Lost Season 5 Premiere: Destiny Calls

lostseason5castshot.jpg

After another 8 month hiatus, Lost is back this evening, with a three hour premiere event. There is an hour long recap show at 8 EST, followed by the first two episodes of Season 5 – the aptly titled Episode 1 “Because You Left” and then Episode 2 “The Lie”. As you might have noticed, we’ve taken a bit of a hiatus as well – after the DHARMA Wants You ARG catastrophe we too needed a break! Navigating the minefield of spoilers that the Lost blogosphere has become is difficult (if not impossible), but we will continue to treat this blog and our weekly episodic posts as something to prompt intelligent conversation about our favorite show rather than ruin the intrigue far in advance for everyone.

That said, Season 5 is largely going to focus on the theme of time travel – as many of you can imagine – and Episode 1 is said to pick up immediately where Season 4 ended. Lindelof has said that when this season starts, we will not “know when or where we are” – and that the story telling device may change as well. Further, a number of the episodes will be more multi-character focused than we have seen in the past. We will see two new characters introduced in Episode 1.

Because You Left

ABC’s Official Show Description

Spoiler Alert

“The remaining island survivors start to feel the effects of the aftermath of moving the island, and Jack and Ben begin their quest to reunite the Oceanic 6 in order to return to the island with Locke’s body in an attempt to save their former fellow castaways.”

The first scene of “Because You Left” is supposed to start with a jaw-dropping opener, so make sure you don’t miss the first few minutes!

hurley_ep2.jpg

The Lie

ABC’s Official Show Description

Spoiler Alert

“Hurley and Sayid are on the run from the cops after stumbling into trouble at the safehouse; the island survivors come under attack by unknown forces; and an old friend offers some shocking advice to Kate in order to ensure that “the lie” remain a secret.”

We will not dig too far into this episode, given the implications of the episode title itself. I can say that a character we have not seen since Season 2 will make an appearance and there should be an extremely intense action scene.

Season Premiere Preview

Sneak Peeks

Sneak Peek 1
Sneak Peek 2
Sneak Peek 3
Sneak Peek 4
Sneak Peek 5
Sneak Peek 6
Sneak Peek 7

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596 Responses to Lost Season 5 Premiere: Destiny Calls

  1. SFJ says:

    Yes! It’s tonight! Finally!

  2. Missy says:

    8 months since our last new episode – and the new season is finally here! Yipee!

  3. Miraks says:

    Finally! I’ve been watching re-runs for months now.

  4. JohnCML says:

    7 hours and counting…

    A random thought. Does turning the Frozen Donkey Wheel reactivate whatever the magnetic force was hiding the island? So when it moves in time, it cannot be seen in other “times” at it’s current location?

    Did that make sense?

  5. LINS says:

    Finally!!! The wait is over!! Bring on the theories!

  6. Lost Chicka says:

    I can’t wait! 4 hours, 39 minutes! I am so excited to see what happens to Sawyer, Locke, Captain Guyliner/Alpert, Juliet, and the rest of them!

  7. NikkiV says:

    eeeek!! I’m so excited and burning with anticipation for the premiere!!

  8. ESB says:

    tonight! SWEET!!!!! ;)

  9. Rita says:

    YES!!!!! Just about here, after all this wait!!! I’m so excited I can hardly stand it!! Bring it on.

  10. PJSander says:

    I am anxiously awaiting 8pm.

    Does anyone else think that the cast photo (above) is a little creepy? The actors all look… off. Plus, I don’t like that ON island and OFF island folks are all mixed in together. Yes, I am fanatical.

    LOL.

    : ) P

  11. Miss Kim says:

    Soon, soon, soon, soon!!!!!! Yes PJ: It’s a mighty freaky lookin’ photo of everyone.

  12. Hammer says:

    Hammer…..reporting for duty.

  13. Tasha says:

    Wahoooo!!!! I am back!

  14. cazzie says:

    it has been a long wait huh? its here and cant wait…..wonder what answers we will get or what questions will start!!!

  15. Hammer says:

    Breaking rules eh? Sounds like what Ben was talking to Widmore about when he had Alex killed.

  16. NikkiV says:

    I had the most wonderful idea/theory while I was watching the pre-show/re-cap show. I suppose Richard Alpert traveled back in time when he knew Locke was “special” to try to get him to the island sooner.

  17. Hammer says:

    Just throwing it out there again. Dez and Pen are the island’s “Adam and Eve”.

  18. Hammer says:

    Whisperers!!!!!!

  19. michael says:

    When did you hear the whispers

  20. Hammer says:

    Didn’t hear any. Saw one. I believe that the whisperers are dead people stuck in time but can show themselves. Ana Lucia, Charlie, Christian, Libby….all part of the whisperers.

  21. LostGrrl says:

    Okay… saying it for the first time this season… LOVE Hurley and Sawyer. I missed their one-liners.

  22. LINS says:

    just a random thought that probably couldn’t actually be true, but thought i would throw it out there anyway, but what is widmore was the island’s “ben” before ben took over? what is widmore had to move the island and can’t come back, then dharma took over, then ben took over and now widmore is mad and wants control back…? how does he really know so much about the island, enough to create a secondary protocol if ben heads to the orchid, etc.? like i said, just a random thought…

  23. daniel says:

    Here’s Hurly’s Shirt from tonights episode:

    http://skreened.com/clintonville/i-heart-my-shih-tzu

    hot!

  24. Hammer says:

    [quote comment=”308217″]just a random thought that probably couldn’t actually be true, but thought i would throw it out there anyway, but what is widmore was the island’s “ben” before ben took over? what is widmore had to move the island and can’t come back, then dharma took over, then ben took over and now widmore is mad and wants control back…? how does he really know so much about the island, enough to create a secondary protocol if ben heads to the orchid, etc.? like i said, just a random thought…[/quote]
    No all that random Lins…I’ve heard that one before and think it’s viable.

  25. Hammer says:

    Lins, Widmore may even be from the Black Rock. He was VERY interested in the log he bought at the auction.

  26. LINS says:

    [quote comment=”308221″]Lins, Widmore may even be from the Black Rock. He was VERY interested in the log he bought at the auction.[/quote]

    Exactly!!

  27. Tasha says:

    Hurley is crazy! He should just go back! I would want to!

  28. Easy says:

    Who was the old lady with Ben at the end?

  29. Hammer says:

    Hugo is always behind one step. He thinks he’s doing the right thing because Sayid said to do the opposite. Ana Lucia made it clear to stay away from cops.

  30. Tasha says:

    [quote comment=”308224″]Who was the old lady with Ben at the end?[/quote]

    You know the lady that can tell the future from Desmond’s Flashes Before Your Eyes Episode!…Wow I knew the episode name. I must be addicted!

  31. PJSander says:

    The episode did not disappoint. Answered questions, still bringing UP questions though.

    One inconsistency that bothered me… Sun showed Kate a photo of a YOUNG baby – six, maybe eight months at most. Ji Yeon should be at least two and a half – shouldn’t Sun have had a more recent photo? I’m just saying…

    There were a few predictable things… but probably NOT for the “average” LOST viewer (which clearly we are not). Mrs. Hawking is a good example. And bringing Frogurt to the forefront just to kill him off was typical LOST redshirt expenditure.

    : ) P

  32. Hammer says:

    Ms. Hawkings. She was the lady Dez saw while he was time traveling.

  33. Snaisy says:

    Easy, the old lady was the same lady who talked to charlie and convinced him he was not meant to marry Penny yet. She is the one Des saw in one of his visions when he was in London and saw Charlie. She also told Des he could not change Charlie’s death or stop it, rather.

    I am totally not buying Sun’s friendly little ‘catch up’ time with Kate. I am conflicted because I want Sun to still be good. But now that she is part of the Widmore gang, I cant be too sure.

  34. NikkiV says:

    She’s got to be Faraday’s mum..

  35. Tasha says:

    Does anybody have any idea why someone would want Aaron? For research? What good would he do for someone such as…Charles…???

  36. michael says:

    [quote comment=”308231″]Does anybody have any idea why someone would want Aaron? For research? What good would he do for someone such as…Charles…???[/quote]

    Thought maybe ben set that up to get her on the run

  37. Tasha says:

    There was also an episode where Desmond was a priest I think? Anyhow Ms. Hawkins was in a picture frame with someone in that episode…but don’t remember much about it.

  38. PJSander says:

    I thought Mrs. Hawking was going to be Faraday’s mother before we knew it was her. The scribbling on the chalk board SCREAMED of Faraday. It is still possible.

    Loved seeing Ana-Lucia! “Libby says hi.” Classic!

    : ) P

  39. LostGrrl says:

    [quote comment=”308231″]Does anybody have any idea why someone would want Aaron? For research? What good would he do for someone such as…Charles…???[/quote]

    I’m thinking that Ben was behind that. So that she would feel spooked, leave her home behind, and feel that going back to the island would be a good option.

  40. Hammer says:

    [quote comment=”308231″]Does anybody have any idea why someone would want Aaron? For research? What good would he do for someone such as…Charles…???[/quote]
    Well since he was inutero we’ve been told he’s special. Locke is, Dez is, Walt is, Jack likely is….special how? I don’t yet know.

  41. Snaisy says:

    Aaron was not meant to leave the island, remember? You know when Clair was preggo she went to have her fortune told… i forget what the fortune teller told her but she was either to NOT raise him because something bad would happen OR she was NOT TO BE w/o him bc something bad would happen… does anyone remember which it was? That might help us figure out why he is super important to whoever wants him back. For a while I was thinking the lawyers were a way for Ben to get her to go to the island again since she is accustom to fleeing.

  42. Dan-o says:

    Favorite parts…

    – Alarm goes off at 8:15
    – Seeing Dr. Lefty again

  43. sector7 says:

    That was a lot to take in. I thought of a couple of things right after seeing, though.
    1. When Richard visited little John to have him choose the items, could he have been looking for time traveling John?
    2. Could the whispers be coming from people who are shifting around in time? Possibly even James, John, Juliet and the rest?

    Something else — we now know that Dan was who we heard on the dharma video. He must be trying to change the past.

  44. Ben says:

    Um, can we discuss the island only moving for our friends and no one else. How did Faraday escape the whole time travel thing and link up with the dharma people? (Dr. Chang, another name for our friend!) Clearly its creating our path for Dan to investigate the Donkey Wheel. How did Richard Alpert know everything that was to come?

  45. PJSander says:

    [quote comment=”308239″]Something else — we now know that Dan was who we heard on the dharma video. He must be trying to change the past.[/quote]

    Yes, I thought that it was Daniel’s voice we heard off screen in the DHARMA video. However, I think he is more likely to have been course correcting, than trying to change the past. He knows he can’t.

    : ) P

  46. Tasha says:

    [quote comment=”308237″]Aaron was not meant to leave the island, remember? You know when Clair was preggo she went to have her fortune told… i forget what the fortune teller told her but she was either to NOT raise him because something bad would happen OR she was NOT TO BE w/o him bc something bad would happen… does anyone remember which it was? That might help us figure out why he is super important to whoever wants him back. For a while I was thinking the lawyers were a way for Ben to get her to go to the island again since she is accustom to fleeing.[/quote]

    Only SHE can raise him and nobody else.

