While Des may seem a little hot headed due to his love of Penny, I still think he has a grander idea of the big picture than we realize

  83. Erin says:

    OH MY GOD. They found the plane? They’re all dead? Impossible. This girl (parachick) is alive, Desmond is alive (he wasn’t on the plane)

    I am speechless. Now I’m going to scroll back up and read all your comments!!!

    I loooooove this show. Even though it gives me a headache.

  84. A Kelly says:

    I said earlier:

    Both he (Des) and Locke have set him “free” in one way or the other. While Des may seem a little hot headed due to his love of Penny, I still think he has a grander idea of the big picture than we realize

    The him free i am talking about is Patchy

  85. mel says:

    pachy came running after the flare was shot, like he was waiting for it. and if parachick really said “are we ready?” not “thank you” which i am sure she did not, it would make sense that she is working with the others. maybe she is hand delivering info on des, and a sat phone, to the others. since the sat info system is not around anymore. that would explain the picture of des in her backpack. and if she is working with the others, i would not trust what she say’s about the plane being found. maybe someone who speaks itailian will tell us what she really said.

  86. FMGreenSteve says:

    [quote comment="53250"]OH MY GOD. They found the plane? They’re all dead? Impossible. This girl (parachick) is alive, Desmond is alive (he wasn’t on the plane)

    I am speechless. Now I’m going to scroll back up and read all your comments!!!…[/quote]

    Come on Erin…it’s freaking RULE #1…written right there above the reply box…
    “Read all comments before commenting…”

  87. Austin says:

    i think i got a couple things figured out.

    (1) There was a cover-up, but it was not by the others or Hanso. it was by the Australian government. I have always been suspicious of the Aussies. Anyways, this could be wrong because we do know that there are other’s associates that are in australia, but who would benefit most from a cover up? Does dharma really care if the plane isn’t found? the island is pretty much unreachable anyways. but the australian government? they want to tie up loose ends!

    (2) Kinda interesting how some of the biggest developments involve women, claire having a baby, juliet the only other to go to the camp and makin’ smooth moves on jack, sun being kidnaped, the sister that got shot (sorry forgot her name), or how about the two other women got shot, anyways you get the idea. so now it’s about how women can’t get pregnant. you know how everyone keeps talking about religion being big on Lost, well how about paganism?!

    (3) three more episodes left? well, i bet that the key part of the finale will be juliet socking it to the man and screwing the others over and helping the losties out in a extreme way, then Locke being a loser and screwing that up too.

    my roommate wants me off the computer so thats all i got now. whaddyea think?

  88. Erin says:

    You’re right, FMGreenSteve. I was just so excited! It won’t happen again.

    Sorry!

  89. nyc lost says:

    I bet that Jin’s mother got pregnant by Sun’s father making them half brother / sister! Yuk

  90. Erin says:

    I want to know more about Naomi’s statement. I don’t believe it. When was the plane found? Where? By whom? I don’t think this is for real. I just can’t see them telling us this now. If it’s true, then what’s the point in watching anymore, right? A revelation like that would come at the very end of the series, not now. She’s messing with them, and US! (unless she’s been fed that info by the Others/brainwashed?)

  91. FMGreenSteve says:

    [quote comment="53256"]…
    (3) three more episodes left?…[/quote]

    Actually, it’s 3 episodes plus the season finale, which is likely 2 hours. So I like to think of it as 5 hours left.

    [quote comment="53257"]You’re right, FMGreenSteve. I was just so excited! It won’t happen again.

    Sorry![/quote]

    No harm Erin, I’m not The Lost Blog police! =)

    I’m just anal and I really don’t enjoy reading through 300+ comments when 200 of them are redundant.

  92. Erin says:

    [quote comment="53260"][quote comment="53256"]…
    (3) three more episodes left?…[/quote]

    Actually, it’s 3 episodes plus the season finale, which is likely 2 hours. So I like to think of it as 5 hours left.

    [quote comment="53257"]You’re right, FMGreenSteve. I was just so excited! It won’t happen again.

    Sorry![/quote]

    No harm Erin, I’m not The Lost Blog police! =)

    I’m just anal and I really don’t enjoy reading through 300+ comments when 200 of them are redundant.[/quote]

    FMGreenSteve… Thanks for not giving me too hard of a time. My husband usually watches with me but he’s out tonight and I was just about ready to burst! I’m usually really good about following the rules…

    I’m glad you said there are still 5 hours left. 3 isn’t enough!

  93. Fluca says:

    She did not say thank you. She said: “Eu não estou só”. Translation: “I am not alone” (it’s Portuguese, BTW).

    Interesting, eh?

    Cheers

  94. Erin says:

    So do you think there are a few parachutists? I wonder who sent her and why she said that particular thing about not being alone to Mikhail. Did she understand that he wasn’t with the Losties?

  95. Fluca says:

    Damn, sorry, I had not seen post #78.
    Anyways, I speak portuguese and I’m 100% sure she said exactly that.

    Again, sorry for my blunder :)

    Cheers

  96. Erin says:

    Makes me think of “live together, die alone”…

  97. Fluca says:

    I think she does not know about the Others, since she did not know about the Losties either. My guess is that she was searching for Desmond, and Desmond alone.

    Cheers

  98. Erin says:

    If she is indeed searching for Des, which is what I would like to believe, I wonder if Penn is offshore somewhere (like someone theorized last week) or if the other Portuguese guys from the end of last season are with her (but landed somewhere else)?

    I should really go to bed. But how will I sleep now with all of this running through my head?

  99. KJ says:

    Okay, so what I’ve gathered from these comments is that we don’t really know for sure what the ParaChick said, which was my main question. “Are you ready” and “I’m not alone” obviously would have much different implications. Also, if it’s “I’m not alone,” I do wonder why she chose to say that in a language that only Mikhail could understand, because it seems like that’s a lovely hopeful message she’d want everyone to hear. Or was it more of a threat? Patchy did look a little disconcerted.

    Secondly, I agree with those who say that if it does end up to be They’re Actually All Dead, Haha To All The Viewers (which I know has been denied by TPTB), I’d be annoyed. That is totally equivalent to “And Then I Woke Up” in my book.

    Thirdly, Juliet continues to intrigue. Those I was watching with called it that she was gonna go back into the station and contact Ben somehow, but she did look like she hated herself for doing so. The “I hate you” confirmed that. What IS she playing? I’m leaning toward the She’s A Good Person side, but I can’t figure out what her deal is. If she’s REALLY good, why doesn’t she just sever all ties to the Benry clan? I’m thinking Ben must have something pretty serious on her to get her to keep working for him like this. I mean, the “I hate you” totally came from her gut—it wasn’t for anyone’s benefit. She wasn’t trying to prove herself to Sun at that moment or anything.

    Here’s a question about the room Juliet took Sun into. Beneficial to have a private room where women went to die, sure. But did Ben’s clan put in the private secret room? Or did Dharma have it, and Ben’s people just found it? And if it was a Dharma room, why so secret? What was its purpose? That IS a medical station, sure, and private places in hospitals are good. But a secret lever in a locker? Interesting.

  100. Fluca says:

    Same here… One last thought… The helicopter clearly fell away from Lost Island. But, who’s to say it didn’t reach Lostcatraz?

    Cheers

  101. Superchimp says:

    Two Options…

    1) Assuming the parachutist is telling the truth, it would make a lot of sense for her to be shocked about Flight 815. In particular, she’s speaking Portuguese and had Catch 22 in Portuguese. Thus, she’s likely connected to the two men at the end of season 2. If so, she’s only searching for Desmond and would therefore have no clue about the involvement of the plane crash. If this is the case, it’s likely that Hanso, Mittelos, etc staged the crash and pretended everyone was dead to have their way with the Losties on the island with no possible interruptions or search parties running into the island (if that’s even possible). This would also make the character’s connections seem less like coincidence than intentional.

    2) This all involves some sort of time continuum problem. Perhaps in an alternative time line the passengers all died. Not sure how this would work, but somewhat fits into previous time travel/time line theories.

  102. KJ says:

    If the parachick was searching solely for Desmond (which seems extremely likely), that makes me wonder even more why she chose to direct her last comment directly to Mikhail. I might just be remembering wrong, but didn’t she look right at him and everything?

  103. Erin says:

    if that’s the room they take them to to die, why did it have a crib set up in it? (I’m pretty sure I saw a crib) Isn’t that just cruel??? Too bad you’re going to die, and your baby too, let’s rub salt in the wound…

    Wasn’t it the room they had Claire in? They knew she wasn’t going to die, didn’t they? Esp. as she was well past mid-way through her second trimester.

  104. Superchimp says:

    Also, no way she’s an Other in the conventional, island-bound sense. It would make no sense–not only would they be depending on Desmond having the flashes, but also that she wouldn’t be hurt. If anything, there might be a third option that I didn’t list, which is that she knows about the Island/Others along with finding Desmond, but simply didn’t know about Flight 815’s connection to it all…

  105. Superchimp says:

    [quote comment="53276"]if that’s the room they take them to to die, why did it have a crib set up in it? (I’m pretty sure I saw a crib) Isn’t that just cruel??? Too bad you’re going to die, and your baby too, let’s rub salt in the wound…

    Wasn’t it the room they had Claire in? They knew she wasn’t going to die, didn’t they? Esp. as she was well past mid-way through her second trimester.[/quote]

    The room seemed familiar and had cribs in it because they had taken everything from the other rooms and stuffed it all in there. It had once been the room where the women were taken to die, but is now storage.

  106. Fluca says:

    KJ, she didn’t. She was looking to her left (where Des was) when she said it (and when she repeated it).
    Cheers

  107. KJ says:

    Yeah, Erin, I saw a crib in that room, too. But it looked like it was in there for storage, to me. That could just be my imagination, though.

    [quote comment="53276"]Wasn’t it the room they had Claire in?[/quote]

    I’m pretty sure it wasn’t the same room. Claire’s room was bigger, I think. Plus, wasn’t the only way into the ultrasound room via the secret door? There wasn’t another door into the hallway, was there? Because I remember Ethan and Tom hanging out in the doorway to Claire’s room, so that would make it a different room.

  108. Laura R says:

    Hi all,

    This is my first post, so I hope it’s not completely out of context or off the subject…
    Or maybe this was discussed a long time ago after other episodes, but the whole pregnancy issue in this episode made me wonder…
    What do you think is the reason why Ben and the Others are so obsessed with a baby (or for that fact ANY baby) being born on the island? Is that their entire reason for being on the island?
    And also along those lines, if all the religious symbolism is involved with other characters, do you think the writers may be aiming that kind of theme toward a baby that could be potentially born on an island where it seems impossible? And then Sun and Jin’s baby…a baby born to a formerly sterile father?
    Just some things that crossed my mind.

  109. Found says:

    Just a couple of thoughts…If Parachick is there to find Des, which I believe that she is, then she would have no reason to lie about flight 815 being found with no survivors. A couple of possible scenarios… 1. There is an alternate reaility split that happened as the plane entered the “dome” of the island, or 2. Just remembering something that I thought I noticed when they showed the plane crashing from the others perspective: The contrail of the plane seamed to originate just as the plane entered the “dome” of the island? Following that scenario, is it possible that some of the parts of the crashed plane left the other side of the “dome” and splashed down into the ocean, and that is the wreckage that they found. Saying everyone was dead does not have to mean that they actually found the bodies; with that minimal of wreckage recovered it would of course be assumed that there were no survivors. And of course with the “Dome” operational again, the search that discovered the plane would not have seen the island, even if the wreckage was relativily close by.

  110. Stymie says:

    I think Juliet lied about Sun’s DOC. This way Sun will survive and give birth. Juliet can then say she solved the prenancy issues and Ben will allow her to go home.

  111. Will says:

    Go to sleep, wake up, and there are over 100 comments, you guys are amazing! My thoughts:

    -I do not think the Others are behind the flight 815 cover-up (assuming it is a cover-up), if you can recall from the last Juliet centric episode (One of Us), the Others seemed legitimately suprised by the plane crashing and were scrambling to get a plan together as the plane was coming down; would they also have time to put together an elaborate cover-up?

    Probably not. Which makes me think there is a greater authority at power here, and the Others, much like the Losties, are a pawn in this game

    -At this point it is basically confirmed that the still-unnamed parachick said “I’m not alone” in one of the 50 different languages she spoke. It’s difficult to tell if Mikhail was expecting someone, or if he ran up because of Hurley firing the flare gun…

    -I really thought that Juliet was going back into the station to somehow confirm that the baby was conceived pre-island, and much like Stymie comments above, that she is initiating this lie to ultimately get off the island; the recording for Ben threw me off though and now I’m unsure.

  112. Hammer says:

    [quote comment="53360"]I think Juliet lied about Sun’s DOC. This way Sun will survive and give birth. Juliet can then say she solved the prenancy issues and Ben will allow her to go home.[/quote]
    (Bob?) Damn…beat me to the punch! Although I think that is her current tact, I think Ben will never let anyone go home.

  113. MasterPo says:

    Great episode. Don’t trust anything Juliet says!

    Two points:

    1) Re: the hidden room – That’s where Ethan kept Claire. I don’t think it’s not just a storage room as someone previously suggested. I think it is meant as a secure holding room for women and their babies. Not only did I see a crib (maybe more than one) but I also saw I/V setups and other medical equipment near the cribs. And I don’t think it’s just chance the ultrasound is in that room too. My theory: Yes, some women died pregnant. But others survived, at least until they gave birth. And that room is where the babies were kept. The question is why?

    2) Re: Flight 815 being found – My wife says it’s a government cover-up orchastrated by the Hanso corportation. By faking a plane crash and mutilated bodies so the outside world thinks they are all dead, no one will be looking any more for them and the Others and Hanso can do whatever they please with them/to them.

  114. Hammer says:

    Here’s some other random thoughts:

    Patchy was able to survive the massive ear bleeding because it didn’t kill him immediately and he healed in “a day” or “a day and a half”.

    The way Juliet reported Sun’s preg. makes me think it wasn’t why she was sent to camp. Seemed like a bonus. She was there to get “samples” and especially from Austin. My Kate is preg. is still alive.

    I too very much doubt that they are dead in the oustide world. A fake plane and bodies is not necessary to trick the general population. When is the last time you went to an ocean site of a plane crash to verify something you saw on the news?

    I believe parachick is not alone, which would explain why she dropped over the island but the aircraft didn’t. The pilot is in the ocean and MAYBE there are other parachuters in the jungle somewhere.

  115. MasterPo says:

    [quote comment="53372"]I too very much doubt that they are dead in the oustide world. A fake plane and bodies is not necessary to trick the general population. When is the last time you went to an ocean site of a plane crash to verify something you saw on the news?[/quote]

    Maybe not personally, but with every spectacular plane crash there is always some wreckage and bodies to be found. They don’t have to find a fully intact plane nor all the bodies. But enough to convince people the plane went down and no survivors. The media will eat it up.

    Re: Patchy’s survival – If the island could save him why didn’t it save Libby when Michael shot her? Why didn’t it save Boone??

  116. Hammer says:

    Master – re. Patchy: I’m stumped on him. I’m ticked that they used “over kill” to trick us. They didn’t have to have blood squirt out his ears for us to think the fence killed him. So I guess I’m trying to justify being tricked.

    Another thought, didn’t it seem like he was on the run like Dez was when Locke replaced him in the hatch? I don’t think he was waiting for the flare. I think he stumbled on them as he was running away from the Others. His deal was that they would let him go like he was “never there”. I also think he wasn’t afraid to die until he heard about the “phone thingy”. That’s when he decided to help the girl, so he could get that phone to try to get off the island on his own?

  117. MasterPo says:

    Hammer – Yea, he was defiantely running. To the flare or away from someone/something else I can’t say.

    As for the phone, to me it seemed very odd he was walking away so casually with the phone even after Des and Charlie started chasing him. Why didn’t he run? Why didn’t he use his Other’s “powers” (skills) to run and hide/disappear in the jungle with the phone? He seemed to want them to catch him. He didn’t give much fight over it. Very half-hearted.

    The whole fence-thing is a topic for another time.

  118. Hammer says:

    [quote comment="53364"]-I really thought that Juliet was going back into the station to somehow confirm that the baby was conceived pre-island, and much like Stymie comments above, that she is initiating this lie to ultimately get off the island; the recording for Ben threw me off though and now I’m unsure.[/quote]
    This is how I saw it: Juliet’s mission was to check on Kate (and still is). Juliet seemed a little surprised that Sun was preg. (and I think Ben will be surprised too) so Juliet came up with this plan to find DOC so she could do what Stymie said. Sun told her secret BEFORE the test so Juliet knew she could manipulate Sun into coperating by telling her Jin is the father since Sun REALLY, REALLY wanted Jin.

  119. Hammer says:

    [quote comment="53380"]As for the phone, to me it seemed very odd he was walking away so casually with the phone even after Des and Charlie started chasing him. Why didn’t he run? Why didn’t he use his Other’s “powers” (skills) to run and hide/disappear in the jungle with the phone? He seemed to want them to catch him. He didn’t give much fight over it. Very half-hearted.[/quote]Yeah, but why take it in the first place if he wanted to get caught?

  120. MD says:

    Thought about last nights episode

    According to lostpedia there were 324 passengers on the plane only 71 which survived. It could possibly be that some of the bodies and parts of wreckage were carried by the current and washed up somewhere else. It could easily be assumed by whoever happened upon the wreckage and bodies that all the passengers were dead and whatever missing wreckage there was had simply sunk to the bottom of the ocean.

  121. Hammer says:

    [quote comment="53387"]Thought about last nights episode

    According to lostpedia there were 324 passengers on the plane only 71 which survived. It could possibly be that some of the bodies and parts of wreckage were carried by the current and washed up somewhere else. It could easily be assumed by whoever happened upon the wreckage and bodies that all the passengers were dead and whatever missing wreckage there was had simply sunk to the bottom of the ocean.[/quote]
    Yeah, I think there are plenty of explanations as to why the outside world would be lead to believe everyone is dead.

  122. RedDawn says:

    I could be wrong on this, but didn’t Claire already go to the room where she was kept when she went to the station, but it was empty with just a toy on the floor? The room they found just stored the crib, etc they used to comfort Claire while they kept her

  123. MasterPo says:

    [quote comment="53386"]Yeah, but why take it in the first place if he wanted to get caught?[/quote]

    That’s the $42 question!

    Maybe deception? Maybe he took something else, not as immediately noticable as the phone but also very important?

    Or maybe, for as yet unknown reason, he wanted to lure them away from the area (from the girl) for a brief period of time.

    That whole scene seemed very out of place the way it came off. Either let him steal the phone or let me get chased down and fight for the phone. It seemed pointless the way it played out.

  124. Bizzy says:

    The parachick was not sent by Penny. Why would she send some hot chick to rescue her boyfriend? Expect to see more parababes sent by Benry. Now that we know that the Losters have a quintupled sperm count, also expect to see more preggers.

