Confirmed Dead

Davies - Helicopter Guy

Tonight’s episode will focus on the introduction of four new characters from the Freighter (including actor Jeremy Davies who we saw at the conclusion of last week’s episode), and hopefully their true intentions as it relates to the Island. Based on the title of the episode, I also believe we will get more information about what the real world was told happened to Flight 815, which Naomi alluded to last season prior to her demise…

Spoiler Warning

ABC’s official show description:

The survivors begin to question the intentions of their supposed rescuers when four strangers arrive on the island.

Episode Preview

Sneak Peeks

There are 2 sneak peeks available also: Sneak Peek 1 | Sneak Peek 2

I would not expect the fast-paced nature of “Beginning of the End”, but I do expect we will get some critical back story. Further, it will be interesting to see which faction discovers each of these new characters – and the different reactions from the groups to them… Should definitely make for compelling drama!

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245 Responses to Confirmed Dead

  1. Bobola says:

    What sort of Rescue person wears a tie?
    Is Jack gonna pick up on that?

  2. DocH says:

    I feel some ‘fringe’ fans will gripe about this one – “What, I have to learn a half dozen new faces and names?”, or “They keep opening new doors in this saga, raising new questions, and never answering anything!” (not my gripe).

    For those of us dedicated Lost fans, I think we will be quite happy and this episode will put is 4th gear… on the way to season Overdrive. I really do hope they answer at least 1 major question this week. A significant reveal that will help us focus our efforts over the next 2 months. LOST formula usually includes several ostrich-sized Easter Eggs when they add new characters and locales to the plot… I look forward to that. I also agree with Will that “Confirmed Dead” likely means big impact back in the real world – 92 days after the OA815 crash.

  3. lost chicka says:

    i thought the beginning of the end did NOT live up to the hype. it was ok, but not all it was marketed to be (like 2 hour season premiere, i think not). i just hope this episode will be better, and i think it will be. especially after last weeks ending scene.

    bobola, i’ll tell ya what kind of rescue person wear’s a tie, a rescue person who’s really not there to rescue anybody!!! i’m dying to know why the freighter tots are here. my guess is that it has something to do with the island, what’s on it (jacob, smokie, something we still don’t know yet), or what’s being done on it (the other’s work or dharma’s)

  4. katesFriend says:

    query: where do the sneak peaks come from? othe abc shows? they are kinda long….

  5. Will says:

    [quote comment="176502"]query: where do the sneak peaks come from? othe abc shows? they are kinda long….[/quote]
    katesFriend – I don’t think these actually show up on TV, but I could be wrong. I think they are only released online.

  6. katesFriend says:

    thanks will!

  7. Pam says:

    Kate is going with Jack, that means she wants to back home right? She is not afraid of hiding from the police in normal society. Maybe she has a plan, or maybe she’s confused.

  8. Pam says:

    Juliet is going with Jack so she’s not worried about not being on the Oceanic 815 flight plan. Maybe she thinks she’ll expose the Dhrama Intiative to the world…

  9. Pam says:

    That hour went by way too fast.

  10. katesFriend says:

    so ben must have something to do w/ flight 815, right?

    it seems the freighter tots had something to do w/ 815 but they came for ben, so how is ben related to 815?

    and how did the freighter tots know to look in this location?

    maybe, they knew of the purge and are coming to kill ben (or take him to some kind of dharma court/judge/prison?) because he was in charge of the purge

    but how would they know 815 had anything to do with it all?

    sorry, a bunch of rambling but my mind is spinning!

  11. tc says:

    did he say thats not naomi when they brought here to the heuy.

  12. Abby says:

    So Ben has Michael on the freighter…awesome.

  13. katesFriend says:

    and what the hell is naomi? some super agent?

    also, maybe when abbadon was asking hurley if “they are still alive” he was talking about the freighter tots, as they were his team, and may not get off the island alive

  14. Becky says:

    Amazing episode! Great intro to the “rescue” team. Sort of a mish mash posse of random people…can’t wait to see what pans out!

    I was right about it being John Locke’s eye in Jacob’s house last week, too! Haha!

    Why is Harold Perrineau’s name listed in the cast when Michael has not yet come back into the show????

    My questions/observations:

    1. How are each of the four rescuers, aside from Frank, related to 815?

    2. Is the 815 in the ocean a hoax? The bodies obviously are since we know the real pilot was pulled from the plane by the black smoke monster.

    3. Who is the black man who visited Hurley in the hospital and who hired Naomi? What does he want Ben for? Who is Naomi and why did she have a photo of Desmond and Penny?

    4. The pic of Ben was not on the island…when was it taken and where was he? What did he do?

    5. How did Ben know about the freighter and how did he have a spy on the boat? Who is the spy? Someone we’ve met before?

    6. Who is this George on the freighter? What is his deal and why couldn’t he come to the phone?

    7. Who will be the next of the Oceanic 6?

    8. The number on the helicopter was 842 (4,8, 15, 16, 23, 42)

    9. I find it remarkable John Locke made reference to Walt’s height. Obviously that scene was shot two years after the show started so the actor went through a growth spurt, but most of the time that is not mentioned in a show. However, it was mentioned…what does this mean?

    10. Jacob is giving John Locke orders…what is his goal? Who is Jacob? That Frank looks like him!

    11. The polar bear in Tunisia with a Dharma-like collar…a pre-Dharma group? Another station? From how long ago?

    I love all of the new questions and I love that some answers were revealed!

    FANTASTIC!

  15. Andy says:

    TC, yes, Miles did say that it wasn’t Naomi, but he meant that in a body/soul kinda way. He said it wasn’t Naomi, it was just “meat”. it was her body, not her soul, or the REAL her.

  16. lost chicka says:

    OMG, that was a flippin awesome episode!!!
    So much happened it was AMAZING!!! I LOVED IT!

    anyways:
    ~ i think they’re after ben for dharma
    ~ walt is giving locke orders not jacob? or is jacob posing as walt?
    ~ dan is so wierd and a bad liar.
    ~ glad they explained why locke is running around the island with a gunshot wound (looks like john’s daddy coning him did some good)
    ~ haha, naomi did use a code!!!!
    ~ sayid rocks my socks off, he and juliet had an amazing entrance and they certainly helped a lot.
    ~ charlote found a dharma polar bear in the desert, cool!
    ~ naomi was basically sent to babysit the other 4 by Abadon. but why do they need military training to get ben? (actually, i kinda do but still, why?) and they didn’t think there were any 815 survivors, even tho the pilot dude told them it wasn’t the plane. besides, wouldn’t they know about the cover up?
    ~ what plane is in the water?
    ~ my money is on michael being in the freighter.

    i heart polar bears!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
    and cows – moo!!!!!!!!!!!

  17. breto says:

    who is the oceanic six (or what)? I am totally lost.

  18. NikkiV says:

    [quote comment="176551"]
    I was right about it being John Locke’s eye in Jacob’s house last week, too! Haha!

    Why is Harold Perrineau’s name listed in the cast when Michael has not yet come back into the show????

    FANTASTIC![/quote]

    I agree it was a great episode. Better than last week. Not as fast moving, but goodness, it was good. Are those many commercials legal?? Sheesh..

    I think, and I have been wondering this with all the Christian is Jacob business, maybe everyone is still credited in the list of actors/actresses just to keep the viewers on their toes…

    Who knows. But it’s one reason I love Lost.

    Also, I don’t think Ben ever named someone as a spy. He just said he had someone on the boat. Right??

  19. Laurie says:

    Noticed something really interesting…Ben saying the names of everyone at the end there…Charlotte Staples Lewis…you know how the writers LOVE to leave clues, etc. Seems like her name must be one…CS Lewis? Anyone who’s read the Chronicles of Narnia see what I’m getting at? Where’s the wardrobe to get to the island?

  20. Jet Black says:

    What, I have to learn a half dozen new faces and names?”, or “They keep opening new doors in this saga, raising new questions, and never answering anything!”

  21. Link says:

    for all i know, ben, the rescuers and the oceanic airline used to be bond together. ever wonder why ben knows the intention of the rescuers?

  22. Primary Objective says:

    [quote comment="176549"]So Ben has Michael on the freighter…awesome.[/quote]

    That would be a great tie in to get Michael back on the show but I dont think so. I think Ben is also “special” and knows people when he sees them.

  23. NikkiV says:

    ALSO–

    Did anyone try calling the Oceanic hotline? I did…
    1-888-548-0034

    I love this stuff!

  24. Pam says:

    [quote comment="176554"]the pilot dude told them it wasn’t the plane. besides, wouldn’t they know about the cover up?
    [quote]
    I think he was trying to tell them the body of the pilot wasn’t who they were saying he was. This doesn’t prove that the body was piloting the plane.

  25. lostintime says:

    So, that plane in the ocean was most definitely staged by Oceanic Airlines since they had no logical or scientific explanantion of how the real flight 815 dissapeared without a trace. Naomi’s boss (bald guy) must be working with Oceanic or some group who insisted on finding out where the real plane did crash. Maybe an Oceanic/Dharma joint mission. And why the hell was there a polar bear and Dharma logo found buried in Tunisia? Is this the remnants of the island? Do we assume now that the Losties are stuck in some time paradox and the present time on the island took place thousands, maybe millions of years ago? This show is great, I can’t wait to see how this all ties together!!

  26. Julie says:

    [quote comment="176560"]Noticed something really interesting…Ben saying the names of everyone at the end there…Charlotte Staples Lewis…you know how the writers LOVE to leave clues, etc. Seems like her name must be one…CS Lewis? Anyone who’s read the Chronicles of Narnia see what I’m getting at? Where’s the wardrobe to get to the island?[/quote]

    Never thought of that…..the writers are so creative…..and yes, there is a purpose to everything that is said and done. Can’t wait until next week!!! Do we really only get 6 more episodes this season? They can’t do this to us!!!!!

  27. lost chicka says:

    this episode flew by, last weeks dragged in many places, but this one was a whirlwind (and so is my head!) it seemed like only 30 min. when it came to an end (and i’m totally rewatching it religiously!)

    nikkiV: i don’t buy into the Christian is Jacob buisness either, they keep him so shaddowed it’s really almost impossible to tell, but in last week’s ep he looked like Christian (unlike through the looking glass). look at the screencaps on dark ufo!

    why do all the freighter tots care so much (beside frank) about 815????? daniel was shocked, and apparently charlotte read over & over again in different language.

    does ben seriously not know what smokie does?

    comment 14: to answer #9 i think it’s just cuz lost realizes if they don’t say it we’re gonna come up with some crazy theory about why he’s taller.
    and #11 it was old enough to be a skeleton. and was dharma, it was the hydra ( i think, i suck at remembering what the stations are all called)

    miles is mean. :( why does he hate everybody so much? why can’t he be like good ol’ danny, awkward and trusting?

    NikkiV: what happens when you call the number?

  28. LostDamery says:

    Wow Again, LOST is the fastest show on Thursday night!
    So many new people and questions and how dare they tease us with “what is the smoke monster?” That was a great Tease … first thing I thought of with Ben “opening” up…
    Okay 2 cents:
    1) I feel a good ol’ switch coming on. The rescuers are there to Help Ben[shock] and Ben shot the girl knowing she had on a flack jacket[decoy]. Smells of a set up!
    2) Are Walt and Michael the other 2 of the Oceanic Six?

    extra change ..BRING ON SMOKEY!

  29. Toeknee says:

    So, if the team of 4 (plus Naomi) went there to get Ben, where does Desmond fit in? Last season Naomi said she was hired by Penny to find Desmond….very puzzling.

  30. Laura says:

    Daniel’s last name is Faraday. This is a unit in physics for electrical charge. It is named after Michael Faraday, a physicist that worked a lot with electrical charge. I’m not sure how this is relevant, but I noticed it and thought it was interesting… :)

  31. Laura says:

    Daniel’s last name is Faraday. A faraday is a physics unit for electrical charge. It was named after Michael Faraday a English Physicist. I’m not sure how this is relevant, but I thought it was interesting! :)

  32. Laura says:

    Lapidus is a Jewish family name derived from the Hebrew biblical male given name Lapidot, husband of the prophetess Deborah (Judges 4:4). The literal meaning of the name is “torches” or “candles”.

  33. brutha says:

    Great episode and fun to have some new interesting characters. They better not leave us hanging for another year after just 6 episodes.

    Few thoughts:

    – Is the “found” Oceanic plane in the ocean staged and filled with 300+ dead bodies? We obviously know where the real 815 is.

    – Ben must have been off the island as an adult sometime to have that picture taken.

    – I think Michael is Ben’s inside man on the freighter (and will later be dead in the coffin that Jack visits)

  34. Laura says:

    why are we so sure bens picture is off the island? who knows what other strange places there are on the island. we still dont know what the temple is!

  35. DocH says:

    WOW! Easily one of the top 5 LOSTs ever. So fast paced… thought we’d get a gradual intro to each of the new “freighter tots” – but they rammed them down our throats as fast as they could – all with their own flashback issues. This will get an Emmy for editing.

    Most interesting was Miles and his “Ghostbusters” journey to Inglewood, CA. Somebodies(?) grandma had to have an exorcism in a departed young mans’ bedroom. Miles tweeked an extra 100 bucks on the deal. He gave it back after he found a wad of cash and a bag of heroin (cheese) behind the wall. Guess he’ll return soon.

    Second favorite freighter tot was actor Jeff Fahey the helo pilot. I don’t think he is with the program like the others but he did know the profiles of every one on the island AND he knew the pilot of OA815, his stand-in.

    Loved the Locke – Sawyer discussions. Something brewing there. Sayid was more prominent than recently too. Vincent got a nice nod as well with the GPS tracking seen.

  36. Toeknee says:

    [quote comment="176551"]
    I was right about it being John Locke’s eye in Jacob’s house last week, too! Haha!

    Why is Harold Perrineau’s name listed in the cast when Michael has not yet come back into the show????

    My questions/observations:

    6. Who is this George on the freighter? What is his deal and why couldn’t he come to the phone?

    8. The number on the helicopter was 842 (4,8, 15, 16, 23, 42)

    9. I find it remarkable John Locke made reference to Walt’s height. Obviously that scene was shot two years after the show started so the actor went through a growth spurt, but most of the time that is not mentioned in a show. However, it was mentioned…what does this mean?
    [/quote]
    How do you figure you were right about Locke’s eye in the cabin? I still don’t think it was Locke – I think it was Jacob.

    Harold Perrineau’s name appears because he is now back in the regular cast and will appear later in the season. Think about it this way – we didn’t see Sun and Jin this episode, but those actors’ names were listed.

    I thought it was very odd that George couldn’t answer the phone. I mean, it’s not like it was a telemarketer calling. It’s the reason they’re on this mission!

    Great catch on the helicopter number!

    I thought the reference to Walt’s height was another sort of inside joke between the writers and us rabid fans. After we saw Walt last season, there were tons of comments on this and other boards about how tall Walt was, so I think they threw that in to say Locke was thinking the same as us. This is similar to last week when Hurley said Jack would look weird with a beard. I think the writers threw that in to acknowledge that after last season many people complained about how bad that beard looked.

  37. nicunurse says:

    Okay and who was the woman in the first scene when Daniel is in the kitchen and starts shaking when he hears about the plane…he is a physicist….why does the plane affect him? Was that woman Penny?

  38. Toeknee says:

    [quote comment="176332"]
    I really do hope they answer at least 1 major question this week. A significant reveal that will help us focus our efforts over the next 2 months. [/quote]
    I’d say you got your wish, Doc, no? At least with the info that they’re looking for Ben. But also with how Oceanic 815 was supposedly found, and how Frank realized that the pilot wasn’t who they said it was, implying a big coverup.

  39. Laura says:

    lapidus = candle = marvin candle = DHARMA

  40. lostmari says:

    Anyone else think it was strange that Desmond was absent in this episode?

    BTW, if you call the Oceanic Hotline, you get a message/update on the “investigation”… cool…

  41. nicunurse says:

    I don’t think it was locke’s eye in the cabin..he looked way too surprised when Hurley said he had been to the cabin…if it had been locke’s eye, he would have seen hurley…

  42. lostmari says:

    Also, if the real mission was to get Ben, why didn’t Charolette recognize him right off the bat?

  43. Toeknee says:

    [quote comment="176554"]
    ~ haha, naomi did use a code!!!!
    [/quote]
    Indeed! Good call by those of you who said this after last week’s episode.

  44. DocH says:

    Another impression I got is that the four newbies are just as confused about who and what is behind their mission. Sure they know what they’ve been asked and told about the situation, but I genuinely feel they are being as manipulated as the Losties, and the Others.

    You mention the word manipulation to me and I immediately think of Ben. He knows so much more than he has revealed. He will be thee key throughout the remaining 46 episodes.

    Juliet still worries me, she implied, early on, that she may have had some knowledge, that the freighter tos were out there, or at least, nearby. But she shared that with no one, not even Jack.

  45. Toeknee says:

    Just like last week’s improbability that Naomi could have scooted away without any of the Losties noticing, I found it very hard to believe that noone noticed Ben steal Charlotte’s gun from her, especially Charlotte herself. How subtle can a guy be with his hands tied together?