  47. LINS says:

    [quote comment=”308236″][quote comment=”308231″]Does anybody have any idea why someone would want Aaron? For research? What good would he do for someone such as…Charles…???[/quote]
    Well since he was inutero we’ve been told he’s special. Locke is, Dez is, Walt is, Jack likely is….special how? I don’t yet know.[/quote]

    ***********************
    special people have special roles on the island…

  48. Tasha says:

    [quote comment=”308241″][quote comment=”308239″]Something else — we now know that Dan was who we heard on the dharma video. He must be trying to change the past.[/quote]

    Yes, I thought that it was Daniel’s voice we heard off screen in the DHARMA video. However, I think he is more likely to have been course correcting, than trying to change the past. He knows he can’t.

    : ) P[/quote]

    WHich Dharma video would that be? I missed that one….I need to watch it on youtube i guess.

  49. PJSander says:

    [quote comment=”308240″]Um, can we discuss the island only moving for our friends and no one else. How did Faraday escape the whole time travel thing and link up with the dharma people? (Dr. Chang, another name for our friend!) Clearly its creating our path for Dan to investigate the Donkey Wheel. How did Richard Alpert know everything that was to come?[/quote]

    In 1996, Daniel could manipulate time with Eloise. He had eight years to figure it out. I think he can CHOOSE to travel in time.

    I believe Alpert, Walt and Desmond are special, but that Captain Eyeliner has learned to manipulate it better. Some believe that he is a whisperer, and I certainly agree that is a possibility.

    So much to digest…

    : ) P

  50. sector7 says:

    [quote comment=”308227″]The episode did not disappoint. Answered questions, still bringing UP questions though.

    One inconsistency that bothered me… Sun showed Kate a photo of a YOUNG baby – six, maybe eight months at most. Ji Yeon should be at least two and a half – shouldn’t Sun have had a more recent photo? I’m just saying…

    There were a few predictable things… but probably NOT for the “average” LOST viewer (which clearly we are not). Mrs. Hawking is a good example. And bringing Frogurt to the forefront just to kill him off was typical LOST redshirt expenditure.

    : ) P[/quote]

    I thought the picture was wierd, too. These kids were born around 1 year apart from each other. However, Sun said it was a baby picture.

  51. Hammer says:

    Here’s one for ya…how about Miles knowing there was a dead bore in the jungle and new how long it was dead????

  52. Hammer says:

    And now we know why Widmore hates Dez….the rules don’t apply to him.

  53. Ben says:

    Miles can communicate with ghosts. Is dying the key? When you die maybe you have a chance of coming back depending on where the island is in time. Dead people always appear on the island right? What exactly happened to the island when desmond turned the key?

  54. LostGrrl says:

    What’s with Charlotte and the nosebleed? Obviously, Daniel is very worried. A symptom of the rapid time travels? If they can’t stop it, perhaps everyone is in danger?

    And who are the fire throwers? “Others” who don’t know our friends yet?

  55. Tasha says:

    [quote comment=”308247″]Here’s one for ya…how about Miles knowing there was a dead bore in the jungle and new how long it was dead????[/quote]

    Maybe he talked to it LOL.

  56. Snaisy says:

    Here’s one for ya…how about Miles knowing there was a dead bore in the jungle and new how long it was dead????

    I think miles is the baby from the Dharma flashback we first saw when this season started… Asian baby…Asian Miles-who is also special as he can chit chat with the dead (remember he communicated with some lady’s family member for $$ when we were getting to know him through his character’s flashbacks) Maybe that is how he knew the bore was dead waiting to fill their bellies!

  57. Michael says:

    Who was the old lady with Ben in the candle scene at the end???

  58. LostGrrl says:

    [quote comment=”308253″]Here’s one for ya…how about Miles knowing there was a dead bore in the jungle and new how long it was dead????

    I think miles is the baby from the Dharma flashback we first saw when this season started… Asian baby…[/quote]

    Miles is too young. ASSUMING he’s never time traveled before.

  59. PJSander says:

    [quote comment=”308254″]Who was the old lady with Ben in the candle scene at the end???[/quote]

    Mrs. Hawking.

    If you read above, you will see that she has visited with Desmond in his flashbacks. She was sort of the expert in past / future and the idea that you cannot change either, because destiny has a way of course correcting.

    : ) P

  60. Tasha says:

    [quote comment=”308254″]Who was the old lady with Ben in the candle scene at the end???[/quote]

    Back somewhere around comment 30…..

  61. Michael says:

    Thanks!

  62. LostGrrl says:

    [quote comment=”308254″]Who was the old lady with Ben in the candle scene at the end???[/quote]

    See posts 33 – 40.

  63. PJSander says:

    [quote comment=”308256″]Miles is too young. ASSUMING he’s never time traveled before.[/quote]

    I disagree. The “original” video (which I believe was shown at Comic-Con – I wasn’t there, but I think that is the source) was clearly in the early to mid-70’s based on the style of clothing, etc. In it, Halliwax / Candle / Wickman is interrupted by a crying baby, who definitely COULD be baby Miles. That would make Miles in his early 30’s, which I think is quite probable.

    : ) P

  64. Hammer says:

    [quote comment=”308256″][quote comment=”308253″]Here’s one for ya…how about Miles knowing there was a dead bore in the jungle and new how long it was dead????

    I think miles is the baby from the Dharma flashback we first saw when this season started… Asian baby…[/quote]

    Miles is too young. ASSUMING he’s never time traveled before.[/quote]
    +++++++++
    No he’s not is 2004 on the show and that would put him between 20 and 30, which he looks.

  65. Snaisy says:

    [quote comment=”308256″][quote comment=”308253″]Here’s one for ya…how about Miles knowing there was a dead bore in the jungle and new how long it was dead????

    I think miles is the baby from the Dharma flashback we first saw when this season started… Asian baby…[/quote]

    Miles is too young. ASSUMING he’s never time traveled before.[/quote]

    If miles was similar to Richard in that he does not age, then perhaps he can still be the Asian baby…

  66. MissKim says:

    Sun made some lame comment about “This is a baby picture” when she showed Kate the pic. It’s probably something to do w/ casting–just easier for now. Seriously, they should have had Kate make a comment about it to Sun…..something humorous….or at least had Sun seem apologetic….”THe only pic that I have w/ me is from when Ji Yeon was an infant.” Something.

  67. Claire Crush says:

    I think miles is the baby from the Dharma flashback we first saw when this season started… Asian baby…

    Miles is too young. ASSUMING he’s never time traveled before.

    If miles was similar to Richard in that he does not age, then perhaps he can still be the Asian baby…

    Why is it so hard to understand that Miles could definitly be the Asain baby? Age woudl be about right.

  68. Trixanna says:

    Wow. What great episodes! I agree that the crying baby was most likely Miles. Poor Hurley! He thinks he is doing the right thing by listening to Sayid, but is he? As evil and deceptive as Ben is, Anna Lucia DID say to not get arrested and to stay away from the cops. Ben has his own interests at heart (as always) but he may have been the better choice for Hurley. We shall see.

  69. DishHater says:

    I missed the episode and recap because my sat provider was having problems with setting my local channels and I live to far to get them off air. Now I have to wait for it to come out on ABC.com. Life is NOT FAIR!

  70. Claire Crush says:

    Was one of the cops that showed up to get Hurley the black dude from Fringe and the insane assylum?

  71. Hammer says:

    [quote comment=”308265″]I think miles is the baby from the Dharma flashback we first saw when this season started… Asian baby…

    Miles is too young. ASSUMING he’s never time traveled before.

    If miles was similar to Richard in that he does not age, then perhaps he can still be the Asian baby…

    Why is it so hard to understand that Miles could definitly be the Asain baby? Age woudl be about right.[/quote]
    ++++++++++
    Throw in his special ability to chat with dead and it becomes even more obvious.

  72. LINS says:

    I’m glad to see Vincent is ok :)

  73. PJSander says:

    [quote comment=”308264″]Sun made some lame comment about “This is a baby picture” when she showed Kate the pic. It’s probably something to do w/ casting–just easier for now. Seriously, they should have had Kate make a comment about it to Sun…..something humorous….or at least had Sun seem apologetic….”THe only pic that I have w/ me is from when Ji Yeon was an infant.” Something.[/quote]

    I agree, Miss Kim. It was probably a casting thing… don’t want to identify the older child until she is cast. And it would be like D&C to add a bit of humor to cover that in exactly the way you described… which is why I think there might be something else to it!

    Speaking of D&C humor, in the “clip show” (which was really so much more than that) I loved how Damon talked about Jack’s “really bad beard.” I expected them to say something about “Carole’s really bad Australian accent,” but they didn’t.

    An example of their senses of humor is when Hurley gave his mother a three minute recap of his time on the island. I mean it DID sound ridiculous, but that has always been Hurley’s job – to be the Greek chorus, so to speak.

    : ) P

  74. Jet Black says:

    Does the wheel affect time AND move the island?

  75. LostGrrl says:

    Great line… from Hurley’s mother…

    “Why is there a dead Muslim man on my couch?

  76. Hammer says:

    Bedtime for Bonzo…but as usual, I leave you with this:

    Charlotte’s nose bleeds will be for eveyone, it’s going to be the reason Locke has to get everyone back, to stop the sickness….or they’ll all die.

  77. Claire Crush says:

    Who was the lady at the Butcher shop?

  78. PJSander says:

    [quote comment=”308273″]Great line… from Hurley’s mother…

    “Why is there a dead Muslim man on my couch?[/quote]

    I think she said Pakistani, but yes, it was priceless. There were a number of good ones.

    : ) P

  79. LINS says:

    the conversation between kate and sun was too weird…sun was so fake. and i think perhaps the reason she only had a baby picture is maybe because that’s the last time she’s seen ji yeon.

  80. Claire Crush says:

    LINS
    Comment 81, posted 1 minute ago – Quote and reply
    the conversation between kate and sun was too weird…sun was so fake. and i think perhaps the reason she only had a baby picture is maybe because that’s the last time she’s seen ji yeon.*

    I like that idea about the baby, I thoughht it was really weird how Sun was acting. Almost like she wasn’t who she used to be.

  81. kellybeee says:

    [quote comment=”308268″]Was one of the cops that showed up to get Hurley the black dude from Fringe and the insane assylum?[/quote]

    i have no idea but can someone please look this up!

  82. LINS says:

    [quote comment=”308282″][quote comment=”308268″]Was one of the cops that showed up to get Hurley the black dude from Fringe and the insane assylum?[/quote]

    i have no idea but can someone please look this up![/quote]

    ***********************
    no, it wasn’t him

  83. DocH says:

    [quote comment=”308221″]Lins, Widmore may even be from the Black Rock. He was VERY interested in the log he bought at the auction.[/quote]

    So if Widmore is an ancient, is Hawkings an ancient too? But she is on team-Ben (or vice versa). If they go back centuries – why are they in opposite camps?

  84. PJSander says:

    I thought Mrs. Hawking could be Jacob. Kind of a stretch, but that is where my mind went. Please help me shoot that theory down!

    : ) P

  85. DocH says:

    Connections? Nose-bleed – we saw Charlotte start to flow… only other nose bleed I can remember is the miner guy on the loor of the cavern where they were digging the Orchid. He was too close to the “power source” – maybe Charlotte is too close too, now that the power to continually jump in time has been unleashed.

  86. LINS says:

    i think sun was trying to convince kate that she had to keep aaron safe as a cover for kate to think she can trust sun. when ben or jack or whoever comes to collect kate and aaron to take them back to the island, this trust in sun will force her to choose, and ultimately possibly lead sun/widmore to ben.

    mrs. hawking freaks me out, what was all that equipment she was working on! is she the only one that knows when and where the island is? does widmore even know about her? if she really is dan’s mom, how will des find her if she’s in l.a. when he thinks he’s supposed to go to oxford?

    quite an episode, going to bed for now, but will re-watch and post more questions tomorrow! i love being on central time for this season instead of pacific time!!