  125. Hammer says:

    Master – I see your point…again I took it as he was running from the others and scene was hinting at it.

  126. Hammer says:

    [quote comment="53391"] Now that we know that the Losters have a quintupled sperm count, also expect to see more preggers.[/quote]
    I didn’t need the sperm count increase to tell me that. For crying out loud, Ben’s current focus is fixing the preg. problem (see several past posts).

  127. MasterPo says:

    Hammer – Could go either way (running from someone/something or running to someone/something).

    Bizzy – I don’t see how Ben could have called for the girl to be dropped or anyone else. The Torch was the satelite station and Locke blew it up. Patchy was the communications guy. So unless there is another communications station somewhere we haven’t yet seen I think her apparence isn’t due to anything Ben has orchastrated.

  128. birdwatcher says:

    Ok. I keep trying to post but get interupted and then have to refresh to see what was written since last I looked. So, I apologize if I’m repeating…

    1) Is “death” really out for Charlie? He died once already on the island. Will he really die if he gets killed?

    2) It shouldn’t be too much of a surprise that Patchy came back to life since Charlie has died before. One question though, why didn’t Patchy’s eye grow back? I mean, if the island has such wonderful healing powers, why not regeneration powers? Or, maybe the fence is just to keep out smoky. That would explain the lack of animal carcasses or old bones around the fence.

    3) If Juliet lied about the DOC, it will be obvious soon. If they’ve been on the island 90 days, that’s about 13 weeks (and lets say her last encounter was a week before they left). She could start showing within a week and she would feel definite changes in her body. But, a week is a long time in Lost world, so who knows.

    4) Are there other women who are pregnant besides Sun and probably Kate, or does Juliet have to get samples from all the women? And why is Ben so obsessed with it anyway?

    5) My last thing, they aren’t really all dead. The producers of Lost ruled that out a long time ago and as was mentioned before – it would be a total rip-off.

    Sorry about any repeats! I’m a slow typer.

  129. Mark Jensen says:

    At some point I think it is indeed possible for the other’s to wake dead people back to life.

    We saw Mikhail in this episode, and when Hurley told Juliette where Ethan was burried she really seemed interested in exactly that info. Also, I think there is a little easteregg planted when Hurley and Charlie burried Ethan. Hurley said: “I know how this is going to end. It’s going to end with you and me running, screaming through the forrest” – or something like that.

    About waking people up from death — Juliette made women pregnant. She created life. Exactly how this is connected to the death of pregnant women, I’m not sure of yet.

    Am I totally off track or could there be something about this?

  130. Other 218 says:

    MoistAvenger at http://losthatch.com/forums/forums/thread/2202.aspx
    wrote:
    “My italian is a little rusty, but I believe that the parachute girl said “anno e stato,” which I think means: What year is it? Hmmm. It looks like, perhaps, time is moving faster on the island. Wounds heal faster, etc. Any thoughts as to why this, if true, would make the women who become pregnant on the island die?”

  131. Tina says:

    I’m convinced that Widmore has everything to do with the Hanso Foundation and if it was a coverup, any coverup regarding the crash of 815. The Parchick spoke portuguese, likely related to the men in the Listening station likely near the south pole. She said the plane was found with no survivors, but she being sent from Widmore Corp.(or a subsidiary) she likely has no idea that there was an actual coverup but believes the plane actually crashed and everyone died. If Hanso and Widmore and Mittelos and maybe even Paik are in on this whole island thing together it makes sense how Mikhail would know to come (that and the flare) to the spot she landed. Perhaps when Ben said they had no contact with the outside world, surprise surprise, he LIED.

    If we consider what Juliet said about the supersperm and the allusions she made to island’s healing properties, Ethan’s reference to “time flying” on the island, Ben’s resistance to and insistance that no leave the island and finally the Hanso Foundation’s experimentation into a Life Extension Program perhaps all that is happening on the island and off begin to fit together. I’m not entirely sure how, but my gut tells me that some kind of high level orchestration is going on here.
    Perhaps the island was a crazy anamoly discoverd by Hanso/Widmore/Paik and targeted as a prime area for experimentation, however outside of government sanctioning, they couldn’t get permission to perform the procedures they wanted to. So they set up house on this crazy time warped island and went to work privately funded by the organizations I mentioned. I doubt they arranged for the crash specifically however, that could be because of the shielding people have mentioned surrounding the island lapsing long enough for the plan to get sucked through onto the island.

    I mean, it sort of makes sense, didn’t Widmore supply high level weapons and security equipment to various governments? I thought that was part of the company’s business.

    Episode specific:

    Juliet is seriously screwed up. Period. Good or bad, she’s unravelling. Jack has to be in on some aspect of her plan, perhaps she told him that pregnancies could fatal and he told her Sun was pregged and thence, the ultrasound. i doubt he is “in with the Others” he is still too unpredictable a character for Ben to trust him with that type of information.

    Sun is so badass, and obviously not as sweet and innocent as we’d like to believe she is.

    So Mikhail is alive, he was never confirmed dead so I’m not too surprised.

    All in all, the plot continues to thicken.

    Happy posting! :)

  132. Mark Jensen says:

    Comment 114:

    And maybe Penny is one of those parachusist.. Just like in Desmond’s vision?

  133. Hammer says:

    Didn’t Juliet tell Jack and Kate about the preg. thing in Catch 22 when Claire got sick? I can see Sun thinking Jack was weird, but why do the viewers not know why Jack knows?

  134. brian says:

    Didn’t all the plane wreckage supposedly wash back out to sea?? If so…they could have found the wreckage…there were a lot of bodies inside still that the castaways burned…but I dont think that rescuers would be too suprised to find burnt bodies in a plane crash…and I agree with previous statements that it would only take a few found bodies and a really torn up plane for rescuers to make the assumption that everyone died…and Im not sure but I dont think she said everyone died…she just said there were no suvivors?!?

    Here is my theory…
    – the island was a Dharma facility with the sole purpose of saving the world.
    – there were many different projects going on
    1) Prolonging life/ healing
    2) Increasing awareness
    3) weather control (hense how the others know exactly when it is going to rain)

    …….etc.

    – the magnetic field somehow works with all of this and also creates the field that makes the island hard to find….I beleive it makes it invisible, and unable for electronic devices to pass through, and also allows the weather to be seperate from the rest of the world..or controlled…see above theory

    – the others worked for the company with this purpose…at some point there was a revolt… the experiments went awry…perhaps the it the increased awareness… the islands powers…went from being scientific discoveries.. to almost religious powers… the others “purged” the island of the scientists and it then became under their control.

    -the leader of the revolt was Jacob…who we have not seen yet

    – all the 815 suvivors were brought to the island on purpose by the others…. their “awareness” allows them to see the future (Desmond after the emp)… which allowed them to create events that would lead the others into doing what they wanted ( the bus hitting juliets ex)

    a lot more but I will spare you

  135. Jocco says:

    Just because the parachick was addressing Patchy does not mean that she is one of the Others. It is entirely possible that just as the others know all about the survivors of 815, Penny’s people may have mucho info on the Others. She wouldn’t know about 815 because she’s there for Desmond. I think that her words to Patchy were definitely a warning for him and the Others.

  136. MasterPo says:

    Tina,

    Sun isn’t a bad ass. Not a sweet innocent thing either but not a bad ass. Most people would react strongly in some way when someone they care about is threatened.

    As for Patchy’s death, it’s a well accepted “rule” of TV (and movies) that someone isn’t really dead unless you see lots of blood. And we sure saw lots of it coming out of him at the fence.

  137. Brandon says:

    Long time reader, first time poster, but I was just reading about how everyone is questioning the deaths on the island, and asking well how come they didnt heal. Is it because the losties dug their graves to fast, and didnt give the island its time to heal the hurt and wonded, kind of what happen with Pablo and Nikki. That could also be why Juliet had a funny look on her face when she knew that Ethan was in his grave.

  138. Barb says:

    That secret room doesn’t make sense – if I were a pregnant woman, knowing my death was eminent, I wouldn’t want to be locked in a concrete block, no sunlight, no greenery. I would want to be outside, enjoying my final days. Yeah, under the Others control but there’s more to that room. Maybe they wanted those mothers dead and kept their babies! And so had to lock the mothers away after actually giving birth. Juliet is lying in order to can confidence from Ben.

  139. Hammer says:

    [quote comment="53408"]Long time reader, first time poster, but I was just reading about how everyone is questioning the deaths on the island, and asking well how come they didnt heal. Is it because the losties dug their graves to fast, and didnt give the island its time to heal the hurt and wonded, kind of what happen with Pablo and Nikki. That could also be why Juliet had a funny look on her face when she knew that Ethan was in his grave.[/quote]
    Not buying that island brings people back to life. Unless the girl that Sun killed and her husband that Juliet killed (both bodies were under control of the others) make a sudden appearance…Goodwin wasn’t buried either…what about the 9 preg. women, are they back to life too?

  140. Bizzy says:

    MasterPo: If Penny wanted to send somebody who could survive this perilous journey, she would have sent some Rambo dude. Why didn’t send the eskimos?

    Paracutie said she wasn’t alone, so you’ve got believe that there are more hotties coming.

  141. Hammer says:

    [quote comment="53411"] Maybe they wanted those mothers dead and kept their babies! And so had to lock the mothers away after actually giving birth. [/quote]
    Why would they want the mothers dead?

  142. Barb says:

    They would want the mothers dead to get rid of evidence, so they, the mothers couldn’t report what experiments are actually going on. This could be a lame theory.

    Other thoughts: Some people have mentioned references to other works of fiction, that are reflected in the Lost story-line: Wizard of Oz, the Odyssey, the Lord Horizon (movie). Is there a complete list of such titles? How many other classical books/movies are mirrored in the Lost story?

  143. Tina says:

    [quote comment="53407"]Tina,

    Sun isn’t a bad ass. Not a sweet innocent thing either but not a bad ass. Most people would react strongly in some way when someone they care about is threatened.

    As for Patchy’s death, it’s a well accepted “rule” of TV (and movies) that someone isn’t really dead unless you see lots of blood. And we sure saw lots of it coming out of him at the fence.[/quote]

    I will agree to disagree. I’ve never threatened to ill someone with my Korean mafia connections before. I also think her treatment of Juliet was rather badass initially.

    As far as Patchy is concerned, well expect the unexpected right.

  144. Jim Krzyzak says:

    Did I miss something? I could swear that we were meant to believe that someone walked in the room behind Juilet as she was finishing her recording and THAT’s who she said “I hate you to.” The recorder was already off and it looked like Sun was about to follow Juliet back in the hatch.

  145. Toeknee says:

    [quote comment="53404"]Didn’t Juliet tell Jack and Kate about the preg. thing in Catch 22 when Claire got sick? I can see Sun thinking Jack was weird, but why do the viewers not know why Jack knows?[/quote]
    Good point. I’m guilty of overlooking the obvious here.

  146. Mark Jensen says:

    If time is gowing faster on the island, that means pregnant woman reaches the stage of delivering the child faster than nine months.

    1) How does this fit with Claire delivering at the right time? She was 8 months pregnant when she arrived on the island, but it still took that one month as planned to deliver — This could however be Ethan (and maybe more) inject people – to delay the pregnancy. I don’t know why would do this. But IS time going faster on the island, then something must have delayed Claire’s pregnancy, and something must be done to delay Sun’s.

  147. BigBadaboom says:

    I think we can now pretty much rule out the theory that time passes differently on the island than it does on the outside.

    Remember when they showed Juliet the live video of Juliet’s sister and baby to prove they were still alive? They showed ‘today’s’ paper over the video. That would seem to indicate there is no time shift.

    If Juliet had been an other for three years I don’t think you can argue that she could have been kept in the dark about a time shift. It might be something relevant to her medical research.

    Besides, the Others seem to have near-real-time communication ability with the outside world. That would be somewhat difficult if there was a time or reality difference.

  148. Tina says:

    [quote comment="53413"]MasterPo: If Penny wanted to send somebody who could survive this perilous journey, she would have sent some Rambo dude. Why didn’t send the eskimos?

    Paracutie said she wasn’t alone, so you’ve got believe that there are more hotties coming.[/quote]

    Maybe they didn’t expect a perilous journey and besides who says she isn’t some karate kicking judo weilding badass rambochic with a stash of knives and mini ak 47s in her copter.

    I’d think if anyone fell through a forest of trees with little protecting vital organs but skin and a flight suit, that a branch puncturing a lung could happen to man, woman, child, alien, or whatever.

    Why’s it always got to be a guy or a rambodude coming to save the day…

  149. Hammer says:

    [quote comment="53411"] Maybe they wanted those mothers dead and kept their babies! And so had to lock the mothers away after actually giving birth. [/quote]
    Why would they want the mothers dead? [quote comment="53422"]If time is gowing faster on the island, that means pregnant woman reaches the stage of delivering the child faster than nine months.

    1) How does this fit with Claire delivering at the right time? She was 8 months pregnant when she arrived on the island, but it still took that one month as planned to deliver — This could however be Ethan (and maybe more) inject people – to delay the pregnancy. I don’t know why would do this. But IS time going faster on the island, then something must have delayed Claire’s pregnancy, and something must be done to delay Sun’s.[/quote]
    Possible, but it seems to me that the problem is the women’s wombs are aged faster than their appearance. Juliet was brought on board to help the women with this problem get preg., that happened, but now they are dying from it. So Juliet’s new mission is find fix that problem.

  150. I’m not convinced that the island can bring people back from the dead.

    It can HEAL you if you’re dying or not completely dead, but once you’ve expired, I think you’re gone. And I think the healing must only apply to The Others, as Boone was injured but didn’t heal.
    I don’t know where that leaves Locke and Rose though…

    If they could just bring people back from the dead willy nilly, then the death of Pickett and his lady friend wouldn’t have been so dramatic.

  151. Wm I says:

    Thanks to Found for offering a simple explanation (see Comment 109, observation 2) of parachick’s comments to Hurley. Those last seconds of the ep keep me theorizing all night about them all being judged at the “pearly gates”, etc. As for parachick, is she actually Naomi? and how does Naomi tie in to the show anyway (sorry,I missed her connection)?

    I agree that Jules lied about Sun’s D.O.C. to try and convince Ben that the baby is just pre-mature, hoping for her “release” and that she is basically “good natured”. However, I don’t think she realizes that “going home” is impossible and travelling back through the portal into the past doesn’t work. The time warp is very integral to the island. They ALL are existing in the future and time is actually faster than “real world time”. Another clue last night was Mikhail claiming parachick would recover in a day or day and a half. Perhaps the reason the island seems invisible to the outside world, is that it doesn’t exist yet. It’s a future volcanic land mass that has not yet emerged from the sea. They are ALL time travellers and crash through the “dome” into the future. Can’t explain return trips by Ethan.

  152. Toeknee says:

    [quote comment="53271"]
    Thirdly, Juliet continues to intrigue. Those I was watching with called it that she was gonna go back into the station and contact Ben somehow, but she did look like she hated herself for doing so. The “I hate you” confirmed that. What IS she playing? I’m leaning toward the She’s A Good Person side, but I can’t figure out what her deal is. If she’s REALLY good, why doesn’t she just sever all ties to the Benry clan? I’m thinking Ben must have something pretty serious on her to get her to keep working for him like this. I mean, the “I hate you” totally came from her gut—it wasn’t for anyone’s benefit. She wasn’t trying to prove herself to Sun at that moment or anything.
    [/quote]
    I agree with most of this. But she won’t sever ties with Ben because he represents her only chance to get off the island. As others here have said, I think it’s quite likely that Ben will never let her leave, but she doesn’t know that. It may be that Ben told Juliet that she’ll be allowed to leave if she goes along with his plan for her to be with the Losties for one week and collect samples from the women.

  153. Hammer says:

    FM – That’s what I meant in #139.

  154. spiralturtle says:

    RE: parachick’s statement that there were no survivors of flight 815…

    Assuming she was telling the truth, doesn’t that mean that Walt and Michael didn’t escape the island like Ben promosed they would? Their sudden appearance in the outside world would throw a wrench in that theory.

  155. Toeknee says:

    [quote comment="53425"]I think we can now pretty much rule out the theory that time passes differently on the island than it does on the outside.

    Remember when they showed Juliet the live video of Juliet’s sister and baby to prove they were still alive? They showed ‘today’s’ paper over the video. That would seem to indicate there is no time shift.

    If Juliet had been an other for three years I don’t think you can argue that she could have been kept in the dark about a time shift. It might be something relevant to her medical research.

    Besides, the Others seem to have near-real-time communication ability with the outside world. That would be somewhat difficult if there was a time or reality difference.[/quote]
    I don’t think you can rule out anything with Lost. But specifically, you can’t rule out a time difference based on the points you made. The video of Rachel and the Others’ apparent real-time communication with the outside world were discussed extensively here in the posting for “One of Us”, with many theorizing that it was all part of Ben’s deception of Juliet. You make a good point in that it seems that Juliet would have discovered such a time difference if there is one, but I just chalk that up to Ben being such a great manipulator and con artist – he pretty much completely controls what she sees/knows about the outside world.

  156. birdwatcher says:

    So, the time is the same.

    The reason the parachute lady mentioned that there were no survivors was to let Hurley (and all of us) know that no one is looking for them. But, she was looking for Desmond because he just disappeared. And, Penny’s father has something to do with that island and she has lots of resources, so she is more determined than others might be to find her lost love.

    Does anyone else see the parallels between Desmond/Penny and Jin/Sun?

    Re people coming back to life, lots of people have actually died on the island so, obviously they don’t come back to life. But, if they are only “mostly dead”, then they can heal, right? (which is why Charlie and Patchy both came back – I was pretty annoyed in the first season when Charlie died and Jack revived him – it seemed he would have been brain dead or something – he was out a long time. But, given the healing powers of the island…If he were only “mostly dead”).

  157. Tasha says:

    I read through the comments and didn’t exactly see any of this so forgive me if I am repeating,

    Maybe Patchy was running toward that woman because they were expecting her. When the flare gun was shot he went to get her and then was totally surprised to see the Losties there.

    Didn’t Julliet say that a certain amount of women made it to their third trimester? We don’t know how far along those women died. Let’s say they made it to 32 or 33 weeks. With enough equipment they could have kept a baby alive. SOme babies born at 34 weeks are perfectly healthy.

    I too saw the way the show was weird when Julliet went to record that message for Ben. I thought Sun was following her. If not, what was up with the weird look Sun had and the way she stopped and turned around? Do you think Jules knew she was followed in there?

    I still believe that the Others could have known about the plane crash. Some said in past comments that they reacted surprised. Well Julliet didn’t know. Maybe not everyone knew, only Ben. Or maybe Ben and Patchy. Who knows. We know Ben knows how to act. He WANTED this to happen. Why can’t anyone see that??

  158. birdwatcher says:

    to tasha,
    Juliet said no one made it to their 3rd trimester which starts at about 26 weeks (and is when the fetus is considered viable) and that some made it about 1/2 way through their second trimester (to about 20 weeks – definitely not viable).