  46. lost chicka says:

    i don’t think ben’s pic is off the island. i think it’s in one of the stations.

    doch: agree absolutly in top 5. for me, probably closer to top 3!

    could george be ben’s person who’s hangin out with the freightor tots? i think it’s michael, but it could be george, yes?

    oh, and i think last week it was jacob’s eye to. i made my mind up when i watched that again right before confimed dead.

    is jacob giving locke orders posing as walt? or is walt really bossing mr. locke around?

    what plane did they find? or is it part of 815?

  47. William says:

    I am wondering does anyone have any clue why the polar bear in the archeological dig in the memory flash of the woman who crashed on the island had a Dharma Initiative colar on?

    The polar bear was obviously very old at least the way the plot spinned the scene. A polar bear in a desert being excavated and having a Dharma Initiative colar.

    What say you???

  48. DocH says:

    I did get my wish ToeKnee. We all did.

    One quick Q? Was the TV news gal who reported the discovery of OA815 at the beginning of the show, the same gal who played “Tricia Tanaka” in the middle of last season? I haven’t had time to check yet. If it is, that is another major bone the writers tossed us.

  49. lostmari says:

    #45: I don’t think Ben took Charolette’s gun, wasn’t it Alex’s boyfriend’s gun.

  50. I’ve posted a summary of “Confirmed Dead” on my blog with highlights and some of the biggest clues and questions. Did anyone else pick up on the fact that Hurley saw a cabin (with Christian Shepherd in it!) in a different place than where Locke wanted to go to reach Jacob’s cabin? Also, when and where did Ben go off the island, that Matthew Abaddon’s people had that photo of him? What is Ben’s significance, that they are after him rather than the island? And the island and Walt want to protect him? There is so much more going on than we know so far! :-)

  51. DocH says:

    I got a weird flashback (personal, not LOST) when Charlotte did her scientist thing in Tunisia. I first thought wow – Close Encounter of the Third Kind – when the little French guy was finding clues in the desert. Then I thought – Stargate (the movie).

    It was cool to see the HYDRA tag on the polar bear bones. … whoever is behind the zoological experiments (Dharma, Natives, Hanso?) wanted to try all environments for the bears. What next? Polar Bears in the Rockies or Florida swamps?

  52. lost chicka says:

    [quote comment="176613"]I did get my wish ToeKnee. We all did.[/quote]

    it feels like christmas all over again doesn’t it?

    why do all the freighter tots care so much (beside frank) about 815????? daniel was shocked, and apparently charlotte read over & over again in different language.

    where does desmond and penny fit in? if the freighter tots are there for ben, why do they need des & penny?

    i’m tellin y’all, juliet is bad to the bone. she’s playing the good girl card to get her butt off the island but if that don’t work she’ll do whatever the heck she has to to get off.

  53. lalalalalost says:

    it couldn’t have been locke’s eye in the cabin last week because, he was shocked when hurley revealed that he knew about jacob’s cabin…

    i think that the freighter team sent out there by abbadon (is that how you spell it?) has something to do with dharma and not oceanic. i think they’re looking for ben because he killed all of dharma!!! and they’re there to destroy (like his name means) “the others”.

  54. Toeknee says:

    [quote comment="176610"]I am wondering does anyone have any clue why the polar bear in the archeological dig in the memory flash of the woman who crashed on the island had a Dharma Initiative colar on?

    The polar bear was obviously very old at least the way the plot spinned the scene. A polar bear in a desert being excavated and having a Dharma Initiative colar.

    What say you???[/quote]
    I assumed that the Polar Bear had been taken off the island, perhaps as part of a travelling exhibit, and somehow died in that desert. Perhaps it escaped from its handlers and couldn’t survive in that climate.

  55. katesFriend says:

    not sure how this all fits together, but maybe the freighter has only been able to find the island since the magnetic anomoly when the hatch imploded and the portugese men in the arctic called penny

    this connects penny (naomi had picture of her and des) and maybe thats how they knew where to look for ben

    this could maybe be the dharma/widmore connection?

    remember, naomi had a portugese Catch 22 too

  56. Toeknee says:

    [quote comment="176616"]#45: I don’t think Ben took Charolette’s gun, wasn’t it Alex’s boyfriend’s gun.[/quote]
    Could be. I assumed it was Charlotte’s because there was one scene where we see a glimpse of her gun in her pocket, and if I remember correctly they showed Ben looking at it.

  57. Toeknee says:

    [quote comment="176613"]I did get my wish ToeKnee. We all did.

    One quick Q? Was the TV news gal who reported the discovery of OA815 at the beginning of the show, the same gal who played “Tricia Tanaka” in the middle of last season? I haven’t had time to check yet. If it is, that is another major bone the writers tossed us.[/quote]
    Different actresses, per IMDB.

  58. NikkiV says:

    [quote comment="176594"]Anyone else think it was strange that Desmond was absent in this episode?

    BTW, if you call the Oceanic Hotline, you get a message/update on the “investigation”… cool…[/quote]

    I was wondering where Desmond had got off to. But I suppose for that matter, we didn’t see Rose and her Rambo either…

  59. Jet Black says:

    Quick question, where can I rewatch the show, I missed the first half. It’s not on itunes yet, already checked.

    thaaaaanks

  60. DocH says:

    In the words of John Locke – “We’re gonna have to watch that again.”

  61. Toeknee says:

    Trying to tie this episode into what we learned in last week’s episode…..

    When Abbadon asked Hurley if “They’re still alive”, he must have been talking about the four “rescuers”. Perhaps they don’t get off the island. Maybe something in the upcoming episodes prompts some of the Losties to just hop in the helicopter and fly away. Maybe there will be some sort of fight with the rescuers. So once they get in the ‘copter, they’re not going to go to the freighter, they’re going to seek real rescue, thnking that they can go back to the island whenever they want to get the rest of the Losties. And maybe there are only 6 of them that can get in the ‘copter. Sayid would be have to be one – he’d fly the thing. But I don’t know if the ‘copter could carry 6 people, especially if one of them is Hurley.

    The only part I can’t work into this theory is when Jack said “I’m sick of lying” in his flash-forward. To me that implies some agency had guaranteed their rescue in exchange for them lying about the island.

  62. ByeByeBoone says:

    Does anyone think that Miles should go to Jacob’s cabin? If he can speak to spirits, maybe he can find out what Jacob is all about.

    Did I miss something? When was it confirmed that it was Locke’s eye that Hurley saw in the cabin?

  63. Eman V says:

    WOAH! its gotta be michael on that freighter… he was the one that was escaping the island… the freighter found him… why Ben says one of his is on the boat? maybe cause he considers michael one of his as he helped him escape. or maybe Ben’s got Michael on his side by somehow convincing him. I coulda sworn they were REALLY confirmed dead like as in now, they are in some sorta state between alive and dead… blew my mind totally

  64. herxanthikles says:

    One thing we should be concerned about is Ben being interested in Hurley having seen Jacob’s cabin. Clearly Hurley gets off the island, but I’m worried about the guy given that Ben is a little possessive of his Jacob connection. At any rate, Hurley’s communion with the island seems to be getting more and more important–will it rival Locke’s or Ben’s?

  65. meathead says:

    Kinda disappointing. I was expecting more. I think it was insulting for Locke to ask the question about the smoke monster and then get no answer. This was almost as bad as the Charlie episode with the weird dream.

  66. Marry Me Kate says:

    #45-It was definitely Carl’s (Alex’s boyfriend) gun. After Ben shoots Charlotte Carl looks down at his belt where his gun was.

    Also, when Miles goes to that women’s house to get rid of her grandson’s ghost, did anyone notice the pictures on the wall? To me, it looks a lot like young Ecko.

  67. Courtney says:

    [quote comment="176560"]Noticed something really interesting…Ben saying the names of everyone at the end there…Charlotte Staples Lewis…you know how the writers LOVE to leave clues, etc. Seems like her name must be one…CS Lewis? Anyone who’s read the Chronicles of Narnia see what I’m getting at? Where’s the wardrobe to get to the island?[/quote]

    Could the ‘wardrobe’ be the box that Ben said could bring anything to the island?

    If the photo of Ben was taken ON the island, how would the photo get to people OFF island? Maybe Abbadon has a spy on the island, as well?

  68. ByeByeBoone says:

    who is Tricia Tanaka??

  69. meg says:

    I don’t think the young boy Miles “visited” could have been Ecko because it was the day they found the wreckage, and also he said that a friend told him he was murdered. BUT could it be a son or relative?! What was the connection with the drugs? Ecko was in the business of trafficking the drugs inside Mother Theresa statues…?!

    Also what is the meaning of the 4 new people bringing gas masks on the helicopter? I think they have all been to the island before, and knew the people who had been killed by Ben. This would motivate them to go after him for revenge. Could Dan (physicist) have helped build the massive magnet that caused the plane to wreck, therefore bringing him extreme sadness when he realized the plane had been taken by Ben when he sees the staged wreckage?

    What about Charlotte (anthropologist)? Could she have been the little girl that was part of the original Dharma village (Ben’s girlfriend), therefore causing the both of them to look at each other funny, especially at the end when she realizes her cover is blown and her true feeling come out as total disgust for him.

    I dont know exactly Miles’ connection but I think the 3 of them are tied to the island and have a serious vendetta against Ben.

    Frank on the other hand, I believe just feels a moral obligation to help the Oceanic survivors since he was supposed to be flying that flight.

  70. froggirl says:

    How do they know about Ben and why do they want him?? Will Juliet stay loyal to the Losties or has she been playing them, still the double agent?

    It seems the freighties wanting Ben will lead to a Team Jack vs Team Locke match up.

    Taller Walt Ghost = awesome band name.

  71. froggirl says:

    Meg, I think it COULD have been a young Eko if there is some sort of alternate universe/time line in play, which to me seems likely.

  72. chris says:

    just wanted to point out that if you watch the season 3 dvd – you’ll find another DHARMA training video for the Hydra. the video abruptly ends with a reference to teleportation and cloning… but cloning in the the way Tesla does in the movie “the prestige”

    with that said – it is quite possible that the polar bearar has been teleported to the desert – but with a time-travel twist.

    quite possible the island or Dharma has figured out how to bend time… and notice that one of the 4 tots – is a physicist.

    also – i agree – it was clearly lockes eye in the shack last week.

  73. dara lost says:

    What I am thinking is the 4 people in the helio are decendents of the origina Dharma and are looking for revenge with Ben. Charolette is an anthropologist and was looking for evidence in the desert of other Dharma sites. Miles is a paranormal investigator possibly with the last name Lapitus? Meaning candle or torch..possibly the son or relative of Dr. Marvin Candle? Daniel is a physicist who beyond his obvious saddness of the finding of 815 we know little about…maybe another relative of Dharma??

    It would be very interesting if they were going to exact their revenge and the pilot Jeff was going for the survivors.. he knew it wasnt the pilot, maybe he is hoping to find the guy who filled in for him…

    we will see…

  74. gigi says:

    not sure how this all fits together, but maybe the freighter has only been able to find the island since the magnetic anomoly when the hatch imploded and the portugese men in the arctic called penny
    this connects penny (naomi had picture of her and des) and maybe thats how they knew where to look for ben
    this could maybe be the dharma/widmore connection?
    remember, naomi had a portugese Catch 22 too

    I was wondering about this too except that someone said (Frank??) that all the controls on the helicopter were messed up in the electrical storm, which by the way seems suspicious, especially after seeing Locke look up at the sky and predict that the storm was ending. It’s almost as if there is still something on the island that is serving to screw with the electo- magnetics involved with navigation.
    I also really like the nod to CS Lewis. And Laura, really interesting connection on the Lapidus =Marvin Candle = Dharma. I think you’re on to something.
    Finally, my theory is that it is Penny’s father who is behind the search. He very easily could have gotten the info from the Portugese guys (by following them, shaking them down, who knows?) But, Penny’s dad hates Desmond, he’s a power monger, and he and his company pop up periodically. I feel like we haven’t heard the last of him.

  75. Mustachio says:

    Parallel Universes.Has to be.

  76. ghostrider says:

    The polar bear fossil in the desert shows that dharma conducted experiments in a time bubble way in the past. They were attempting to establish a Noah’s Ark kind of colony that would exist in the past. This is because according to the Valenzetti Equation humanity will destroy itself on a determinable date and the whole idea behind Dharma was to defeat the Equation and in effect give humanity a second chance. Probably a CIA operation.

    Sam’s boat the Christianne I is funded by a consortium headed by Penny’s father. The freighter on the other hand was probably built by Paik Heavy Industries. I think they are hunting for the fountain of youth.

    Did you see the reaction from Ben when Hurley said he had been at the cabin? Jacob summons you. You don’t just go to see Jacob.

  77. noname says:

    Meg,
    I thought those were great points about Charlotte being the little girl in Dharma and Dan being a physicist for Dharma, possibly involved in the magnetic/hatch creation. But then thought he is too young to have worked on anything before the purge. Unless he is like that other guy who doesn’t age, but I doubt it. I’m still pretty confused about Charlotte.

    My thoughts on the plane:
    I think Ben’s people on the outside created the fake plane that was found in this episode with the substitute dead passengers. They did this to keep people from looking for the real plane and in the process happening upon the island, which obviously has to remain secret. Ben obviously has a lot of money at his disposal, given what we saw with him recruiting Juliette. I don’t think Oceanic was involved b/c there is no good reason for it. Penny had already discovered with the Portuguese guys the magnetic disturbance right at the moment Oceanic went down. Maybe they made this connection to Oceanic and somehow let this on to Naomi/her company (someone said Naomi had a Portuguese book, right?), so they figured Oceanic went down on the island–they just couldn’t find the island until the radio signals were opened by Charlie. So that is why they were all shocked by the news stories showing the plane in a different location. They were interested, but it still wasn’t their “primary objective.” I don’t think the helicopter pilot was in on it until he figured out the found plane was a scam on his own b/c of the ring thing and so for some reason the freighties brought him in on it.

  78. Circus Mom says:

    WOW!!!

    I’ve already watched the show twice and have a lot of comments. My first time posting.

    Ben
    When did he stop wearing his glasses? He dosn’t have them in the picture the tots had. I’m pretty sure he had them as a child and at least in season 1. The gun he was looking at and later took was Carls. #21 & 22, Ben knows the identity of the tots because he had a spy on the freighter. Thats also why he knows what they are there for. He’s not phycic.

    Daniel
    Said “I’m hear to rescue you.” and later “Not our primary objective.” Want’s to share information with Jack but Miles won’t let him. Dosn’t seem to have any ill will towards the losties. His most interesting comment, “The light dosn’t scatter.” I think this comment is important. The women in the house with him wasn’t Penny, no accent. The fact that we never saw her face means her identity is important.

    Miles
    What did the vaccume like thing he brought to Mrs. Gardner’s house do? Seemed like it might have created some sort of magnetic or electrical field or energy.

    Frank
    The plane he droped in the fish tank looked a lot like the one Kate had in season 1. #37, He did not know the profile of everyone on the island. He knew the names on the flight manafest. He was supposed to te the pilot and may be feeling guilt. Why didn’t he fly the plane that day?

    Charlotte
    She dosn’t beleive they found 815 in the bottom of the ocean. The bear in the desert dosn’t have to be extreamly old. The climet could have worn it to bones in just a few years. Could have been teleported there anytime in the last 30 years.

    #10 Ben had nothing to do with 815. He was supprised to see a plane break up in the air over the island.

    #50 Walt protected Lodke. He is not protecting Ben.

    #74 The helo was hit by lightning at night and locke predicted the storm ending during daylight.

    I think there are several groups of players here. Dharma bacically means “path of righteousness” and I think they are really the good guys. Ben’s group and Abaddons group both seem to have questionable motives. Penny’s dad could be connected to either group. Oceaniac may not be involved, but the call Frank made to the hotline seems to prove otherwise.

    Why were there still two Dharma men in the hatch after the purge and when Desmond arrived? Why were they not purged?

    The outer markings on the Hydra symble are different than the Pearl and the Swan. Has anyone looked into what their configuration means? Also, there was a word in the bottom set of lines on the polar bears collar. Can anyone tell what it said?

    When they want us to know who was in the coffin and the cabin, we will.

    Where did the cow come from?

    I’d love to hear responses.

  79. lostfan says:

    Michael is Ben’s man on the freighter. It was the deal he made to get off the island with Walt. At the end of season 2 – Ben & Dee told Michael the coordinates and said if he took that rickety old boat to the coordinates – another boat will be waiting.

    The Oceanic 6 are therefore…Sayid, Kate, Jack, Hurley, Michael & Walt.

    Michael dies later – Jack is the only one who goes to the funeral because Michael’s deception was so much more complicated than we originally thought.

    The guy who shows up in Hurley’s hospital and later to assemble the team – is asking Hurley if they are still alive – he’s referring to Dan, Charlotte, Naomi, etc. because our favorite heroes left them behind and took their helicopter.

  80. Circus Mom says:

    #79 If your list is the Oceaniac 6 then why didn’t Walt go to his fathers funeral. And why was there no media concedering their celebraty status.