  87. LINS says:

    [quote comment=”308287″]Connections? Nose-bleed – we saw Charlotte start to flow… only other nose bleed I can remember is the miner guy on the loor of the cavern where they were digging the Orchid. He was too close to the “power source” – maybe Charlotte is too close too, now that the power to continually jump in time has been unleashed.[/quote]

    ok, one more comment and then bed time…charlotte said something to dan about her mother and the last nosebleed she had was as a child…if she was born on the island, it might have happened then, perhaps at another time the island was moved?

  88. Tami says:

    Ok,if Claire is supposed to be the one and the only one to raise aaron, then why did she leave hinm and go with her father??? Then she shows up in Kates dream telling her not to dare bring him back to the island.

  89. katesFriend says:

    [quote comment=”308248″]And now we know why Widmore hates Dez….the rules don’t apply to him.[/quote]

    I think he is only special since the hatch implosion, when he first could time travel

    Widmore has hated him much longer

    Unless, I guess, Widmore can see the future…

  90. Ben says:

    A lot less action on here tonight than I thought esp after a season premire.

  91. tjm0805 says:

    The nosebleed topic…the man that I think Locke comes upon that is cutting down a tree in a previous episode has a nosebleed and says he has been dead for some odd years. Maybe Charlotte is dead when she has that nose bleed cause the island jumped in time past when she died?? Just a thought.

  92. Dennis says:

    I think Widmore is from the future, and at some point has access to the past… he knows desmond is ben’s connection to Penny, who ben has promised to kill, thus the reason why he tries to keep them apart at all costs.

    And I’m guessing the reason the six need to return are because they are the “constants” to the survivors, as they have not been affected by the massive release of EM energy that was released from the donkey wheel.

    The catastrophic event that lead to the construction of the Swan station(mentioned in the early seasons) is the result of someone drilling into the giant donkey wheel room and causing an energy leak that needs to be slowly released by pushing the button every 108 minutes. I think Faraday causes this event in order to get desmond into the room to “save the world” when the events in teh show take place

  93. Jules3882 says:

    I agree on the whispers conversations. I said it out loud while I was watching the episodes, “I bet this will explain the whispers!”. Also, were the guys towards the end in Dharma uniforms or Army uniforms. It was hard to tell on the tv I was watching…

  94. PJSander says:

    [quote comment=”308293″]The nosebleed topic…the man that I think Locke comes upon that is cutting down a tree in a previous episode has a nosebleed and says he has been dead for some odd years. Maybe Charlotte is dead when she has that nose bleed cause the island jumped in time past when she died?? Just a thought.[/quote]

    I think that Goodspeed (the man cutting down the tree) had a nosebleed in Locke’s dream / vision because he had a nosebleed when he died in the purge from the gas.

    But that brings up a question… what was in those canisters and up at the Tempest? Could there be a relation to that and the “energy” that the island has?

    Perhaps the first purple sky event (when Desmond turned the fail safe) moved the island back in time just a few minutes (hence the difference between the freighter and the island when the rocket was launched). Of course, that leaves the whole “doctor washes up on shore dead while he is still alive on the freighter” thing in limbo.

    Hmmm.

    : ) P

  95. tjm0805 says:

    I think they were army uniforms…I didn’t see the dharma logo anywhere on there. I could be wrong though.

  96. kellybeee says:

    [quote comment=”308294″]I think Widmore is from the future, and at some point has access to the past… he knows desmond is ben’s connection to Penny, who ben has promised to kill, thus the reason why he tries to keep them apart at all costs.

    And I’m guessing the reason the six need to return are because they are the “constants” to the survivors, as they have not been affected by the massive release of EM energy that was released from the donkey wheel.

    The catastrophic event that lead to the construction of the Swan station(mentioned in the early seasons) is the result of someone drilling into the giant donkey wheel room and causing an energy leak that needs to be slowly released by pushing the button every 108 minutes. I think Faraday causes this event in order to get desmond into the room to “save the world” when the events in teh show take place[/quote]

    that is so smart! i love the idea! it def has to be right! if they button wasnt pushed then all the energy would be released and time would be messed up and all the “constants” would get caught up in the messed up time and eventually everyone would die. hense pushing the button saves the world. but then what happened when Dez turned the key? how was the energy controled or stored or released?

  97. Dennis says:

    hmmm…. i dunno. I figure the swan station where the button was and the plated magnet wall was originally teh mining site we see in the beginning of this episode(the swan station/mine site being directly next to the wheel room), the magnet wall being where dharma had attempted to plug and control the leak that faraday ad caused. So with the collapse of the swan station, i’d guess taht plugged up most if not all of the leak, since the room had caved in leaving a crater.

    But I’m thinking taht there is energy escapeing every 108 minutes, but it’s a very small amount compared to the giant blast caused by turning the wheel. If a massive amount of energy causes everyone to sporadically jump through time very quickly, a slow release of energy from the swan leak would cause everyone on the island to move through time, but gradually and much more slowly. The evidence of this first being the delayed arrival of the faraday’s missile(which was off only by a few minutes), and later the freight doctor’s body(which was off by many days).

  98. Dennis says:

    That would also explain why des’s key is a fail safe. If he hadn’t turned the key, there could have possibly been a release of a massive amount of energy much like the one released by turning the wheel, that would have put them in the situation they are in now. Turning the key would cause the station to collapse, effectively sealing the leak.

  99. Paul says:

    OK 2 words people – Ana Lucia!!! Greatr episode.

  100. Scooter says:

    [quote comment=”308287″]Connections? Nose-bleed – we saw Charlotte start to flow… only other nose bleed I can remember is the miner guy on the loor of the cavern where they were digging the Orchid. He was too close to the “power source” – maybe Charlotte is too close too, now that the power to continually jump in time has been unleashed.[/quote]
    Wasn’t the guy Fisher Stevens played last season afflicted by nose bleeds (and seizures) before dying?

  101. Scooter says:

    [quote comment=”308292″]A lot less action on here tonight than I thought esp after a season premire.[/quote]
    Maybe not a bad thing. It’s been awhile since last season ended and there were TONS of posts then — many of which were useless. Like, um, this one I’m posting now. I’ll stop now…

  102. Scooter says:

    [quote comment=”308309″]OK 2 words people – Ana Lucia!!! Greatr episode.[/quote]
    I’m not sure about the Ana Lucia (and Charlie) sightings by Hurley. I can buy into the time jumping island stuff, but dead people talking to Hurley off the island is one more reach that doesn’t seem to fit. I’m sure it does somehow, but it’s a stretch for me now. Maybe Hurley has a bit of Miles’ capabilities in him?

  103. mikey says:

    [quote comment=”308302″]hmmm…. i dunno. I figure the swan station where the button was and the plated magnet wall was originally teh mining site we see in the beginning of this episode(the swan station/mine site being directly next to the wheel room), the magnet wall being where dharma had attempted to plug and control the leak that faraday ad caused. So with the collapse of the swan station, i’d guess taht plugged up most if not all of the leak, since the room had caved in leaving a crater.

    But I’m thinking taht there is energy escapeing every 108 minutes, but it’s a very small amount compared to the giant blast caused by turning the wheel. If a massive amount of energy causes everyone to sporadically jump through time very quickly, a slow release of energy from the swan leak would cause everyone on the island to move through time, but gradually and much more slowly. The evidence of this first being the delayed arrival of the faraday’s missile(which was off only by a few minutes), and later the freight doctor’s body(which was off by many days).[/quote]

    I have to disagree. They specifically say at the beginning of the episode that there is a problem at the Orchid. We even see the donkey wheel in the sonar image the worker shows Chang. The energy in the Orchid is related to time. The energy at the Swan where Des was pushing the button was electromagnetism. Kelvin explained to Des that the button has to be pushed to release the electromagnetic energy every 108 minutes so that it doesn’t become too big to contain. Two seperate stations in two seperate parts of the island and not related to each other based on anything we know at this time.

    Granted, it has been suggested that the purple haze of the Swan implosion did originally cause Des to become unstuck in time and it is possible that event also caused some of the other time weirdness on the island that is revealed in season 4. However I think it’s a bit of a reach to make any connection between the button-pushing at the Swan and the time-travel at the Orchid.

  104. Rita says:

    VERY GOOD EPISODES!! I can’t believe they left us hanging where they did – OK, I guess that’s pretty typical – but what a long wait until next week to get more!

    It strikes me that the “donkey wheel” looks like something that might have come from the ship, or at least built by the same people who would build a ship like the Black Rock – from the same era anyway. Widmore seems to know all about the island and it’s properties. Whoever suggested that he might be from the Black Rock might be on to something.

    I agree that the Asian baby we see in the beginning is most likely Miles. Does that make him born on the island? Maybe, and if so, that could explain his “specialness”. Aaron was also born on the island and is therefore special. Ben made a big point about being born on the island, even though he later admitted that that was a lie. He said that the “Others” all THOUGHT he was born there, so that was significant.

  105. I’m in the UK, can’t wait til it comes out over here, it’s gonna be so awesome!

  106. LostDamery says:

    Wow good to have the island back…or is it? I agree with alot of the discussed ideas widmore as a previous chosen one and the dead are whisperers and maybe some time overlap…my favorite twist is that they say you cannot change anything in time. That is so different from most time travel theories…waiting to see what else happens and try to get through comments before next week.

  107. Dukester says:

    Was I the only one who noticed Tom getting whacked at the end when Locke shows up?

  108. Hammer says:

    [quote comment=”308290″]Ok,if Claire is supposed to be the one and the only one to raise aaron, then why did she leave hinm and go with her father??? Then she shows up in Kates dream telling her not to dare bring him back to the island.[/quote]
    Okay…my take….the psychic is a real psychic. His first reading told him that Aaron was special and new he would be important to saving the world and Claire had to raise him. Widmore (who I now believe set up the folks on 815) got to the psychic and “convinced” him to get Claire on the plane. Claire dies and meets some “whisperers” that don’t want Aaron on the island and now “whispers” to Kate to keep the baby from the island. I am now wondering if the folks Claire hangs with now are on Widmore’s side or Ben’s side.

  109. Becky says:

    Loved the premiere! Fantastic! My observations:

    1. Loved the alarm at 8:15…is it possible that that baby is Miles?
    2. I find it interesting that there was a station being built to deal with the hostile indigenous population on the island i.e. the Others
    3. Loved the record skipping, foreshadowing the skipping of time that Ben set off when he moved the island
    4. Way too much Hurley in this episode…he drives me nuts, his character has gone from endearing and a comic relief to just plain annoying
    5. What is with the butcher shop??? Noticed Ben’s number was 342 (4, 8, 15, 16, 23, 42)
    6. Faraday lied to Sawyer, obviously, about being able to change things in the past since he tried to find Desmond in the hatch
    7. Charlotte seems to be time traveling or is affected by the island the way the comm. officer of the freighter was…nosebleeds, lost time, etc. I am sure she’s indigenous to the island…not able to remember her Mom’s maiden name
    8. I was hoping Charlie would make another appearance!
    9. Loved seeing Ana Lucia…her bangs looked great!
    10. I think Sun does blame Kate and Jack a bit for Jin’s “death”
    11. Who was throwing those fire torches and who were those guys who grabbed Sawyer and Juliette?

    I think that’s it for now! I need to watch it again…was pretty sleepy last night!

    Off to a great start!

  110. flgrl says:

    Lots of great ideas here! We had pretty much decided that Widmore was the island’s “ben” before Ben, but these episodes seemed to confirm it.