  159. Wm I says:

    Ben’s biggest problem is survival of the species. All island conceptions killing mother and child mean eventual extinction. They had to lure Jules to the island to find a cure and failing that, they must draw pregnant women to the island at least once every generation to keep their “paradise” going.

  160. amnesiascope says:

    a few of thoughts….

    1. it’s probably not very difficult to fake a crash – especially given that they were supposedly thousands of miles off course. someone above pointed out that you don’t really have to alot of dead bodies and plane to confirm it. someone in authority (the faa, etc) could easily ‘verify’ that the plane had been found with no survivors, etc.

    2. there’s something about juliet (and by extension jack as well) that i don’t like/trust. we know she was sent by ben. i’m not sure that what she’s doing is to get off the island. i suspect they all know what we suspect; that’s it not possible to get off the island. however, she could be doing it to help/protect her sister and/or nephew. while i don’t like juliet, it’s clear that she’s doing whatever she’s doing on the beach at ben’s direction.

    3. mikhail just showed up?!? why? especially when he knew the losties thought he was dead. my guess is that he was somehow in contact with the parachick – even though the communications center was destroyed, i think his staging his death in front of the losties was for a specific reason. so there has to be other ways of communicating with the outside world….

  161. Toeknee says:

    [quote comment="53420"]Did I miss something? I could swear that we were meant to believe that someone walked in the room behind Juilet as she was finishing her recording and THAT’s who she said “I hate you to.” The recorder was already off and it looked like Sun was about to follow Juliet back in the hatch.[/quote]
    Maybe I missed something but I didn’t think that at all. I certainly don’t think Sun went down there, she just turned towards the hatch to wait for Juliet. Juliet’s “I hate you” was meant for Ben. She was giving Ben an update on the tape recorder, talking directly to him, with sort of a blank look on her face. And after she turned the recorder off, the look on her face stayed the same, and she continued talking as if she was still talking to him.

  162. Chris says:

    Re: finding the wreckage of the plane and declaring no survivors. In the beginning of the series, when Kate and Jack found the pilot of Flight 815, he told them that the plane was way off course and they would not even be looking for them at their current location. So how could they have found any wreckage if they were looking in a totally different place ?

  163. anita says:

    [quote comment="53437"]

    Maybe Patchy was running toward that woman because they were expecting her. When the flare gun was shot he went to get her and then was totally surprised to see the Losties there.

    [quote]
    First time posting here.
    Great point. That would explain why she spoke the other languages around Patchy and chose to speak English with Hurley after she heard him say “That’s Spanish”. But then where are the ties to the men that spoke Portugese with Penny and the fact that she had a pic of Penny & Desmond – could this be another great piece of homework done by the others?

    Also the Lost writers do a great job of letting us see the complexities of the characters. I feel that Juliet is very complex. In this episode we get to see more of her internal struggle. I think her main allegiance is to herself, to get home. But we see her being pulled by the Others with her going against her doctor ethics “I hate you” towards Ben and all. And her feelings related to the Losties and their situations (Sun’s pregnancy related to her sister’s own problems of not being able to conceive). However, in the end, Ben won’t let her leave since she is such a high commodity for him. Notice how he still uses her after she wants him killed. She does a great job at lying and deceiving and Ben needs her badly which gives her some sort of power I guess.
    Love dis ‘cho!

  164. Found says:

    Concerning Patchy, as to if he was running from something, or towards the parachick, the one observation I have is that when they let him go, he continued to go in the same direction that he was going when he “stumbled” upon the losties. Seams like if he was sent to get her he would go back the way he came… or of course maybe he wouldn’t so they couldn’t follow him back to were he came from; who knows, just throwing it out there…

  165. anita says:

    Sorry I messed up with the Quote and reply thing.

  166. MasterPo says:

    1) It’s seems the pregnancy and birthing problem only applies to humans. It might just be Hollywood license, but the island’s animals (like the boars) don’t seem to have a problem reproducing.

    2) I still have to point out: If the island can heal you why didn’t it heal Libby and Boone?!

  167. Hammer says:

    [quote comment="53445"]Re: finding the wreckage of the plane and declaring no survivors. In the beginning of the series, when Kate and Jack found the pilot of Flight 815, he told them that the plane was way off course and they would not even be looking for them at their current location. So how could they have found any wreckage if they were looking in a totally different place ?[/quote]
    I suggest again, that the masses take the news reporters at their word. If a news report comes out that the plane was found and there no survivors…why would some parachick question it? No one would even know that the pilot new they were off course…having said all that, vintage Lost…you can take it two ways, either the outside world was lied to or the losties were lied too.

  168. Hammer says:

    [quote comment="53452"]1) 2) I still have to point out: If the island can heal you why didn’t it heal Libby and Boone?![/quote]
    Yep, another stumper. I already mentioned all the other folks that were shot and haven’t (yet) made an appearance. I forgot about Kate’s cop too. Maybe the island doesn’t help the “bad” ones.

  169. [quote comment="53456"][quote comment="53452"]1) 2) I still have to point out: If the island can heal you why didn’t it heal Libby and Boone?![/quote]
    Yep, another stumper. I already mentioned all the other folks that were shot and haven’t (yet) made an appearance. I forgot about Kate’s cop too. Maybe the island doesn’t help the “bad” ones.[/quote]

    That’s a distinct possibility. The island judges those who are injured and decides who to heal, and who not to heal.

  170. Laura R says:

    I found it funny that the parachick new immediately all about Flight 815 upon Hurley mentioning it. I don’t know about the rest of you, but I don’t remember the flight numbers of every plane that goes down out of every other country in the world. She new immediately which flight he was talking about and exactly where it flew out of. Makes me wonder if she had intentions behind saying that.

  171. Laura says:

    julliette REALLY hates Ben. she said it into the recorder

    She said it after she turned the recorder off.

  172. Tina says:

    [quote comment="53455"][quote comment="53445"]Re: finding the wreckage of the plane and declaring no survivors. In the beginning of the series, when Kate and Jack found the pilot of Flight 815, he told them that the plane was way off course and they would not even be looking for them at their current location. So how could they have found any wreckage if they were looking in a totally different place ?[/quote]
    I suggest again, that the masses take the news reporters at their word. If a news report comes out that the plane was found and there no survivors…why would some parachick question it? No one would even know that the pilot new they were off course…having said all that, vintage Lost…you can take it two ways, either the outside world was lied to or the losties were lied too.[/quote]

    __________

    OR: There were two crashes in two distinct realities.

    OR: Parts of the wreckage were sucked through a rip in the time/space continum while the plane entered the shield surrounding the island and were rocketed back out to sea.

    OR: Agree with Hammer and people are lying. I think it has become obvious that our cast members suck at telling the truth.

  173. Harry's girl says:

    random thought — pregnancy does not need to be a death sentence for the women. Couldn’t Juliette abort the fetuses to save the women? Couldn’t Sun make this choice?

  174. Hammer says:

    All those having the shakes from detox, say aye.

  175. txflw says:

    [quote comment="53452"]1) It’s seems the pregnancy and birthing problem only applies to humans. It might just be Hollywood license, but the island’s animals (like the boars) don’t seem to have a problem reproducing.

    2) I still have to point out: If the island can heal you why didn’t it heal Libby and Boone?![/quote]
    Perhaps they are simply dying faster than the islands healing properties can work

  176. Sawyer's Evil Twin says:

    [quote comment="53432"]RE: parachick’s statement that there were no survivors of flight 815…

    Assuming she was telling the truth, doesn’t that mean that Walt and Michael didn’t escape the island like Ben promosed they would? Their sudden appearance in the outside world would throw a wrench in that theory.[/quote]

    Excellent point! “Oh, hi! Our plane crashed in the middle of the ocean and we survived and swam back to shore”. No, I don’t think so. Walt and Michael are still on the island(s) Otherwise they would have said something to the authorities….unless he doesn’t want to say anything for fear of being arrested for murdering Anna Lucia and Libby??? That kind of fits. Just talking out loud here. Sorry.

  177. Jim Krzyzak says:

    [quote comment="53444"][quote comment="53420"]Did I miss something? I could swear that we were meant to believe that someone walked in the room behind Juilet as she was finishing her recording and THAT’s who she said “I hate you to.” The recorder was already off and it looked like Sun was about to follow Juliet back in the hatch.[/quote]
    Maybe I missed something but I didn’t think that at all. I certainly don’t think Sun went down there, she just turned towards the hatch to wait for Juliet. Juliet’s “I hate you” was meant for Ben. She was giving Ben an update on the tape recorder, talking directly to him, with sort of a blank look on her face. And after she turned the recorder off, the look on her face stayed the same, and she continued talking as if she was still talking to him.[/quote]
    I’ll have to watch it again, I walked away last night thinking she was saying that to Sun, or we were made to think it was Sun and it will turn out to be someone else who walked up behind her.

  178. whatif says:

    Regarding Mikhael: I didn’t see this in any of the posts, and I am not sure that it makes sense, but couldn’t he have taken a pacemaker (similar to the one Ben gave to the bunny to scare Sawyer off) in order to bring down his heartrate to a bare minimum that would be hard to recognize when checked whether he was still alive? I know there was all that blood and it might have been caused by the sonic fence – but that bleeding may not be lethal? I don’t know if I make any sense here. Good ep though.. I also agree with those who touched on the possibility of 815 wreckage being a big cover up in order to ensure that they island remained unknown to the outside world…

  179. afro jack says:

    I’m not sure if someone wrote this already but I strongly believe Hurley is an other. Thats right I said it and I’m surprised no one has caught on this, espically from last nights D.O.C episode. First off, he fired the falre gun on purpose to single that someon new has landed on the island. You don’t hold a flare gun up and pull the trigger by mistake. Second, he then tells patchy that they have a phone? Why would he even think to say that?

    But let’s look further back on this for a minute. The previous episode Desmond was concerned about not being able to get Jin to come on the “trip” so what does Hurley say, let the master do it, he is a manipulator. But he is doing it so everyone thinks he is a good guy. Sawyer even said when hurley con’d him into being nice b/c he thought he was getting voted off. Also how the hell did Hurley know that was a satelitte phone so quickly.

    But this goes back to season one. Hurley tried to stop Locke from blowing up the hatch not b/c the numbers were on it, though that is what he said but really because he didn’t want everyone to find out what was really inside the hatch. He is trying to hold the “losties” back from advacning. Again, he was the only one released when the “other” captured them. Why do you think that was?

    Also, in Lockes tripped out dream sequence we see a scene from the airport with all the losties and with all the “others” but what is interesting is that the losties are all in the role of customers and the “others” are the workers but the one thing that doesnt fit is that Hurley was a working? Interesting.

    The show always referd to cons and a long con. Hurley is setting everyone up for the long con in which he is an other. Dun Dun Dunnnnn.

    Let me know your thoughts.

  180. Tasha says:

    I will totally buy the fact that Hurley is an Other and doesn’t even know it? LOL

    Kind of like Locke was on the plane and now he is an other.
    I see all the connections with Hurley and there was something else that happened last night that I don’t remember, or maybe it was in last weeks episode where I was thinking, “How the heck would Hurley even know that???”

  181. Tricia says:

    Anita:

    My impression of her speaking different languages was simply that she was in shock and mumbling. She is obviously fluent in several languages, and in her injured state just got confused. When she was lucid enough to realize that people around her were speaking English, she started speaking it as well.

  182. Nick says:

    [quote comment="53491"]Anita:

    My impression of her speaking different languages was simply that she was in shock and mumbling. She is obviously fluent in several languages, and in her injured state just got confused. When she was lucid enough to realize that people around her were speaking English, she started speaking it as well.[/quote]

    I agree completely, I think it was her being disoriented and confused, and obviously hurt. Considering her eyes were closed while she was speaking, for the most part, that was my impression.

  183. MasterPo says:

    Hurley isn’t an Other. We’ve seen too many flash backs that show he isn’t. Neither is Locke but he might be manipulated by Ben, as Locke has a history of being duped.

    As for the flare gun, yea I totally agree it was sooooo stupid. Not just Lost but on soooooooo many other shows and movies you see some adult pick up a gun, pull the trigger ans say “Ooops”. Like in this day & age you don’t know what a gun is and not to pull the trigger unless you mean it?!

    ps- I doubt Des had reloaded the flare gun when he was threatening Patchy with it. And I think Patchy knew that too.

  184. MasterPo says:

    [quote comment="53491"]Anita:

    My impression of her speaking different languages was simply that she was in shock and mumbling. She is obviously fluent in several languages, and in her injured state just got confused. When she was lucid enough to realize that people around her were speaking English, she started speaking it as well.[/quote]

    110% agree.

  185. Jocco says:

    The only way that Hurley could be an Other is if someone got to him in Austrailia. Maybe something like he could lose the curse if they would do what they say.

  186. Jocco says:

    sorry, if he would do what they say

  187. whatif says:

    I don’t think hurley is an other.. why would he expose nathan in Season 1 when he compiled the list of survivors upon Jack’s request??

  188. whatif says:

    I don’t think Hurley is an other, or why would he expose Nathan – a fellow other- when he was asked to compile a list for the 815 survivors??

  189. sue says:

    If Hurley is an Other,that would explain why they let him go and kept Kate, Jack and Sawyer at the end of last season.He also asked Juliet why she wasn’t there on the beach when they were kidnapped and she said it was her day off. He seemed satisfied with that answer.LOL!
    I think Jin’s real father will turn out to be the guy in the Dharma videos. The Others tested Walt to see if he had any abilities and they are interested in the children. Maybe they are waiting for a ‘special child’ for unknown reasons. Jin’s and Sun’s child could be the one they are waiting for. It would tie in nicely with all the other biblical references in the story.

  190. Tina says:

    [quote comment="53506"]If Hurley is an Other,that would explain why they let him go and kept Kate, Jack and Sawyer at the end of last season.He also asked Juliet why she wasn’t there on the beach when they were kidnapped and she said it was her day off. He seemed satisfied with that answer.[/quote]

    Eh, not good enough proof for me given all the flash backs we’ve already seen of Hurley. He seems WAY too goodnatured to be an Other. I figurd they let him go because he didn’t serve any other purpose besides being a reliable messenager, I mean everyone loves him and believes what he says. No way he’s an Other

  191. LostDamery says:

    Ok that was a great episode and getting closer to another layer of the LOST onion or what I call my “Beneath the planet of the Apes reveal.”
    As always a quick 2 cents to bring you along the path:
    1) Naomi (as ABC has called her) is really from the outside and I think they are really in an alternate time and not so much the future or past, but parallel. 4th dimension so to speak. She is hunting for Desmond but is really with another group of others I like to call the undergrounders or overseers and is just a messenger about the Penny and Desmond communication BLIP!
    2) Death on the island sends you to the judges (underground) who judge you and send you back to another Plane of time as has happened to Desmond and I suspect Locke. I don’t think Mikhail was dead but as described earlier “Only mostly dead” as I suspect Paulo and Nikki are too …roaming the island underbelly.

    Come on, are you with me brotha’
    ok then, see you in another life!

  192. afro jack says:

    They bult Hurley up to be this great guy for a huge twist in the plot. That is what makes this show so good. You never know what is going to happen. Also, Hurley was the one who got the planes manifest, he wanted to know who was on that plane and is playing everyone that he is a great guy.

  193. mel says:

    i agree, why wouldn’t sun have an abortion. if neither of them are going to survive. it would be the logical thing to do.

  194. Erin says:

    I don’t believe Hurley is an other for a second. He’s a nice guy (maybe not the brightest) in a bad situation. No way is he bad. The guilt would drive him over the edge (look how he felt about the deck collapse!)

  195. katesFriend says:

    Ok, took me a while to read all the posts, but here are my thoughts:

    to everyone mentioning the plane crash being a cover up, not to get all conspiracy theory on you guys, but I’m sure the US gov’t (or any ohter gov’t for that matter) would really want to put any kind of thoughts about alternate realities, hidden places, etc to rest (a la bermuda triangle, aliens, etc) and so they know about the island (or at least that something like the island exists) and are just reassuring everyone that the whole flight died so no one questions where the folks are

    also, as far as i can tell no one has commented on this, but Mikhail said “i already died once this week” significance?

    either he is just being sarcastic, or there is something that allows people to die more than once

    also, did anyone notice what the combination was when Sun’s dad got the money out of his safe to give to her

    if it is THE numbers, he is definitely in on this whole Dharma, Mittelos, Hanso conspiracy

    finally (so for being so long winded) but I also watch House (awesome dr show that is usu true to life) and one episode was about a fetus that had something really wrong with it and that is why it was killing the mom, so it was something wrong with the baby, not the mom

    ok, that’s it, enjoy!

  196. MKS says:

    [quote comment="53458"]I found it funny that the parachick new immediately all about Flight 815 upon Hurley mentioning it. I don’t know about the rest of you, but I don’t remember the flight numbers of every plane that goes down out of every other country in the world. She new immediately which flight he was talking about and exactly where it flew out of. Makes me wonder if she had intentions behind saying that.[/quote]
    If the plane was really off course and “lost” for a while, there would have been extensive media coverage. When the plane was finally found, I’m sure the coverage would also have been non-stop. Since this happened only three months ago (assuming the time on the island is the same), any informed person would know and remember seeing it on TV.

  197. katesFriend says:

    also, about hurley

    lets not forget he was the only one that had a connection to the numbers pre-crash

    i don’t know the significance of this, but he is connected to the numbers some how

  198. MKS says:

    If the plane was really off course and “lost” for a while, there would have been extensive media coverage. When the plane was finally found, I’m sure the coverage would also have been non-stop. Since this happened only three months ago (assuming the time on the island is the same), any informed person would know and remember seeing it on TV.

  199. Jono says:

    While reading all of these posts, I just realized something. About one of the posts above, that discusses about an underground judge or something, that one sentence could mean everything about the show: “I’ll see you in another life.” It may not sum up everything, but for some reason, I have a feeling that we will be going back to Desmond saying that alot. Maybe it is that the producers want to have a reason so that they can say: “It was sitting there all along! One little line said by a character.” Just one of those “oh my god, we could have known about all of this by just understanding that line.” moments. Good posting you guys! Obviously (and with no disrespect to the person who created and those who agreed with this) Hurley is not an other. It would be a very interesting twist, but it is just not possible. We know too much of him already. We know about his past, we know that he figured out that Ethan was an other, and he was on the plane too! If he could be an other, than any one of the people on the island could be an other. Penny could be an other for all we know ;-). I dont mean to offend you, but I think that the possiblility of a lostie being an other (or anyone else that is not on the island currently) is slim to none. Great episode, I would like to say that those last 10 seconds in my opinion revealed (if it is true) the biggest piece of information in the whole series so far. I would wonder, however, if the combo to the safe did indeed include the numbers. I remember it having around 6 numbers to it. Can somebody check to see if I am correct?