  81. Bailey Loves Lost says:

    Hey all,

    Did any of you notice how similar Miles looks like the guy in the Dharma videos? My theory is that he is the son of the guy in the Dharma videos. Also, it’s quite possible that Daniel and Charolotte could be the children of the Dharma people who were killed, and they are coming back for retribution against Ben. They did have gas masks in the box that Jack and Kate found in the jungle. When Ben killed his father he put on a gas mask so that he wouldn’t die.
    Also, Naomi being linked with Desmond and Penny – wasn’t Penny’s father somehow affiliated with Dharma? If you remember back in Season Three when Desmond went to speak with Penny’s father there was a picture on the wall behind Desmond that had Dharma like drawings on it and a polar bear. That could be how Naomi knew about Penny and Desmond – if they are related to the Dharma group.
    The lady who was with Charlotte in the desert when they found the polar bear, was that Sayid’s girlfriend? She looked really familiar!

  82. lostfan says:

    Perhaps Michael went under an assumed name after they made it back to the mainland due to all the publicity – the freeze frame of the obituary Jack was reading in the season 3 finale said it was a man from New York (where Michael is from) – and though the letters were hard to read – the name began with a J. Walt has daddy issues just like the others on the island – there must be a deeper story there.

    Also – John knows Hurley saw Jacob – so he takes him to Jacob’s cabin. Hurley gets a look at the creepy guy – and runs from John…stumbling back to Jack’s group (hence the comment in last week’s episode – I should have gone with you, not John). Hurley gets on the helicopter with Sayid, Jack & Kate, but because he’s a big guy – someone can’t go with them…like Juliette..who gets left behind.

    Which, may be OK with the other castaways as they may realize that she knew all along about Michael on the freighter.

    Also, there may indeed be a personal link to Dharma dead people and the newly assembled team -but I wonder if Charlotte was sent to uncover the remains of the Dharma staff and do some forensics, and if Miles was sent to communicate with the dead about the purge…in addition to getting Ben and the other natives.

    And…while we’re on it…will Miles stumble across Libby and Anna Lucia’s gravesites and through his ghostbusting ways, find out Michael – if the theory is correct – is not one of them, but one of the castaways?

    Also, could it be that Dharma, so desperate to keep people away from the island, just like the natives, constucted an elaborate crash site just to call off the search. They don’t want anyone knowing about their many, many, controversal experiments.

  83. Laura says:

    In physics and mathematics, Minkowski space (or Minkowski spacetime) is the mathematical setting in which Einstein’s theory of special relativity is most conveniently formulated. In this setting the three ordinary dimensions of space are combined with a single dimension of time to form a four-dimensional manifold for representing a spacetime. Minkowski space is named after the German mathematician Hermann Minkowski.

    Minkowski seems pretty darn important….

  84. deangoodes says:

    I’m writing this comment as I go through the other comments.
    First, are the inserts of civilization for the 4 rescuers flashbacks? Flashforwards? Occurring at the same time? Charlotte seemed like hers was a flashback, Miles seemed like a flashback, but Dan and Frank seemed like current flashes. Or am I the only one thinking that??
    Next, whose house was Miles ghostbusting? Was it anyone we already knew?
    It doesn’t loook like the plane in the ocean was staged by Oceanic. When Frank called to say he had info about the pilot, the woman on the phone seemed intrigued by story. Not panicky like someone was going to blow the airline’s cover-up.
    Who was the woman on the other end of the phone this week? It sure sounded like Naomi??
    A lot of the commenters say Juliet is bad, or Desmond is bad, or whoever; just because they’ll do anything to get off the island–I think most of the cast would do anything to get off of the island; and maybe that’s why only six get off and why they’re feeling guilty about it back in the civilization??
    The photo on the wall at the house Miles went to sure did look like Ecko (or his brother) but they grew up in Central (or was it South) America, so if it was them then this would definitely be some sort of alternate reality/alternate timeline scenario.

  85. Laura says:

    btw… the reason for all the name postings is that i am trying to figure out what is so important about miles last name. Why did he make such a big deal about people knowing his last name… which Ben tells us at the end is Straume. I can’t find any meanings for this… but I find it interesting.

    I’m thinking Ben’s ‘man’ on the boat is Walt. He left with his father, and he is the one that keeps coming back.

    cows only live ~15 years, so this guy isn’t straight from DHARMAS (could be a relative). Patchy had cows… but one was black and one white. if i remember correctly this was one was reddish/brown

  86. lostfan says:

    Regarding the flashbacks/forwards of the team members…my original thought was that it was present tense, and in some time/space travel, what had happened to them on the island was in the future or in the past, but they can’t remember. Which would explain why Sam/Dan was crying while watching the crash footage, but didn’t know why.

  87. lost chicka says:

    ben is even MORE important then we originaly thought he was. could abaddon’s people be after ben because he’s trying to save the island or because of the purge? i think they want him because of something he has to do with dharma or the island (maybe that he can speak to jacob).

    what did daniel say about the light on the island? “the light doesn’t scatter”? does that have something to do with the sky turning purple when the hatch imploded?

    agree with circus mom, the fact that we DON”T see the woman’s face means she is important. so who is she? the cow came from the flame.

    jet black: abc.com

    maybe jack and the rest of the O6 aren’t lying for an agency, they’re lying for themselves. cuz something tells me with jack commiting attempted murder, hurley murder, and kate having done what she’s done, they might lie because they believe they have to, not cuz an agency told them to.

    i believe ben has michael on his side by using walt as bate…like you do this for me or i’ll kill walt.

    could jacob be seen as different to everyone? to locke, jacob is walt, ben, it’s the face we saw in through the looking glass, and hurley it’s christian?

    meathead: how the hell could you have expected more? what didn’t they show? i didn’t think the smokie thing was insulting, i was shocked that they were gonna tell us, but i guess ben doesn’t even know what smokie does. which could explain why they’re scared of him, cuz most people are scared of the unknown.

    if Abbadon has a spy on the island like Courtney said, could it be Alpert??? Alpert helped locke, so could it be he’s abbadon’s spy???

    i think the 4 “rescuers” are really just randomly picked people that have nothing to do with the island, just people that could do the work they were sent to do (sorta like juliet originally, or the losties).

    i think they were paying to much attention to the photos for them to mean nothing. they didn’t look like walt or ecko tho.

    locke loves the rain!! and he still is an expert rain predicter! he should become a weather man for the others!

    that wasn’t sayid’s girlfriend!

  88. James says:

    Michael is a good choice for Ben’s man on the freighter. Walt is another option, since Michael genuinely seemed doubtful when Ben told him to follow a particular course and he’d “find rescue”, whereas Walt had been with the Others, was already on the boat hiding, and seems to be inspiring Locke to protect Ben from the newcomers. Plus Locke mentioned that Walt was taller – does that mean that Walt is a bit older now, and is thus rightly called Ben’s man on the boat? Or is it a future Walt that appeared to Locke?

    There is further speculation and an overview of last night’s episode on my blog at http://exploringourmatrix.blogspot.com/2008/02/lost-in-speculation.html

  89. mitch says:

    I dont think it was lockes eye in the cabin i think it is that russian guy michayel or whatever his name is … also i think the guy sitting down in the cabin or jacob if you will is the head guy from the crazy house that hurley was in… also i dont know if anyone else has caught this or not but if you look at screen when they go to commercial where they show the word lost and on the top of the screen is the island and on the bottom half is what looks like the reflection of the island but it is really a reflection of a city and not the island… take a close look and you will see…

  90. vavila says:

    [quote comment="176651"]One thing we should be concerned about is Ben being interested in Hurley having seen Jacob’s cabin.

    Maybe this is because only ‘chosen ones’ can see the Cabin, like only chosen ones can hear/speak to Jacob? From the last two episodes it seems that Hurley has some special powers (some of which he takes to the normal world)… Hmmm…..

  91. mcotter says:

    Did anyone else pick up on the pictures in that black woman’s house that looked like a young eko on the wall probably wrong but i thought that.

  92. vavila says:

    Re # 71 & 69: I don’t think it was Eko’s relative. I think Eko grew up in Africa (Nigeria?) and the setting for gostcatcher part of last episode was US…

  93. Pam says:

    [quote comment="176913"]
    The photo on the wall at the house Miles went to sure did look like Ecko (or his brother) but they grew up in Central (or was it South) America[/quote]
    They are from South AFRICA!

  94. roaringleo says:

    This episode was a stretch. No news agency on Earth would broadcast corpses on live television. And how did the polar bear have time to fossilize? I love this show, but they’re not being as smart as they used to be. Now it’s sort of resorting to dumb tricks.

  95. Pam says:

    [quote comment="176952"]Re # 71 & 69: I don’t think it was Eko’s relative. I think Eko grew up in Africa (Nigeria?) and the setting for gostcatcher part of last episode was US…[/quote]
    Sorry for commenting on the same comment you commented on.
    You might be right about Nigeria.

  96. nona says:

    i don’t want to sound like an overly sensitive politically correct whiner, but what’s up with all these borderline racial comments? the kid whose grandmother hired miles to do the exorcism may have been eko because…..they’re both black? miles may be related to marvin candle because….they’re both asian? charlotte’s translator may be nadia becasue….they’re both from the middle east? i know there’s lots of connections between all the different characters, but c’mon people!

  97. Lostntyme says:

    Just because the dead grandson was african american, why does everyone assume that he is Eko? First off, that dead grandson was in California. Secondly, Eko was born and raised in South Africa. Some of you generalize things way too much. Oh he’s black and Eko was black so they must be the same person…geez

  98. Lostntyme says:

    So maybe I’m not right about South Africa, I’m not sure what country he’s from, but lets just say Eko was from Africa, not the US. And it would be really dumb for that kid to be Eko considering that Miles doesn’t look any different in age from that point where he did the ghostbusting to the point where he is now on the island. And Eko died as an adult, so how does that make any sense? I don’t think there is any siginificance between Eko and the dead boy. It was just a backstory to Miles’ character.

  99. shellonius funk says:

    so i wonder why sam said his name was daniel…the other 3 didn’t use fake names. then again he IS a head case, so sayeth naomi.

    what if naomi in the abbadon flash was REALLY her twin sister regina?!? all i know is that they showed a “naomi” flash, and then immediately after we hear her voice on the walkie as regina. it sounded JUST like her.

    i think that miles uses his gift to get money from dead people. i think that’s his Thing; he told the grandma that he had a buddy at the police station.

    i was hoping to see kelvin’s body when they discovered miles at the cove.

    i agree [with whomever] that some of the flashes seemed back and some seemed forward.

    i’ve read on here in the past that several people believe that time is moving backwards [somewhere]..well what if that is the case in an alternate reality? i dunno..i don’t really WANT to believe that, but with walt predicting birds and locke predicting rain and miles the ghostbuster and polar bears…my brain is spinning.

    slightly off topic: the joop/orangutan that lived to be 100…from the Life Extension Project [lostpedia.com]….if dharma started in the 70’s, how do they know joop lived to be 100? definitely some time issues going on, possibly time travel?

  100. Adam says:

    I think Walt is connecting everything. Does anyone remember that episode from season 1, when Walt is in a flashback, and he gets angry that his mom and stepdad won’t pay attention to the bird in the book he was reading, and then that same live bird crashes into the window? Obviously, Walt has some type of ability that the Others were interested in. He is going to tie everything together.

  101. SPIRALTURTLE says:

    [quote comment="176629"]it couldn’t have been locke’s eye in the cabin last week because, he was shocked when hurley revealed that he knew about jacob’s cabin…

    i think that the freighter team sent out there by abbadon (is that how you spell it?) has something to do with dharma and not oceanic. i think they’re looking for ben because he killed all of dharma!!! and they’re there to destroy (like his name means) “the others”.[/quote]

    Yes but one of the freighter tots was shocked when he figured out that Juliet was not on the plane — He said something along the lines of “So there ARE natives here!”

  102. shellonius funk says:

    ok so joop is hanso and not dharma…still that polar bear fossil made me think of joop.
    but it also makes me think time travel and/or teleportation.

  103. Bailey Loves Lost says:

    [quote comment="176964"]i don’t want to sound like an overly sensitive politically correct whiner, but what’s up with all these borderline racial comments? the kid whose grandmother hired miles to do the exorcism may have been eko because…..they’re both black? miles may be related to marvin candle because….they’re both asian? charlotte’s translator may be nadia becasue….they’re both from the middle east? i know there’s lots of connections between all the different characters, but c’mon people![/quote]

    I really don’t think that the connections people are making are borderline racial comments.

  104. shellonius funk says:

    i think that when hurley mentioned the cabin, locke DID know what he meant. he said “what’d you say” almost sternly…in a don’t-mention-it way, and then hurley did the ole “oh…uh…i meant the uh…airplane cabin.”

    also, i certainly don’t think that EVERY weird incident can be attributed to jacob; that would be such a cop-out on the writer’s parts.

  105. Mars says:

    There has been much discussion as to the Oceanic 6. Kate, Jack and Hurley have been revealed but who are the other three? Think about this scenario, who has the best opportunity for storylines back in the real world? This is a little long but read it out:

    Kate: Former felon on the run but adept at for the long con. She has something to gain by leaving the island, her father, making up for killing the doctor, an ex-husband(I think), there are possibilities.

    Hurley: A romanticized character loved by fans. He has a storyline off the island that parallels Jack’s descent into madness. With respect to the opposing forces on the island any side be it Dharma, the others, etc. consider Hurley as harmless thus he survives.

    Jack: He has a life off the island a life to return to. Although we know how it ends (with him wanting to return), presently there is a reason compelling him to return to the outside world ie, career, reconcillition with his ex-wife, perhaps the woman who gave him the tatoo?

    Sayid: We know that Sayid’s love makes it to the United States (remember the episode where Locke does some sort of inspection on her new home?) Once again Sayid has a compelling reason to leave the island. There are things left undone for Sayid and the storyline is one that would want this issue resolved.

    Desmond: Of all the characters here is the one with the greatest desire to leave. Not to mention that four or five storylines coincide with this one character. Penny, her father, the Wittemore Industry (is that right?) plus whoever may be cooperating / competing against Wittmore to find or cover up the island. Desmond’s is someone that once off the island offers great possibilities.

    Michael: It’s thin but he’s already left the island. This point that Michael is Ben’s man on the boat seems not quite right. Why then would Naomi state that “Oceanic 815 was found and there were no survivors.” Michael is at heart, selfish for both him and his boy. Michael was willing to do whatever it took (killing 2 people!) to get off the island. My thought is Michael and Walt were able to leave and make contact with something Ben set up and returned to the world incognito. Michael made the deal to keep his mouth shut about the island and in return was he and Walt were granted freedom by “the others” outside contacts. Perhaps when Jack, Kate, Hurley and Sayid return from the dead and are pronounced to the world, Michael someway returns as well.

    What about the rest of the characters. One simple truth, they have nothing to return to in the outside world. What did they leave behind that was important?

    Claire: no husband, no real family to speak of, she was going to give her baby away.

    Sawyer: Ben’s right, he’s just a con man. Besides he has taken care of his demons on the island. His revenge is complete, there is no compelling reason to leave.

    Locke: Locke’s outside storyline is done, of all the characters he has the best reason to stay on the island.

    Sun and Jin: Have’nt really thought these two out. They have a reason to leave, but the story in and of itself seems to have drifted away from them.

    Juliette: A tragedy waiting to happen. I think she never leaves the island alive. Its the last knife in the heart of Jack to make him curse the island and return to the world.

    Ben: Ben is a wealth of knowledge, but does his story stand to be interesting if he were off the island? Not really.

    Chew on this for awhile and comment. I love the show and what accounts for the best and only watchable TV out there.

  106. Toeknee says:

    [quote comment="176913"]
    First, are the inserts of civilization for the 4 rescuers flashbacks? Flashforwards? Occurring at the same time? Charlotte seemed like hers was a flashback, Miles seemed like a flashback, but Dan and Frank seemed like current flashes. Or am I the only one thinking that??
    [/quote]
    I thought all 4 were flashbacks. Dan and Frank were watching news footage related to the recent discovery of Oceanic 815, same as Miles listened to similar news on the radio and Charlotte read about it in the newspapers.

  107. miette1 says:

    I am one of the believers in a weird time-space continuum/alternative reality theory. So, I buy into the whole “Through the Looking Glass” premise. I think that the plane we saw at the bottom of the ocean is Oceanic 815, but on an alternate timeline (or on the other side of the looking glass). So I think both planes exist, but had different crash sites and passengers. To this end, I think that the four people that landed on the island yesterday were all SUPPOSED TO BE on the Oceanic flight that crashed on the island, but for whatever reaosn they weren’t. I think that they might actually be on that flight that was discovered at the bottom of the ocean. Jeff Fahey says he was supposed to be the pilot on that flight (I’m guessing he was kicked off because he was drunk) so the other guy became the pilot and then crashed into the island. Jermey Davies is having a breakdown while he’s looking at the footage on TV…perhaps because he was supposed to be on that plane (or a part of him knows that on the alternate timeline, he’s on the plane at the bottom of the sea). This is a weird group of people to put together to go and get Ben. Maybe Abbadon (and the island) wand these four on the island, hence, why they are there. It kind of makes your head spin, but that’s why I love LOST in the first place.

  108. miette1 says:

    I forgot to add that I believe that the pilot on the plane in the ocean is Jeff Fahey, hence why there is no ring on the finger.

  109. miette1 says:

    I forgot to add that I believe that Jeff Fahey is the pilot on the plane in the ocean, hence, why there is no wedding ring.