    Mrs. Hawking as Faraday’s mom – brilliant!

    About Charlotte and her nosebleed – Let’s not forget that Miles said to her last year something about coming back to the island. She either didn’t know what he was talking about or is hiding something. She genuinely didn’t seem to understand the nosebleed, but it’s got to have something to do with being dead (would make sense with the Miles connection) or the energy from orchid (would make sense from specifically showing the guy on the floor with the nosebleed).

    Such a great show!

  111. Hammer says:

    I think folks are forgetting the lesson we learned from Des’s time travel and trying to change things. Des learned from Ms. Hawkings (Faraday’s mom) that you can’t change destiny (save Charlie) so don’t change events (break the rules). It’s not that you are unable to change events, it’s that you can’t (break the rules). So Dan is telling Des what to do to make sure things happen. Just like he did in the Constant…give me the info so I can do my destiny(help “save us all” as Ms. Hawkings put it). Dan is “fixing” destiny because Widmore and now Ben have broken the rules.

  112. Hammer says:

    [quote comment=”308360″]Lots of great ideas here! We had pretty much decided that Widmore was the island’s “ben” before Ben, but these episodes seemed to confirm it.

    Mrs. Hawking as Faraday’s mom – brilliant!

    About Charlotte and her nosebleed – Let’s not forget that Miles said to her last year something about coming back to the island. She either didn’t know what he was talking about or is hiding something. She genuinely didn’t seem to understand the nosebleed, but it’s got to have something to do with being dead (would make sense with the Miles connection) or the energy from orchid (would make sense from specifically showing the guy on the floor with the nosebleed).

    Such a great show![/quote]
    Yeah, like I mention in 78, I don’t think she’s dead yet, but it’s a clue that the folks that don’t have a constant are going to get the “sickness”. Dan’s note book from last season told us that Des is Dan’s which is how he knew to try to get Des to go to Oxford and tell Ms. Hawkings……?????

  113. flgrl says:

    Also in the “clip show”, Carlton says “Sun BELIEVES that Jin is dead.” Very Darlton to throw that in there!

  114. Hammer says:

    [quote comment=”308365″]Also in the “clip show”, Carlton says “Sun BELIEVES that Jin is dead.” Very Darlton to throw that in there![/quote]
    Yeah, I’ve been pondering that. I don’t think he survived the explosion per se, I wonder if he is caught up in time skipping as well. Remember the freighter was being effected by the side effects of turning the key. Dr. washing up on shore before he died, etc.

  115. Hammer says:

    Tidbit:

    We need a screencap of the beer that Frank was carrying. I saw a skull and cross bones but couldn’t read the rest of the label.

  116. Lostfan says:

    My thoughts:

    1. Totally agree Miles is definitely the baby. When I first saw the sneak peek video of Chang, I thought the voice behind the camera was Miles’ not Daniel’s.
    2. Charlotte was on the island as a child – still a theory that she could be the little girl from Ben’s childhood.
    3. Minkowski’s nose bled BEFORE he died, not after. He time traveled and didn’t have a constant. Where’s Charlotte’s constant?
    4. Hurley sees dead people. So does everyone else.
    5. Had the exact same thought that the whispers were people shifting through time.
    6. At some point, will our current castaways find Danielle Ruseux and her original team from 16 years before? Will we see how Ben acquired Alex? Will we see how the team really died? Did they bleed out through their noses too?
    7. Daniel finds Des because the “rules don’t apply” to him. He has special abilities.
    8. Love the Mrs. Hawkings is Dan’s Mom.
    9. 70 hours? Why 70 hours? What’s up with that?
    10. Seriously? Frogurt? Was this the same Neil that they kept confusing with Steve in the 1st season?
    11. Ethan 20-30 years before shooting John Locke? Ageless again? Wouldn’t Ethan have remembered this in the future? Can anyone remember a conversation/comment that Ethan gave John in season 1 to indicate some kind of past relationship? Wouldn’t John have remembered Ethan shot him 20 years ago? If you can’t change the past – then John would have always had the memory of being shot. Unless of course, the rules don’t apply to him either.

  117. Tasha says:

    I thought Charlotte was born in England and she seemed surprised he knew that so that would mean she wasnt born on island……

  118. Missy says:

    Great episode! I know they said they’ll be answering more questions than posing them; however…

    1. When Farday asked if anyone was missing from their group, why did Sawyer just say Locke – don’t they think Claire is still missing too? Although Locke knows where she is.
    2. Mrs. Hawking as Faraday’s mom – brilliant – but were they in Oxford, or LA? They just seemed to be in a church.
    3. If you can’t change what happens in time shifting, then how are they interacting with the people of the time they are in? How can you get shot? Or is it all a form of course correction?
    4. We know Charlotte lives because we see her in a flash forward in the Tunisian desert. She clearly has been to the island before, and we know she’s searching for the place that she’s been born; but what is her point of being on the mission crew. Daniel and Miles have both shown what they’re so good at.
    5. If time just kept on shifting, wouldn’t everybody just go koo-koo. Is that the sickness that Rousseau warned of? Is that what Kelvin warned Desmond of in the hatch. And is the time shifting the reason all of the hatches are so well protected?

    That’s all for now!

  119. Tasha says:

    I just read up on Charlotte….

    some things I just noticed. (If it’s true)

    She was raised with 2 younger sisters…who might they be?

    She attended Oxford University.

    I am sure almost everyone knows this but I forgot and am sure someone might find it interesting.

    Oh yeah….and what is the significance that she can’t remember her Mother’s Maiden name? Maybe it’s a clue. Someone we already know about?

    You know something else I just realized….it would seem like most of the main characters from lost are an only child. I am sure everyone knew that from season 1 but I guess I get so caught up in the deep stuff i miss the obvious.

  120. Lar says:

    That was a nasty splinter Sawyer got in his foot…perhaps he loses a toe?

  121. PJSander says:

    [quote comment=”308357″]
    11. Who was throwing those fire torches and who were those guys who grabbed Sawyer and Juliette?
    [/quote]

    My thoughts are that the fire torches were the ancient civilization that built the four toed statue.

    : ) P

  122. PJSander says:

    [quote comment=”308357″]
    11. Who was throwing those fire torches and who were those guys who grabbed Sawyer and Juliette?
    [/quote]

    My thoughts are that the fire torches were the ancient civilization that built the four toed statue and that the people who grabbed Sawyer and Juliet were part of Rousseau’s team.

    : ) P

  123. Lostfan says:

    Another random thought:

    John Locke (aka Jeremy Benthem) visited all of the Oceanic 6 to tell them to go back. But he also visited Walt. Yet, Ben is not at all concerned about grabbing Walt to get back to the island.

    The fact is, Walt could see the future and often appeared in people’s visions (Shannon before she got shot/John Locke after he got shot). Also, Ben was all too happy to let Michael take Walt off the island in Season 2 because “he was more than we could handle.” They also did a lot of psychological testing on Walt (perhaps like Richard Alpert did to John Locke). Could it be that Walt is supposed to succeed John as leader of the Others. If so, why is Ben ignoring this fact?

  124. Woschiz says:

    “[quote comment=”308371″]4. We know Charlotte lives because we see her in a flash forward in the Tunisian desert. She clearly has been to the island before, and we know she’s searching for the place that she’s been born; but what is her point of being on the mission crew. Daniel and Miles have both shown what they’re so good at.”

    This was actually a flashback, not a flashforward.

  125. PJSander says:

    [quote comment=”308369″]
    10. Seriously? Frogurt? Was this the same Neil that they kept confusing with Steve in the 1st season?[/quote]

    Scott was the guy they were always confusing with Steve. Neil Frogurt was in a deleted scene where he was taunting Hurley as Hurley prepared for his date with Libby. I am not at all sure that he has ever had lines in an on-air episode.

    : ) P

  126. PJSander says:

    [quote comment=”308369″]
    11. Ethan 20-30 years before shooting John Locke? Ageless again? Wouldn’t Ethan have remembered this in the future? Can anyone remember a conversation/comment that Ethan gave John in season 1 to indicate some kind of past relationship? Wouldn’t John have remembered Ethan shot him 20 years ago? If you can’t change the past – then John would have always had the memory of being shot. Unless of course, the rules don’t apply to him either.[/quote]

    I think your timeline might be off. Ethan shot Locke in the leg shortly after the drug plane crashed. It was an OLD plane, but it only crashed a few years before the LOSTies showed up. We know this because we saw Eko’s flashback, where as an adult, he is planning to take this plane to smuggle drugs.

    : ) P

  127. Hammer says:

    [quote comment=”308372″]
    Oh yeah….and what is the significance that she can’t remember her Mother’s Maiden name? Maybe it’s a clue. Someone we already know about?[/quote]

    It’s a side effect of the ‘sickness’, Des and Minkowski weren’t able to remember things as well. She’s skipping through time.

  128. BaileyLovesLost says:

    There is something important about the compass that Richard gave to Locke. John asked what it’s for and Richard said, “It points North, John.” Do you recall back in Season One Locke had a compass that he gave to someone (I want to say Sayid) and he said that he doesn’t need it anymore. Well, when Sayid was looking at teh compass he made a comment about North on the compass being in the wrong directions. I think this is very important.

  129. Hammer says:

    Could be Bailey, but I think it is more that Locke is Alpert’s constant and he is using the compass to know that Locke is someone he needs to pay attention to when he doesn’t remember Locke.

  130. Sawyer's Constant says:

    When Desmond was a monk at the monastery, remember the tall thin monk that seemed to be his boss? The one that caught him drinking the wine and threw him out? When Desmond went in his office to turn in his “uniform” there was a picture on the head monks desk of him (the head monk)with the white haired woman. Or so I thought anyway. It was a quick shot. I assumed she is his mother. That monk is the one that asked Desmond to help load the wine and that is when Desmond meets Penny! So, another circle back to how all of these lives are intertwined. The monk also seemed to know Widmore pretty well. Also, Mrs Hawking was in a church in that last scene with Ben.

  131. BaileyLovesLost says:

    I think it has something to do with being his constant also. But would Alpert be Locke’s constant or would Locke be Alpert’s constant? Either way, I think there is something significant about the compass and pointing North.
    How about that giant thing with Ms. Hawking swinging back and forth and making marks on the ground? Perhaps that has something to do with where the island is or where it moved to.
    Hurley is bothering me now too. I am worried about that he told his parents about the lie. How did he go from last season in a flash forward saying they have to go back because the island wants them to go back, to now he doesn’t want to. Maybe he does still want to but just not with Ben…. maybe with Widmore? Did you notice the smirk at the end when he ran to the cops? And what could it be that made Sayid go from working with Ben to suddenly being against him?
    Have we seen Dr.Chang’s/Dharma guy’s wife before? She looks familiar.
    And after all the anticipation of Sawyer being shirtless for the first episode….. he kind of has a beer belly. Must be all that Dharma beer he drank from the van they found! But he still looks good :-)

  132. ESB says:

    After last night, i think that Ji Yeon and Aaron just might be Adam & Eve…Sun said something about how she hoped someday that Ji Yeon And Aaron would meet and it just seemed kinda foreshadow-y to me…regardless, GREAT beginning to a new season…;)

    LOST is back, and that is GOOD…;)

  133. BaileyLovesLost says:

    I totally agree, ESB!