  200. Jones says:

    Re: Mikhael: One of the deleted scenes on the season one dvd compares happenings on the island to a soap opera, with Kate saying something like “it’s not a soap opera till an evil twin shows up.” Based on that, we should have known somebody would be coming back from the dead. Maybe the new Jack is an other who simply had total face reconstruction in order to look like the real Jack.

  201. MasterPo says:

    I think Patchy was being sarcastic when he said he died once already that week. Same with Juliet when she said it was her day off.

    As for the plane wreckage, since most seems to have fallen in the water and there is at least some underwater connection between the island and the outside world I suppose it’s possible some debris and bodies got sucked out the underwater entrance and were found by the outside world. Also, keep in mind how powerful and influential Hanso is. They could easily have engineered a fake plane crash site and bodies.

  202. MasterPo says:

    Jono – Des’s line is “See you in another life Brother”, not ‘afterlife’.

    (BTW, the big boss in my office goes around calling people ‘brother’. I doubt he was ever a monk! ;-) ).

  203. MKS says:

    I don’t think Juliette was lying to Sun about the baby’s DOC. They have been on the island about 90 days and she said the fetus is about 53 days now. That is a big difference. If Sun had conceived off the island she would be in her second trimester- dying just about now. It also would not work with all the “time moves at a different pace on the island” theories.

  204. Mark Jensen says:

    The first number Mr. Paik pushes is 7. Would have been an awesome detail, but maybe too revealing and “over-used” at this point.

  205. katesFriend says:

    [quote comment="53529"]The first number Mr. Paik pushes is 7. Would have been an awesome detail, but maybe too revealing and “over-used” at this point.[/quote]

    i agree, but they showed us him pushing the numbers so i felt like it would mean something:

    they don’t show us things for no reason

  206. MKS says:

    I don’t think Naomi is an Other. I also think that Penny is with her and the pack they found was Penny’s, not Naomi’s. Now that Hurley drew attention to the location by shooting of the flare-gun (whether on purpose or not), the Others will come and find Penny (if they don’t have her already) while our guys transport Naomi back to their camp. This will create a showdown between the Others and the Losties. The Losties will have an adventage though, and that is Desmond. His visions always include him and/or the ones he cares about and he will see where Penny is being held. He will also see something that will allow the Losties to have a heads-up.

  207. poopypants says:

    [quote comment="53525"]Re: Mikhael: One of the deleted scenes on the season one dvd compares happenings on the island to a soap opera, with Kate saying something like “it’s not a soap opera till an evil twin shows up.” Based on that, we should have known somebody would be coming back from the dead. Maybe the new Jack is an other who simply had total face reconstruction in order to look like the real Jack.[/quote]

    Right on.I think the “Jack” at the beach protecting Juliet is not the “Jack” we have come to know and love.Over the last 3 to 4 episodes we have all these seemingly unnesessary camera shots of “Jacks” tattoos,a little foreshadowing there I think.The “EvilTwin” is about to reveal himself soon and we will have the “Game Changer” Cuse and Lindoff were commenting about a few weeks ago in their podcast,thoughts?

  208. DocH says:

    I am still trying to figure out Mikhails’ little pop-in visit. He wasn’t just trucking through the forest for no good reason. He was out & about and enroute to a specific area. He did not have any supplies (pack, canteen) or even a weapon. Patchy always has a weapon. Remember Ben & Juliet approaching Mikhails’ agriculture outpost – Ben starts talking loud “hey, its’ us… don’t kill us”. So with no supplies or a weapon, Mikhail was on a short mission/errand and because of where he was on the island, had no reason to believe he would encounter the Lost Boys scouting party. Where did he come from that he felt secure enough to venture out quickly? A hatch we are not familiar with or from the underground tunnel network that laces the island?

    I think he was looking ‘specifically’ for the downed parachutist. Most good bailout equipment (chute/beacon) not only has the flashing light beacon that we saw, it also has an electronic radio beacon that activates during “opening shock” as the parachute pops open. That way injured/unconscious jumpers can be searched for by rescue forces. Though Mikhails’ comm gear was blown-up, other assets on the island likely triangulated the downed Naomi location to within a few hundred meters. Mikhail simply caught the cross-island express bus (underground), and headed to the surface to locate the nearby parachutist. Do you remember the surprise and hesitation on his face when he charged out of the forest to see the Losties? Of course he made a beeline to the sight when he saw the flare, but he just assumed it was the parachutist he was sent to recover that fired the flare. The fact that Naomi/Mikhail speak similar languages makes me not only think that they are on the same team – they probably know each other too (and well).

  209. MKS says:

    First Mikhail and Naomi do not speak similar languages. He speaks Russian, which is no way similar to Portugese, Chinese, or Italian (which by the way I did not hear her speak). I also don’t think that Mikhail is still with the Others. I think he is in a similar situation as Juliette and wants to leave the island. Getting Locke to push him through the fence was a way for him to fake his death. The Losties assumed he was dead and that is what they told Ben. I think Mikhail might have been able to contact someone on the outside and is/ has been waiting for rescue. That is why he ran to the place where the flare came from, thinking it might be his ship out of there. Once he realized it was not, he wanted to bail. Also a reason for him to steal the phone (by the way, I think he might have swiped a chip fromit or something for his own equipment).

  210. poopypants says:

    Patchy either took a chip or something from the sat-phone to make it inoperative or he replaced a chip so that when the sat-phone does work it goes straight to ole Ben.I would say “Naomi” is backup called by Patchy or Ben and she has a crew with her,expect fireworks soon I would say.

    -And a post further up the scroll asked why the Island didn’t fix Patchys eye? Well apparently the ole island just dont do eyes,just look at that thyroid case,ole bug eyed Ben,this island dont do eyes.

  211. Mark Jensen says:

    Comment 206:

    Why would Penny have a portugeese book?

  212. poopypants says:

    sry MKS ,I didnt realize it took me more that 10 minutes to writa a post,lol.

  213. poopypants says:

    sry MKS didnt realize it took me 10 minutes to write that ,lol.

  214. nicunurse says:

    Okay, lets see if this works first

  215. nicunurse says:

    Okay..Juliet lied to Sun about the DOC…. First, you don’t do abdominal ultrasounds until 8 weeks (which is 56 days, not 53); you do them transvaginally instead, second, there is no STRONG fetal heart at 8 weeks…it is hard to hear and not strong until at least 10-12 weeks. Additionally, morning sickness resolves after 12-14 weeks so Sun, who said she was through with morning sickness (meaning she had morning sickness) could not still be in her first trimester (which is 12-13 weeks). Also, Sun will feel baby movement, known as quickening, like a flutter, at around 18 weeks, 20 for a first time mom. Jack will realize this (and Jack will realize that Sun would not be at 53 days if she was done with morning sickness) and when Sun, soon, feels the baby, Jack will be able to tell how far along she is (any health care professional would know this, even an Orthopedic Surgeon). I can’t wait for Jack to realize that Juliet is lying to Sun…why is she lying…is she trying to take samples from Sun to save others or to see what hormone levels Sun has? Sun will let her do whatever she wants because Juliet will say she is trying to “save her.” Also, Juliet tells sun they die in the middle of the second trimester, giving Sun lots of time before she “dies.” I thought, in a previous episode, the woman died trying to give birth, a term pregnancy I thought. Certainly they were not set up to save a 26 weeker…even Juliet would know that you would need extra help to deliver a baby in the middle of the second trimester.
    All from here! Back to the NICU

  216. nicunurse says:

    OH someone nailed it earlier when they said that Juliet will claim to Ben that she figured out and solved the problem because she said into the tape that Sun is 53 days. When Sun doesn’t die halfway through (and she won’t since she conceived off the island), Ben will think Juliet figured out what to do and Juliet will be able to go home. THAT is why Juliet is lying about the doc.

  217. Hammer says:

    [quote comment="53528"]I don’t think Juliette was lying to Sun about the baby’s DOC. They have been on the island about 90 days and she said the fetus is about 53 days now. That is a big difference. If Sun had conceived off the island she would be in her second trimester- dying just about now. It also would not work with all the “time moves at a different pace on the island” theories.[/quote]
    You have a point, except if Sun conceived off the island, she WOULD NOT be dying. That’s the beauty of Juliet POSSIBLE plan. If Sun was 90 days and conceived on the island, she would be dying about now. Since she is not dying, Ben wouldn’t be able to tell the truth of DOC at this time.

  218. Hammer says:

    By the way…as much as I love this theory that Juliet lied about the DOC, I feel like it is Jin’s baby because D&C said we would find out who the father was in the episode. So since we don’t know for sure that Juliet lied…

  219. Lesley says:

    I have a couple more comments and random thoughts. I think Juliet may be lying about Sun’s preganancy as stated above to save herself and get off the island. That seems to be her main focus. And what “sample” is she going to get from Kate? She did not take a “sample” from Sun, right?

    Perhaps flygirl saw people coming who were unrelated to her mission. Wouldn’t someone connected to Ben’s people be trying to figure out what happended to the Others and check out their lack of communication by now?

    Maybe flygirl was not in the helicopter at all but a high flying plane. Didn’t someone last week say that jumping from a heli was not possible? Does that mean the other person(s) swam in from the ocean? (We certainly saw a big splash.)

    I am guessing that only Ben, Ethan and Alpert know about the time anomaly on the island and Ben has not shared that information with anyone else. Remember that even Patchy thought they could leave via sub BEFORE the Purple Sky. Ben told Locke his people needed to believe they could leave. If they cannot leave how are Alpert and Ethan coming and going?

    Ben and the Hostiles were on the island long before Dharma and according to Patchy, they won the war so what are they doing there? Guarding paradise?

    I like the dual timeline theory but how would that affect pregnant women, unless their wombs age immediately upon landing on the island? Claire nearly went into labor right after the crash, right? I also got the impression that Juliet had tried to save each of the mothers with surgery so coming there to die did not mean they waited there to die.

    Patchy probably had burst eardrums that were mended by the island. His comment regrrding having already died was just BS because the Losties thought he died. Sonic barriers are not always lethal it depends on the frequency. I am sticking with my theory that it is a Smokey fence. I don’t think anyone is coming back from the dead.

    I love that the perspective has changed from Jin being the bad guy in season one to Sun having put him in that predicament by trying to save his honor. (The Russian dolls again!) There is a constantly evolving perspective about everything and everyone in this show. Like a big circle..hmmmmmmm Everyone’s comments are excellent! I am going to be thinking about this until next week.

  220. JenA says:

    I’ve read the 200+ posts and only one person mentions that the parachuteGirl spoke Spanish, Italian or Portuguese and Chinese. Spanish first, Hurly translated to something like she is hurt and dying, than later spoke Portuguese (or Italian) to Patchy but Patchy translated something different than what she really said, and also spoke Chinese to Jin. I barely speak my native American  so I can’t translate but I am wondering if she said something significant in the foreign language and each translator (Hurly with Spanish, Patchy with Portuguese & Jin with Chinese) had a motive to lie about what she said.

    • So did she speak Chinese to Jin and if so what is the translation?

    • Were her first words Spanish to Hurley and did he translate it correctly?

    • And what does she mean by “I am not alone”?

    And Jim Krzyzak, I too thought something came in behind Juliette just as she was saying “I hate you”. But I haven’t watched it a second time.

  221. Hammer says:

    Lesly – I belive that the sample from Kate would be unrine or blood for a preg. test.

    JenA – I watched a couple of times and no one followed Juliet back in…there was her own shadow on a translucent door, but no one else.

  222. dragonfly says:

    [quote comment="53413"]MasterPo: If Penny wanted to send somebody who could survive this perilous journey, she would have sent some Rambo dude. Why didn’t send the eskimos?

    Paracutie said she wasn’t alone, so you’ve got believe that there are more hotties coming.[/quote]
    That is so sexist. The women on this show are just as badass and tough as the men- do you even remember ana lucia? Anyway, your comments are offensive. And her name is Naomi- not paracutie.

  223. dragonfly says:

    [quote comment="53080"]First, I take credit for comparing the evolution of the third season into a soap opera, viz the softer Sawyer, the aloof Jack, the inactive Sayid, and the coward Desmond who willing accepts this characterization from his fiance and brother superior (see the Catch-22 thread), accompanied by the emergence of the strong plot leaders: Kate, Juliet.

    Second, Will, your assertion that the xy contributor could be Jin, Jae Lee, or any other thing else is conveniently patently noncomittal. Your 3 possibilities are *all* possibilites.

    Third, Sun was not kidnapped by the Others–that was Charlie.

    Fourth, according to my understanding of why conception on the island produces a fatal result for both mother and fetus, is that somehow the the placental barrier is breeched and the mother’s immune system is activated against the fetus which is recognized as foreign tissue, precipitating a strong auto-immune reaction by the mother, thereby affecting both. This is something like how strep throat can cause rheumatic fever leading to heart failure. During the One of Us episode Juliet mistakenly says that her treatment would prevent Claire’s immune system from shutting down. Jack should have picked up on the fact that the correct treatment would have been an immunosuppressive as is used in allo-transplant patients.[/quote]
    Bizzy, I’m a medical student and you clearly don’t know what you are talking about. The reason why people living with AIDS die is because of the diseases they catch due to their “lack” of an immune system. Also, I think your comments are incredibly sexist. In response to your “Why didn’t they sent a rambo instead of paracutie comment”- the women on this show are just as badass and tough as the men (remember Ana Lucia?). And her name is Naomi, not paracutie.

  224. Omar Kamel says:

    Well, Patchy, yeah. Well. We’ll see.

    As for the flight and the passengers being all dead – my provisional hypothesis is that in fact the ‘reality’ Naomi comes from is one in which yes, the flight was found, and they are all dead. The reality we’ve been following on the show is an alternate/parallel reality in which the plane crashed. You get to the Island by way of some wormhole between worlds.

    A bit out there, but otherwise, you’d have to accept the purgatory theory – which, if true, will lead to somebody murdering the creators, or you’d have to accept that Naomi is trying out a poorly plotted con. I reject both possibilities. Therefore – both realities must be true.

  225. LostDamery says:

    Hey look I found a little more change…
    2 more cents to add to the pot:
    1) A few people have mentioned the evil twin, What if they are not in purgatory but are actually a doppelgänger of their real selves in the parallel time? The only way you can die on the Island is if your real you dies in the real world.
    2) I think we are missing the point that there is another group of others some where on under or near the island and Naomi is working with them and the smoke monster.

  226. Phoeber says:

    This may be way out there- but I was thinking about all of the literary connections this show has regarding character names – Ethan Rom. ie Ethan Frome , Henry Gale – Wizard of Oz etc. I was thinking Jacob – could be from Jacob’s ladder? Although I do realize that is a movie not a book – and if I recall Jacob was the guys son..

  227. losty says:

    My old schoolfriend who works in honolulu told me that he went to visit his co-worker’s parents who live near to where the beach shots are filmed just after christmas. His father says that apparently abc are renting a huge wharehouse in which they store pieces of plane wreckage. This must mean that they are planning to use this in filming again, either in other shots of the crash/aftermath or that they might (after watching the end of DOC) use it to film scenes of the staged/other crash site where everyone is dead.

    Now i’m thinking of it why do we never see the wreckage anymore? It must just be a continuity/don’t leave plane parts on the beach thing.

  228. Toeknee says:

    [quote comment="53578"]
    Now i’m thinking of it why do we never see the wreckage anymore? It must just be a continuity/don’t leave plane parts on the beach thing.[/quote]
    I believe the thinking is that when the high tide came in, it washed away the parts of the plane that were on the beach. I’m not 100% sure that is possible – there were some massive parts of the plane on that beach.

  229. Toeknee says:

    [quote comment="53521"]If the plane was really off course and “lost” for a while, there would have been extensive media coverage. When the plane was finally found, I’m sure the coverage would also have been non-stop. Since this happened only three months ago (assuming the time on the island is the same), any informed person would know and remember seeing it on TV.[/quote]
    I agree, and furthermore, Hurley told the girl himself that they were on Oceanic 815. So it’s not like she had to come up with the flight number herself.

  230. lost chicka says:

    1) if i remember right, the Others aren’t with Dharma & the Others killed all the Dharma people. So y would Dharma cover up the 815 crash?

    2) i still say (& want) naomi is with the Others. patcy was right around the corner watching to make sure she didn’t die. maybe y’all haven’t noticed this yet but Ben was tortured & didn’t give his people up & Miss Clue was willing to die for the Others so y wouldn’t Naomi? I’ve said this before & i’ll say it again nobody thinks that they’re really an Other till it’s to late. NObodyknew Ethan was one till he took Claire & Charlie, nobody thought Benry was one, nobody thought Michael was working with them until Ana Lucia & Libby got killed & Kate, Jack, Hurley, & Sawyer got handed over to the Others, AND everybody believed Julliette till the very end of One of Us.

    so naomi spoke chineese, portugeese, italian, spanish, & maybe more? where’s she from?

    3) i really hope kate ain’t preggers. nothing wrong with bein pregnant, just don’t want her to wind up that way. but she is 2 times more likely to wind up preggers now. but i say the writers’ll lead us on for a couple of episodes and we’ll all be convinced she’s preggers & then we’ll find out she ain’t. i just don’t see kate getting preggers & dying.

    4) pretty sure i said this before but heck i’ll say it one more time. boone, libby, & the cop guy all took longer to die cause Jack interfered w/ all of em & didn’t let the island just do it’s work.

    5) i’ve only read up to comment 130 & i can’t wait till i read all the comments to post mine. sorry =). i know ur supossed to read all but please just let me get away with it! Patchy wasn’t running from the Others. He seems to loyal to them. & besides, y would u stop if ur running from the people who know the island better than n e body else? MayB he was running to the spot where parachik fell to check on her.

    6) Julliette’s mission is to get everybody’s fertility tests. If I remember that’s what she said into the recorder. It’s not only for Kate’s but for everybody’s. Sun’s pregnancy was known by Julliette (i think they made Jack tell em & he was askin about Sun’s preggnancy to see if she had been tooken to the med hatch yet. but it is like the old jack to want to get into everybody else’s buisness.) she just acted surpised. they seem to be Oscar winning actors.

    Who said that the sperm count is 5x higher on the island is true? maybe she just wants sun to tell that to Kate so she will want to see if she’s preggers since now she’s 10x more likely to be preggers (if it’s true).

    i think Julliette is pure evil & have thought that from the very begining. i don’t care if she was a good person – people change. she’s evil. i think she said i hate you to ben at the end cause 1) she’s had some type of a relationship with him (incase u can’t tell i luv that idea ;D), 2) she’s just mad that he hasn’t let her get off the island yet. i don’t think she’s gonna switch sides & go with the losties. cum on! she wants OFF the island not to STAY on it.

    7) Ethan not being dead seems like a good idea except wouldn’t Goodwin be alive by now then too? But Hurley did say something about running in the jungle from Ethan so who knows?