  110. Toeknee says:

    [quote comment="176674"]who is Tricia Tanaka??[/quote]
    Tricia Tanaka was the news reporter in the season 3 episode “Tricia Tanaka is Dead”. In the opening scenes of that episode, she’s interviewing Hurley about his lottery winnings, outside the new restaurant he opened up. When she went inside the restaurant, a meteor hit it and she died. This is the same episode they discovered the Dharma van on the island.

  111. shellonius funk says:

    the more i think about it, the more i think miles was lying when he said that the naomi/sister thing was code. if it really WAS code, why did dan seem clueless about it? miles seemed like he was trying to convince dan that that’s what they’d talked about.

    that makes me think that regina IS naomi’s twin. also, when we see “naomi” with abbadon, he never calls her by name….maybe THAT was regina.

  112. Missy says:

    Anyone find it odd that upon being discovered each freiter tot gave a different reason for coming to the island? Naomi was looking for Desmond; Dan and Miles were looking for 815 survivors; Charlotte looking for Ben.

    Hydra – What was the purpose the two girls in the hydra were doing? There must have been a reason that station was secretly manned. If it stopped transmitting something, wouldn’t that send a red flag to someone in the outside world?

    Miles – There’s many stories to be told. Will he come near the hole where Ben put all the original Darhma people? Do they have an idea of what has already happened because they came with the gas masks?

    Oceanic 6 – Does Kate know she’s pregnant and that’s why she wants to leave the island? There is no other reason for her to want to leave. Same for Sun – she needs to leave the island too.

    Claire/Jack – Are they ever going to find out their related? That’s been bugging me forever.

    That’s all for now. Great comments on the fastest hour of tv around.

  113. lostfan says:

    The Oceanic 6 cannot include Desmond or Juliette…as they were never on the plane.

  114. SPIRALTURTLE says:

    Laura — I also tried to find something on Straume but found nothing. However, I did run across this entry in lostpedia:

    The name ‘Miles Straume’ is a play on the word “maelstrom”, which means a powerful whirlpool or a swirling mass of water.
    The device he brought upstairs makes and spreads cold air. It’s a common device that real-life ghostbusters use to flush spirits out of their hiding places

  115. Toeknee says:

    [quote comment="176652"]Kinda disappointing. I was expecting more. I think it was insulting for Locke to ask the question about the smoke monster and then get no answer. This was almost as bad as the Charlie episode with the weird dream.[/quote]
    I think the writers threw that exchange in there as a response to the criticism they’ve been getting for years – why don’t these characters ask more questions? So, they show Locke asking one of the biggest questions, only to have Ben say “I don’t know”. This is typical of all exchanges the Losties and the Others – the Others give out very little information, perhaps to protect themselves. Remember when Sawyer and Sayid cornered Juliet and demanded answers, Juliet responded “If I told you what I know, you’d kill me.” Maybe that’s the mindset of all of the Others, so they evade questions asked of them.

    But the real reason that no answers are given by the Others is that the writers are not ready to reveal certain key pieces of information. They have presumably plotted out the remaining 46 episodes and when the time is right they will offer explanations to (hopefully) most of these mysteries. If they explained how the monster works now, that may make many of the remaining episodes pointless.

  116. Barb says:

    Why the box with gas masks – because Ben had the Dharma crew killed with poison gas.

    Except for Frank, the pilot, perhaps Miles, Charlotte and Daniel are relations to those on the original Dharma crew – out for revenge to get Ben and that’s why Abaddon picked them even thought they seem to have no training and are a bunch of misfits. I know this theory has been thrown out there already

    Hurley has been to the Jacob’s cabin and Locke was inside conversing with Jacob – Locke’s eye, I believe. Ben was surprised to hear Hurley mention the cabin and I think Locke blew it by giving that away.

    I’m thinking more and more that it’s time-travel and parallel universes. The Kate/Hurley/Jack – oceanic six – are in the wrong timeline – that’s why their lives are unraveling. They know it’s wrong and they have to go back.

    I think Ben was the one in the coffin – small and since he grew up on the island no one would know him to come to his funeral.

    Penny, I think, met Naomi but under a different name – so when Charlie asked if the freighter was Naomi’s she said no, because she’d never met “Naomi” but actually did, but using another name.

    Big question – always running throughout all seasons – how does Ben get his information about new people – such detail and so many secrets? Perhaps he, and Richard, etc. time travel to gather facts because he can go in the future he knows what’s going to happen so knows how to prepare for it.

    I love the real people in history connection to the characters. It’s a highlight of each episode to see whose name will the writers pick to name a character – C.S. Lewis – I loved that one and wonder how her character will be similar/different.

    Still disappointed that Smokey’s identity isn’t secret.

  117. CaptMeltdown says:

    GREAT EPISODE !
    I’m starting to see a very Steven Kingish kind of story path. Like the capability of an airliner going through a rift or a time portal in space AND time.
    The polar bear in the Tunisian desert, –is that the polar bear the 815ers saw in season 1?
    When Jack says to Kate in a flash forward “we have to go back” — not only can that mean go back to the island, but back in time. Also Hurley says to Jack in a flash forward, “he wants us to go back”, — this could also mean back in time.
    Keep in mind what the Tunisian desert was before the ice ages, and the polar bear along with all the other “research” stuff actually was sent through the time portal by Dharma.

  118. Paul says:

    NOTE TO ABC:

    I will never watch ELI WHITE no matter how much you try to scam me. However I may consider if:
    1. Claire loses that stupid baby and gets a speaking role again.
    2. Jack and Kate run like the wind through the jungle , lose Juliet and she is never heard from again.
    3. BRING CHARLIE BACK TO LIFE!

    Only if all these demands are met will I watch Eli White.
    Thank you.

  119. Circus Mom says:

    #99 Miles said Naomi dosn’t have a sister, thus the code phrase.

    #101 Frank said “Miles, Juliette here wasn’t on the plane. She’s a native.” Miles then immediatly thought whe would know where Ben was and they knew there were “Natives.”

    #105 I think you have something here. If Michael and Walt are returned to the world incognito then Michael wouldn’t be on the boat. Michael didn’t seem to have anything in his previous life he would want to get back to. He may have contacted the 6 when they arrived back so they are aware of him. Him being alive is one of the things they can’t tell. He is in the coffin and no-one shows up because he is “nobody.” Jack is upset because Michael is the one who knows how to get back to the island.

    #107 I like the idea that the 4 were supposeed to be on the plane. It explaines ther interest in it and why Abaddon would choose them.

    I wonder if it’s possible that in the flashbacks of our origional losties, some of the flashbacks that don’t jive with the person we see on the island are from a alternative reality and that is why they don’t jive.

    Can’t wait to hear more speculation.

  120. Cookie says:

    I am not sure why people are second-guessing the Losties desire to leave the island. Why would anyone choose to be stranded on an island and not get back to civilization? The only exception to this would be Locke, as the island experience was life-changing for him, and possibly Rose and Bernard, as the island’s “healing powers” saved her life.
    I am enjoying everyone’s observations and theories!

  121. Tina says:

    Doning some research into black wholes and scattered light and I found something interesting:
    “Black holes almost certainly exist, and one of their basic properties is that they trap light. However, it is also true that nothing exceeds the speed of light. In fact, the theoretical prediction of black holes is due to the General Theory of Relativity, which is built on the principle that the speed of light in a vacuum is constant.Photons always travel at the speed of light, but they lose energy when travelling out of a gravitational field and appear to be redder to an external observer. The stronger the gravitational field, the more energy the photons lose because of this gravitational redshift. The extreme case is a black hole where photons from within a certain radius lose all their energy and become invisible. Indeed, light in the vicinity of such strong gravitational fields exhibits quite bizarre behavior.”

    As the redshift continues the light becomes invisible because it looks black.

    On Event Horizons:
    “The event horizon is the point outside the black hole where the gravitational attraction becomes so strong that the escape velocity (the velocity at which an object would have to go to escape the gravitational field) equals the speed of light. Since according to the relativity theory no object can exceed the speed of light, that means that nothing, not even light, could escape the black hole once it is inside this distance from the center of the black hole. A more fundamental way of viewing this is that in a black hole the gravitational field is so intense that it bends space and time around itself so that inside the event horizon there are literally no paths in space and time that lead to the outside of the black hole: No matter what direction you went, you would find that your path led back to the center of the black hole, where the singularity is found.”

    http://csep10.phys.utk.edu/astr162/lect/blackhole/blackhole.html (Check it out!)

    I think this has alot to do with what Danile said with regards to the light not scattering.

  122. shellonius funk says:

    circus mom: i think that miles saying it was code was a lie; that’s why dan seemed clueless about the whole thing. miles shouldn’t have had to explain it so much if it was known that it was code.
    maybe regina is her twin?
    maybe penny knew regina but not naomi?
    i don’t know…but i think that it being code is too obvious. especially since we were all CERTAIN that it was code after last week’s show.

  123. Enik says:

    This episode introduces new characters that may support the theories based on the scientific, the spiritual, or both. Like the dichotomy between the man of science and the man of faith, the show itself is hard to nail down as science fiction or spiritual fantasy.

    Lost can be classified as science fiction if we take into account how the drama is enhanced by science, technology, and bleeding edge theories based on space and time. On the other hand, Lost can be considered to be more in line with a fantasy as many themes revolve around the supernatural, such as the whispers heard around the island and the ghostly behavior of those characters believed to be dead.

    There is still too many unknowns to figure out the show, however. The archaeologist may shed some light onto the connected artifacts on and off the island, a physicist can help explain the anomalies in time, and the ghost whisperer can help interpret the incomprehensible ghost-like whispers.

    It would be interesting to list which island phenomena would fall under which discipline each of these new experts represent.

  124. apigsagem says:

    How are Jack and Claire related?

  125. Meg says:

    [quote comment="177079"]How are Jack and Claire related?[/quote]
    Christian is their dad

  126. Barb says:

    Another theory about the Oceanic 6: That they volunteered to leave the island because it was dangerous to leave, put them in jeopardy. Someone had to leave so kate, jack, hurley and two others volunteered so as not to put the others in danger. It seems unheroic for jack and kate to flee the island, stranding the others (losties, not the others). It doesn’t make sense. I think they eventually discover that being on the island was the best thing but someone had to go back – hence they volunteered and Ben didn’t volunteer but it was his punishment to be banished from the island and go back to los angeles.
    What do you think?

  127. Becky says:

    [quote comment="176964"]i don’t want to sound like an overly sensitive politically correct whiner, but what’s up with all these borderline racial comments? the kid whose grandmother hired miles to do the exorcism may have been eko because…..they’re both black? miles may be related to marvin candle because….they’re both asian? charlotte’s translator may be nadia becasue….they’re both from the middle east? i know there’s lots of connections between all the different characters, but c’mon people![/quote]

    It is not nearly racist to make assumptions based upon national origin. That is a major stretch and also a major insult. The boy in the photo looked EXACTLY like the young Eko we saw in past episodes and many of us thought that. That hardly classifies anyone as racist. And as you’ll duly note, most connections based upon race (such as Nadia being a translator) end up being done on purpose to further the connections between the cast members.

    Please do not pollute this blog with false accusations and trying to make something racist that clearly isn’t.

  128. Lostboi says:

    I might have missed this in a previous episode, but how are claire and jack related?

  129. Pam says:

    [quote comment=”176970″i think that miles uses his gift to get money from dead people. i think that’s his Thing; he told the grandma that he had a buddy at the police station.[/quote]
    How do these two things relate?
    [quote comment="177053"]I think Ben was the one in the coffin – small and since he grew up on the island no one would know him to come to his funeral.[/quote]
    What? That makes no sense. Ben is the normal height ans weight of for an average male adult. If he wasn’t that would be a big important detail every one knows.
    Maybe the person in the coffin could be anyone under an assumed name, therefore no one in society at the time of his death recognized his alias and didn’t come to funeral. Maybe Jack and Kate help Mr. Whomever to establish his fake i.d.

  130. RJ says:

    My thoughts in no particular order:

    The lawyer, Abbadon or whatever his name is, is working for Dharma. Dharma still exists, even though Ben killed those that were on the island. Him asking Hurley if they are still alive refers to the people on the helicopter, not survivors from 815.

    Along with this, last night Sayid checked out the helicopter and said that it was in working order. At some point, he must pilot the helicopter off the island with Hurley, Jack, Kate and 2 other people. I think Sayid is #4 of the Oceanic 6 and this is why the lawyer comes to see Hurley. His people have been left on the island.

    I don’t agree that the eye was Locke’s when Hurley was looking in the cabin. I believe it was Hurley’s looking back at himself. Locke was surprised when Hurley had said the cabin was not in the direction that Locke was taking them.

    Great pick up on Charlotte and CS Lewis. If you know anything about CS Lewis, he was once an atheist who later became a Christian. I like the wardrobe idea of entering into another dimension or another world. The island represents this other world. The Chronicals of Narnia have an overall Christian theme. Aslan the lion = Jesus, etc. Perhaps the island represents God, Jacob = Jesus and smokie = Holy Spirit. That could be a stretch, but either way, if you watched the recap of the show last week before the first episode, the narrator (Ben) talks alot of Jack being a man of science and Locke being a man of faith, people losing faith then regaining faith on the island. Could be a tie in there.

    A theory a few of us have been working on here in my office is that Charlotte is not Ben’s old girlfriend (a bit too young), but rather Ben’s daughter. Ben’s childhood girlfriend’s name was Annie. She is the “inside guy” on the freighter that is feeding Ben information. Charlotte is their daughter. When Ben helps kill everyone from Dharma, we don’t know what happened to Annie. I think it is safe to say he didn’t kill her or have her killed. My thought is that he got Annie pregnant and got her off the island. That is also why Ben tries to protect Alex and tries to keep her away from Carl–so she doesn’t get pregnant. Last night, Charlotte also asks Clair if she had Aaron on the island. She knows about what happens to women on the island

  131. mcotter says:

    Just saying that the photo did look alot like young Ecko from his first flashback episode in season 2 plus they found a bag of heroin in his room, eko was a heroin dealer these are just a few conincedences.

  132. DocH says:

    “The A-Team”

    The campy 80’s show with a crew of 4 “to-the-rescue” types with unique skillsets & talents.

    The freighter tots are looking more like the “B-Team”.

    Charlotte’s skills eventually put her on Hydra Island, with the experiments there.

    Daniel’s destination will likely be the Swan Hatch and maybe the Orchid or Looking Glass.

    Miles, who knows? I can see him in the Orchid, or going after Smokie or The Island Whispers.

    Frank, he seems like the pragmatic voice of reason that will facilitate the adventures of his teammates.

  133. Miraks says:

    Answers (?)
    The frighter people are Dharma looking for their island. They are after Ben because he led the coup that kicked them off the island. In order to find the island, you need special radio signals, since it is otherwise invisible. All signals were being jammed by the computer (the one into which you had to type in numbers)until it blew up. We know Ben has been jamming all signals since then(from last episode of last season)from the underwater station.
    When flight 815 “misteriously” dissapeared, Dharma KNEW that it had to have ended up on the island. In order to throw the general public off track (and stop everyone from continuing to look for the plane), they put a fake plane sans passangers on the bottom of the ocean.
    I agree that at least the heli pilot who was supposed to fly 815 was hired BECAUSE he was supposed to be on the flight- and because he knew too much (might have suspected that the people on the fake 815 were -well, fake).
    Miles (?) assumes that Juliette is a native, because as far as Dharma knows, Ben led the coup with the help of the natives (and since she is not Ben, she must be a native). I don’t think Dharma realizes that Ben (or his people)was able to travel back and forth between the island and the outside world.

  134. dc says:

    I think Miles at the womans house is a flashforward. The wad of money he pulled out of the wall I believe is part of a huge stash of cash that Abbadons firm(?) lost a dumptruck full of when the flight crashed and the islanders found it and split it up. It must have come from some illegal activites which is why they came up with and staged the wreckage find story. They are looking for Ben because he found the stash seperated from the rest of the wreckage and knows where they are hiding it. They also were very interested to know that Juliet was one of the original inhabitants so she might know where it all is too. ????????????

  135. Miraks says:

    Charlotte Staples Lewis- Clive Staples Lewis
    a definite connection there.
    Also C. S. Lewis and Lewis Caroll (L.C. and C.L.) -maybe a connection/ hint? Mirror images?

  136. Barb says:

    We know how the dharma folks got there. Do we ever learn how the “natives” got there?

  137. DocH says:

    Oh – Miles is there to go after Jacob too.

  138. vavila says:

    [quote comment="177098"]

    A theory a few of us have been working on here in my office is that Charlotte is not Ben’s old girlfriend (a bit too young), but rather Ben’s daughter. Ben’s childhood girlfriend’s name was Annie. She is the “inside guy” on the freighter that is feeding Ben information. Charlotte is their daughter. When Ben helps kill everyone from Dharma, we don’t know what happened to Annie. I think it is safe to say he didn’t kill her or have her killed. My thought is that he got Annie pregnant and got her off the island. That is also why Ben tries to protect Alex and tries to keep her away from Carl–so she doesn’t get pregnant. Last night, Charlotte also asks Clair if she had Aaron on the island. She knows about what happens to women on the island[/quote]

    very interesting…. then she may be Ben’s insider? or maybe she has been passing information to Annie and she has been giving it to Ben? who knows! :) Hopefully we’ll find out in time…

  139. Circus Mom says:

    [quote comment="177074"]circus mom: i think that miles saying it was code was a lie; that’s why dan seemed clueless about the whole thing. miles shouldn’t have had to explain it so much if it was known that it was code.
    maybe regina is her twin?
    maybe penny knew regina but not naomi?
    i don’t know…but i think that it being code is too obvious. especially since we were all CERTAIN that it was code after last week’s show.[/quote]
    To follow this thought we would have to beleive Abaddon is working for Penny. This dosn’t seem likely. Penny wants to find Desmond, why would she hive a team to get Ben.