  134. Hammer says:

    [quote comment=”308401″]After last night, i think that Ji Yeon and Aaron just might be Adam & Eve…Sun said something about how she hoped someday that Ji Yeon And Aaron would meet and it just seemed kinda foreshadow-y to me…regardless, GREAT beginning to a new season…;)

    LOST is back, and that is GOOD…;)[/quote]
    Certainly possible. I’m still riding the Des and Pen theory. I think that they end up on old Paradise island together.

  135. Miraks says:

    1. If Miles is the baby in the beginning/ Dr. Chang’s son, then how and when did he get on the island? Was he born there? How and when did he leave? Had to be before the purge.

    2. Charlotte’s nosebleeds and “skipping” memory indicate that she is in danger of loosinf her mind. Perhaps the same sickness that killed Russou’s group. Didn’t Dez also get a nosebleed on the helicopter last season?

    3. I think the other person Sun blames for Jin’s death (or presumed death) is Jack, and she is using Kate to get to him.

    4. Could Sun be the one that spooked Kate with the lawsuit/ blood test? It’s a weird coincidence that she calls Kate out of the blue at a time when Kate is on the run.

  136. Dukester says:

    Am I still the only one that saw Tom get the sharp end of the knife from Locke when Sawyer and Juliet were attacked??/

  137. PJSander says:

    [quote comment=”308397″]Could be Bailey, but I think it is more that Locke is Alpert’s constant and he is using the compass to know that Locke is someone he needs to pay attention to when he doesn’t remember Locke.[/quote]

    I can’t say for sure, but I think that the compass that Captain Eyeliner gives Locke is the same one he OFFERED five-year-old Locke, along with the comic, the knife, Book of Laws, baseball mitt and vial of ash (you know before he gets all pissy and storms off – LOL).

    The compass that Locke gave Sayid was newer I think, and I believe that was a deleted scene. Sayid told him it wasn’t quite accurate, probably because of the odd electromagnetic properties of the island.

    I need to find a screenshot of the stuff that Mrs. Hawking was working on… I thought the markings might be the places like Tunisia, and Australia – where anomalies are taking place. The markings appear to have been mostly over water, though. Perhaps those areas coincide with where the island has been or will be.

    : ) P

  138. Miraks says:

    I’ll disagree with a lot of people here that Mrs. Hawkins is Daniel’s mother. I think he would know a lot more about the island if she was. Also, I think she is much more than that. More likely one of the “originals” like Alpert. Farraday’s mom is more likely to be the Losties “Mrs. Hawkins”.

  139. TheoryNut says:

    I am sooooo happy to be LOST again! Did anyone notice the black smoke when Locke looked up at the plane again. It seemed to be Smoky… It was only on the right side of the propeller, just seemed a little off and intentional.

  140. NikkiV says:

    [quote comment=”308233″]There was also an episode where Desmond was a priest I think? Anyhow Ms. Hawkins was in a picture frame with someone in that episode…but don’t remember much about it.[/quote]

    You know that is a very good point. Considering they (Ben and Mrs. H) were in a church of some sort.

    It’s all very wonderful.

  141. Hammer says:

    Neither Kate nor Jack is the ‘other’ person Sun blames for Jin’s death. She has already told us who they are. She blames her father and Ben.

  142. Frank says:

    Excellent start to a very anticipated season.
    Though too much Hurley and not enough Desmond and Penny.
    I think Charlotte is Des/Pen’s daughter (in previewing scenes, i think we see penny in labor). I think Des/Pen end up on the island, Penny gives birth to Charlotte, and somehow, she ends up off the island.
    And one thing that Dan said about time being like a string – you can move forward/backward but you can’t change anything. Except for Desmond. Which implies that he can change things.
    Also, i think the comment about Sawyer getting the splinter in his toe (and the 4 toed statue) – something’s up with that connection.

  143. Frank says:

    Excellent start to a very anticipated season.
    Though too much Hurley and not enough Desmond and Penny.
    I think Charlotte is Des/Pen’s daughter (in previewing scenes, i think we see penny in labor). I think Des/Pen end up on the island, Penny gives birth to Charlotte, and somehow, she ends up off the island.
    And one thing that Dan said about time being like a string – you can move forward/backward but you can’t change anything. Except for Desmond. Which implies that he can change things.
    Also, i think the comment about Sawyer getting the splinter in his toe (and the 4 toed statue) – something’s up with that connection.

  144. Lostfan says:

    [quote comment=”308410″]I am sooooo happy to be LOST again! Did anyone notice the black smoke when Locke looked up at the plane again. It seemed to be Smoky… It was only on the right side of the propeller, just seemed a little off and intentional.[/quote]

    Yes, I noticed it too.

  145. Dennis says:

    [quote comment=”308319″][quote comment=”308302″]I have to disagree. They specifically say at the beginning of the episode that there is a problem at the Orchid. We even see the donkey wheel in the sonar image the worker shows Chang. The energy in the Orchid is related to time. The energy at the Swan where Des was pushing the button was electromagnetism. Kelvin explained to Des that the button has to be pushed to release the electromagnetic energy every 108 minutes so that it doesn’t become too big to contain. Two seperate stations in two seperate parts of the island and not related to each other based on anything we know at this time.

    Granted, it has been suggested that the purple haze of the Swan implosion did originally cause Des to become unstuck in time and it is possible that event also caused some of the other time weirdness on the island that is revealed in season 4. However I think it’s a bit of a reach to make any connection between the button-pushing at the Swan and the time-travel at the Orchid.[/quote]

    when Desmond gets stuck, Faraday tells him taht large amounts of electromagnetic energy is what can send a conciousness through time… Eloise the mouse was given the ability to go through time by Faraday exposing her to large amounts of EM. So it is possible that the energies in teh wheel room and the swan station are both one and the same thing, and taht unlimited electromagnetic energy causes the time shifts.

    You are right though, the swan station and the orchid are a ways apart. But I’m sure that they are very connected in some way. The doctors warning about releasing the energy at the orchid by breaching the wall, the plate wall and energy release at the swan(as a result of some “cataclysmic event”), and faraday’s presence in the mine right as they are warned not to breach the wall are too close to not be connected in some way.

    The real question here though, is in the trailer for hte next episode, charlotte seems to die of the time sickness that almost killed desmond. Yet she reawakes, her eyes looking really sickly. so that bears the question… zombies?

  146. NikkiV says:

    [quote comment=”308408″][quote comment=”308397″] I need to find a screenshot of the stuff that Mrs. Hawking was working on… I thought the markings might be the places like Tunisia, and Australia – where anomalies are taking place. The markings appear to have been mostly over water, though. Perhaps those areas coincide with where the island has been or will be.

    : ) P[/quote]

    I have a good link for you:

    http://losteastereggs.blogspot.com/2009/01/episode-5×02-ms-hawkings-station-hq.html

  147. Hammer says:

    Oh that just got me thinking. Didn’t Eloise appear dead when her concious was traveling? Maybe Locke’s conciousness is traveling while Ben is using him?

  148. PJSander says:

    Dennis and Frank,

    I don’t recognize your names, so I am guessing that you are new to this blog. Because of that, I won’t go all crazy on you, but rather ask that you please abide by the rules set out above the comment form, specifically:

    No spoilers or discussion of episode previews.

    Many of us visit this blog specifically because we DON’T want spoilers. Many of us rush to turn the TV off before previews flash across the screen. (And honestly, those previews are generally MEANT to mislead you anyway!)

    Thanks.

    : ) P

  149. PJSander says:

    [quote comment=”308419″]Oh that just got me thinking. Didn’t Eloise appear dead when her concious was traveling? Maybe Locke’s conciousness is traveling while Ben is using him?[/quote]

    Tee hee! I thought the same thing, Hammer… only about Sayid! Then I realized that his problems were drug induced. Good catch on Locke.

    : ) P

  150. sector7 says:

    [quote comment=”308369″]My thoughts:

    11. Ethan 20-30 years before shooting John Locke? Ageless again? Wouldn’t Ethan have remembered this in the future? Can anyone remember a conversation/comment that Ethan gave John in season 1 to indicate some kind of past relationship? Wouldn’t John have remembered Ethan shot him 20 years ago? If you can’t change the past – then John would have always had the memory of being shot. Unless of course, the rules don’t apply to him either.[/quote]

    How are you getting 20-30 yrs in the past? The plane was Yemi’s. Yemi left in the plane not too long before Eko got to the island. Ethan shooting Locke would have taken place somewhere around a year prior to 815 crash.

  151. katesFriend says:

    I might be wrong, but I thought Sawyer stepped on a dart that stuck in his foot, not a splinter

    I feel like we’ve seen this dart before, either someone else stepped on it or we saw who shot it….I just can’t remember

  152. Toeknee says:

    [quote comment=”308406″]Am I still the only one that saw Tom get the sharp end of the knife from Locke when Sawyer and Juliet were attacked??/[/quote]
    I didn’t think that was Tom. I’ll have to watch again.

  153. Eric says:

    Maybe Charlotte is sick because she has no constant. She’s the daughter of X. Who is not on the island now that could fit role of her parents?

  154. Dharma 34 says:

    IDK if this has ever been answered but why did dr chang in season 2 on the swan orientation film say to never use the computer for any other use? and what was the drilling accident that happened at the swan? we obviously now know what happened at the orchid and we now know why chang stressed not to put anything in the time chamber

  155. Toeknee says:

    [quote comment=”308408″]
    I can’t say for sure, but I think that the compass that Captain Eyeliner gives Locke is the same one he OFFERED five-year-old Locke, along with the comic, the knife, Book of Laws, baseball mitt and vial of ash (you know before he gets all pissy and storms off – LOL).
    [/quote]
    Quite likely – here’s a picture of the objects Alpert showed young Locke:

  156. Hammer says:

    [quote comment=”308427″]Maybe Charlotte is sick because she has no constant. She’s the daughter of X. Who is not on the island now that could fit role of her parents?[/quote]
    Lot’s of options….including about 100 purged DHARMA folks…maybe she’s a Hanso…

  157. Hammer says:

    [quote comment=”308428″]IDK if this has ever been answered but why did dr chang in season 2 on the swan orientation film say to never use the computer for any other use? and what was the drilling accident that happened at the swan? we obviously now know what happened at the orchid and we now know why chang stressed not to put anything in the time chamber[/quote]
    When Michael was in the Swan he was able to chat with who he thought was Walt. I think the idea was if you use the computer for other purposes you may miss the time frame for entering the code and therefore creating an implosion…which happened.

  158. Dharma 34 says:

    yeah that makes sense

  159. Toeknee says:

    [quote comment=”308397″]Could be Bailey, but I think it is more that Locke is Alpert’s constant and he is using the compass to know that Locke is someone he needs to pay attention to when he doesn’t remember Locke.[/quote]
    Hiya Hammer, nice to “see” you again.

    I didn’t think the Locke-Alpert exchange had anything to do with “Constants”. I think Alpert was simply giving Locke an item that would prove Locke isn’t lying when he says he time travelled, much like last season when Faraday told Desmond to find Faraday at Oxford and mention Eloise, so he’d know it wasn’t someone trying to play a prank.

  160. Hammer says:

    [quote comment=”308433″][quote comment=”308397″]Could be Bailey, but I think it is more that Locke is Alpert’s constant and he is using the compass to know that Locke is someone he needs to pay attention to when he doesn’t remember Locke.[/quote]
    Hiya Hammer, nice to “see” you again.

    I didn’t think the Locke-Alpert exchange had anything to do with “Constants”. I think Alpert was simply giving Locke an item that would prove Locke isn’t lying when he says he time travelled, much like last season when Faraday told Desmond to find Faraday at Oxford and mention Eloise, so he’d know it wasn’t someone trying to play a prank.[/quote]
    You too ToeKnee.