  231. Toeknee says:

    [quote comment="53506"]If Hurley is an Other,that would explain why they let him go and kept Kate, Jack and Sawyer at the end of last season.He also asked Juliet why she wasn’t there on the beach when they were kidnapped and she said it was her day off. He seemed satisfied with that answer.LOL!
    [/quote]
    Not to beat a dead horse with this subject, but…..
    afro jack made some good points in comment 179 about some facts that could support the theory that Hurley is an Other. But I think there’s much more evidence showing Hurley is not an Other, as many people have already posted.

    But noone yet has mentioned what is, to me, the most conclusive evidence that Hurley is not an Other – the conversation he had with Juliet on the beach. If he’s an Other, Juliet would know that, and in that conversation on the beach, when noone else was in earshot, he wouldn’t have had to pretend he was a Lostie. He would have gone back to acting like an Other, and ask Juliet about her reasons for being there and telling her the results of his “investigation” or whatever you call it that he was supposedly carrying out while living with the Losties. But instead they acted pretty much like strangers, which is exactly what they are.

  232. Julie says:

    I’m seeing all this talk about purgetory. Everyone forgetting that Carlton Cuse flat out said in a podcast that they ARE NOT in purgetory?

  233. joeliskey says:

    locke is jesus.

  234. lost chicka says:

    my top 5:

    1) i know this is kinda off subject but i can see Widmore being in on the island & making Des go there since every daddy wants to keep his little girl from growing up and getting married. But i can not see Paik being in on it. Why would he want his baby girl on the island? I mean, i guess they didn’t have the best relationship but wouldn’t he want to take Sun off as soon as he found out she was there?

    2) i think everybody else burried is dead but patcy lived cause he didn’t really die i think it was just an implant. maybe the fence activates the implant in people? i really am beginning to think that the fence is only there to keep people from entering into the Others’ territory & smoky out. i mean, it doesn’t have any skeletons around i’d think that they would keep dead bodies there as a warning and nobody’s tried to just pass through it. and also about people who die on the island, Ethan would’ve tooken Charlie out by now, Goodwin would’ve shot Ana Lucia before Michael got to her, Picket would’ve killed Sawyer & Julls by now, and Sun would probably be murdered by that girl she shot. and they wouldn’t be so concerned about the mothers dying since they would be alive again in a couple of days. I could go on, but i’ll save y’all the trouble.

    3) so naomi said “i’m not alone” to patchy. last ep we found out des’s ex was named ruth & in the bible ruth followed naomi. religion seems to play alot into the show so is ruth gonna show up? just can’t write a comment without including her! i’ve never had a punchered lung before but something tells me if i have a punctured lung i wouldn’t be to remember the numbers of a plane crash. she just doesn’t seem right.

    4) i know i’m going way back but comment 154 by spiralturtle makes a lot of sense about if Michael & Walt made it to the outside world. i think this is more proof that Naomi is a friggin other & can’t be trusted. i REALLY want her to B an other if u haven’t already figured that out.

    5) just can’t stop talkin about julliette. i think that now she’s “full blood other” and the branding or tatoo or whatever they gave her means that. i think now she is totally with the Others & is willing to do whatever they tell her to do & now she’s completely turned evil. it’s been 80+ days since she saw the tape of her sister & nephew a LOT could’ve happened between then & now.

  235. Leah says:

    Lesley said:

    Another possibility is that in real time everyone is already dead. But since time travels more slowly on the island perhaps they just have not died yet.

    Lesley, I had thought of that but now I think that if that were true their story would be over now that they’ve been found. This reminds me of A Wrinkle in Time, so if the losties live through the wrinkle and are back up to linear time they would realize they are dead.

  236. lost chicka says:

    My Top 5:

    1) Hurley is NOT an other. he’s a cluts, kinda dumb sometimes, to nice. He hasn’t been missing for days in which the Others could’ve gotten to him & like somebody already said he would’ve had a more dramatic talk with Julliette & they would’vee told us by now. They did when Michael was. But then again i am kinda biased since i’m one of the biggest fans of the bigest guy on the island. =) Judging by commercials for next week Locke ain’t with teh Others. he’s easily manipulated, he’s an island worshiper, & he’s kinda stupid, but not an other. Jack is a different story though. Jack is actin kinda wierd & he was with the Others for a while & already helped emout. I’ve never liked him much either so again i’m biased. I’m sure the others threw him a couple bones & were probably like “u do this or we shoot her (julliete) right now” so he went with em.

    2) jin doesn’t speak chinese, he’s korean. just incase we all missed this little fact Korena ain’t Chinese.

    3) Sun was preggers before she came to the island. It could still be jin’s tho. she sorta avoaided the q. Julliette is going to try & gett off the island by sayin i’ve done it but Ben wil have a reason fore keeping her.

    4) Des is the only one who promised to act like he never saw Patchy so Charlie or Hurley better tell Sayid or somebody.

    5) Didn’t sun’s dad punch in 77 to get the $$$$$? Does anyone remember the numbers Locke punched in from Enter 77? Something tells me that 4815162342 is getting worn out & to easy to catch so D&C have decided to switch em. Wasn’t 53 one of the numbers to?

  237. Pinto says:

    i was wondering why sun asked her dad for 100 thousand DOLLORS instead of yen? im not sure if it matters but it was still weird how he had dollors in his safe

  238. speechwriterLLC says:

    JUST HAD A HUUUGE REALIZATION:

    Ever since Desmond’s first ‘time travel’, the Mittelos anagram for ‘lost time’ and the backwards “only fools are enslaved by time and space” I’d been thinking about he possibility of multiple universes and that the Island is located in a different 4th demention that ran on a different time.

    MANY PEOPLE HAVE THOUGHT THAT TIME MOVED SLOWER ON THE ISLAND, BUT THIS IS NOT POSSIBLE!!

    A couple episodes ago, Juliet’s flashback showed Ben telling Richard to show footage of Juliet’s sister, Rachel. To verify the accuracy of the footage they show a newspaper with the date of the pilot episode when the plane supposedly crashed, in 2004. This date seemed to be consistent to the date that Juliet thinks it is. Therefore the date off of the island would be the same as the date on the island.

    WHILE THIS DOESN’T PROVE OR DISPROVE THE POSSIBILITY OF TIME TRAVEL, IT DOES IMPLY THAT TIME MOVES THE SAME ON THE ISLAND AS IT DOES OFF OF THE ISLAND!!

  239. polaralex says:

    Well, the episode was cute (-_-) but it still continues to show nothing new than just raise new questions…

    Well, the last line was CERTAINLY shocking… but I really think that they’re being so slow as a series.

    It is a big mistake that they decided to continue to 4th season… :|

    [] polaralex

  240. Jim Krzyzak says:

    I watched the episode again, just to see the final 5 minutes. THANKS ABC.COM since I already deleted it on my DVR. Anyway, I was wrong… the camera does pan a little right before Juliet says “I hate you” but it’s not meant to look like someone just walked in behind her. Not sure what I saw when I first watched it… but after watching it again I’m pretty sure that it was meant for Ben. Sorry for confusion. :-)

  241. Nail says:

    The whole Hurley is an other comment proves my point that you can think pretty much anything you want about the story, and be able to convince yourself you might be right. The supernatural element via Smokey allows this.

    The show is awesome. After watching two seasons on DVD back to back prior to the start of this season, I think it is like watching a very long movie, NOT a TV show.

    I have to say, trying to follow the thread of these discussions and remembering what is said is like trying to remember tiny details from past episodes. Heck, I am starting to have a hard time remembering big details from past episodes.

    I enjoy watching the show and appreciate the details & clues (I do like the Riven/Myst quality of the show), but resolving the mystery of the show would be the biggest spoiler of all. I know its fun, but who knows, maybe it was already figured out (i.e.: purgatory), but if the directors told you that you were right, then what?

  242. Sawyer's Evil Twin says:

    One thing that struck me as odd was when Hurley took the sat phone and pretended to call his mom. ‘Hi mom’. Wouldn’t it be funny if his mom shows up in an episode or 2 to receive a phone call from Hurley saying exactly that! Of course she faints because she thinks he’s dead. I don’t see the reason to show us this unless their setting something up in future episodes. Or not….

  243. Jim Krzyzak says:

    Sorry if this has been said… but in the previews for next week it shows Locke trying to convince Sawyer to kill Ben (who has a hood over his head)… but the official description reads: A newly focused Locke breaks away from “The Others” in an attempt to persuade Sawyer to help rid them of a great nemesis that has caused nothing but pain in both of their lives.

    I have a huge feeling that it’s not Ben… it’s Locke’s dad and they finally reveal that he is also the man Sawyer is looking for (which everyone has already assumed).

  244. Harold says:

    Theory of Lost based on modern Physics:

    I think that much of what is happening on the island can be explained using some of the concepts that are used in modern physics.

    1-Black hole-A black hole is thought to occur when a star collapses. The gravity is so great that light cannot escape. Once an object reaches the “event horizon: around the black hole it is sucked and can never escape. Also, some scientists think that a black hole may act as a wormhole or portal to another location in space-time in our universe or to another universe.

    The island is some ways is like a black hole. The Island has unusual magnetic properties. Objects seem to crash into it all the time. It is impossible or at least difficult to leave the island. The submarine is used to leave and enter the island and is the episode with Juliette arriving on the island she has to be sedated because the ride is so violent when approaching the island. Also, warping of space-time is associated with black holes/the Island.

    2-Heissenbergs Uncertainty Principle-This is a theory is quantum mechanics. that stated that it is impossible to know the exact location and speed of an object. Another way of stating it is that by measuring the location or speed of an object one changes the object. This has to do with determinism. It used to me thought that using newtonian theories of physics that one could exactly predict what a complex system would do if one knew everthing about the system. So if you knew everything about every atom in a person and every force acting on that person you could exactly predict what would happen to that person. However, because of the uncertainty principle this is thought not to be true. No matter how much you know you can never exactly predict the future.

    This comes up on lost quite a bit. Desmond predicting the future and possible changing it. The issue of faith. Can we change our “destiny.”

    3-The multiverse. Modern physics using concepts such as string theory believes that there are many dimensions and possibly an infinite number of universes. Each universe may exist slightly out of phase with each other. So one universe may exist where the flight 815 crashes and another where it does not. In another universe the bodies may be found while in another universe the flight may crash without the bodies found.

    Multiple dimensions also may explain thing on the island that appear magical. For example for a 2 dimensional creature on a flat surface events occuring in three dimensional space would appear magical. In the same way on the island when things happen with the ‘smoke monster” maybe we are unable to perceive events occuring in higher dimensions impacting on a three dimensional world.

    So to sum up, the island is a “singularity”. It has properties because of its magnetism that make it act like a black hole. Space-time is warped and quantum mechanics is needed to explain occurences. Perhaps the others can somehow monitor different universies where there are different time-lines. So that when Ben shows Juliette that he cured her sisters cancer and that her sister had a baby that is just one potential timeline that he reveals to her. All of the unusual events on the island occur because when there are extremes of forces such a gravity or magnetism,quantum mechanics tell us that anything can occur. Nothing is impossible. Events may have a low probability but they can occur. Desmond may also able to see different time lines. He is therefore not really seeing the future but only seeing possible “futures” or “pasts” that may or may not be part of the time line we are observing.

    I have not tried to expain everything but just to say that the crux of my theory would have to be that the island represents a “singularity” because of its unusual magnetic properties and that ordinary physics that we use on a day-to-day basis cannot be used to explain things on the Island.

  245. vinny2cubes says:

    Sun didn’t ask for 100,000 yen because that’s Chinese currency… not Korean. She should have asked for 92 Million Won which would be about 100,000 USD.

  246. spiralturtle says:

    Polaralex wrote:

    Well, the episode was cute (-_-) but it still continues to show nothing new than just raise new questions…

    Well, the last line was CERTAINLY shocking… but I really think that they’re being so slow as a series.

    It is a big mistake that they decided to continue to 4th season… :|

    Polaralex, one of the rules is “be kind and helpful”. and “Be constructive”. This site is for intelligent discussion of Lost, so if you don’t have anything to contribute to that discussion, please don’t post.

  247. MD says:

    [quote comment="53586"][quote comment="53578"]
    Now i’m thinking of it why do we never see the wreckage anymore? It must just be a continuity/don’t leave plane parts on the beach thing.[/quote]
    I believe the thinking is that when the high tide came in, it washed away the parts of the plane that were on the beach. I’m not 100% sure that is possible – there were some massive parts of the plane on that beach.[/quote]

    In season one they had to move up the beach because the tide had moved in too far. Those bodies/parts of the plane were what was discovered and everyone is thought to be dead.

  248. ifotophan says:

    Theory: HURLEY used to be on the island BEFORE the crash. I think Hurley was one of the individuals who used to push the numbers into the computer many years ago.

    He could have left the island and agreed to have his memory erased. But in his unconscious mind, the numbers remained since he pushed them every 108 minutes for God knows when.

    Hurley is also an EXPERT in table tennis (he beat Sawyer easily). The hatch had a ping pong table for the number pushers recreation.

    Those numbers meant something to him. He won the lottery using those numbers.

    Hurley isn’t dumb either – he was smart enough to trick Sawyer into thinking the losties were going to banish him (ala Ben).

    Why Hurley may be an Other:

    1. He created the list of the crash survivors.
    2. He didn’t want the hatch to be opened (end of Season 1).
    3. Ben sent him back to the losties in final episode of Season 2.
    4. He fired the flare.
    5. And in his flashback – in Sydney he acted like it was life or death that he had to be on the plane.

    I may have left something out – please add…

  249. Wm I says:

    Although, in general, I like the time warp and/or parallel universe theories, it IS possible that time is the same on the island as “real world” time. The island could be west of the international dateline in the Pacific and therefore crashed on the 22nd of September local time/date and published in the Miami paper the next day, the 22nd in Miami.

  250. SnappyPappy says:

    [quote comment="53698"]Sorry if this has been said… but in the previews for next week it shows…[/quote]Party Foul – Bullet #4 Right above where you typed your name “No spoilers or discussion of episode previews!”
    I’m following Bullet #5 “Be kind and helpful”.

  251. This “Hurley is an other” talk is driving me nuts. It’s probably the wrost theory I’ve ever heard regarding Lost.

    [quote comment="53626"]JUST HAD A HUUUGE REALIZATION:

    MANY PEOPLE HAVE THOUGHT THAT TIME MOVED SLOWER ON THE ISLAND, BUT THIS IS NOT POSSIBLE!!

    A couple episodes ago, Juliet’s flashback showed Ben telling Richard to show footage of Juliet’s sister, Rachel. To verify the accuracy of the footage they show a newspaper with the date of the pilot episode when the plane supposedly crashed, in 2004. This date seemed to be consistent to the date that Juliet thinks it is. Therefore the date off of the island would be the same as the date on the island.[/quote]

    This has been brought up at least twice before in the replies to this episode, and many times before in older episode comments.

    It doesn’t prove anything at all. If Mittelos can arrange for Juliet’s husband to be run over by a bus, they can certainly fake the date on a newspaper.

    It’s also quite possible that they recorded that when it actually happened, which would be in the past in real-world-time, and then sent it back to Ben to be played for Juliet when he wanted her to see the video, in island-time.

  252. DBM says:

    A few people have indicated that Juliette may have given Ben a false recording of the timing of Sun’s DOC, in hopes that after Sun lives Juliette will be allowed to leave the island. Why would this work? Ben is smart enough to know that Juliette might have faked it and would want proof, and any scientist (not sure Ben is a scientist, but he is overseeing Juliette’s research) will tell you that in order to prove something, the results must be replicable. Just “fixing” Sun is not enough to get Juliette off the island. Ben would need to know about the details of how this had worked, so he could do it again.

    Also, a minor point, but I don’t think Sun’s father gave her dollars as someone suggested, and I don’t think the conversations in Korean actually reference dollars (if someone speaks Korean, they could probably get an exact trans), but rather the sub-titles are just paraphrasing of the ideas that the writers want to get across.

  253. MKS says:

    Sun’s dad would have given her dollars (and Jin’s mother would have asked for dollars), because that is the currency most deals are done in internationally. Especially since her father’s deals were in a large part illegal ans the currency for illegal activity world wide is the dollar.

  254. lost chicka says:

    I always thought that the father of Sun’s baby was Jae Lee since the only point of that scene where they tell us she was cheatin on Jin was to say that Jae Lee is the daddy. So now that apparently Jin is tha papa, why did they show that scene to us? To jerk us around on a chain? To prove that Sun ain’t as innocent & sweet as we think?

    Harold: love that theory! it’s really good & makes a lot of sense (well for lost anyways).

    ifotophan: 1) didn’t they want to see who survived or something like that?
    2) he saw the numbers on it which he’s convinced are cursed. he seems pretty supersticious.
    3) y would they want hurley? apparently they just wanted kate to choose somebody to do the do with & they needed somebody to go back & warn everybody. y not pick the perfect person for the job?
    4) he’s a kluts! and he could still be cursed by the #s. don’t know if u haven’t noticed that already.
    5) he payed for his ticket & it was his mom’s birthday. tickets r usually non-refundable & nobody wants to make their mama mad!
    6) HURLEY IS NOT AN OTHER!!!!!!!!!

    the episode was one of the best, maybe the best of the season! i loved it! big sun & jin fan & the pregnancy had to be talked about sometime. this season has seemed to be kinda slow but i think it’s just cause of the long break with no reruns (which i’ve always liked) and to much of the Others & not enough of the Losties. i think/hope that next season will be better & they’ll just do reruns again to give us all a chance to refigure it all out. (sorry if i’m breakin one of the rules) lost has always seemed to go a little slow with answering big Qs but they did answer a couple in this ep: who sun’s baby is, patchy is still alive, the island has heeling powers which speeds up recovery, julliette’s mission…

  255. Jocco says:

    The quantum physices explanation of Lost makes the most sense to me. If you watch the move, “What the Bleep do we Know,” it seems like the place that D&C got a lot of their ideas. I thought that the movie itself was a little stupid, but it illustrates that all of the island’s questions can be answered with moden quantum theory.

  256. jorts says:

    Might Naomi be the Other who makes the food drops on the island?

  257. Rick says:

    So I’ve read through many of the comments, but haven’t seen mention of this: If ‘Naomi’ thought that the LOSTies were all dead, then what exactly was she doing there? If she thought they were dead, why did she say “Desmond”? Anybody have a translated transcript of what she said.

    I think it was pretty clear that she was in cahoots with Patchy. Perhaps she was communications reinforcement and the sat-radio was intended for Patchy. She was supposed to simply land near the others, but instead crash landed for whatever reason. He saw the first flare and was tracking her down when Hurley set off the second one.

    Given this, I’d say there are two possibilities:
    1.) She is related to the Penny-led search group but not aware that she’s searching for so somebody from flight 815
    2.) She is related to the others

    Given her apparent secret communique with patchy, I’m inclined to think it’s the latter.

  258. MKS says:

    [quote comment="53751"]So I’ve read through many of the comments, but haven’t seen mention of this: If ‘Naomi’ thought that the LOSTies were all dead, then what exactly was she doing there? If she thought they were dead, why did she say “Desmond”? Anybody have a translated transcript of what she said.