  140. LOSTmama says:

    Jack & Claire are (step?) brother and sister they share the same father If I recall correctly

  141. RGS says:

    While I won’t go so far as to say it is racist to assume characters are the same just because they are the same nationality, it does seem kinda silly to make that connection.

    To me the Miles situation was just a background story as to why he is chosen to go. What I didn’t understand about that was why would a ghost “haunt” a room, so that some random outsider (Miles) could recover the money the ghost had hidden?

    I could possibly see why they would have a photo of Desmond & Penny, if they somehow knew Desmond was on that island doing the “reset the clock” experiment. Find out who this guy is, and then get his information which these outside forces seem to be able to do. Pretend to be concerned when speaking with Penny and offer help, which she gives into by giving up a picture.

    Why would Desmond know to believe that Charlie is correct in saying “not Penny’s boat.” I can’t remember but did Charlie get excited and call for Desmond when Penny appeared on the monitor? I just wish that the characters could act a little more logical at times, as it would eliminate some of the unanswered questions.

    Why doesn’t Charlotte, seeing that Ben is tied up and being led around like an animal, not immediately come up with a story to show she’s on Locke’s side in that they both have a dislike for Ben, especially after Locke damn near kills him. That was supposed to be her objective no?

  142. Hammer says:

    [quote comment="176641"]Trying to tie this episode into what we learned in last week’s episode…..

    When Abbadon asked Hurley if “They’re still alive”, he must have been talking about the four “rescuers”. Perhaps they don’t get off the island. Maybe something in the upcoming episodes prompts some of the Losties to just hop in the helicopter and fly away. Maybe there will be some sort of fight with the rescuers. So once they get in the ‘copter, they’re not going to go to the freighter, they’re going to seek real rescue, thnking that they can go back to the island whenever they want to get the rest of the Losties. And maybe there are only 6 of them that can get in the ‘copter. Sayid would be have to be one – he’d fly the thing. But I don’t know if the ‘copter could carry 6 people, especially if one of them is Hurley.

    The only part I can’t work into this theory is when Jack said “I’m sick of lying” in his flash-forward. To me that implies some agency had guaranteed their rescue in exchange for them lying about the island.[/quote]

    Awesome theory ToeKnee…knowing that you have to be in the know to get back to the island…makes sense.

  143. wendy says:

    Are some of you watching the same show I am?

    Ecko is from Nigeria, not South America.

    The four newcomers were chosen for that mission because of their connection to flight 815, not for any Dharma connection.

    Dharma has a lot of reasons to want Ben so I’m placing bets that the “rescuers” are being funded by Dharma, even if they are themselves unaware of the connection.

    Desmond & the hatch – I don’t think Ben knew where exactly it was. It was well concealed. Even if he did, there was no real reason to gas the people who were there, especially if he wanted someone to keep pressing the button.

    The picture of Ben was probably taken on the island, and as others have left the island (Richard, for instance). We don’t really know much about Richard and who he really is working for or where his loyalties lie.

    If we are to believe Juliet (ha!) there were some in the others group who wanted a change (notes she held up for Jack prior to Ben’s surgery). If that’s true, all it would take is one “other” to transmit a photo to the outside world. Not every “other” loves Ben.

  144. Circus Mom says:

    [quote comment="177110"]Answers (?)
    The frighter people are Dharma looking for their island. They are after Ben because he led the coup that kicked them off the island. In order to find the island, you need special radio signals, since it is otherwise invisible. All signals were being jammed by the computer (the one into which you had to type in numbers)until it blew up. We know Ben has been jamming all signals since then(from last episode of last season)from the underwater station.
    When flight 815 “misteriously” dissapeared, Dharma KNEW that it had to have ended up on the island. In order to throw the general public off track (and stop everyone from continuing to look for the plane), they put a fake plane sans passangers on the bottom of the ocean.
    I agree that at least the heli pilot who was supposed to fly 815 was hired BECAUSE he was supposed to be on the flight- and because he knew too much (might have suspected that the people on the fake 815 were -well, fake).
    Miles (?) assumes that Juliette is a native, because as far as Dharma knows, Ben led the coup with the help of the natives (and since she is not Ben, she must be a native). I don’t think Dharma realizes that Ben (or his people)was able to travel back and forth between the island and the outside world.[/quote]
    The picture of Ben that Abbadon had was, presumibly, in the outside world. How would Dharma know about the purge and that Ben led it unless someone told them. This person would have to have traveled off the island. They, therefore, would have also known Ben and his group could travel and that outsiders were there.

  145. Meg says:

    [quote comment="177146"]Jack & Claire are (step?) brother and sister they share the same father If I recall correctly[/quote]
    Close. They half-siblings. Step would mean no blood relation.

  146. Circus Mom says:

    [quote comment="177147"]Why doesn’t Charlotte, seeing that Ben is tied up and being led around like an animal, not immediately come up with a story to show she’s on Locke’s side in that they both have a dislike for Ben, especially after Locke damn near kills him. That was supposed to be her objective no?[/quote]
    They seem to be there to get BEn, not kill him. Since Locke has him tied up she dosn’t know if he will give him up. That dosn’t explane why she dosn’t protest when Locke almost kills him.
    Remember, she is a cultural Anthropoligest, trained to understand how societies work. She may be reading their actions and reactions.

  147. shellonius funk says:

    [quote comment="177144"][quote comment="177074"]circus mom: i think that miles saying it was code was a lie; that’s why dan seemed clueless about the whole thing. miles shouldn’t have had to explain it so much if it was known that it was code.
    maybe regina is her twin?
    maybe penny knew regina but not naomi?
    i don’t know…but i think that it being code is too obvious. especially since we were all CERTAIN that it was code after last week’s show.[/quote]
    To follow this thought we would have to beleive Abaddon is working for Penny. This dosn’t seem likely. Penny wants to find Desmond, why would she hive a team to get Ben.[/quote]

    i’m not really saying penny is in cahoots with abbadon; i’m saying that i think naomi could have a twin sister named regina…listen to regina on the walkie…it sounds EXACTLY like naomi, and all my co-workers agree. especially since that scene took place right after a naomi flash.

    keep in mind: 1. abbadon never called her naomi in the flashback…maybe that was regina?
    2. on the island, naomi told the losties she was hired by penelope widmore. i also wonder penny’s dad might be behind some of this re: keeping desmond away.
    that’s what i thought until lastnight at least.

  148. Becky says:

    [quote comment="177146"]Jack & Claire are (step?) brother and sister they share the same father If I recall correctly[/quote]

    Christian Shepherd is the father of both of them. This was shown in Season 3. However, neither Jack nor Claire know this. Claire did not even know Christian’s name so only a photo would reveal the truth.

  149. LOSTmama says:

    How is the O6 famous when the news clearly showed all were dead (what news would show that anywats?) part of the whole warped time theory?
    Random…there’s could be more than 6 who get back maybe some Others get off too just aren’t part of the flight so no one knows about them?

  150. deangoodes says:

    So maybe Penny didn’t know who Naomi was but did hire Regina??

  151. LOSTKING1 says:

    MCOTTER, good point about Ecko being the young boy in the photographs, i completly agree with you.
    NENA, yes i do think you are being too sensitive and picking at something which isnt there, but lets face it your comments are normally quite erroneous!

  152. lostmari says:

    #130 Annie left as a little girl…way too young to get pregnant. She and ben exchanged gifts on a dock when she was saying goodbye.

  153. RGS says:

    [quote comment="177155"][quote comment="177147"]Why doesn’t Charlotte, seeing that Ben is tied up and being led around like an animal, not immediately come up with a story to show she’s on Locke’s side in that they both have a dislike for Ben, especially after Locke damn near kills him. That was supposed to be her objective no?[/quote]
    They seem to be there to get BEn, not kill him. Since Locke has him tied up she dosn’t know if he will give him up. That dosn’t explane why she dosn’t protest when Locke almost kills him.
    Remember, she is a cultural Anthropoligest, trained to understand how societies work. She may be reading their actions and reactions.[/quote]

    I was a little unclear with my post, I meant that her objective was to get Ben, and Locke & co. seemed to have accomplished that. It seems to me now that the cat is out of the bag, they almost HAVE to offer some explanation as to why Ben. It would seem like the others in Locke’s party would want some answers PRONTO.

    They went with Locke assuming that the Freightors were trying to kill them. (Locke said everyone would be dead or something like that). They see that Ben has tried to kill one of the Freightors. They see that Ben is almost killed by Locke and Sawyer. Then Ben tells them that they are actually there to get him. Even crazy Hurley would have to ask what in the blue hell is going on here?

  154. skweez says:

    I love it. You guys have come up with some really good theories. I do have one question, though…. if there are 46 more episodes, do you really think they are going to give us any real answers anytime soon?

  155. Missy says:

    Something I forgot to add above:

    During the exchange where Charlotte is with the Locke gang – I was loving how John and Ben freaked when Hurley mentioned the cabin.

    Also – I totally thought that Sawyer was going to mention how he killed Locke’s dad, not Locke.

  156. shellonius funk says:

    i don’t think that it was a young eko. the real eko has a longer face.

    compare:

  157. RGS says:

    [quote comment="177160"]How is the O6 famous when the news clearly showed all were dead (what news would show that anywats?) part of the whole warped time theory?
    Random…there’s could be more than 6 who get back maybe some Others get off too just aren’t part of the flight so no one knows about them?[/quote]

    The O6 would be famous because folks would have thought them to be dead. I don’t think ‘the Others’ want to leave the island.

  158. Laura says:

    Maybe I am missing something, but I do not remember Miles having any distinctive connection to 815. Sure the radio was announcing it while he was driving, but he didn’t seem to be having any distinctive reaction. I think the four helitots can be characterized by their reactions to the news. Frank the ‘drunk’ reacted by angrily phoning the hotline. Daniel the ‘headcase’ cries. Charlotte the ‘anthropologist’ refuses to believe the news and Miles disregards the news. I feel like the reactions clearly indicate that they were i no way involved with whatever the mission was at this time.

    Assuming that there is no crazy time on the island (which is a big assumption), there have only been approx. 90 days since the crash. I didn’t do any of the find815 stuff but i’d assume the discovery of the plane was at least a month after the crash? This would mean that in less than two months the five people were contacted, trained, and taken on their mission.

    Another thought… if the crash was staged by whoever (which it was presumably) where did they get all of the supplies? The fake plane, the fake bloated bodies… as well as all the technology to make it happen. This is a HUGE amount of trouble to go to, somebody must really not want the 815ers found. I feel like whoever is taking care of this coverup must have been getting awfully nervous (was Penny getting close to finding them after the hatch blew up? when the snowy people found the signal?) and so they felt the need to create an elaborate coverup to stop people searching.

  159. ByeByeBoone says:

    has anyone thought that maybe it is juliette in the coffin? i rewatched that episode last night and the coffin seems small, but not small enough for a child. jack seemed so upset bc he loved her, and when asked if he was family or friend he said neither because they were just lovers. kate didnt go to the funeral bc juliette stole jack from her. and in regards to why jack had to find out through the paper is because something had to have happened between juliette and the losties before they left the island that ruined her and jacks relationship.

    just throwing that out there…

  160. DocH says:

    [quote comment="177160"]…could be more than 6 who get back maybe some Others get off too just aren’t part of the flight so no one knows about them?[/quote]

    Thanks LT! I was thinking Juliet as one of the six. Now she can be a 7th. She was never on the flight.

  161. Missy says:

    [quote comment="177110"]Answers (?)
    The frighter people are Dharma looking for their island. They are after Ben because he led the coup that kicked them off the island. In order to find the island, you need special radio signals, since it is otherwise invisible. All signals were being jammed by the computer (the one into which you had to type in numbers)until it blew up. We know Ben has been jamming all signals since then(from last episode of last season)from the underwater station.
    When flight 815 “misteriously” dissapeared, Dharma KNEW that it had to have ended up on the island. In order to throw the general public off track (and stop everyone from continuing to look for the plane), they put a fake plane sans passangers on the bottom of the ocean.
    I agree that at least the heli pilot who was supposed to fly 815 was hired BECAUSE he was supposed to be on the flight- and because he knew too much (might have suspected that the people on the fake 815 were -well, fake).
    Miles (?) assumes that Juliette is a native, because as far as Dharma knows, Ben led the coup with the help of the natives (and since she is not Ben, she must be a native). I don’t think Dharma realizes that Ben (or his people)was able to travel back and forth between the island and the outside world.[/quote]

    I totally agree. Very well put.

  162. Laura says:

    I don’t think Kate is in hiding, the police all know about her, I would have thought she’d at least dye her hair or something.

    I don’t think anyone has commented on Charlotte’s reaction when she landed in the water. Sure she was happy to be alive but she was ecstatic. It reminded me of like a treasure hunter who has had theories that noone believed (aka the dharma initiative… connecting the polar bear to this) and she finally had proof that her theory was right.

  163. ByeByeBoone says:

    if i remember correctly, didn’t richard go into the outside world to recruit juliette? the others used to go off the island on the sub before locke blew it up, explaining why that picture of ben could be from the outside world.

  164. skweez says:

    [quote comment="177172"]has anyone thought that maybe it is juliette in the coffin? i rewatched that episode last night and the coffin seems small, but not small enough for a child. jack seemed so upset bc he loved her, and when asked if he was family or friend he said neither because they were just lovers. kate didnt go to the funeral bc juliette stole jack from her. and in regards to why jack had to find out through the paper is because something had to have happened between juliette and the losties before they left the island that ruined her and jacks relationship.

    just throwing that out there…[/quote]
    Interesting thoughts about Juliet. I think you may be correct. That would be a good reason why Jack feels like he has no where else to turn but to take himself out.

  165. ByeByeBoone says:

    if i remember correctly, didn’t richard go off the island it recruit juliette? the others used to go on and off the island regularly before locke blew up the sub. this could explain why the picture of ben appeared to have been taken when he was off the island…

  166. How much more abuse can Ben take? That guy is just creepy as all heck. He has, once again, survived a brutal beating — the third “big” beating by my count (Sayid had a shot in season 2, Jack had a shot in season 3, and now Sawyer in season 4). For being a scrawny, mouse-looking man, he sure can put up with a lot. Although I know they couldn’t kill off Ben in this episode, Locke looked like he wanted to kill him. Is Ben going to die this season? Is Ben the guy in the coffin?

  167. skweez says:

    When Jack met Kate at the airport in the season 3 finale. She said somehting to the effect that he was still saving people. I think the Oceanic 6 are famous because they are the ones who are responsible for “rescuing” the other folks on the island. I think that a lot more than just 6 people make it back to civilization….

  168. DocH says:

    Oh – And Desmond can go home too. #8. Not an Oceanic Sixer.

    So – Jack, Kate & Hurley, #1-3.

    Who else? – Sayid & Kwons? #4-6.

  169. Laura says:

    Okay so we know that not too long ago Ben decided it was a bad idea to have communications with the outside world… is this because he knew the freighter tots were suspicious? This good be what he was doing in the TLG… talking to the freighter. esp, when penny came through pretty clearly? (i know she denied being on the boat, but she could still be connected to it, as has been brought up many times)

  170. Avidfan says:

    I just thought of something… If the news of all Oceanic 815 passengers confirmed dead at the bottom of the ocean was spread all over the world (not surprising, such a disaster makes big news), how did Oceaning or whoever is behind the rescue explain that 6 survivers came back? How could these 6 people have survived a crash which landed everyone else at the bottom of the ocean? Makes no sense, unless we are talking about a parallel universe, but I have a difficult time buying that theory also. Thoughts?

  171. DocH says:

    [quote comment="177171"]… I do not remember Miles having any distinctive connection to 815..
    .
    [/quote]

    I agree. All four of the new folks aren’t directly connected to the specific flight. I think they have unique talents and are kept on “retainer”, like a lawyer. Once an event ‘like’ OA815 happens, in that part of the world, they are put on alert. Once the wreckage is located, they are activated to verify or deny the legitimacy of the event. If it is not legitimate, then they head to the general vicinity of where they (Dharma) lost the island after the purge. They know that “fresh meat” on the island can stir things-up, giving them a better chance of finding the island.

    When I say Dharma, I mean – or what it has evolved into currently. Naomi already detailed that the freighter went to the ‘televised’ crash site – she just didn’t mention that they knew if was bogus.

  172. DocH says:

    … why do you think Daniel Faraday goy so weepy when he saw the underwater wreckage? He was getting activated (called in on retainer).

    … Frank pracitcally did the verification on 815 in front of the TV – “That’s not the pilot”.