    I just jumped to that conclusion because after all of the mumbo with the factors Des was supposed to give Dan at Oxford (Eloise was just the qualifier), Dan looked in his notes and found out that Des is his constant. So I just assumed that the compass is the qualifier and when Alpert sees Locke, he will be Alpert’s constant.

    Jibberish.:)

  161. duke says:

    [quote comment=”308369″]My thoughts:

    1. Totally agree Miles is definitely the baby. When I first saw the sneak peek video of Chang, I thought the voice behind the camera was Miles’ not Daniel’s.
    2. Charlotte was on the island as a child – still a theory that she could be the little girl from Ben’s childhood.
    3. Minkowski’s nose bled BEFORE he died, not after. He time traveled and didn’t have a constant. Where’s Charlotte’s constant?
    4. Hurley sees dead people. So does everyone else.
    5. Had the exact same thought that the whispers were people shifting through time.
    6. At some point, will our current castaways find Danielle Ruseux and her original team from 16 years before? Will we see how Ben acquired Alex? Will we see how the team really died? Did they bleed out through their noses too?
    7. Daniel finds Des because the “rules don’t apply” to him. He has special abilities.
    8. Love the Mrs. Hawkings is Dan’s Mom.
    9. 70 hours? Why 70 hours? What’s up with that?
    10. Seriously? Frogurt? Was this the same Neil that they kept confusing with Steve in the 1st season?
    11. Ethan 20-30 years before shooting John Locke? Ageless again? Wouldn’t Ethan have remembered this in the future? Can anyone remember a conversation/comment that Ethan gave John in season 1 to indicate some kind of past relationship? Wouldn’t John have remembered Ethan shot him 20 years ago? If you can’t change the past – then John would have always had the memory of being shot. Unless of course, the rules don’t apply to him either.[/quote]
    It wasn’t ethan 20-30 years before shooting locke. We know that yemi’s plane took off when he and eko were adults therefore the small plane had not been on the island that long seeing as how eko appears to be about the same age playing a priest as he was on the island.

  162. Hammer says:

    BTW, there is an official D&C podcast out that confirms a couple of things about the episodes. It is short as they didn’t have time to answer fan questions this week but will next week.

  163. Dharma 34 says:

    Did anyone else notice that when desmonde answered the door for faraday he was wearing his dharma issued suit? to my knowledge there was only one suit and Inman wore that. Desmonde figured out that it was fake because there was a tear in Inmans suit when he went to go take desmondes boat so my question is……y did desmonde feel the need to put on the suit when he knew from experience there’s no risk? Inman at that point had to be dead or he would have answered the door instead of dez

  164. Hammer says:

    [quote comment=”308437″]Did anyone else notice that when desmonde answered the door for faraday he was wearing his dharma issued suit? to my knowledge there was only one suit and Inman wore that. Desmonde figured out that it was fake because there was a tear in Inmans suit when he went to go take desmondes boat so my question is……y did desmonde feel the need to put on the suit when he knew from experience there’s no risk? Inman at that point had to be dead or he would have answered the door instead of dez[/quote]
    I see your point, but it’s possible that it was before Inman cracked his head. Inman could have been in disposed or ordered Des to take the risk of opening the door.

  165. Miraks says:

    [quote comment=”308412″]Neither Kate nor Jack is the ‘other’ person Sun blames for Jin’s death. She has already told us who they are. She blames her father and Ben.[/quote]

    Ok, I knew she blamed her father, but I missed where she blamed Ben. I still find it a strange coincidence that Sun calls Kate out of the blue, just as Kate goes on the run. It seems like they have not seen each other in years at this point.

  166. Toeknee says:

    [quote comment=”308382″]
    My thoughts are that the fire torches were the ancient civilization that built the four toed statue and that the people who grabbed Sawyer and Juliet were part of Rousseau’s team.

    : ) P[/quote]
    I don’t think those guys were part of Rousseau’s team. I thought her team succumbed to the “sickness” within a few weeks after they arrived, so I don’t think they lived long enough to consider it “our island”.

    I think the guys with guns and the burning-arrow-shooters are all the same group of people. And I think that those scenes pre-dates Dharma’s arrival on the island (say, in the ’60’s). My guess is that they are just another in a long line of invaders of the island who eventually are defeated by the Others.

  167. sector7 says:

    [quote comment=”308435″][quote comment=”308369″]My thoughts:

    11. Ethan 20-30 years before shooting John Locke? Ageless again? Wouldn’t Ethan have remembered this in the future? Can anyone remember a conversation/comment that Ethan gave John in season 1 to indicate some kind of past relationship? Wouldn’t John have remembered Ethan shot him 20 years ago? If you can’t change the past – then John would have always had the memory of being shot. Unless of course, the rules don’t apply to him either.[/quote]
    It wasn’t ethan 20-30 years before shooting locke. We know that yemi’s plane took off when he and eko were adults therefore the small plane had not been on the island that long seeing as how eko appears to be about the same age playing a priest as he was on the island.[/quote]

    duke, I covered that in comment 152. Man I feel like Rodney Dangerfield around here sometimes.

  168. Hammer says:

    The glitch I caught was Ben blowing out the match he was using to light a candle…twice. LOL.

  169. Hammer says:

    [quote comment=”308440″][quote comment=”308412″]Neither Kate nor Jack is the ‘other’ person Sun blames for Jin’s death. She has already told us who they are. She blames her father and Ben.[/quote]

    Ok, I knew she blamed her father, but I missed where she blamed Ben. I still find it a strange coincidence that Sun calls Kate out of the blue, just as Kate goes on the run. It seems like they have not seen each other in years at this point.[/quote]
    ++++++++++
    Correct me if I’m wrong, but I thought the conv. with Widmore was when she clarified that she and Widmore both wanted Ben dead. I used the progression that she told her father he is one of two, then she contacted Widmore to tell him they have a common interest, then told him she wanted Ben dead that he must be the other one.

  170. Jet Black says:

    I don’t understand why Locke has to die to bring everyone back to the Island

    Just like I don’t understand why when people die on the island they can talk to people back in civilization (e.g., Charlia, Ana Lucia, etc)

    Anyone have any ideas?

  171. Dennis says:

    The guys with the guns looked to me a lot like american WWII soldiers in the south pacific. They were wearing army boots, and their uniforms looked the part. The rifle they had was an old M1, which was standard for WWII soldiers, and the machete they used was common equip for those fighting in the islands of hte pacific theatre. Which would explain their paranoia towards the group of people that just popped out of nowhere during their patrol, and the claim that it was “their island(in occupation)”, as the japanese often used ruthless and very tricky tactics(playing dead, popping out of ground holes and scary thingsl ike that).

  172. Hammer says:

    [quote comment=”308445″]I don’t understand why Locke has to die to bring everyone back to the Island

    Just like I don’t understand why when people die on the island they can talk to people back in civilization (e.g., Charlia, Ana Lucia, etc)

    Anyone have any ideas?[/quote]
    Not sure on why Locke had to die….but I do have an on going whisper theory for the dead folks. :)

  173. duke says:

    [quote comment=”308441″][quote comment=”308435″][quote comment=”308369″]My thoughts:

    11. Ethan 20-30 years before shooting John Locke? Ageless again? Wouldn’t Ethan have remembered this in the future? Can anyone remember a conversation/comment that Ethan gave John in season 1 to indicate some kind of past relationship? Wouldn’t John have remembered Ethan shot him 20 years ago? If you can’t change the past – then John would have always had the memory of being shot. Unless of course, the rules don’t apply to him either.[/quote]
    It wasn’t ethan 20-30 years before shooting locke. We know that yemi’s plane took off when he and eko were adults therefore the small plane had not been on the island that long seeing as how eko appears to be about the same age playing a priest as he was on the island.[/quote]

    duke, I covered that in comment 152. Man I feel like Rodney Dangerfield around here sometimes.[/quote]
    Sorry dude, just did not read far enough. If you remember the episode where alpert visited a young locke he asks him to pick the items that are already his. Locke picks the compass as one so now we see that the compass was his beacause alpert gave it to him in the Future. that is part of the significance of the alpert giving him the compass last night. The only question that remains is what are the other items locke should have picked? we know the compass and the little bottle of dirt or whatever.

  174. Hammer says:

    [quote comment=”308446″]The guys with the guns looked to me a lot like american WWII soldiers in the south pacific. They were wearing army boots, and their uniforms looked the part. The rifle they had was an old M1, which was standard for WWII soldiers, and the machete they used was common equip for those fighting in the islands of hte pacific theatre. Which would explain their paranoia towards the group of people that just popped out of nowhere during their patrol, and the claim that it was “their island(in occupation)”, as the japanese often used ruthless and very tricky tactics(playing dead, popping out of ground holes and scary thingsl ike that).[/quote]
    Well, we didn’t see their ‘morooned’ vehicle, unless the sub was theirs. Anyone know anything about the sub we’ve seen?

  175. sector7 says:

    [quote comment=”308448″][quote comment=”308441″][quote comment=”308435″][quote comment=”308369″]My thoughts:

    Sorry dude, just did not read far enough. If you remember the episode where alpert visited a young locke he asks him to pick the items that are already his. Locke picks the compass as one so now we see that the compass was his beacause alpert gave it to him in the Future. that is part of the significance of the alpert giving him the compass last night. The only question that remains is what are the other items locke should have picked? we know the compass and the little bottle of dirt or whatever.[/quote]
    ___________________________________
    No problem. I think when Alpert visited young John he was looking for time traveling John.

  176. Toeknee says:

    [quote comment=”308447″][quote comment=”308445″]I don’t understand why Locke has to die to bring everyone back to the Island

    Just like I don’t understand why when people die on the island they can talk to people back in civilization (e.g., Charlia, Ana Lucia, etc)

    Anyone have any ideas?[/quote]
    Not sure on why Locke had to die….but I do have an on going whisper theory for the dead folks. :)[/quote]
    ____________________________________
    And I’m still holding onto the possibility that Hurley is imagining seeing Charlie and Ana Lucia, just like he imagined his friend Dave. As far as I know, noone else has seen a dead person. There are other apparitions that are Whisper-related, like Shannon seeing Walt, Michael and Jack seeing Christian Shephard. But I think those apparitions are not the same phenomenon as Hurley’s visions of dead people.

  177. Tasha says:

    [quote comment=”308437″]Did anyone else notice that when desmonde answered the door for faraday he was wearing his dharma issued suit? to my knowledge there was only one suit and Inman wore that. Desmonde figured out that it was fake because there was a tear in Inmans suit when he went to go take desmondes boat so my question is……y did desmonde feel the need to put on the suit when he knew from experience there’s no risk? Inman at that point had to be dead or he would have answered the door instead of dez[/quote]

    I think maybe that is the only clothes he had. I dont think there was only one.

  178. Hammer says:

    [quote comment=”308451″][quote comment=”308447″][quote comment=”308445″]I don’t understand why Locke has to die to bring everyone back to the Island

    Just like I don’t understand why when people die on the island they can talk to people back in civilization (e.g., Charlia, Ana Lucia, etc)

    Anyone have any ideas?[/quote]
    Not sure on why Locke had to die….but I do have an on going whisper theory for the dead folks. :)[/quote]
    ____________________________________
    And I’m still holding onto the possibility that Hurley is imagining seeing Charlie and Ana Lucia, just like he imagined his friend Dave. As far as I know, noone else has seen a dead person. There are other apparitions that are Whisper-related, like Shannon seeing Walt, Michael and Jack seeing Christian Shephard. But I think those apparitions are not the same phenomenon as Hurley’s visions of dead people.[/quote]

    Nah, he was able to see Jacob’s cabin too. He’s not imagining the WHISPERERS. ;)

  179. Dennis says:

    Oy, they’re European soldiers(i didn’t pick up on the accent the first time around), and Jones(the young one) has a private insignia on his right arm. So they’re def old military.