    I think it was pretty clear that she was in cahoots with Patchy. Perhaps she was communications reinforcement and the sat-radio was intended for Patchy. She was supposed to simply land near the others, but instead crash landed for whatever reason. He saw the first flare and was tracking her down when Hurley set off the second one.

    Given this, I’d say there are two possibilities:
    1.) She is related to the Penny-led search group but not aware that she’s searching for so somebody from flight 815
    2.) She is related to the others

    Given her apparent secret communique with patchy, I’m inclined to think it’s the latter.[/quote]
    I think Naomi was send by Penny to look for Desmond who has been on the island for three years now. She would not have known that the plane survivors would be on the island as well (which would explain why she was so surprised that they were the survivors of 815). I just can’t see her being part of the Others, given that she was A) looking for Desmond B) Desmond knew her helicopter was coming C) she was trying to let them know she was not alone (why risk saying so in front of the Losties if she was trying to give some secret message to Patchy?). I think Patchy came running because he saw the flare, not because he was looking for Naomi.

  259. Tina says:

    [quote comment="53698"]Sorry if this has been said… but in the previews for next week it shows Locke trying to convince Sawyer to kill Ben (who has a hood over his head)… but the official description reads: A newly focused Locke breaks away from “The Others” in an attempt to persuade Sawyer to help rid them of a great nemesis that has caused nothing but pain in both of their lives.

    I have a huge feeling that it’s not Ben… it’s Locke’s dad and they finally reveal that he is also the man Sawyer is looking for (which everyone has already assumed).[/quote]

    NO SPOILERS!

  260. Tina says:

    1. Sun’s father DID NOT giver her dollars, if you rewatch the episode you will see that the money he puts into the envelope is no in any way american dollars. I think the term “dollars” is a subtitle translation error. I don’t know for sure if Sun’s father gave her Korean money or not, they could be Yen, a currency many international business transactions occur in or maybe something totally different, but there aint no dollar bills that envelope.

    2. Dragonfly, I agree with you wholeheartedly, Buzzy burns my biscuits with the sexist comments too and I told them as much in one of my posts.

    3. Mulitverse theory?! I’ve been saying that forever to my friends and no one listens. Thank to those who thought it too, I feel validated. :)

  261. katesFriend says:

    Jocco: i like what the bleep do we know too, it was watered down so it would keep people who don’t know about physics interesting, but good movie

    Harold: I love the ideas, esp Heissenbergs Uncertainty Principle, that makes the most sense to me too

    also the idea about multiple dimensions and how smoky would look amazing, it reminds me of how Noew saw things (bullets, etc)in the Matrix

    Sawyer’s evil twin: I think you are right about the call to Hurley’s mom, they wouldn’t put that in there for no reason

    Finally, about the money and Sun’s dad, the money they showed was definitely not American currency

  262. katesFriend says:

    sorry tina, was typing, didn’t mean to repeat

  263. LostDamery says:

    LNF-Lets Not Forget,
    1) We have a variety of groups.
    a) The losties from the plane crash.
    b) Desmond from a boat crash.
    c) Rousseau from a boat crash.
    d) Naomi from apparent helicopter crash.
    e) Ben group of Dharma others
    f) Group of others brought by sub.(Karl, Juliet)
    g) The hostiles before the purge.
    h) And the Masters of the island, those damn dirty apes underground.
    2) The island sucked the plane in from Sept. 22 when Ben and the island was bending time to that date to prove to Juliet that her sister was ok. It just so happened that Desmond let the “hole” open and the plane flew in.
    3) Some on the island are frequent time jumpers.
    a) Desmond and he knows it.
    b) Charlie but his drugs have eaten those brain cells.
    c) Locke and he is not talking
    d) Claire and Jack have secrets they are not sharing
    e) Hurley but he just thinks he’s Crazy.

  264. MKS says:

    [quote comment="53762"]

    also the idea about multiple dimensions and how smoky would look amazing, it reminds me of how Noew saw things (bullets, etc)in the Matrix

    [/quote]

    _________________
    Remember, not everyone sees Smokie the same way. Locke saw a bright, beautiful light.

  265. Will says:

    [quote comment="53751"]So I’ve read through many of the comments, but haven’t seen mention of this: If ‘Naomi’ thought that the LOSTies were all dead, then what exactly was she doing there? If she thought they were dead, why did she say “Desmond”? Anybody have a translated transcript of what she said.

    I think it was pretty clear that she was in cahoots with Patchy. Perhaps she was communications reinforcement and the sat-radio was intended for Patchy. She was supposed to simply land near the others, but instead crash landed for whatever reason. He saw the first flare and was tracking her down when Hurley set off the second one.

    Given this, I’d say there are two possibilities:
    1.) She is related to the Penny-led search group but not aware that she’s searching for so somebody from flight 815
    2.) She is related to the others

    Given her apparent secret communique with patchy, I’m inclined to think it’s the latter.[/quote]
    Rick, remember that Desmond was already there, not on the plane, so therefore she could easily know his name and still believe there were no survivors of the flight 815 crash

  266. Tina says:

    [quote comment="53766"]sorry tina, was typing, didn’t mean to repeat[/quote]

    No worries, I do it too sometimes, you never can tell who is typing while you are.
    :)

  267. Tina says:

    [quote comment="53767"]LNF-Lets Not Forget,
    1) We have a variety of groups.
    a) The losties from the plane crash.
    b) Desmond from a boat crash.
    c) Rousseau from a boat crash.
    d) Naomi from apparent helicopter crash.
    e) Ben group of Dharma others
    f) Group of others brought by sub.(Karl, Juliet)
    g) The hostiles before the purge.
    h) And the Masters of the island, those damn dirty apes underground.
    2) The island sucked the plane in from Sept. 22 when Ben and the island was bending time to that date to prove to Juliet that her sister was ok. It just so happened that Desmond let the “hole” open and the plane flew in.
    3) Some on the island are frequent time jumpers.
    a) Desmond and he knows it.
    b) Charlie but his drugs have eaten those brain cells.
    c) Locke and he is not talking
    d) Claire and Jack have secrets they are not sharing
    e) Hurley but he just thinks he’s Crazy.[/quote]

    I doubt Charlie is a time jumper, he’s just addled from all that smack. Besides, Desmond recognized him in his flash, not the other way around. If they were both time jumpers wouldn’t they have recognized each other?

  268. katesFriend says:

    [quote comment="53769"][quote comment="53762"]

    also the idea about multiple dimensions and how smoky would look amazing, it reminds me of how Noew saw things (bullets, etc)in the Matrix

    [/quote]

    _________________
    Remember, not everyone sees Smokie the same way. Locke saw a bright, beautiful light.[/quote]

    I was responding to what Harold said about how 3 dimensions would look amazing to someone who only experience 2d before

  269. katesFriend says:

    also, about juliet being there for kate,

    she and ben saw kate and sawyer in the bear cages, so it would make sense that they would think she was the pregnant one

  270. katesFriend says:

    one more thing, i saw on Lostpedia they talk about LostVerse and RealVerse, for the alternate universe theory, i like it

  271. Rick says:

    [quote comment="53770"]Rick, remember that Desmond was already there, not on the plane, so therefore she could easily know his name and still believe there were no survivors of the flight 815 crash[/quote]

    Thanks, temporary brain fart. That’s what I get for posting at work. Now I’m back to thinking she’s seeking out Desmond but has no idea what’s going on and simply sided with the guy who was helping her out and understood her. The multi-lingual thing is still odd though.

  272. Rick says:

    Re: Dollars

    It’s not really an error, just a choice for clarity. The Korean ‘won’ is worth about a 1/10th of a cent. If they had said 100,000,000 won, very few people would have any idea how much money it is. Keeping it in dollars is less of a distraction than having everybody run off too look up the conversion rate.

  273. Will says:

    [quote comment="53781"][quote comment="53770"]Rick, remember that Desmond was already there, not on the plane, so therefore she could easily know his name and still believe there were no survivors of the flight 815 crash

    Thanks, temporary brain fart. That’s what I get for posting at work. Now I’m back to thinking she’s seeking out Desmond but has no idea what’s going on and simply sided with the guy who was helping her out and understood her. The multi-lingual thing is still odd though.[/quote]
    Rick, I agree that her multi-linguistics were odd, but I also think the fact that she had the photo of Penny and Desmond is peculiar as well. I’m not sure this got much discussion on the previous post, but if I recall, didn’t Desmond immediately leave Penny after they took the polaroid… So how could there be a duplicate copy? Am I wrong about that?

  274. Tina says:

    [quote comment="53785"][quote comment="53781"][quote comment="53770"][/quote]
    Rick, I agree that her multi-linguistics were odd, but I also think the fact that she had the photo of Penny and Desmond is peculiar as well. I’m not sure this got much discussion on the previous post, but if I recall, didn’t Desmond immediately leave Penny after they took the polaroid… So how could there be a duplicate copy? Am I wrong about that?[/quote]
    _________________________________

    In both of Desmond’s timeline’s there is a single photograph, but I think in the first timeline, she keeps the picture. I’m not sure of that part though. I can’t figure out how the duplicates exists unless there are two seperate realities existing simultaneously, one where Penny has a pic from which she could make thousands of duplicates (why Naomi as one) and one where only Desmond has a photo.

    The photo thing is itching my brain.

  275. poopypants says:

    [quote comment="53785"][quote comment="53781"][quote comment="53770"]Rick, remember that Desmond was already there, not on the plane, so therefore she could easily know his name and still believe there were no survivors of the flight 815 crash

    Thanks, temporary brain fart. That’s what I get for posting at work. Now I’m back to thinking she’s seeking out Desmond but has no idea what’s going on and simply sided with the guy who was helping her out and understood her. The multi-lingual thing is still odd though.[/quote]
    I’m not sure this got much discussion on the previous post, but if I recall, didn’t Desmond immediately leave Penny after they took the polaroid… So how could there be a duplicate copy? Am I wrong about that?[/quote]
    yup ,your wrong,listen to the last podcast and Cuse and Lindoff state that there was always two copies,how they conclude that I cant remember,Hell im going to listen to again too.
    oh yea
    Yen=Japan
    Yuan=China
    Won=Korea

  276. Dax says:

    Are we sure she said ‘Desmond’, remember in Expose when Nikki said ‘poisonous’ and Hurley thought she said ‘Paulo lies’ (or something to that effect).

    She said to Mikhail “I’m not the only one” (a rough translation)

  277. Lefty says:

    But I thought Locke saw smokie in his normal form right before he saw the bright light. Maybe it’s something that smokie can produce.

    And enough already with the sexist talk, the guy was making a joke, don’t turn him into Don Imus. That’s not what this blog is about…

  278. SnappyPappy says:

    [quote comment="53537"]First Mikhail and Naomi do not speak similar languages. He speaks Russian, which is no way similar to Portugese, Chinese, or Italian (which by the way I did not hear her speak).[/quote]I think Mikhail speaks at least three languages. We’ve heard English, we’ve heard Portugese, and we assume he speaks Russian (probably a pre-req for the Russian Army stint).

  279. LostDamery says:

    [quote comment="53775"]I doubt Charlie is a time jumper, he’s just addled from all that smack. Besides, Desmond recognized him in his flash, not the other way around. If they were both time jumpers wouldn’t they have recognized each other?[/quote]
    No, Because Charlie has flashes only when he is stoned and is too wacked to remember them mostly…
    Desmond is the pro and gets them easy…
    Locke is in between he had to get buzzed (the tent) one time and others it comes easy.

    They are all communicating with the Mysterious Underground smoke wielding apes! A.K.A. the whispers in the jungle….for those who dont jump/tap into time folds.

  280. violet says:

    [quote comment="53563"]By the way…as much as I love this theory that Juliet lied about the DOC, I feel like it is Jin’s baby because D&C said we would find out who the father was in the episode. So since we don’t know for sure that Juliet lied…[/quote]
    it wouldn’t be the first time the producers lied. they also said there’s no time traveling involved, it’s not purgatory, the time on and off the island’s the same…
    of course, the hopeless romantic part of me still want to believe they’re on top of it, and we won’t get a magic turtle at the end.

  281. lost chicka says:

    watching the episodes with the whispers they seem kinda childish. like when sayid hears them the only word u can really make out is “boo”. r the whispers the kids that the Others took messing with the losties & danielle?

  282. katesFriend says:

    this is random, but does anyone here actually speak portugese?

    i know it literally translates to i am not alone, but could it have a different meaning for a native speaker?

    many words in the english language have very different meanings contextually or b/c of adoption as slang or jargon than their literal translation would mean to a non native english speaker

  283. da caz says:

    I know this is off the topic for the weeks episode, but there hasnt been many post in the last couple of days so i thought this would be something to get a past the next couple of days….what is your biggest mystery about the shows first two seasons that you would like them to answer, mine would be what was walts “powers” that they showed in the first year and why was libby in the crazy center with hurley. just something i thought could pass the time until next week…cant wait!!!!

  284. ABD says:

    Bizzy, correct me if I’m wrong, but I believe you’re referring to Erythroblastosis fetalis (hemolytic disease of newborn). It’s when a mother’s blood type is Rh-negative and she’s pregnant with an Rh-positive fetus. She produces an antibody that attacks the fetus. Of course, tests and drugs prevent most cases of this nowadays (RhoGAM counteracts it), but perhaps the problem on the island has a similar concept. (Also, I think people need to be a little less over-sensitive to your “sexist” comments about a male vs. female rescuer. I’m a woman and was not offended.)

  285. dragonfly says:

    [quote comment="53968"]Bizzy, correct me if I’m wrong, but I believe you’re referring to Erythroblastosis fetalis (hemolytic disease of newborn). It’s when a mother’s blood type is Rh-negative and she’s pregnant with an Rh-positive fetus. She produces an antibody that attacks the fetus. Of course, tests and drugs prevent most cases of this nowadays (RhoGAM counteracts it), but perhaps the problem on the island has a similar concept. (Also, I think people need to be a little less over-sensitive to your “sexist” comments about a male vs. female rescuer. I’m a woman and was not offended.)[/quote]
    I highly doubt that the problem they’re having on the island is something as mundane as the Rh-factor. If that was the case, Juliet would have been just as useful in Miami. I do not consider myself overly sensitive, bizzy’s comments were simply clearly sexist. Bizzy insinuating that Dr. Juliet didn’t know what she was talking about, that Dr. Jack (being a man) should of course have corrected her, that the show is turning into a soap opera because there are female leaders, and that Penny should have sent a “rambodude” and not a female if they wanted to be rescued. I dont see where the confusion about the sexism comes in??

  286. CandyGirl says:

    [quote comment="53968"]Also, I think people need to be a little less over-sensitive to your “sexist” comments about a male vs. female rescuer. I’m a woman and was not offended.[/quote]i agree. para-chick & para-cutie is not sexist. it may offend sum sensitive types like dragonfly & tina, but sexism it is not. sexism is when you say someone cannot or should not do or be something based solely on their gender. like women should be nurses only and not doctors – thats sexist. men cannot be the more nurturing of the two parents – sexist. suspecting 100 lb naomi will not performly physically as well as a buff, 200 pound, rambo-dude, in combat conditions, thats just a good guess. and by the way, ana-lucia wasn’t a super hero, she was a bully with a gun {:p>-8

  287. dragonfly says:

    Also, I find it amusing how some people have become doctors overnight. I am an actual medical student and take it from me, your “knowledge” of medicine is very limited. If you feel the need to impress people with so-called medical terminology, either go to medical school or post on a different forum!

  288. JonathanM says:

    I’m a straight guy and even I gotta agree with dragonfly.. some of bizzy’s comments are really chauvenistic. I’ve been reading this blog for a long time (first time poste) and am a big fan of LOST and this blog. So for all our sakes, lets leave the sexist comments behind so we can all just enjoy this show without pissing people off.

  289. CandyGirl says:

    dragonfly – so ur not a doctor either, right?

  290. lost chicka says:

    [quote comment="53954"]I know this is off the topic for the weeks episode, but there hasnt been many post in the last couple of days so i thought this would be something to get a past the next couple of days….what is your biggest mystery about the shows first two seasons that you would like them to answer, mine would be what was walts “powers” that they showed in the first year and why was libby in the crazy center with hurley. just something i thought could pass the time until next week…cant wait!!!![/quote]

    Ever since the episode where we saw that Libby gave Des the boat, i’ve kinda had this idea that after her husband died she went insane. Probably not the best idea, but whatever. U can shoot it down if u want.

    Wasn’t Walt’s power being places he wasn’t supposed to be? And speakin of Walt, it wasn’t him who sent the e-mails (or whatever they were) to Michael right?

    Let the “sexist” comments go. It’s done, it’s over, u said what u thought, now move on! Start a new blog if u wanna talk about wether the comments r sexist or not.

  291. ABD says:

    [quote comment="53983"]Also, I find it amusing how some people have become doctors overnight. I am an actual medical student and take it from me, your “knowledge” of medicine is very limited. If you feel the need to impress people with so-called medical terminology, either go to medical school or post on a different forum![/quote]

    Dragonfly,
    Please read comments carefully before your emotions get the better of you. I did not say it was an Rh-factor issue; I said it could be a “similar concept.”

    Additionally, rather than go all worship-me-’cause-I-go-to-med-school on people, please don’t attack their use of medical terminology unless they are blatantly wrong. Obviously I was giving a layman’s overview, but was my description of the Rh-factor problem false? If so, please inform me so I can tell my A&P professor that his knowledge is inferior to a med student’s. Plus, how do you know that I didn’t have a pregnancy with an Rh problem and studied the topic, or that I’m not otherwise qualified to offer an OPINION on a Lost theory? Offering opinions on theories is why we’re here, and it is rude to bash someone simply because you believe you are more knowledgeable than they.

    I’m trying to be as polite as possible here, so I apologize if you were offended by my “so-called medical terminology,” as you put it.

  292. CandyGirl says:

    ABD – you should be a doctor, you have a nice “blog-side manner”.

  293. beej says:

    I Hope I’m not repeating previous entry but – why all the speculation on Sun’s baby’ daddy? The doctor told Sun that Jin was infertile to her face – but once she left the room the doc ‘fessed up to Jin that it was really Sun who was infertile. As bad-ass as Sun’s daddy is,the doc told Jin he didn’t want to give Sun bad news (you know, kill the messanger?) Anybody owning the DVDs can check this. The baby has to be Jin’s because Sun was infertile before the plane crash.

    As for Kate being preggers, well, probably. That’s why the Others put them together, her and Sawyer. As for the people who wonder why they let Hurley go back instead of Kate or Sawyer. Needed Kate fo the experiment and she’s a hot-head who would certainly have come back, as she later did. As for Hurley, he’s a sweetie and all but really, if you were Kate who would you wanna do, the brooding pretty boy bad guy Sawyer or the weight-challenged doofus nice boy?