  173. RGS says:

    [quote comment="177174"][quote comment="177110"]Answers (?)
    The frighter people are Dharma looking for their island. They are after Ben because he led the coup that kicked them off the island. In order to find the island, you need special radio signals, since it is otherwise invisible. All signals were being jammed by the computer (the one into which you had to type in numbers)until it blew up. We know Ben has been jamming all signals since then(from last episode of last season)from the underwater station.
    When flight 815 “misteriously” dissapeared, Dharma KNEW that it had to have ended up on the island. In order to throw the general public off track (and stop everyone from continuing to look for the plane), they put a fake plane sans passangers on the bottom of the ocean.
    I agree that at least the heli pilot who was supposed to fly 815 was hired BECAUSE he was supposed to be on the flight- and because he knew too much (might have suspected that the people on the fake 815 were -well, fake).
    Miles (?) assumes that Juliette is a native, because as far as Dharma knows, Ben led the coup with the help of the natives (and since she is not Ben, she must be a native). I don’t think Dharma realizes that Ben (or his people)was able to travel back and forth between the island and the outside world.[/quote]

    I totally agree. Very well put.[/quote]

    Seems the only way Dharma would know Ben led the coup was if 1) Ben himself told them and then gave them a “don’t call us we’ll call you” or 2) that picture caught him on the outside world so they knew he must still be alive.

    Otherwise since they have no way of knowing where the island is w/o radio transmissions, then they would not know who it was that caused their studies to abruptly end.

    So that would then make it possible for Dharma to know there was at least someone (Ben) getting back and forth between the island and the real world.

  174. RGS says:

    [quote comment="177186"]I just thought of something… If the news of all Oceanic 815 passengers confirmed dead at the bottom of the ocean was spread all over the world (not surprising, such a disaster makes big news), how did Oceaning or whoever is behind the rescue explain that 6 survivers came back? How could these 6 people have survived a crash which landed everyone else at the bottom of the ocean? Makes no sense, unless we are talking about a parallel universe, but I have a difficult time buying that theory also. Thoughts?[/quote]

    I pray it is not a parallel universe storyline crap. Anyway, there are a lot of sensational occurences happening in the show, it does not seem to be that big of leap to suggest that 6 people survived the crash by landing on some remote island (the remote island would be some fictitious island the O6 would agree to claim).

  175. DocH says:

    Wasn’t Ben in a nice suit in his photo that they showed? If so, I’d say he was off-island. Richard Alpert always wears nice business clothes off-island. If Ben was in his regular island wear (L.L. Bean?) in the photo, I’d say the pic was on the island.

  176. nakira says:

    Wow, awesome episode, seemed only ten minutes long.

    Nona &Becky: I’ve noticed too that there are a few people that comment on here that perceived almost every “ethnic” character is the same person in another episode, like confusing Yemi for Abbadon and Nadia for another person. It may not be racist, but psychologically/sociologically speaking, people can tell the differences better between people of their own ethnicity/race. So I’m assuming some viewers may not be adept perceptive to differences in diverse peoples. People think I look like I look like “this foreign exchange student from Mexico” – no matter where I go – but the people who make the comment are blond and blue eyed so all brown haired brown eyed Hispanics look the same. Just my obervation as a mixed person.

    Aside from that it seems time travel/multiple dimensions are starting to emerge more now. We know the Dharma people did experiments with animals and so could they have miscalculated and sent a polar bear to another time/place? They obviously would have started with animals to do time travel/testing. Polar bear in the desert makes a lot more sense now, possibly the cages and behavior modifaction trials prepared the bears for manipulating some sort of the machine. The physicist is there for this reason. I love how the writers typecasted the character as a square, awkward scientist guy. So not like this guy -SARCASM.

    Ghostbuster dude, he did not want his last name used or revealed. I see dead people! You would be pretty grumpy too if you heard dead people alot.

    It seems maybe the Others are trying to manipulate the island’s time traveling properties. Maybe that’s why we saw Ben as an adult, definately NOT on the island in the photo. From the photo he seems to have a messenger back in be in an office/airport or somewhere that had computers.

    Portuguese connection. Maybe Naomi and her crew via Abbadon intercepted their communications with Penny Widmore so that they could use their info to find the island. I could see Naomi reaching the frigid pole to steal information and probably picked up the clue Penny left the Portugues speakers- pic of her and Desmond. That’s why Naomi has the book Catch 22 in Portugues – there’s not much to due in the cold I guess- she lifted it from the two guys.

    Ben is so surprised of Hurley and jealous he can “see” the cabin.

    LOVIN LOST.

  177. Missy says:

    [quote comment="177176"]I don’t think Kate is in hiding, the police all know about her, I would have thought she’d at least dye her hair or something.

    I don’t think anyone has commented on Charlotte’s reaction when she landed in the water. Sure she was happy to be alive but she was ecstatic. It reminded me of like a treasure hunter who has had theories that noone believed (aka the dharma initiative… connecting the polar bear to this) and she finally had proof that her theory was right.[/quote]

    What if – since they found the wrecked plane on the bottom of the ocean, that all passengers were declared legally dead – and since she was declared legally dead, the law can’t prosecute her for killing her step dad?????

  178. Circus Mom says:

    If we go with parallel universes, the plane at the botton of the ocean contains all those who were innitially intended to be on that flight. Frank would have been the pilot, he dosn’t wear a ring. Daniel could have been on the origional list too which is why he has such a emotional reaction to them finding the plane on the bottom of the ocean. A part of him is gone.

    Someone had asked why Sam lied and said that his name was Daniel. Why do you think Daniel’s name is really Sam? As I understand it Sam is a Aussie, computer tech abord the Christian 1 and Daniel is a American, Phyisist abord the freighter. Am I missing something?

  179. Denken says:

    Most everyone is assuming that the background information on the freighter tots is being provided through flashbacks. It is feasible that all of the off-island storyline in this episode is a flash forward. That is why the drunk knows that the pilot is not pictured, that is why Charlotte does not believe that everyone is dead, that is why Daniel cries…. just a thought. It is no longer safe to assume we are seeing flashbacks.

  180. CaptMeltdown says:

    [quote comment="177176"]I don’t think Kate is in hiding, the police all know about her, I would have thought she’d at least dye her hair or something.

    I don’t think anyone has commented on Charlotte’s reaction when she landed in the water. Sure she was happy to be alive but she was ecstatic. It reminded me of like a treasure hunter who has had theories that noone believed (aka the dharma initiative… connecting the polar bear to this) and she finally had proof that her theory was right.[/quote]
    Hi Laura,
    Her reaction when landing in the water would be the reaction of someone that started her flight mission from a — oh, I don’t know, maybe a DESERT.

  181. Missy says:

    [quote comment="177188"][quote comment="177171"]… I do not remember Miles having any distinctive connection to 815..
    .
    [/quote]

    I agree. All four of the new folks aren’t directly connected to the specific flight. I think they have unique talents and are kept on “retainer”, like a lawyer. Once an event ‘like’ OA815 happens, in that part of the world, they are put on alert. Once the wreckage is located, they are activated to verify or deny the legitimacy of the event. If it is not legitimate, then they head to the general vicinity of where they (Dharma) lost the island after the purge. They know that “fresh meat” on the island can stir things-up, giving them a better chance of finding the island.

    When I say Dharma, I mean – or what it has evolved into currently. Naomi already detailed that the freighter went to the ‘televised’ crash site – she just didn’t mention that they knew if was bogus.[/quote]

    Do you think that upon hearing on the radio that flight 815 plane was found, that Miles could sense that those people were not dead – well not all of them anyway? Or does he need his vaccuum thing for that?

  182. Missy says:

    [quote comment="177202"]Most everyone is assuming that the background information on the freighter tots is being provided through flashbacks. It is feasible that all of the off-island storyline in this episode is a flash forward. That is why the drunk knows that the pilot is not pictured, that is why Charlotte does not believe that everyone is dead, that is why Daniel cries…. just a thought. It is no longer safe to assume we are seeing flashbacks.[/quote]

    That’s deep – now I have to go back and watch it episode again. I just assumed they were all flashbacks!

  183. Missy says:

    [quote comment="177194"]Wasn’t Ben in a nice suit in his photo that they showed? If so, I’d say he was off-island. Richard Alpert always wears nice business clothes off-island. If Ben was in his regular island wear (L.L. Bean?) in the photo, I’d say the pic was on the island.[/quote]

    At first glace of Ben in that picture made him look like he was traveling – like he had the strap of a shoulder bag on his shoulder – I’ll have to watch again more closely.

  184. Sean says:

    PBS shows dead people on the news. Most Public broadcasting news sources show the “actual” news rather than what rupert murdoch wants you to see or the latest crazy Spears drama.

  185. RGS says:

    [quote comment="177202"]Most everyone is assuming that the background information on the freighter tots is being provided through flashbacks. It is feasible that all of the off-island storyline in this episode is a flash forward. That is why the drunk knows that the pilot is not pictured, that is why Charlotte does not believe that everyone is dead, that is why Daniel cries…. just a thought. It is no longer safe to assume we are seeing flashbacks.[/quote]

    Only problem I see with that line of thinking, is how would you explain (assuming Naomi) and Abbadon discussing the motley crew she is supposed to be working with? Naomi would be dead at that point.

  186. LostinSev says:

    Do you remember when Hurly is talking to a physciatrist (?sp) at the physc facility about a balcony falling (when he stepped onto it) and two people dying and that it wasn’t his fault. I think he feels like what ever happen, it was his fault.??

    On a funny note…the vacuum cleaner Miles had looked like a vacuum cleaner I once had called the “Shark”. There are a lot of sharks pictured on this show and there were Dharma sharks in the ocean.

  187. Jacque & Bray says:

    I have only posted once in a year, but here goes…
    I get the impression that the plot of the 4 rescuers is like Close Encounters of the Third Kind… especially when they showed the pilot drop the toy plane in the aquarium and Dan becoming emotional without knowing why. Obsessed comes to mind. I think they are possibly connected to the initial Dharma group and were brainwashed like Ben tried with Sawyer. They feel a connection with the island and don’t know why.

    Why did Locke call Hurley – Hugo? Sawyer did too, but Sawyer has nicknames for almost everyone.

    I think the person sitting in the cabin’s rocking chair resembles Ethan – who was killed off.

    I do think Jack and them kill off the rescuers and they take the copter off the island, but how does Hurley join up with them?

    My husband says Oceanic airlines is behind all this.

    The gas masks are back…….

    In closing – you are all brilliant and we love reading your theories!

  188. bold deceiver says:

    Just wanted to point out a couple of “numbers” references
    I noticed in the grandson’s room that Miles ghostbusts. The number 15 appears in a football players poster on the wall. Also a close-up of a white clock in the room reveals that it is 11:04. 11+4=15. Any thoughts?

  189. GT says:

    Okay, here are my theories:

    I do think the backstories are flashbacks and not the future, because Naomi is alive in the flashes and seems to be just learning about these people.

    Two theories about the four “rescuers”:

    One possibility is that they all have different reasons to believe that the Oceanic passengers are alive. Lapidus is convinced that he is seeing a fake (or different) pilot, Charlotte indicates that she can’t believe it when she sees the newspapers, and Miles may have been called in as a ghost whisperer for a family member of someone from the flight who DID die on the island (Libby, Ana Lucia, etc.), and he learned what really happened. Daniel looks like he’s having some kind of empathic response, but I’m not sure how or why he would doubt the discovery of the plane. If the team were assembled to investigate what REALLY happened to the plane, this would explain the conversation between Naomi and Abbadon, and it would also explain his question to Hurley: Are they still alive?

    Another possibility is that someone (Dharma? Hanso? Widmore?) knows all about what’s happening on the island and has gathered a team to address the myriad mysteries. Charlotte is there to investigate the fate of Dharma, Lapidus is there to check on Oceanic 815, Daniel is there for the electromagnetic properties, Miles is there to interpret ghostly apparitions and voices (Christian Shepherd, Jacob, Smokey, Walt, Kate’s horse, etc.), and Naomi is there to find Desmond.

  190. Toeknee says:

    [quote comment="177218"]
    Why did Locke call Hurley – Hugo? Sawyer did too, but Sawyer has nicknames for almost everyone.
    [/quote]
    I’m not sure if this is what you’re asking, but Hugo is Hurley’s real name. “Hurley” is the nickname.

  191. Laura says:

    Interesting that Frank mentioned that the instruments were having trouble functioning (he said it was due to an electrical storm… but still), while Naomi said the same thing when she landed.

    Also, does anyone else find it suspicious that Naomi, the LEADER of the team, who is apparently the only one with any experience, who is charged with keeping the team safe… is the one that flies off on her own in a helicopter…. why wouldnt she have one of the “lesser” people do this so she could stay safe and call the shots. strange.

  192. Laura says:

    also interesting that Ben voluntarily introduced himself to Naomi in TTLG… when supposedly he knew she was after him (and she knew who he was)

  193. nicunurse says:

    Great commments! I like the theory that the six are heroes because they survived the crash (that Ben had faked in the ocean) that killed the rest of the people. That is why Jack can’t stand all the lies.
    Also, love the thought that discovering Juliette means there were “natives” like Richard (even though we know Juliette is not a native).
    Also like that Ben had his buddies set up the fake crash scene because that blip led people to the crash and he needed to provide a fake plane, that could not be salvaged, so that Oceanic people, as well as Penelope, would stop looking. BUT, Penelope DOES know that Desmond is alive and there…those are charlie’s last words to her… but, obviously, he was not part of the plane passengers…
    Love the whole Annie, Ben, Charlotte connections…Charlotte could be Annie’s daughter …who had been told, growing up by her mom, that there was such a place as the Dharma Island and that is why she is so excited to find the desert polo bear and then, to find the island (and not recognize Ben)…Great posts everyone!

  194. SpinPapi says:

    Great discussion on an awesome episode. I have some thoughts I will throw out after watching again tonight, but I wanted to lay one controversy to rest right now:

    Jorge Garcia said in an interview that it was most definitely Jack’s dad in the chair in Jacob’s cabin, but that he’d also been filmed in the chair.

    He also said that they hired a new actor to play the person whose eye we saw, so it could not be Locke or Hurley or anyone else we know of so far.

  195. Toeknee says:

    Here are some photos to help in some of the “analysis”:

    Here’s the photo of Ben that Miles had:

    Here’s one of young Eko:

    The boy on the wall: http://img172.imageshack.us/img172/3622/grandsonzx4.gif

    Some others of Eko and the dead boy:

    http://lost.cubit.net/archives/2008/02/4×02-ghost-boy-house-photos.php#more

  196. nicunurse says:

    WAIT!!! If Ben (who lies…and said he “spent his whole life on this island and we know it is not true) was seen off the island (if that photo was taken off the island) then…He COULD be charlotte’s father, having looked up Annie on one of his trip’s off AND intersting that he shot her in the vest….especially if he had a man on the boat who KNEW she would be wearing a vest…and it could all be a big set up…I wouldn’t put it past Ben…

  197. Laura says:

    [quote comment="177236"]WAIT!!! If Ben (who lies…and said he “spent his whole life on this island and we know it is not true) was seen off the island (if that photo was taken off the island) then…He COULD be charlotte’s father, having looked up Annie on one of his trip’s off AND intersting that he shot her in the vest….especially if he had a man on the boat who KNEW she would be wearing a vest…and it could all be a big set up…I wouldn’t put it past Ben…[/quote]

    Great idea Nicunurse… Also, from Lostpedia:

    “Annie is a variant of Ann and Hannah, which are of Hebrew origin, meaning “favored grace”. Hannah was the mother of the prophet Samuel. After her marriage Hannah initially seemed to be barren. Later, she asked God to bless her with a child, and her prayer was answered.”

    interesting… blessed with a child…

  198. DocH says:

    re: Ben off-island. I always thought that Ben would never go off-island as he was the “figure-head”, while Alpert was the “master-mind” that coukd slip as the “#2″ guy. But I recant that… Ben has probably slipped away to the mainland a few times… maybe 3 times in the past three decades…? (WAG)
    ————-new topic———-
    Two big clues?

    1) Bag of heroin: Miles does his ghostbuster routine in SoCal and he finds a bag of heroin behind the wall that the “spirit” leads him to (along with cash). You say heroin on LOST and I think of Charlie (user) and Eko (supplier). How does Miles, or the house he was in, fit into the equation, if there is one?

    2) Big wad of cash: Along with the heroin was a big wad of cash. Makes sense if someone was dealing drugs. But, we also seem a similar wad of money in the hands of Charlotte. She used it to bribe her way into the Tunisia desert dig site and get carte blanche.

    Are the two connected, or relevant?

  199. Pam says:

    [quote comment="176558"]who is the oceanic six (or what)? I am totally lost.[/quote]

    They are the 6 survivors who eventually returned to civilization, as per the peeks into the future we have been given. So far, it has been revealed that Jack, Kate, and Hurley returned home. Three more did…and the rest were left on the island. We will have revealings in tidbits of who the rest are.

  200. DocH says:

    We don’t know that three more did. We just think that there were 3 more from Oceanic Flt 815 that took the public spotlight upon return. The rest could be under a “witness relocation or protection” program. Technically the Others, and Juliet or Desmond aren’t from 815. they could all make it home and not be part of “The Six”.

  201. mkhaynes says:

    [quote comment="176637"][quote comment="176613"]I did get my wish ToeKnee. We all did.