  180. Dennis says:

    Oy, they’re European soldiers(i didn’t pick up on the accent the first time around), and Jones(the young one) has a private insignia on his left arm that you can see when he first appears holding the rifle. So they’re def old military.

  181. Hammer says:

    [quote comment=”308449″][quote comment=”308446″]The guys with the guns looked to me a lot like american WWII soldiers in the south pacific. They were wearing army boots, and their uniforms looked the part. The rifle they had was an old M1, which was standard for WWII soldiers, and the machete they used was common equip for those fighting in the islands of hte pacific theatre. Which would explain their paranoia towards the group of people that just popped out of nowhere during their patrol, and the claim that it was “their island(in occupation)”, as the japanese often used ruthless and very tricky tactics(playing dead, popping out of ground holes and scary thingsl ike that).[/quote]
    Well, we didn’t see their ‘morooned’ vehicle, unless the sub was theirs. Anyone know anything about the sub we’ve seen?[/quote]
    +++++++++
    Found it myself. The sub was from DHARMA. So I wonder how they arrived on the island?

  182. Hurley's Dad says:

    Hi everybody…it’s been a while! :)

    Questions for pondering, always looking for answers and/or opposition to any theories I pose.

    1 – Has Mrs. Hawking been in charge the whole time and not Ben?
    2 – Where is Walt and why does he not have to go back?
    3 – Is the runway they were building in S3 going to land an Aljira plane carrying the losties back to the island?
    4 – 99% sure Mrs. Hawking is Faraday’s mum (the pic on the monk’s desk has Oxford in the background), but I’ll throw another name out there. Isabel the sherrif.

  183. Bobola says:

    Hurley sure has been turning into one prize asshole.
    He’s so stupid he doesn’t see a need to lie?
    And his gullible mother acts like she believes a story no sane person would swallow; so are they both nuts?
    Hurley runs into the arms of the cops? He sees that as his ONLY alternative? He’d rather get his fat ass locked up and enjoy all that great Prison food and maybe a random beat down by convicts trying to get at his Lottery winnings? What a dolt. There WAS a third alternative Dumbo; run away from both the Cops and Ben. Why the hell didn’t he just get in the car with Sayid to help his Dad? He’s a dumb lazy fuck.
    Now Ben’s going to have to break his ass out of jail…maybe after he’s gotten reamed a few times (shades of Deliverance).

    So, I am lukewarm on this restart; more puzzles and not many answers. But glad that Frogurt got the arrow to the chest he deserved. But why is Rose going all bitchy?
    Ben may be a hero after all…but eager to know why Sayid is against him now. Sayid has screwed up some in the past so now I can’t trust him anymore.
    Sawyer slapping Dan was a cheap shot; he’s got some bad karma building.

    John Locke is still my fav; shows up in the nick of time.
    Those are some bass ass baddies who wanted to cut off a hand just to show they mean business!
    Now that Patchy and that mean mercenary who got his Orchid are gone we need more scary guys or gals to keep it interesting. Or just give us more Widmore…he’s pretty creepy. Love the baddies!

    I’m starting to distrust Sun; fun scene with her and Widmore…with his regal attitude about her having the gall to approach him in public…ha! What an asshole.
    But now she is siding with him? The guy who is responsible for blowing up her husband?
    Well, I still think Sun’s hubby survived the blast; he must have jumped off at the last second…and he comes from a family of fishermen, neh? So, he knows how to survive in the water I bet.

  184. sector7 says:

    Bobola is in the hizzy y’all!

  185. SDlost says:

    Wow what a great episode! Took me awhile to read through all of the comments. Still have some questions:

    1. Dr.Chang seemed like a really mean guy in general. His attitude towards the people filming the orientation videos was really rude.
    2. It seemed like Dr.Chang had just gotten to the island with the Dharma people because they were still working on the videos and getting the stations ready. Maybe Miles was born off of the island before they moved there?
    3. What was the deal with Sawyer wanting to take peoples shirts? I understand that he might have felt uncomfertable but he never seemed to care what people thought of him before.
    4. When ben turned the giant wheel in the orchid station it seemed like the tunnel had already been dug out for him. I find it hard to believe that the explosion carved out that perfect tunnel with the frozen piece at the end. So that means that people have definitely moved the island since the dharma people found the wheel.
    5. It was fairly easy to tell that Frogurt was a redshirt.

  186. geribnj says:

    [quote comment=”308368″]Tidbit:

    We need a screencap of the beer that Frank was carrying. I saw a skull and cross bones but couldn’t read the rest of the label.[/quote]
    look here for the beer

    http://www.docarzt.com/lost/lost-easter-eggs/what-was-that-thing-on-lost-501-the-lie-easter-eggs/

  187. SDlost says:

    [quote comment=”308454″][quote comment=”308451″][quote comment=”308447″][quote comment=”308445″]I don’t understand why Locke has to die to bring everyone back to the Island

    Just like I don’t understand why when people die on the island they can talk to people back in civilization (e.g., Charlia, Ana Lucia, etc)

    Anyone have any ideas?[/quote]
    Not sure on why Locke had to die….but I do have an on going whisper theory for the dead folks. :)[/quote]
    ____________________________________
    And I’m still holding onto the possibility that Hurley is imagining seeing Charlie and Ana Lucia, just like he imagined his friend Dave. As far as I know, noone else has seen a dead person. There are other apparitions that are Whisper-related, like Shannon seeing Walt, Michael and Jack seeing Christian Shephard. But I think those apparitions are not the same phenomenon as Hurley’s visions of dead people.[/quote]

    Nah, he was able to see Jacob’s cabin too. He’s not imagining the WHISPERERS. ;)[/quote]

    ____________________________________________
    When Hurley saw charlie outside at the institution his friend pointed charlie out. So it wasn’t just Hurley seeing him…

  188. K.C. says:

    Re: “Ms Hawking”, the white haired lady at the end with ben. I recall seeing her in season 3 after jack/kate/sawyer were taken by the others. She could read the oriental symbols of jacks tatoos. when jack asked ben about her he said something to the effect that she was “the sargeant” , implying she was higher in the hierarchy than ben.

  189. Hammer says:

    [quote comment=”308464″][quote comment=”308368″]Tidbit:

    We need a screencap of the beer that Frank was carrying. I saw a skull and cross bones but couldn’t read the rest of the label.[/quote]
    look here for the beer

    http://www.docarzt.com/lost/lost-easter-eggs/what-was-that-thing-on-lost-501-the-lie-easter-eggs/%5B/quote%5D

    +++++++++
    Thanks.

  190. Hurley's Dad says:

    In Season 1, Boone ends up in the drug plane because Locke’s legs suddenly “go out on him”, when they got near the plane. Anybody else think it has something to do with Ethan shooting him there. Up until now, we haven’t had a logical explanation for that.

  191. Hurley's Dad says:

    [quote comment=”308467″]Re: “Ms Hawking”, the white haired lady at the end with ben. I recall seeing her in season 3 after jack/kate/sawyer were taken by the others. She could read the oriental symbols of jacks tatoos. when jack asked ben about her he said something to the effect that she was “the sargeant” , implying she was higher in the hierarchy than ben.[/quote]
    That was Isabel the Sherrif.

    http://lostpedia.wikia.com/wiki/Isabel

  192. NikkiV says:

    Not that it is necessary, but has anyone translated the “Sun’s passport” screen shot?

    Again, it may not be important, but why would they take a couple of extra seconds on it if it isn’t important?

    Just curious..

  193. Skweez says:

    Hello everyone…

    Thoughts/obs…

    – So sick of Hurley!
    – Dez and Penny have been sailing for the last 3 years, but when Dan tells him about going to Oxford on the island, it’s 3 years in the past, why did he “just” get the “memory”
    – Is Ms. Hawkins mother nature!

  194. how jewlikethemapples? says:

    what if Charlotte is Daniels mom? can’t remember her mums name, Daniel cares deeply about her (not necessarily in a sexual way).

  195. How come Cindy and the other tailies didn’t stay in the same time with Locke and everyone else?
    The Island knows who’s in each group? and if that’s the case why did it leave Locke?
    I am so confused!! Am I missing something

  196. Hammer says:

    [quote comment=”308486″]Hello everyone…

    – Dez and Penny have been sailing for the last 3 years, but when Dan tells him about going to Oxford on the island, it’s 3 years in the past, why did he “just” get the “memory”
    ++++++++
    I think we are supposed to believe that the experiences that the castaways are having have THEM ONLY suspended in time. It doesn’t elapse for 3 years. That’s the disconnect, the castaways started jumping time immediately, but it has taken 3 years time off island for Ben to get things to this point.

  197. michael says:

    I’ve tried to read all of these but it keeps steering me away from what I was originally thinking about.

    As the time changes on the island I think it changes locations as well. It looked like the old lady in the church was trying to pin point where the island would be at a specific time. If theres is a screen shot of it, It looked like there were 6 or 7 spots it could be at different times.

    If someone already brought this up, sorry .

  198. PJSander says:

    [quote comment=”308475″]In Season 1, Boone ends up in the drug plane because Locke’s legs suddenly “go out on him”, when they got near the plane. Anybody else think it has something to do with Ethan shooting him there. Up until now, we haven’t had a logical explanation for that.[/quote]

    Good catch!

    : ) P

  199. LINS says:

    watched it again and had some more thoughts…

    – if miles is candle’s son, and he was born on the island, how would that really be possible since pregnant women die on the island? obviously, there are alternative explanations like the arrived late in the pregnancy ala claire or they arrived after he was born…but what if he really was conceived and born on the island…does that make him “special”?

    – funny how the recordin the beginning was skipping just like dan used that analogy to describe time

    – why is candle wearing the dharma coat with the swan symbol if he’s in the arrow? also interesting that he was talking about defensive strategies against hostiles…

    – maybe the island was moved when/right before rousseau’s team ended up on the island, that’s how the boat got there and crashed and then they all got “sick”

  200. Toeknee says:

    [quote comment=”308465″][quote comment=”308454″][quote comment=”308451″][quote comment=”308447″][quote comment=”308445″]I don’t understand why Locke has to die to bring everyone back to the Island

    Just like I don’t understand why when people die on the island they can talk to people back in civilization (e.g., Charlia, Ana Lucia, etc)

    Anyone have any ideas?[/quote]
    Not sure on why Locke had to die….but I do have an on going whisper theory for the dead folks. :)[/quote]
    ____________________________________
    And I’m still holding onto the possibility that Hurley is imagining seeing Charlie and Ana Lucia, just like he imagined his friend Dave. As far as I know, noone else has seen a dead person. There are other apparitions that are Whisper-related, like Shannon seeing Walt, Michael and Jack seeing Christian Shephard. But I think those apparitions are not the same phenomenon as Hurley’s visions of dead people.[/quote]

    Nah, he was able to see Jacob’s cabin too. He’s not imagining the WHISPERERS. ;)[/quote]

    ____________________________________________
    When Hurley saw charlie outside at the institution his friend pointed charlie out. So it wasn’t just Hurley seeing him…[/quote]
    _______________________

    Regarding Hammer’s comment about Hurley seeing the cabin – I didn’t mean he doesn’t have the ability to see any Whisper-related aparitions. I think everyone can see them. I’m saying Charlie’s and Ana Lucia’s appearances to him were not Whisper-related, they were figments of his imagination.