    Now: here’s what’s ticking me off about this season: no answers to a bunch of stuff from prev season.

    1. Where the heck are Walt and Michael? They were leaving the island just as Desmond was blowing up the hatch. I think this screwed up their escape (if the Others really were going to let them go, which I doubt). WHERE ARE THEY?

    2. A statue with four toes…we soooo deserve an explination for this one.

    3. I spend all summer tracking down that stoopid Rachel video and it doesn’t tie into this season at all. What a pile of whooie! Where is Rachel in the series? Where are the folks from Hanso? Don’t give me all this stuff and then drop the ball. OF course, after the Nikki and Paulo waste of an episode (did this episode really advance the story line?) I’m starting to think that the writers have developed a bad habit of throwing in everything including the kitchen sink when they don’t know what to come up with next. at least the Rachel site gave me an idea where the island is (off of Sri Lanka…). Wonder why they haven’t been hit by a typhoon yet.

    Also: why didn’t the Others kidnap Rouseau? Why leave her on the island and not just kill her? She doesn’t appear to be a bad person, just wacked out from – what, 16 years? – being on her own and having her party all die and having her baby stolen. Why not kill her or welcome her into the group, mate her with one of their guys as an experiment?

    Why don’t the Others just kill the Losties they don’t need? It isn’t that they have these high morals – they stole children, tried to steal Claire’s… some morals. They tortured that teen boyfriend of Rouseau’s daughter. They have no qualms about torture, murder, lying, whatever. Why not just kill off the Losties who aren’t “on the list”?

    I love a good mystery but I hate when elements are not answered after being introduced.

    AND SOMEBODY ANSWER ME THIS: What do the writers have against fathers? Not a good one in the bunch besides Jin’s. And now I’m having doubts about him.

  294. JonathanM says:

    ABD, I’m sorry for being so defensive. Bizzy’s (many) comments just really bothered me. And you do have good blog side manner :)

  295. JAKESNAKE says:

    solid episode. the latter of this season has been very good. as with my thoughts about mikhail and the portugese woman there’s no way they are working together. mikhail was running toward the flare to see what new “losties” showed up. he also stole her phone.

    is it just me or does it look like hurley is getting bigger? i know he was big before but now he looks super huge. his character is still awesome as are his one-liners.

    i like that the mythology of the island is back. they’ve somewhat ignored it in the beginning of the season.

    Sun is a lot more badass than i thought. it was tight how she threatened jin’s mom at the end.

    i’m pumped to find out about the portugese lady. hopefully she can provide a huge twist to the plot just like in season 2 when the losties captured ben [one of the great moments in lost].

    this is jakesnake saying keep on rockin in the free world!!!

  296. dragonfly says:

    I’m also sorry if I was rude or condescending. Everyone is entitled to their opinion. Solid episode!

  297. Ali says:

    Hi there
    The book in Portuguese Naomi carries (with Des and Penny’s photo inside) is from a Brazilian publisher, “Record”.
    Might it be a clue from her origin?

    The season’s finale is getting so confusing and exciting!!

  298. Laura G says:

    Can’t believe I’ve just now discovered the lostblog…you guys are awesome.

    Just a thought on the Juliet lying about Sun’s DOC thing:

    I think this must be the case otherwise why all the secrecy (taking Sun by herself, telling her not to tell anyone)? She obviously didn’t want Jack to come along because he would have know she was lying about the DOC.

  299. katesFriend says:

    [quote comment="54001"]I Hope I’m not repeating previous entry but – why all the speculation on Sun’s baby’ daddy? The doctor told Sun that Jin was infertile to her face – but once she left the room the doc ‘fessed up to Jin that it was really Sun who was infertile. As bad-ass as Sun’s daddy is,the doc told Jin he didn’t want to give Sun bad news (you know, kill the messanger?) Anybody owning the DVDs can check this. The baby has to be Jin’s because Sun was infertile before the plane crash.

    As for Kate being preggers, well, probably. That’s why the Others put them together, her and Sawyer. As for the people who wonder why they let Hurley go back instead of Kate or Sawyer. Needed Kate fo the experiment and she’s a hot-head who would certainly have come back, as she later did. As for Hurley, he’s a sweetie and all but really, if you were Kate who would you wanna do, the brooding pretty boy bad guy Sawyer or the weight-challenged doofus nice boy?

    Now: here’s what’s ticking me off about this season: no answers to a bunch of stuff from prev season.

    1. Where the heck are Walt and Michael? They were leaving the island just as Desmond was blowing up the hatch. I think this screwed up their escape (if the Others really were going to let them go, which I doubt). WHERE ARE THEY?

    2. A statue with four toes…we soooo deserve an explination for this one.

    3. I spend all summer tracking down that stoopid Rachel video and it doesn’t tie into this season at all. What a pile of whooie! Where is Rachel in the series? Where are the folks from Hanso? Don’t give me all this stuff and then drop the ball. OF course, after the Nikki and Paulo waste of an episode (did this episode really advance the story line?) I’m starting to think that the writers have developed a bad habit of throwing in everything including the kitchen sink when they don’t know what to come up with next. at least the Rachel site gave me an idea where the island is (off of Sri Lanka…). Wonder why they haven’t been hit by a typhoon yet.

    Also: why didn’t the Others kidnap Rouseau? Why leave her on the island and not just kill her? She doesn’t appear to be a bad person, just wacked out from – what, 16 years? – being on her own and having her party all die and having her baby stolen. Why not kill her or welcome her into the group, mate her with one of their guys as an experiment?

    Why don’t the Others just kill the Losties they don’t need? It isn’t that they have these high morals – they stole children, tried to steal Claire’s… some morals. They tortured that teen boyfriend of Rouseau’s daughter. They have no qualms about torture, murder, lying, whatever. Why not just kill off the Losties who aren’t “on the list”?

    I love a good mystery but I hate when elements are not answered after being introduced.

    AND SOMEBODY ANSWER ME THIS: What do the writers have against fathers? Not a good one in the bunch besides Jin’s. And now I’m having doubts about him.[/quote]

    first of all, the whole jin/sun infertility thing is exactly the opposite way around (anyone with dvds would know this) it is that the dr told sun she was infertile, then found sun on the street and told her it was really jin

    second, please read the rules: be constructive, don’t complain, be kind and helpful

    these are all questions we all have and i’m sure the PTB will let us know when they are ready

    that is the point of this show

  300. oi says:

    wow, i’ve been reading this blog for a while now, and this is the first time i’ve seen so many people involved in a catfight. can we talk about the show? in my kind and helpful comment, i would like to observe that what Naomi a.k.a. parachick said was an echo (no pun intended) of what Boone heard when he got the radio in the heroine-laden plane to work. i.e. “No, we’re the survivors of flight 815.” vs. “There were no survivors.” the producers shot down the parallel universe idea once before by introducing the tailies. i’m pretty confident there isn’t going to be a parallel universe this time either.

    since the producers/writers have been responding to audience comments/criticisms by 1) getting rid of Paolo and Nikki (poor Paolo), 2) getting at least 3 characters on the last episode to further the plot by saying so-and-so told me this-or-that (and some other examples i can’t think of right now), i think Naomi is a response to Ana-Lucia. i’m hoping she’s going to be just as badass but maybe less bitchy (and less trigger-happy).

  301. Bobbi says:

    I suppose we’ll know for sure whether Juliet was lying about the DOC. The difference between 53 and 90 days pregnant is significant, more than five weeks difference. She said she and Jin were having trouble and weren’t sleeping together for awhile before the island. If it was the other guy’s she’d be about 13 weeks pregnant, which is not only a huge difference, but it would mean we will see a belly soon, and she’d feel fluttering. I don’t believe it’s the other guy’s (but I’ve been wrong plenty of times before when it comes to this show) Also, someone before mentioned that if the DOC Juliet told her was right, she wouldn’t hear heartbeat yet. But at 53 days, an ultrasound can most definitely pick up a strong heartbeat.

  302. lost chicka says:

    - Beej: since michael & walt haven’t com back yet, i say the Others took em out. they either wired the boat with a bomb or shot em.

    the statue with 4 toes ur right we do deserve an answer!

    and u got it backwards about the sun-jin fertility thing. i rewactched the ep. & the doc. says it’s sun to jin’s face but later comes back & says it’s the other way. but if sun’s family is as big & bad as they say, what if he lied to her the 2nd time, not the first?

    how can u say jin’s dad was bad? he was tryin to protect his son from emabarssment! & even tho i hate what mikal did to get his son, he definitely luvs walt. he traded in 4 of his friends & shot 2 people + himself! he just met his son & was willing to do all that.

    as for not killing off the losties & danielle. some people r sayin she might b an other. i could C it, but don’t think so. the losties not gettin killed yet, i’m sure they have lots of experiments so they’re all useful specially if they want to make em all Others.

    – u know what i luv about the writers? they kill people off the show a lot, but it’s not usually the main characters. 1/2 the time it’s either a character they brought on just to blow up (ex. p.o.ed science teacher) or a character who’s name is mentioned 2times.

    – naomi is absolutely positively an other & there’s no doubt that patchy was searchin for her! he showed up at the exact moment that they needed him over there so he could’ve been around the corner waitin for the right moment & she came to bring a couple of things to help the Others & he stole the phone thing to get caught so they’d think that they found evrything he took. i’ve convinced myself & it’s pretty much impossible to change my mind now.

    – i think julliette is lying about the DOC. but if she isn’t, maybe the island speeds up the pregnancy or something like that & it winds up killing the mother & baby? feel free to shoot the idea down. if julliette is lying about the DOC (which i believe she is since she’s a lying no good other) could it still be Jin’s baby?

  303. Bobbi says:

    I still wonder how come (if Desmond is NOT an other) the Others left him alone? In that hatch for a few years and none of them bothered him? Could they not get to him unless they blew up hatch door like the losties did? Seems strange that they could watch him, yet never intervened-especially when he killed the other guy who was stealing his boat. Almost makes me consider other people’s theory that he could possibly be an Other.

    I feel like Naomi telling Mikhail that she’s “not the only one” backs up that she is NOT an other. If she were an other and Mikhail were expecting her, I’d think he’d already know who else was with her.

    HMMM, however, if i combine both paragraphs i just wrote….PERHAPS, Desmond is an Other afterall, and he purposely showed Charlie his pic with Penny, so that when they found Naomi and her pic, Charlie would confirm who was in the pic-making Desmond seem all the more innocent and a lostie. (I REALLY DON’T WANT NAOMI OR DESMOND TO BE OTHERS)

  304. lost chicka says:

    - naomi IS probably an other (i think).

    – hurley is NOT an other.

    – locke COULD be working with the others.

    – julliette IS an other.

    – desmond is hopefully NOT an other.

    – jack COULD be working with the others.

  305. Boots says:

    [quote comment="53863"]this is random, but does anyone here actually speak portugese?

    i know it literally translates to i am not alone, but could it have a different meaning for a native speaker?

    many words in the english language have very different meanings contextually or b/c of adoption as slang or jargon than their literal translation would mean to a non native english speaker[/quote]

    I do. I didn’t catch what she mumbled the first time, but after going back and listening carefully, she definitely said, “Eu nao estou so.” There is only one way to interpet that statement…’I am not alone’…and i’m sure eyepatch guy is off to find the other person(s) that came with her.

  306. katesFriend says:

    [quote comment="54268"][quote comment="53863"]this is random, but does anyone here actually speak portugese?

    i know it literally translates to i am not alone, but could it have a different meaning for a native speaker?

    many words in the english language have very different meanings contextually or b/c of adoption as slang or jargon than their literal translation would mean to a non native english speaker[/quote]

    I do. I didn’t catch what she mumbled the first time, but after going back and listening carefully, she definitely said, “Eu nao estou so.” There is only one way to interpet that statement…’I am not alone’…and i’m sure eyepatch guy is off to find the other person(s) that came with her.[/quote]

    i just thought maybe it could mean something like, thank you for saving my life, there are other people on this island who will help me, etc

  307. Ali says:

    [quote comment="54268"][quote comment="53863"]this is random, but does anyone here actually speak portugese?

    i know it literally translates to i am not alone, but could it have a different meaning for a native speaker?

    many words in the english language have very different meanings contextually or b/c of adoption as slang or jargon than their literal translation would mean to a non native english speaker[/quote]

    I do. I didn’t catch what she mumbled the first time, but after going back and listening carefully, she definitely said, “Eu nao estou so.” There is only one way to interpet that statement…’I am not alone’…and i’m sure eyepatch guy is off to find the other person(s) that came with her.[/quote]

    Hi there! I agree with above!

    I am a Portuguese speaker from Brazil and she does say twice “Eu nao estou so”, which means “I am not alone”. Well, I just watched again and she does not have any Portugal accent in her “s” pronounciation. Mikhail’s translation is cheeky, as she really did not say “Thank you” (a “thank you” from a lady would be “obrigada”).
    But, something to point out about her expression. Colloquially, you wouldn’t say “Eu nao ESTOU so”. We usually say “Nao TO so”, as it’s quicker/simpler. This could hardly make her a native speaker though. I would never speak proper language if I just had a piece of bruch stick into my lung!

    So, even though her book is from a Brazilian publisher, I guess she got the Portuguese out perhaps because she thought she had landed in the Amazon!

  308. liesa says:

    Ok, this is a theory about the obsession with babies and pregnancy. The Others are a cult, not necessarily religious and certainly not christian, but they seem to have that same structure of “God” ( Jacob) and God’s annointed one ( Ben) and everyone else who does the annointed one’s bidding. I think they need a baby who was conceived on the island to be the “messiah” for the group. Evidently it doesn’t have to be anyone’s in particular, just a baby born there. Maybe a baby cements their relationship to the island and all the “promises” it makes to them ie. long ( eternal) life, healing, and who knows what other prophetic or mystical things. In order for this to last , they must have a baby. Or maybe they’ll have to sacrifice the baby to the island, like Locke said Boone was sacrificed. But this is definitely not idle research. You don’t let nine women die in the attempt unless it’s essential to your continued existence. Anyway, what do you think??

  309. jason davis says:

    after seeing D.O.C i think that every one on the island are clones except from some of the others.
    the reasons for this is
    the others seem to be doing a lot of scientific work around babies and they all seem to be dying and the mothers too,is this because they are having problems with the clones growth(when they hired juliet they had a scan of a woman which was more mature than juliet thought)may be they took a new approach by taking samples of the dead people off of flight 815 and cloned them implanting memmories(room 23)and left them on the island around a empty plane they crashed, to wake up and belive they were normal people who just survived,explaing why johns legs now worked and every one else heals fast, because as they are making advanced clones they put a fast healing potential in thier gene make up,and phsic abilities.
    my therory would also explain how johns dad apeared on the island (he was cloned)and explain what the seperate hatches were for(to examine how the clones were working and thier mental abillities)also the dead flame man apeared in this episode,how else could he be alive unless he was a clone.
    this is why every one seems to pop up in each others past as they had limmited memories to implant they had to keep puting memories around the other survivors lives just as it made it easier for them not to thnk up to much stuff.
    the hatch? may be they were not suppose to find the hatch and desmond was a different experiment altogether and they implanted a implant (like they did in claire)in each of the surrvivors to see the sky go purple just incase they found desmond and he stopped pressing the button.
    i also think ben is a clone and maybe some of the others ,i have no answers for this i just belive it to be true,this is why people are not alowed to leave the island as cloning is ilegal and obviously they do not want clones of dead people running around in the normal world.
    even if i am wrong i think jacks dad is the main leader of the others as he seems to pop up in most peoples memories and is related to a few,he was not in the coffin when jack found it(was he ever in it?)

  310. ausiswell says:

    Interesting theory Jason; however, the fact that all passengers on flight 815 seem to have a connection, makes me believe otherwise. I know the purgatory theory has been refuted, however, how else could so many flawed characters find themselves in one place, with an opportunity to atone for their sins and find their way out -I would argue they moved on to the next level-: Boon, Shannon, Mr. Eko, Ana Lucia or, choose to continue their destructive paths and die a horrible dead: Nikki, Paulo, Kelvin.
    Two characters seem to belong permanently in this realm: Ben and Desmond. Ben has never been outside: -albeit with connections and influence to the outside world-, while Desmond pops in and out and has a mission to accomplish, even though we are made to believe he does not know that mission is. Ben has the power to let people off the island, while Desmond works to prevent” people from leaving it: Saving the island from imploding, or constantly preventing them from dying -Charlie-. Or help them out the once their term has expired: Kelvin.
    I have a feeling Ben is the good guy and Desmond is the bad guy. The rest -Losties or Others- are in the island trying to find either their way out: Others, or hoping to be rescued: Losties.
    Ben owns the Others, Desmond controls the Losties -Remember his encounter with Jack on the track field-.

    The beauty of it all is that there are so many interesting alternatives, as there are parallel realities, but in the end it all boils down to good vs evil. Problem is, who is good and who is evil?

  311. maria says:

    hi i saw this esp last night on Sky 1 {Ireland} and i loved it..i am glad it is Jins but can i say that juile is 1 heck of a scary lady…does any one know why hurley has not lost the weight come on i mean he is 90 days without proper food!!! but i love him i think he is very funny…can’t wait for next week good night from ireland…..

  312. jason davis says:

    in my therory comment 309,
    i explained about my therory of clones,in therory 310 ausiswell said this did not explain how they all seem to know each other,allthough i did explain (room 23)they had thier memories implanted and due to limited resources they had to make all thier memories fit around each other, thanks ausiswell for saying you liked my therory!

  313. Tina says:

    I think corporate orchestration (i.e. Widmore Corp and its subsidiaries) is just a good reason that all the folks on the plane are connected to each other as the clone theory. Although I like the idea of implanted memories, it just doesn’t seem realiztic enough for me to fit in with the show’s nitty grittiness. It seems a little too sci-fi and not enough mystery.

  314. lost chicka says:

    i don’t think that they’re all clones. they were all at the same air port & city for at least a little while so they’ve obviously seen each other before the crash then. i really like how the writers have pulled the whole 6 degrees thing in. cloned people just sounds a bit to far out ther for me.

  315. Sawyer's Evil Twin says:

    Jason, I agree with the clone theory. After last episode I was thinking the same thing. I’ve also thought of the pergatory theory. But since the producers have said this was not pergatory I have to believe in clones until proven otherwise.

    Here’s something about the show that potentially bugs me. If Juliet was lying to Sun about the baby DOC and all of that then they should have done it in a way that put the viewers in a position to believe she was lying. But they didn’t. They have Juliet cry and say some really nice things to Sun. They have a moment if you will. That’s why I will choose to believe Juliet. If she is lying then I’m totally disapointed in the show. I hate being lied to and that’s what this would be. Know what I mean?

  316. Tina says:

    [quote comment="54600"]Jason, I agree with the clone theory. After last episode I was thinking the same thing. I’ve also thought of the pergatory theory. But since the producers have said this was not pergatory I have to believe in clones until proven otherwise.