    One quick Q? Was the TV news gal who reported the discovery of OA815 at the beginning of the show, the same gal who played “Tricia Tanaka” in the middle of last season? I haven’t had time to check yet. If it is, that is another major bone the writers tossed us.[/quote]
    Different actresses, per IMDB.[/quote]

    The gun was Carl’s, Charlotte wasn’t ever shown with a gun. Ben was looking at Carl’s waistband.

  202. Miss Kim says:

    [quote comment="177302"][quote comment="176558"]who is the oceanic six (or what)? I am totally lost.[/quote]

    They are the 6 survivors who eventually returned to civilization, as per the peeks into the future we have been given. So far, it has been revealed that Jack, Kate, and Hurley returned home. Three more did…and the rest were left on the island. We will have revealings in tidbits of who the rest are.[/quote]

    Were we actually ever told that the O6 were the ONLY 6 survivors of the crash? Is it possible that they were the 6 “Heroes” that actually made the rescue a reality?

  203. mkhaynes says:

    [quote comment="177218"]

    Why did Locke call Hurley – Hugo? Sawyer did too, but Sawyer has nicknames for almost everyone.

    Hugo is his first name, and Sawyer has stopped calling everyone by their nicknames since he killed his father. Remember when he called Kate “Kate” instead of “Freckles”?

  204. Miss Kim says:

    It seems to me that the four people sent to the island who were there for Benjamin Linus were not the people I would send to seek revenge/capture/etc. As a physicist/anthropologist/soil sampling ghost buster, they may be the right people to talk/gather info from Benjamin Linus…..Naomi was there to “Get in, get out, and see that no one gets killed.” If I wanted to hunt/capture Ben I would have sent a whole bunch of Naomi-types. Charlotte, Frank, Daniel, and Miles are seeking something other than retribution.

  205. lostlaur says:

    I think the island has a protective bubble around it. How that bubble is there I have no idea- but that would explain how every time someone gets close to/ tries to land on the island, there is some sort of problem (the Oceanic plane breaking up, the freighties’ helicopter having electrical problems…)
    This would explain why Sam noticed that the sunlight was weird. The “bubble of whatever” interferes with how the sunlight filters through.

    Also I’ve started watching again from the beginning and in Tabula Rasa, one part really resonated with me. When Jack and Kate are sitting on the beach, Kate tries to explain about her criminal past & Jack stops her with something along the lines of, “We all died 3 days ago. We’re new people now.” And then it shows all the losties on the beach, sort of making the character switch- Charlie changing the tape on his hands to LOVE from HATE, Sun & Jin coming together, Sayid throwing an apple to Sawyer etc.
    I think that was a really important moment that’s worth watching again. It seems like it puts some stock on the idea of the island causing people to become a mirror of their former personalities.

    Also, don’t know if there is something with parallel universes/time travel (it’s a really interesting concept though) but I DO think that the island has been the home to some radical experiments that need to be hidden from the general public.
    Maybe Dharma was backed by or part of a big corporation or the government and had control of the island where they began setting up their experimental stations. Then and when Ben & the natives (who could be part of a rivaling corporation, the one the hired Juliet?) killed them off & took over the island and experiments the original company has been trying to take it back.
    Enter the Oceanic flight & the Losties who end up throwing off the balance of the power struggle and now are being used as pawns between the two. Could explain why the Oceanic 6 are sworn to a secrecy they feel bad about. They picked the wrong side and feel like they sold out.

    Sorry that was so long- I’m glad I finally have someone to discuss these ideas with! Getting to come up with theories that Lost will probably blow holes the next episode is why I love this show so much. TV that makes you think!

  206. Miss Kim says:

    It was made very clear that Frank, Charlotte, Daniel, and Miles were “there for Benjamin Linus.” It was not made clear that they were seeking vengence or wanted to capture Ben. (At least not to me.) If I wanted to “get in, get out, and no one gets killed” I would have sent a foursome of Naomi types, not a physicist, an anthroplogist, a pilot, and a ghost busting “soil sampler.”

  207. brez says:

    in support of the whole parallel universe….in last week’s episode during hurley’s flashforward, charlie says to hurley that he is both dead and here.

  208. Circus Mom says:

    [quote comment="177236"]WAIT!!! If Ben (who lies…and said he “spent his whole life on this island and we know it is not true) was seen off the island (if that photo was taken off the island) then…He COULD be charlotte’s father, having looked up Annie on one of his trip’s off AND intersting that he shot her in the vest….especially if he had a man on the boat who KNEW she would be wearing a vest…and it could all be a big set up…I wouldn’t put it past Ben…[/quote]
    If I said “I spent my whole life in Chicago.” that would mean I had always lived there. It wouldn’t mean that I had never gone elsewhere on a vacation or trip.

    It seems highly unlikly that Charlotte is Bens daughter. When Naomi was meeting with Abbadon she indicated that the rescuers should have military training and Abaddon said it was her job to get them in and out and make sure nobody got killed. She could be Annies daughter but I doubt it.

    Abaddon said that each member of the team was chosen for a specific purpost. I think their skills/jobs and the fact that they had each stumbled onto some type of information is why they were chosen. Frank knew the pilot was wrong. Charlotte found the darma collar on th polar bear. Daniel’s wife may hold a clue to his connection. Not sure yet about Miles. Someone had suggested that he had been called to read one of the passengers. Perhaps he learned something there.

  209. Lesley says:

    Wow that took some time to read. Great theories all around. Here’s mine. I think there is a time/space anomaly on the island important to the earth’s existence. The polar bear in the desert was part of a failed experiment by Dharma (remember Dr. Candle’s rabbit?) I liked the black hole theory and the connection with the light not scattering on the island. Maybe the island is a portal into a black hole? Anyone else notice that the Losties’ skin tones are looking a little orange lately?

    Ben’s people seem to have huge financial resources off-island and until the purple haze some could travel back and forth gathering information. Widmore and Paik have power and money. Finding a location like the island could expand their power in the world enormously. They have been looking for the island and Ben’s people have been protecting it. Abbaddon works for Widmore/Paik, and the crash has provided them with a unique opportunity to locate the island and take over. In fact, they have been looking for the island for years and Ben knows that. The island knows it too – – enter flight 815. Was the Black Rock was also the island’s call for help? Perhaps the island s more capable then Ben perceives.

    The freighter makes regular runs hoping for a crack in the armour. Widmore/Paik people have been gathering evidence for a very long time. However, the four newbies do not have all the facts only their isolated interests/mission. They are indeed sent to get Ben and gather island information, in and out fast but they are a disjointed bunch. Conflict with the Four will lead to the O6 stealing the helicopter in to escape with their lives becasue we know more folks will die before they do….(I am guessing the other 3 are Sayid, Claire and Sun.) When eventually found, floating in the ocean their story is that they escaped the plane crash and Jack kept them alive. (A hero twice over…remember?) Leaving the island’s time/space they are disoriented, frightened and all six make a pact amoung themselves never to tell… This theory assumes Jin is killed and Saywer stays behind, providing the hook someone above suggested will be needed to get Kate to agree to go back. Not sure how Des and Penny fit but she will continue to search for him and maybe she, Michael and Walt will help them get back………..Or not!

  210. Circus Mom says:

    [quote comment="177319"]It seems to me that the four people sent to the island who were there for Benjamin Linus were not the people I would send to seek revenge/capture/etc. As a physicist/anthropologist/soil sampling ghost buster, they may be the right people to talk/gather info from Benjamin Linus…..Naomi was there to “Get in, get out, and see that no one gets killed.” If I wanted to hunt/capture Ben I would have sent a whole bunch of Naomi-types. Charlotte, Frank, Daniel, and Miles are seeking something other than retribution.[/quote]
    Good point.

    I don’t think Miles is really a soil sampler. He didn’t want Daniel to give the losties any information and probably didn’t want to tell them what he really did. Soil sampler was a cover.

  211. Nikitancsu says:

    [quote comment="176607"]Just like last week’s improbability that Naomi could have scooted away without any of the Losties noticing, I found it very hard to believe that noone noticed Ben steal Charlotte’s gun from her, especially Charlotte herself. How subtle can a guy be with his hands tied together?[/quote]
    [quote comment="176607"]Just like last week’s improbability that Naomi could have scooted away without any of the Losties noticing, I found it very hard to believe that noone noticed Ben steal Charlotte’s gun from her, especially Charlotte herself. How subtle can a guy be with his hands tied together?[/quote]

    He stole the gun from Carl, not Charlotte… it was the one he was carrying on his hip, they showed him looking at his hip in surprise after Ben shot Charlotte.

    I totally agree with everyone that this episode was amazing!

  212. Bobola says:

    Lost Chicka; I thought this last episode was way better than the first of the season. At first I was going; They are opening a bunch of new can of worms with all the new characters but I’m very impressed with Miles…what an attitude! Loved it when he goes; Wow! Survivors of Oceanic sarcastically. He’s so fearless…and maybe another bad guy…which is needed if Patchy is a goner.
    And if they move the Polar Bear bones back to L.A. then I might yet prove to be right about it being the one in the coffin…ha. How could it be Michael; why would the Doc be sad over that shitbag?
    The thing this show has down is the shift between flashbacks and the present (assuming it is the present). And a neat trick to show that the Plane is probably some sort of fake coverup.
    Hurley sure is getting well fed at that Mental Hospital; but I wonder how the helicopter ever got off the ground if he is on it. Sayeed had such a glow on his face as he looked the helicopter over.
    Ben acting as Ben does is always a joy. The way he goes from Fear of the Chopper folks to smart ass comments to Sawyer. But he’s gonna need a facial Surgeon if he takes too many more smacks to the face.
    Takes a licking and keeps Lipping.
    When do these folks eat? They just keep chugging on water as far as I can tell.
    Maybe Desmond split to look for another Monastery…but now is his chance to hook up with Charlie’s ex if Sayeed does not beat him to it. I need more sex in the show!
    And if Abadon is such a bad ass why doesn’t he get himself out to the Island himself? Great scene with Noami; they gave me just enough revelations this show to keep me happy.

  213. Circus Mom says:

    [quote comment="177379"]Lost Chicka; I thought this last episode was way better than the first of the season. At first I was going; They are opening a bunch of new can of worms with all the new characters but I’m very impressed with Miles…what an attitude! Loved it when he goes; Wow! Survivors of Oceanic sarcastically. He’s so fearless…and maybe another bad guy…which is needed if Patchy is a goner.
    And if they move the Polar Bear bones back to L.A. then I might yet prove to be right about it being the one in the coffin…ha. How could it be Michael; why would the Doc be sad over that shitbag?
    The thing this show has down is the shift between flashbacks and the present (assuming it is the present). And a neat trick to show that the Plane is probably some sort of fake coverup.
    Hurley sure is getting well fed at that Mental Hospital; but I wonder how the helicopter ever got off the ground if he is on it. Sayeed had such a glow on his face as he looked the helicopter over.
    Ben acting as Ben does is always a joy. The way he goes from Fear of the Chopper folks to smart ass comments to Sawyer. But he’s gonna need a facial Surgeon if he takes too many more smacks to the face.
    Takes a licking and keeps Lipping.
    When do these folks eat? They just keep chugging on water as far as I can tell.
    Maybe Desmond split to look for another Monastery…but now is his chance to hook up with Charlie’s ex if Sayeed does not beat him to it. I need more sex in the show!
    And if Abadon is such a bad ass why doesn’t he get himself out to the Island himself? Great scene with Noami; they gave me just enough revelations this show to keep me happy.[/quote]
    Great comment, but why would the funeral director ask Jack if he was friend or family to a polar bear?

  214. Doug says:

    Hey guys:
    Has anyone noticed the irony of “Matthew Abaddon”? Abaddon is in the book of Revelation and means either destroyer or is hell.

  215. TanziTwo says:

    [quote comment="177379"] [pp] Ben Linus…
    Takes a licking and keeps Lipping.
    [/quote]

    Bobo gets my vote for one-liner of the month.

    We’ve been saying here –

    “Ben Linus takes a slappin’… and keeps on rappin’.” — see he is like a Boy-Otch.

  216. Missy says:

    Went back and watched the first episode on abc.com – the pilot of flight 815, smokey’s first victim DID have on a wedding ring.

    Observation from Thursday’s show – why was Daniel wearing a tie? It seems so inappropriate, like he wasn’t expecting to jump out of the plane, or was he planning on meeting someone important?

    Also Charlotte did seem to recognize Ben. So has she seen the picture Miles had? Weird.

    One last thing that keeps striking me as odd. Whomever our Oceanic 6 end up being – we know right now is Kate and Jack and Hurley – they don’t strike me as people who would follow rules. Like the would sell out thier friends left on the island for money or fame or anything. The way I’m imaging it goes down is that they have the chance to take the chopper. Sayid knows how to fly it – Jack, Kate, Hurley are on board I’d guess Sun is about because of the baby – so maybe Jin is the 6th? I think they won’t tell because they stole the chopper and don’t want people to harm the people who are left. So they say everyone is dead. That seems more like our protective heroes. Just a thought.

  217. nicunurse says:

    Just rewatched (yay for DVR) and Charlotte and Ben have exactly the same blue eyes…in fact, they show Charlotte up close and then Ben when they first meet. They have to be connected…
    George not coming to the phone is definitely strange…
    Dan is called Dan by the woman (presumably his wife) in the kitchen, not Sam as others have suggested.
    That computer terminal that Ben is photographed near…no wires? no plugs? what is that all about?
    Great episode…almost better the second time around!

  218. LOSTmama says:

    people keep asking about Kate and how she’s famous per her history but if the government or some other huge co. was involved they could easily give her a clean slate or pardon her wiith the power they have.

    about the o6 being famous when the plane was found w/ everyone dead still don’t get it if they showed on tv everyone’s dead bodies how do they explain the o6 suddenly being alive?

  219. LOST (POOF) says:

    Has anyone noticed at the end of the preview for next weeks episode, when they show the image saying all new LOST, the reflection in the water is not of the island, but of a city skyline. Has anyone noticed this before?

  220. RGS says:

    [quote comment="177759"]people keep asking about Kate and how she’s famous per her history but if the government or some other huge co. was involved they could easily give her a clean slate or pardon her wiith the power they have.

    about the o6 being famous when the plane was found w/ everyone dead still don’t get it if they showed on tv everyone’s dead bodies how do they explain the o6 suddenly being alive?[/quote]

    Lol, mama, how are you certain that the pbs/news could 1) even fit their submarine into the underwater fuselage of the plane, and 2) would take the time to go to each seat checking to see if a passenger is in each chair, even though a plane crash and subsequent submerging would send parts and people scattered about. My point is, that yes, even though there appears to be footage, it doesn’t mean that it is 100% accurate. News reports make mistakes all the time.

    So the news reports 815 crashed everyone is presumed dead. Three,6 or however months later 6 people are recovered from (insert story that the O6 are sworn to secrecy to let’s call it the Isle of Dr. Moreau) the Island of Dr. Moreau, which was a tiny uncharted island miles from where the plane went down. You don’t think Oprah, Larry King, Newsweek, People magazine, or your favorite reporter wouldn’t be all over it?

  221. skweez says:

    [quote comment="177830"][quote comment="177759"]people keep asking about Kate and how she’s famous per her history but if the government or some other huge co. was involved they could easily give her a clean slate or pardon her wiith the power they have.

    about the o6 being famous when the plane was found w/ everyone dead still don’t get it if they showed on tv everyone’s dead bodies how do they explain the o6 suddenly being alive?[/quote]

    Lol, mama, how are you certain that the pbs/news could 1) even fit their submarine into the underwater fuselage of the plane, and 2) would take the time to go to each seat checking to see if a passenger is in each chair, even though a plane crash and subsequent submerging would send parts and people scattered about. My point is, that yes, even though there appears to be footage, it doesn’t mean that it is 100% accurate. News reports make mistakes all the time.

    So the news reports 815 crashed everyone is presumed dead. Three,6 or however months later 6 people are recovered from (insert story that the O6 are sworn to secrecy to let’s call it the Isle of Dr. Moreau) the Island of Dr. Moreau, which was a tiny uncharted island miles from where the plane went down. You don’t think Oprah, Larry King, Newsweek, People magazine, or your favorite reporter wouldn’t be all over it?[/quote]

  222. skweez says:

    [quote comment="177830"][quote comment="177759"]people keep asking about Kate and how she’s famous per her history but if the government or some other huge co. was involved they could easily give her a clean slate or pardon her wiith the power they have.

    about the o6 being famous when the plane was found w/ everyone dead still don’t get it if they showed on tv everyone’s dead bodies how do they explain the o6 suddenly being alive?[/quote]

    Lol, mama, how are you certain that the pbs/news could 1) even fit their submarine into the underwater fuselage of the plane, and 2) would take the time to go to each seat checking to see if a passenger is in each chair, even though a plane crash and subsequent submerging would send parts and people scattered about. My point is, that yes, even though there appears to be footage, it doesn’t mean that it is 100% accurate. News reports make mistakes all the time.