    Here’s something about the show that potentially bugs me. If Juliet was lying to Sun about the baby DOC and all of that then they should have done it in a way that put the viewers in a position to believe she was lying. But they didn’t. They have Juliet cry and say some really nice things to Sun. They have a moment if you will. That’s why I will choose to believe Juliet. If she is lying then I’m totally disapointed in the show. I hate being lied to and that’s what this would be. Know what I mean?[/quote]

    I believed her too, despite that I think she may have lied about everything else. I think we saw whatever shred of humanity Juliet has left come out in her interaction with Sun. She truly loved her life as a fertility doctor and being able to recreate that, even if for a moment with Sun gave her a bit of sparkle.

    Unfortunately it was dirtied up by her talking into that tape recorder…

  317. Lost4Lost says:

    Hello everyone I’m new to this blog but have not misted a show thanks to TIVO!!! I don’t think Juliet is lying (my opinion) She still thinks her sister is alive (might be but I like some of the theories of the time warp) and they will let her leave if she cooperates with them (the others). Also has anyone thought Sun’s baby is Micheal’s. They were getting close in S1. That would make a good twist to bring him back. And last for now, I have watched most episodes twice and I do not remember the Doctor telling Sun or Jin they were not able to produce a baby. Is there some extra previews somewhere? Thank for all your post.

  318. Toeknee says:

    [quote comment="54616"] And last for now, I have watched most episodes twice and I do not remember the Doctor telling Sun or Jin they were not able to produce a baby. Is there some extra previews somewhere? Thank for all your post.[/quote]
    This occurred in Season 2’s “The Whole Truth”. Here’s part of the summary from ABC.com:

    “Since they haven’t had any luck conceiving, Jin suggests that they visit a fertility specialist.The specialist tells them that Sun has endometriosis and that their chances of conceiving are impossible, news that clearly upsets Jin more than it does Sun. ….. in the final flashback we learn that the doctor lied to Sun and Jin out of fear of the Paik family, assigning the problem to Sun when in fact it is Jin who is sterile.”

  319. lost chicka says:

    Here’s something about the show that potentially bugs me. If Juliet was lying to Sun about the baby DOC and all of that then they should have done it in a way that put the viewers in a position to believe she was lying. But they didn’t. They have Juliet cry and say some really nice things to Sun. They have a moment if you will. That’s why I will choose to believe Juliet. If she is lying then I’m totally disapointed in the show. I hate being lied to and that’s what this would be. Know what I mean?[/quote]

    I don’t know if she’s lying or not. She’s an other so i don’t think she’s trustworthy, but she did seem pretty believable with Sun so, i don’t know. for sure. But Whenever Ben lies, they make it so it sounds like it’s the truth for however long untill u believe him & then u find out he lying. In One of Us, the fix the ep so by the middle u’re starting to believe julliette & then at the very end u go “that little…!!!!” So i think we’ll have to wait to see if she’s telling the truth or lying.

  320. lost chicka says:

    sorry, i screwed up the quoting on my last comment!

  321. MKS says:

    I just can’t see Juliette not telling the truth about the baby’s DOC. It was obvious in her flashbacks that there were several other people present during her work with the other pregnant women. Also, since it is such a big deal, I am sure Ben and several other people know at least something about babies. It would take them one look at the ultra-sound to figure out she was lying. There is a four to five week difference between the date she gave Sun and before island conception. Ben would know how old the baby he saw on an ultra-sound picture was.

  322. Tina says:

    [quote comment="54814"]I just can’t see Juliette not telling the truth about the baby’s DOC. It was obvious in her flashbacks that there were several other people present during her work with the other pregnant women. Also, since it is such a big deal, I am sure Ben and several other people know at least something about babies. It would take them one look at the ultra-sound to figure out she was lying. There is a four to five week difference between the date she gave Sun and before island conception. Ben would know how old the baby he saw on an ultra-sound picture was.[/quote]

    I agree with you wholeheartedly. I think we have all become so accustomed to expecting lies to come from the Others that when there is a legitimate possibility of truth we second guess it. Juliet seemed so emotionally connected to giving Sun the news, I couldn’t help but feel my heart scrunch for her a little bit. I still think she’s a dirty Other who is up to know good, but a little bit of her humanity shone through there.

  323. lost chicka says:

    [quote comment="54826"][quote comment="54814"]I just can’t see Juliette not telling the truth about the baby’s DOC. It was obvious in her flashbacks that there were several other people present during her work with the other pregnant women. Also, since it is such a big deal, I am sure Ben and several other people know at least something about babies. It would take them one look at the ultra-sound to figure out she was lying. There is a four to five week difference between the date she gave Sun and before island conception. Ben would know how old the baby he saw on an ultra-sound picture was.[/quote]

    I agree with you wholeheartedly. I think we have all become so accustomed to expecting lies to come from the Others that when there is a legitimate possibility of truth we second guess it. Juliet seemed so emotionally connected to giving Sun the news, I couldn’t help but feel my heart scrunch for her a little bit. I still think she’s a dirty Other who is up to know good, but a little bit of her humanity shone through there.[/quote]

    i don’t care if she saves everylast lostie she’s stil an other! she seemed really nice in One of Us to until the last 3 minutes or whatever when we hear her & ben going over the plan!

    i have a little theory about the Others & why they can’t deliver babies on the island. maybe dharma used them as test rats. Dharma was trying to find a way to speed up the pregnancy or stop people from giving birth prematurely or something & something went wrong. REALLY wrong. At first it was OK, but the mutation kept getting worse & worse untill finally the couldn’t make it past the second trimester. What do you think? To far out there?

  324. Meg says:

    [quote comment="54832"][quote comment="54826"][quote comment="54814"]I just can’t see Juliette not telling the truth about the baby’s DOC. It was obvious in her flashbacks that there were several other people present during her work with the other pregnant women. Also, since it is such a big deal, I am sure Ben and several other people know at least something about babies. It would take them one look at the ultra-sound to figure out she was lying. There is a four to five week difference between the date she gave Sun and before island conception. Ben would know how old the baby he saw on an ultra-sound picture was.[/quote]

    I agree with you wholeheartedly. I think we have all become so accustomed to expecting lies to come from the Others that when there is a legitimate possibility of truth we second guess it. Juliet seemed so emotionally connected to giving Sun the news, I couldn’t help but feel my heart scrunch for her a little bit. I still think she’s a dirty Other who is up to know good, but a little bit of her humanity shone through there.[/quote]

    i don’t care if she saves everylast lostie she’s stil an other! she seemed really nice in One of Us to until the last 3 minutes or whatever when we hear her & ben going over the plan!

    i have a little theory about the Others & why they can’t deliver babies on the island. maybe dharma used them as test rats. Dharma was trying to find a way to speed up the pregnancy or stop people from giving birth prematurely or something & something went wrong. REALLY wrong. At first it was OK, but the mutation kept getting worse & worse untill finally the couldn’t make it past the second trimester. What do you think? To far out there?[/quote]
    That make a lot of sense. That would explain why and how they got there, and Ben being born there.

  325. jason davis says:

    CLONE THERORY

    Originally posted on D.O.C comments page post 309,due to lots of people replying to my post and agreeing with me I have decided to repost but in more detail and try to explain some things I missed in my original post.

    After watching D.O.C and the lady from the helicopter crash said that flight 815 had been found with no survivors I wandered how this could be true!
    The only way this could be possible is if every one on the plane had an identical twin who was on an identical plane ,which is surely not the case ! Or if the others (some how) as soon as the plane crashed got a replica plane which they painted the same ,forged all paper work on the plane, got hold of a couple of hundred dead people and gave them face lifts ,changed all their teeth to fit into the dental reports for when the authorities came to identify the bodies and replicated wedding rings ect (managing to do all of this in a few hours)
    Surely this is not the case either, it is my belief that flight 815 did crash on the way to America and every one did die on board ,and all of the losties that are on the island are indeed clones, this is the reasons why.

    All the hatches on the island have cameras in them and we know at least one of them (the pearl) was to observe other people in other hatches to see how they were behaving , although the last episode of season 2 we see that all the reports that were being sent ,were just ending up in the middle of nowhere, so I believe that the hatches were designed to observe clones to see if they were turning out alright but as we know from the pregnant mums dying and possibly the babies too there must be something wrong with the clones so the others took a new approach by taking samples of the dead flight 815 people and cloning them ,they then implanted all their memories (in room 23 in episode not in Portland) this is why most of their memories revolve around each other as for some reason it made it easier for the others so they would not have to make up too much stuff to be implanted, and then placed them around a plane that they crashed on purpose so when they activated the clones implants (Claire had an implant to make her ill) they would wake up around the crashed plane to believe that they were the survivors and any disorientation was due to the crash.
    This is why people heal quicker on the island not due too the island but as they are clones and in their gene make up they are designed to heal quick (johns legs now work when before they did not) . Obviously if they all have implants this could be why they keep seeing thing such as people no one else can see or the sky turning purple.
    The others seem to be doing a lot of research into babies (they showed Juliet a scan of a baby in a whom that she thought the whom was a lot older than it actually was) and the mothers and the babies keep dying showing that the others are having problems with child birth (why else would they be so worried about child birth)
    This is why no one is aloud to leave the island as they can not have any one letting the rest of the world know about them cloning as it is illegal and they can not have clones of dead people running loose in the world.
    The hatch and desmond? Is desmond a clone (an earlier test) or was he put on the island by his girlfriends dad as her dad was very rich and might have had something to do with the others (funding) and might of thought it would be funny to put him in the hatch for the rest of his life pushing a button, probably not as this does not fit my theory as desmond can see thing that are about to happen maybe desmond died on his boat trip and if his girlfriends dad does have something to do with the others and had him cloned with physic abilities to go in the hatch as punishment ,and because of the success of desmonds clone working because he had no idea he was a clone they decided to clone the flight 815 fatalities and try something similar to them.
    Also johns dad appearing on the island , how did he get there if he was not cloned
    The other from the flame post ,he died and then turned up alive again, is this why the others don’t really care if they die or who they kill as they can just clone them again.

    even if I am wrong I think jacks dad is the main leader of the others as he seems to pop up in most peoples memories and is related to a few, he was not in the coffin when jack found it(was he ever in it?)

  326. Disco says:

    Great thoughts everyone. Of the 100’s of questions racing around my head, the one that sticks out most in DOC is the concept of our parachute gal jumping/bailing out of a helicopter. She appeared to be wearing high altitude parachute gear. Referred to in military terms as HAHO (high altitude high opening) or HALO (high alitude low opening).
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/HALO
    Typically, only very specialized elite military personnel are trained in this type of parachute technique. Maybe she IS Rambo after all. And this type of jump, at night, would be the most difficult and dangerous option of all. Usually reserved for secret infiltrations only when other options are not available. Thoughts/questions IF a helicopter was actually what crashed…

    1)Helicopters are relatively short range. Did it take off from a nearby island, refuel mid-flight off of a military tanker jet or launch from a ship? Or, did she jump from high altitude out of a prop plane which would have had a longer range?

    2)If either are true, this throws off all those theories about the island being invisible to the outside world and impossible to find by conventional means.

    3)She certainly may have intended to get on to the island secretly in order to find out the situation and report back (via satellite phone) without being discovered. But, because the vehicle that delivered her crashed, can’t we assume that it was sent by someone who was NOT familiar with the island and its potential destructive capabilities?

    4)Regardless of technicalities, doesn’t the fact that someone parachuted in, ON PURPOSE, mean that the multiple dimensions and or purgetory stuff is off the table? It seems to be the ONE thing lately that has pulled everything back to there needing to be a reasonably conventional explanation to it all.

    4)Our Russian friend did something to that phone.

  327. lost chicka says:

    Maybe Naomi is from DHARMA & they believe that they are still in control of the island or are letting the Others live on the island if they do something (or something else along those lines). Dharma has an island nearby & since 2 hatches blew up, they decided to go check it out. They have some sort of idea that Ben & friends won’t be to happy to see them, so they send Naomi (& somebody else?) to the island at night. What do u think about that theory?

  328. Hurley's Dad says:

    Finally got done reading all 327 posts. I apologize for doing so many in a row like this.

    [quote comment="53452"]2) I still have to point out: If the island can heal you why didn’t it heal Libby and Boone?![/quote]
    No one verified he was dead when he “died”. He did not die and come back to life, so asking why Boone and Libby weren’t saved is easy. His “wounds” weren’t life threatening, they were just made to look life threatening.

  329. Hurley's Dad says:

    [quote comment="53452"]2) I still have to point out: If the island can heal you why didn’t it heal Libby and Boone?![/quote]
    No one verified he was dead when he “died”. He did not die and come back to life, so asking why Boone and Libby weren’t saved is easy. His “wounds” weren’t life threatening, they were just made to look life threatening.

  330. Hurley's Dad says:

    [quote comment="53575"]2) I think we are missing the point that there is another group of others some where on under or near the island and Naomi is working with them and the smoke monster.[/quote]

    I’ve been waiting for this one!

    In the D&C podcast this week, they brought up (again) how many groups of others there are on the island.

    “There are two factions, and they’ll become apparent in the coming weeks.”

    This is something I’ve always wondered about. Do they dress in rags to hide in/from with the “other-others”?

  331. lost chicka says:

    3 Questions Here:

    1) are the other others the whispers?

    2) did libby, boone, & kate’s cop guy take longer to die since jack interfered with the island?

    3) if jack had left them (libby, boone, & kate’s cop) alone would they still be alive?

  332. Tina says:

    [quote comment="54864"]
    3)She certainly may have intended to get on to the island secretly in order to find out the situation and report back (via satellite phone) without being discovered. But, because the vehicle that delivered her crashed, can’t we assume that it was sent by someone who was NOT familiar with the island and its potential destructive capabilities?

    4)Regardless of technicalities, doesn’t the fact that someone parachuted in, ON PURPOSE, mean that the multiple dimensions and or purgetory stuff is off the table?

    It seems to be the ONE thing lately that has pulled everything back to there needing to be a reasonably conventional explanation to it all.
    quote]

    If she was sent by Penny and there is a connection between Hanso/Widmore/Paik, then it it remains possible that Penny herself had no idea how the island worked. She may have bits of information that she has subsquently pieced together to get an idea of a location but not neccesarily a how to guide for getting on the island which would explain why Naomi crashed. If a genuine wormhole of sorts exists as the entrance to the island, then with the right information and timing, one could manipulate it to send you in intentionally. Ben brought people to the island intentionally (i.e. Juliet) so it stands to reason that with the right tools, someone else could too. It doesn’t discount parallel universe, but it certainly discounts purgatory (so does the fact that both D&C discredited the theory).

  333. alan says:

    i have a theory:

    Juliet: just wants off the island, the only way will be to solve the pregnancy problem, hnce she will do whatever it is ben wants, no coincidence is it that the first impression we get is of juliet struggling with her time and objectives on the island via her mirror scene.

    Parachick: sent by penny, via widmore industry manipulations who are tied in with dharma, ties in with my theory that Locke blowing up the hatch has sent adistress call, we are not alone are dharma recruits.

    The survivors: All connected, jacks dad, claire’s father etc. But what if they were all from the island in the first place and the experiments are what happens in the outside world and they have to be reinitiated into the project when they return.

    Black smoke: Locke’s white light? You see what you intend. You speak to me as if i am your brother? Eko was ready to ask for forgiveness but pride ( cos he never learnt hs lesson ) got his butt kicked, hencve the cycles of learning they keep going through.

    Spiritual: Hanso, making better people, how do you do that,see how they cope in rubbish situations, like life, for the island is fairly idylic really, it’s only their own pushing that gets them into trouble, others good, survivors, learning, Dharma bad!

    First time posting, so i hope i haven’t messed up

  334. alan says:

    p.s this would account why there are no children on the island, they are sent into the world and then are fetched back when they are older… oooohhhh.

  335. Other 218 says:

    [quote comment="55031"]p.s this would account why there are no children on the island, they are sent into the world and then are fetched back when they are older… oooohhhh.[/quote]
    do we know there are no children? baby Aaron is on the beach with mom/Claire. we saw a childs swing/play set (in good repair) in the barracks compound (Sayid was handcuffed to it) – though we never saw youngsters playing on it. maybe the kids are in another compound somewhere else on the island, being studied by scientists.

  336. Hammer says:

    We saw the children when Juliet was being judged. Cindy was with her when she had a short conversation with Jack. I believe these kids were from the tail section.

  337. Hammer says:

    Sorry if this is a double post.

    We saw children when Juliet was being judged. They were with Cindy when she had a short conversation with Jack when has was moved in the cage. I believe they were from the tail section. We still don’t know if there are any children previous to 815.

  338. Tina says:

    [quote comment="55062"]Sorry if this is a double post.

    We saw children when Juliet was being judged. They were with Cindy when she had a short conversation with Jack when has was moved in the cage. I believe they were from the tail section. We still don’t know if there are any children previous to 815.[/quote]

    YOu are right about the Tailie children and I’m not sure if we’ve seen the two kids that were abducted from the Beach camp, the brother and sister I think.

  339. MKS says:

    I am pretty sure Alex and Carl grew up on the island.

  340. lost chicka says:

    [quote comment="55030"]i have a theory:

    Juliet: just wants off the island, the only way will be to solve the pregnancy problem, hnce she will do whatever it is ben wants, no coincidence is it that the first impression we get is of juliet struggling with her time and objectives on the island via her mirror scene.

    Parachick: sent by penny, via widmore industry manipulations who are tied in with dharma, ties in with my theory that Locke blowing up the hatch has sent adistress call, we are not alone are dharma recruits.

    The survivors: All connected, jacks dad, claire’s father etc. But what if they were all from the island in the first place and the experiments are what happens in the outside world and they have to be reinitiated into the project when they return.

    Black smoke: Locke’s white light? You see what you intend. You speak to me as if i am your brother? Eko was ready to ask for forgiveness but pride ( cos he never learnt hs lesson ) got his butt kicked, hencve the cycles of learning they keep going through.

    Spiritual: Hanso, making better people, how do you do that,see how they cope in rubbish situations, like life, for the island is fairly idylic really, it’s only their own pushing that gets them into trouble, others good, survivors, learning, Dharma bad!

    First time posting, so i hope i haven’t messed up[/quote]

    Julliette: i think that scene was more of the song reminding her of Rachel. even if she was just wanting to go home, i think that tatoo on her back really meant that she’s one of them now. i think somebody already mentioned that on the One of Us thread (sorry if i stole ur idea).

    Parachick: i’ve already said this i think she was sent by dharma since 2 hatches blew up. them & the others ain’t exactly friends anymore or just think that the hostiles have finally tooken over & so they sent her (& somebody else?) to investigate at night to try & make a quieter entry. The dharma island is close by & they know how to get to the island.

    Survivors: i don’t know about that one. it makes sense i guess, but if the Others have such a bad problem with getting preggers, y send the babies off the island? just doesn’t make a lot of sense to me.

    Black Smoke: like that theory.

    Spiritual: i don’t really like that theory either. sorry.

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