    So the news reports 815 crashed everyone is presumed dead. Three,6 or however months later 6 people are recovered from (insert story that the O6 are sworn to secrecy to let’s call it the Isle of Dr. Moreau) the Island of Dr. Moreau, which was a tiny uncharted island miles from where the plane went down. You don’t think Oprah, Larry King, Newsweek, People magazine, or your favorite reporter wouldn’t be all over it?[/quote]

    That’s exactly my thoughts. There are always, follow up stories. They assumed that all of the people aboard the flight died due to the condition of the plane. And I’m sure they didn’t go seat by seat. But, when they did the “follow up” story, they found out that there were surviviors, hence, the O6. But also, I believe there are more than just 6 survivors. I think the O6 are just the “heroes”.

  223. Theorist815 says:

    OK-here’s my theory-

    When we see the Oceanic 6 off the Island and back home(whomever the last 3 are-Michael, Walt, whomever-but they can’t be Juliet or Ben as they weren’t on the manifest of Oceanic 815-thus not able to be explained away as a passenger-where would they say they came from?) along with the rescuers and we are seeing them all back home after rescue (obviously). They get off the island by the helo, to the freighter where they find “George” IS Michael. And the 4 rescuers definately get off too. The rescuers all know the island, the survivors and the dharma project exist. For some reason (yet to be revealed) they all (including the survivors who get off) do not discuss the island or the remaining survivors-possibly explain their survival some other way-maybe they’ve been on this freighter rescued the whole time but there was no way to report it-not sure. Anyway, before leaving the island they are basically blackmailed into staying silent about the island and remaining inhabitants-told something so awful that they were either scared into silence or sworn to secrecy-maybe Ben holds the remaining survivors lives on the island in peril as a gaurantee that no one will tell-(Ben has rigged the island to kill them all) but only the rescuers and the O6 know about this (the remaining survivors are living in “ignorant bliss” on the island). Once home, they all see the cover up going on-but this doesn’t come out until long after they are home. They know it’s not the actual flight 815 plane or bodies, know that there ARE other survivors-when we see “healthy/beardless Jack” it’s still before the planes “discovery”. So when the plane IS discovered to be at the bottom of the ocean this is why Daniel is shown so messed up, Charlotte is so obsessed with reading articles, and so excited when she finds the polar bear and Dahrma collar on it and the drunk pilot guy calls with the excuse of the missing wedding ring because he just can’t deal with knowing and feels he needs to do something. The cover/conspiracy is so disturbing to Jack that he begins drinking heavily and believes he has to go back because he can’t live with himself in the “real” world knowing what he knows-along with obvious addiction problems. Michael-or whomever the person is in the coffin is one of the Oceanic 6 who has committed suicide because he couldn’t live with what he knows and this is what made Jack thinking of ending it on the bridge that night too.

    But then this doesn’t explain how everyone knows about the Oceanic 6 yet doesn’t the report say that there were no survivors? I don’t know-that kind of blows a hole in my theory!! Any additional thoughts are greatly appreciated!

  224. Bobola says:

    Michael-or whomever the person is in the coffin is one of the Oceanic 6 who has committed suicide because he couldn’t live with what he knows and this is what made Jack thinking of ending it on the bridge that night too.

    Michael has a conscience? When did he grow that?
    He’s has puss for brains. Michael is out for Michael and I doubt that can change…killing those lovely women in cold blood. Nice to have him standing on the deck when the helicopter touches down and getting sliced and diced.
    Then he would fit into a smaller coffin.
    OK; before someone insisted that the coffin is Adult size. I say they sure fooled me with the Lens they used…Lenses can greatly distort size relationships.
    Sorry to Lost Chicka for my Coffin obsession; But I love cemeteries.
    Seems I used the wrong word for the Helicopter Flashes; they were flash forwards not backs, I guess.
    But in that context, what more might the one with Miles tell us other than to show his ability with Ghosts?
    Whose mother was that? Michael’s?

  225. Hammer says:

    I’ve been holding back on the coffin comments, but here goes. That coffin is normal size. The camera view from up above is most definately distorted. Go back rewatch the episode. You will a more normal shot from behind Jack next to the coffin and you will see that it is normal sized. Enough the small coffin crap.

    Side note, the actor that plays Ben was on a radio show here in Detroit on Friday. When asked if we will find out who is in the coffin, he said…but not with authority…that we most likely will not find out until the end of the series. So theorize away!!

  226. Theorist815 says:

    Ahhh, Bobola-but if others theories are right and the island offers a mirror image of people, then Michael, whose flashbacks showed his attempts at love and commitment and attempts to gain Walt back before landing on the island-then being “evil” Michael on the island plays into the Mirror theory. Once off the island he can’t deal with what he did-thus the suicide.

  227. Liesa says:

    Has anyone wondered why the plane at the bottom of the abyss hasn’t broken up and scattered bodies as it would in a real wreck? Maybe the electromagnetic energy released when Desmond didn’t hit the button caused the plane to split into two entities ( like the rabbit in the Dharma training video). there were then two planes, one to be transported whole and unbroken to the abyss and one with survivors that crashes on the island. The polar bear found in Tunesia is another example of time and space transport. What do you think?

  228. Miss Kim says:

    [quote comment="177364"][quote comment="177319"]It seems to me that the four people sent to the island who were there for Benjamin Linus were not the people I would send to seek revenge/capture/etc. As a physicist/anthropologist/soil sampling ghost buster, they may be the right people to talk/gather info from Benjamin Linus…..Naomi was there to “Get in, get out, and see that no one gets killed.” If I wanted to hunt/capture Ben I would have sent a whole bunch of Naomi-types. Charlotte, Frank, Daniel, and Miles are seeking something other than retribution.[/quote]
    Good point.

    I don’t think Miles is really a soil sampler. He didn’t want Daniel to give the losties any information and probably didn’t want to tell them what he really did. Soil sampler was a cover.[/quote]

    I don’t think he’s really a soil sampler either…..I do think that they are there to learn, not harm. Ben knows so much about Charlotte–and she knew enough to wear bullet proof clothing. It’s as if maybe this has been played out before. Possibly a space/time thing. If anyone had prior knowledge of how things were going to occur, they could make plans for it. I really think that’s where all of this is heading. The whispers, for example, could be warnings from the future into the past. If you could travel back in time, could you be visible in 2 places at once? Or would you be reduced to a whisper? Perhaps Walt has the ability to be more than a whisper–he can appear and speak and be clearly seen and heard. Kate’s horse is perhaps a meaningful symbol she sent to herself as a warning of sorts. I think the “timeline” is key here. We’re being told a story that didn’t start at the beginning and keeps jumping all over the place. I think we will get to the “end” and it may be “the middle” of the story. The missing pieces that make it all come together.

  229. Pippy says:

    Ok – lots of info and interesting reading. I admit I did not take the time to read all the post. This is my first time posting.

    One of my friends sent me the following theory about the significance of the names of the newbies – Her husband and one of his friends came up with it:
    You had a CS Lewis (Charlotte Staples Lewis) with a PhD from Oxford, Matthew Abaddon (from Revelation as ruling angel of the abyss, name comes from Hebrew word for destroy) Daniel Faraday (Michael Faraday discovered electromagnetic induction), Naomi (from Ruth), and George Minkowski (Hermann Minkowski early 20th century mathmatician that invented 4 dimetional view of Einstein’s theories, aka “space-time”).
    I added to this the fact that Benjamin means “son of the right hand” which could be a reference to the fact that Christ sets at the right hand of the father. So, maybe Ben is to be seen as a sort of Christ figure. Maybe he is not evil, but is being perceived as such by the others, much the way Christ was rejected? Jacob in the Bible is the father of the 12 tribes of Israel, so could that be significant for the “ghost” Jacob in the cabin? Is he some sort of God or father of the nation symbol? CS Lewis was big on spiritual allegory in his book “The Lion, The witch and The Wardrobe” Could it be that LOST is to be seen as a similiar allegory?
    Someone in an earlier post mentioned that Dharma means “path of righteousness” Also, Naomi from the book of Ruth in the Bible returns home to her people, could it be that Naomi had some connection with the “others” in her past?
    Also, John Locke, was the philosopher of freedom he lived from 1632-1704….the name Jack is a derivative of John – John and Jack seem to be rivals in the quest to “save” everyone. They both want freedom, just different kinds.

    Concerning the flashbacks and flashforwards. I think with the castawasy we are now seeing flashforwards of the oceanic 6, but with the new team I think we are getting flashbacks for the purpose of establishing who they are – much like we got on the castaways in earlier seasons.

    As for the Oceanic 6 – we know that Kate, Jack and Hurley are three of them – When Kate and Jack met at the airport, she mentioned that she had to get back because he would be wondering where she was ….could that be referring to Sawyer? If Hurley left John to go with Jack, maybe Sawyer did also. It is possible that the pilot of the helicopter, who I believe was supposed to have been flying Oceanic flight 815, could be one of the six – people would think he had survived with them? and as for the sixth one I am going to say that it was Juliette.

    One other thought on the six is that instead of the pilot and Juliette it could be Locke and Ben? Maybe one of them is the one in the coffin – it would make sense that no one would go to their funerals. Or the Asian couple expecting their child (sorry, I am terrible with names when I am writing and thinking at the same time) anyway she would need to get off the island before her baby was born.

    Lots of mystery and as usual, just when we think we have it figured out something will change and we’ll have to get new theories.

    Happy watching!

  230. Laura says:

    For those of you who did Find815… (or anyone else if I missed something) do we have a date that the plane was found?

  231. Meg says:

    [quote comment="179356"]For those of you who did Find815… (or anyone else if I missed something) do we have a date that the plane was found?[/quote]
    I don’t believe there was. I was looking for that as soon as this ep aired, but as far as I know, they were very careful not to give any dates.

  232. Kyle says:

    First time leaving a comment. I love this site! When Hurley tells Jack hes sorry at the end of the premiere, I was confused. Jack is a horrible leader. Plus what could locke have done that ended so tragically? What if locke does to the losties what Ben did to his dad and the other dharma members (gas attack). Why would Locke do this? To prove himself to Jacob/Walt/Island? To make sure no one gets off island/finds island? Just a thought.

  233. Laura says:

    [quote comment="179659"]First time leaving a comment. I love this site! When Hurley tells Jack hes sorry at the end of the premiere, I was confused. Jack is a horrible leader. Plus what could locke have done that ended so tragically? What if locke does to the losties what Ben did to his dad and the other dharma members (gas attack). Why would Locke do this? To prove himself to Jacob/Walt/Island? To make sure no one gets off island/finds island? Just a thought.[/quote]

    I think Locke is turning into Ben. Locke is making all of his decisions based on what a “vision” (Walt) tells him to do… just like Ben was getting his orders from Jacob. Regardless of whether or not Locke’s actions are “right” he is putting the lives of many at risk and in the hands of this “vision”. How do we know that ghost-Walt is looking out for the best interests of the people, how did Ben know Jacob was always right.

    He doesn’t; Ben didn’t. The simple point is they were both looking for meaning in their lives, and took what they were given and ran with it. When Ben was approached by the natives and invited to work with them he suddenly had the confidence that he never got from his father.

    This is why I think Hurley is sorry. He is sorry because he falls into the trap, and uses his love for Charlie, and desire to honor his last words to outweigh his common sense and integrity.

    Maybe “Walt” tells Locke to kill Ben and Hurley is simply suffering from guilty… I don’t know. But I think the point is that Jack makes his decisions based on reason and logic. Sure he falters some, like when he tried to shoot Locke, but even then he was working with his belief that Locke had just knifed some girl, and Jack was trying to protect his people. Locke on the other hand does whatever his visions, or dreams, or drugs tell him to do… no matter how immoral, illogical or stupid they may be.

  234. samsandrasan says:

    I have just a few things I noticed that I wanted to bounce off of the old folks here (Hammer ; >).

    You all have been talking about the picture in the ladies house that looked like a young Eko. What no one has talked about and what I just noticed is that the pictures change! Do some screen shots before he does the “exorcism” and after he does it.

    The top picture is gone (see the mark on the wall); the other pictures are different. The one picture they show previously of the boy in the large plain gold frame is now smaller and in a more ornate frame. This is why he was looking at the photos. Furthermore the middle picture that is there before he goes up shows an adult, a teenage boy and a toddler girl. The adult looks similar to Michael (I can only see a skewed view of it). Something changed when he did the “exorcism”.

    Also, when Ben shot Charlotte he shot her once. I watched the scene several times. Yet she has two bullets in the vest and the second bullet leaves a bruise you see in a later scene.

  235. samsandrasan says:

    What I thought was a teenage boy may be a woman. There is a shadow I thought was a small beard. None the less, the pictures change.

  236. samsandrasan says:

    What I thought was a teenage boy may be a woman. None the less, the pictures change.

  237. Jeff Lost says:

    Why does everyone think Dharma doesn’t know where the island is located. In past seasons they were dropping food and supplies for the button pushers. Recently started reading blog maybe this topic has previously been hashed out.

  238. roses12 says:

    I missed Lost and you all so much.

    why would the losties pick Hurley to go on the helicopter? Never been first choice for missions before. Love Hurley. Would be devastated to think that he would turn his back on his fellow losties and leave them behind (especially Claire and baby). He and Sayid are our good guys.

    Do you think the photo of Ben was taken at the airport, I vaguely recall some theories on here during a flashback that someone spotted Ben at the airport when our Losties were boarding the plane?

    #198 do you think the drug money miles got paid for the archeaology bribe as part of the teams mission to find the island. This would support the longer timeline theory…..

    Where are the natives gone????

  239. roses12 says:

    sorry meant to read

    #198 do you think that the drug money, Miles found in the wall, paid for the archeaology bribe. Where they working as part of the team at that early stage, to find the island. This would support the longer timeline theory…..

    but then surely the team was funded by someone with deep enough pockets to pay a little bribe off.

  240. DocH says:

    I totally believe the “freighter tots” come from incredibly deep pockets. Be it Dharma, Hanso, Widmore, Mittelos, whatever… they are well funded. We see all four of them getting “current” OA815 discovery news – Daniel & Frank on TV, Miles on the radio, Charlotte from print media… that puts them in the same time frame – days, weeks, a month or two before arriving on-island. My big question??? When were Naomi and Abbadon having their recruiting conversation about the four? Before Flt 815?, as they were in the air?, just after the crash?,
    before 815 was discovered? nce 815 was discovered? Timeline works for the four – not for Naomi & Abbadon.

  241. christy says:

    Don’t know if this means anything, but has anyone noticed in the season opener that the guy who tells Hurley that someone is staring at him hides his face very well? Why does he see the “ghost” of Charlie too???

  242. samsandrasan says:

    Okay, I take that back about the gunshots. I hear one but see two. Really fast gun. But, check out the photos in the house, they are definitely different after Miles comes out of the room. It’s like some people were erased.

  243. dukewm says:

    Kudos to Pippy and acquaintences for researching the significance of the names of the “newbies” (see Comment 229).
    Put together with the Jacob, Benjamin, Christian, Ruth (etc),there is just way too much coincidence for all these names to not have biblical references and story lines that parallel other works of literature, classical studies and connections with events of the past.

    The big question is: How will the writers tie it all together ? Of course I don’t expect that to be revealed until the Series Finale.
    THAT’S gonna’ be a mind blowing episode.

    I still think the numbers will come back in a significant manner (again, too many references to not be important).

    As for the Oceanic 6: EVERYONE other than Jack, Kate and Hurley is pure speculation at this point.

    The Mystery Person in the Coffin: Lots of discussion (even though it really belongs on the S3E23 Finale Thread). I think Michael is too obvious given the reveal of the teenage son. And (not to be racial) but, why would the Funeral Director ask Jack if he was “family or friend” ? It HAS to be someone Jack cares about and Kate practically hated, like Jules.

    The “Eye inside the Cabin”: Watched it again last night and froze that frame. Looked like Hurley himself more than anyone else. However, the left eyebrow is different (thicker towards the outside) than Hurley’s. It does NOT match Lockes eyebrow. I was checking out everyone elses ‘brows after that and couldn’t find a match.

    Whoever said watching S4E2 the second time was almost better than the first could be right. But then, almost every Ep is great the second, third etc. time around because there is so much more detail to soak in.

    I’ll finish by repeating what I said on my very first post – before this is all over, we’ll ALL be saying THIS is the greatest TV show of all time.

    34 Hrs and 17 Minutes ’til S4E3 – can’t wait !

  244. Circus Mom says:

    [quote comment="180665"]The Mystery Person in the Coffin: Lots of discussion (even though it really belongs on the S3E23 Finale Thread). I think Michael is too obvious given the reveal of the teenage son. And (not to be racial) but, why would the Funeral Director ask Jack if he was “family or friend” ? It HAS to be someone Jack cares about and Kate practically hated, like Jules.

    quote]

    Iv’e read several comments that the person in the coffin is someone that Kate, in particular, hates. Noone, except Jack, went to the funeral. All Kate said was why would I go. She could have just as well said why would anybody go. And if it was someone Jack really cared about he would have said yes to friend or family. This death profondly affects Jack but he dosn’t even want to view the body.

  245. Theorist815 says:

    I don’t believe I’ve read anything about the part where it’s raining and Locke says that the rain is about to end-and it does…I think that Locke has now somehow become Jacob or has been given special “powers” from him-and this is how he survived the gunshot wound too.

    The name connections and biblical references are great-you all do EXCELLENT research! Far deeper then mine theories!! WOW! Can’t wait til tonights episode!

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