    Regarding the other patient telling Hurley someone was watching him, my take on this has always been that this guy is crazy too, so who knows exactly what he was referring to. He could have been referring to some other innocent bystander, he could have been imagining things. But his statement to Hurley prompted Hurley’s imagination to create the vision of Charlie.

    I’m not 100% on this theory, and I know Hammer and others here disagreed with me whenever I mentioned this in last season’s discussions. But I’m also not 100% that Charlie and A.L. were Whisper/Island created apparitions.

  201. PJSander says:

    [quote comment=”308465″]
    When Hurley saw charlie outside at the institution his friend pointed charlie out. So it wasn’t just Hurley seeing him…[/quote]

    Well I still resolutely maintain that Charlie did not die. I cannot explain how he ended up in southern California, but there is a scientific explanation for how he did NOT die in the Looking Glass Hatch. Many veterans of this blog know the story, so for their sakes I will not rehash.

    But whether he was a whisperer who could be seen by the other patient at Santa Rosa, or alive, or otherwise, I do believe that Ana-Lucia is a whisperer. The difference between Hurley and everyone else is that Hurley is learning to SEE them as well as hear them.

    “Libby says hi.” Still chuckling over that one.

    : ) P

  202. michael says:

    [quote comment=”308495″][quote comment=”308486″]Hello everyone…

    – Dez and Penny have been sailing for the last 3 years, but when Dan tells him about going to Oxford on the island, it’s 3 years in the past, why did he “just” get the “memory”
    ++++++++
    I think we are supposed to believe that the experiences that the castaways are having have THEM ONLY suspended in time. It doesn’t elapse for 3 years. That’s the disconnect, the castaways started jumping time immediately, but it has taken 3 years time off island for Ben to get things to this point.[/quote]

    That might just have to do with the writing of the show so everything flows or…

    Where Desmond is 3years in the future is the present. There fore nothing before that time can be change. And that’s why he doesn’t get this memory until this time. If he had it would have been in the past, and you can’t change the past. Does that make since. Sounds like theres some logic missing, But I think they get away with that by labeling Desmond as special.

  203. annemoonstar says:

    I think Sun is setting Whitmore up. Wouldn’t she think that he was to blame for Jin’s death since she believes it was his boat, his people on the island trying to kill them, and therefore probably his explosives. She wouldn’t know that Ben let the scary guy with the bomb attached die. But the best way to get Whitmore would be to have him believe she wants to help him get Ben. Just a thought…

  204. PJSander says:

    [quote comment=”308502″]- if miles is candle’s son, and he was born on the island, how would that really be possible since pregnant women die on the island? obviously, there are alternative explanations like the arrived late in the pregnancy ala claire or they arrived after he was born…but what if he really was conceived and born on the island…does that make him “special”?[/quote]

    It may well be that conception and birth on the island were fine before the first “purple sky event.” Perhaps that drilling that we saw was what first set the issues into motion. Maybe that baby, Miles or not, was the last baby conceived on the island.

    : ) P

  205. Toeknee says:

    [quote comment=”308505″][quote comment=”308465″]
    When Hurley saw charlie outside at the institution his friend pointed charlie out. So it wasn’t just Hurley seeing him…[/quote]
    Well I still resolutely maintain that Charlie did not die….. Many veterans of this blog know the story, so for their sakes I will not rehash.
    [/quote]
    Thank you for not rehashing PJ. :)

  206. wallyp says:

    I wasn’t going to add anything this week, because that donkey wheel in my head has just started to spin, and has not quite unleashed its unlimited powers just yet but I wanted to comment on the “70 hours left…” thing.

    Faraday explains the moving time as a skipping record, but it has always seemed by clues to be more like a loop of tape, with a specific start and end point. When the loop ends, it starts again. This specific loop, is something like, three years, and seventy hours… the amount of time that they have to all get back in the loop, before it starts over, and then there is nothing they can do about it.

    like I said, I’m just warming up….

  207. Hammer says:

    [quote comment=”308502″]- if miles is candle’s son, and he was born on the island, how would that really be possible since pregnant women die on the island? obviously, there are alternative explanations like the arrived late in the pregnancy ala claire or they arrived after he was born…but what if he really was conceived and born on the island…does that make him “special”?[/quote]
    I believe the preg. thing wasn’t always an issue. There are orginal inhabitants. I think it was “the incident” that causes healing powers that also caused the preg. issue.

  208. Toeknee says:

    At the very beginning of the show, when they showed the Asian woman in bed, I thought it was Sun many years in the future. And when they only showed the back of husband’s head at first, I thought it might have been Jack. I think they cast that particular actress and filmed that scene that way purposely, to throw us off.

    Also, I got a big laugh out of Sawyer calling Charlotte “Ginger”, and calling Faraday “Dilbert”.

  209. Hammer says:

    [quote comment=”308503″][quote comment=”308465″][quote comment=”308454″][quote comment=”308451″][quote comment=”308447″][quote comment=”308445″]I don’t understand why Locke has to die to bring everyone back to the Island

    Just like I don’t understand why when people die on the island they can talk to people back in civilization (e.g., Charlia, Ana Lucia, etc)

    Anyone have any ideas?[/quote]
    Not sure on why Locke had to die….but I do have an on going whisper theory for the dead folks. :)[/quote]
    ____________________________________
    And I’m still holding onto the possibility that Hurley is imagining seeing Charlie and Ana Lucia, just like he imagined his friend Dave. As far as I know, noone else has seen a dead person. There are other apparitions that are Whisper-related, like Shannon seeing Walt, Michael and Jack seeing Christian Shephard. But I think those apparitions are not the same phenomenon as Hurley’s visions of dead people.[/quote]

    Nah, he was able to see Jacob’s cabin too. He’s not imagining the WHISPERERS. ;)[/quote]

    ____________________________________________
    When Hurley saw charlie outside at the institution his friend pointed charlie out. So it wasn’t just Hurley seeing him…[/quote]
    _______________________

    Regarding Hammer’s comment about Hurley seeing the cabin – I didn’t mean he doesn’t have the ability to see any Whisper-related aparitions. I think everyone can see them. I’m saying Charlie’s and Ana Lucia’s appearances to him were not Whisper-related, they were figments of his imagination.

    Regarding the other patient telling Hurley someone was watching him, my take on this has always been that this guy is crazy too, so who knows exactly what he was referring to. He could have been referring to some other innocent bystander, he could have been imagining things. But his statement to Hurley prompted Hurley’s imagination to create the vision of Charlie.

    I’m not 100% on this theory, and I know Hammer and others here disagreed with me whenever I mentioned this in last season’s discussions. But I’m also not 100% that Charlie and A.L. were Whisper/Island created apparitions.[/quote]
    I remember last seasons debates Toeknee, we are still in the ‘agree to disagree’ mode…right?

  210. Toeknee says:

    [quote comment=”308517″]
    I remember last seasons debates Toeknee, we are still in the ‘agree to disagree’ mode…right?[/quote]
    Of course! I couldn’t come to this or any site if I couldn’t handle all the theories that are opposed to mine…..

  211. Hammer says:

    [quote comment=”308518″][quote comment=”308517″]
    I remember last seasons debates Toeknee, we are still in the ‘agree to disagree’ mode…right?[/quote]
    Of course! I couldn’t come to this or any site if I couldn’t handle all the theories that are opposed to mine…..[/quote]
    ++++++++++++
    Cool ’cause we both need to be around when we find out!!

  212. MCap says:

    [quote comment=”308287″]Connections? Nose-bleed – we saw Charlotte start to flow… only other nose bleed I can remember is the miner guy on the loor of the cavern where they were digging the Orchid. He was too close to the “power source” – maybe Charlotte is too close too, now that the power to continually jump in time has been unleashed.[/quote]

    The other nosebleeds I’ve seen were when ben wiped out the dharma people. That gas he used made them all hemmorage or something because they all got nosebleeds

  213. Dennis says:

    [quote comment=”308506″][quote comment=”308495″][quote comment=”308486″]Hello everyone…

    – Dez and Penny have been sailing for the last 3 years, but when Dan tells him about going to Oxford on the island, it’s 3 years in the past, why did he “just” get the “memory”
    ++++++++
    I think we are supposed to believe that the experiences that the castaways are having have THEM ONLY suspended in time. It doesn’t elapse for 3 years. That’s the disconnect, the castaways started jumping time immediately, but it has taken 3 years time off island for Ben to get things to this point.[/quote]

    That might just have to do with the writing of the show so everything flows or…

    Where Desmond is 3years in the future is the present. There fore nothing before that time can be change. And that’s why he doesn’t get this memory until this time. If he had it would have been in the past, and you can’t change the past. Does that make since. Sounds like theres some logic missing, But I think they get away with that by labeling Desmond as special.[/quote]

    This reminded me of, I think it was Back to the Future III, where the idea is brought up that a person’s future could lie in the past. If you went back in time, sure you’d be in the past, but at the same time you’re moving forward in your own timeline. So assuming that time is already written(we’ll call it fate), at some point in time, faraday goes to the past and connects with desmond. Therefore in his future he goes to the past.

    The island, being the only place where one has the ability to do this is still a part of the universe, and connected to the timeline of the people off the island. So if faraday creates an event(connecting with desmond) on his timeline, it would only change and the memory would arrive in desmonds head at the point in time of which faraday created it.

    God this is confusing. I hope someone kinda understands what I’m saying.

    This is really hard to explain without drawing a picture, i hope someone gets what I’m trying to say and can explain it better.

  214. Paul says:

    Might be pointing out something obvious to everyone else already but just watching the new episode(s)… The island isn’t traveling through time, the survivors are. When Locke time travels, no one around him, Ethan or Richard, even when Richard was in the same time period with Locke, before the wheel turned…
    So to me it seems like the survivors are time traveling whereas the island is just traveling through space, hidden possibly by the whole electro-magnetic spectacle.
    And… is it possible that Locke heals on the island and Richard simply doesn’t age. Peter Pan syndrome possibly. Just a thought, time traveling in any show/movie is pretty tricky to keep straight all the possibilities.

  215. LINS says:

    other things i noticed…miles was talking about widmore to charlotte and mentioned that it took him 20 years to find the island “last time”…seems interesting, i don’t think he was talking about this most recent time that widmore found the island and sent in the mercs to kill everyone

    when alpert was talking to locke while he patched up his leg, he sounded a lot like ben talking to locke…sarcasm and that air of “i know more than you and you have no idea what you’re doing”

    i can’t remember if anyone else has mentioned what sayid told hurley about doing the opposite of what ben says to do, what happened to sayid to make him think that way, have we already seen it and i missed something?

    funny that hurley’s dad was watching expose…wasn’t that the show nikki was on?

  216. michael says:

    .[/quote]
    God this is confusing. I hope someone kinda understands what I’m saying.

    This is really hard to explain without drawing a picture, i hope someone gets what I’m trying to say and can explain it better.[/quote]

    A picture would really help

  217. Hurley's Dad says:

    [quote comment=”308533″]…what happened to sayid to make him think that way, have we already seen it and i missed something?
    [/quote]
    I was thinking about that too. Something tells we’ll find out Ben had Nadia killed so he could recruit Sayid.

  218. Lynn says:

    Who was Jill (in the butcher shop)? She looked like Ben’s twin sister.

  219. Amatha says:

    Just when i thought i had figured out the 2 breath taking hours of lost – i start reading this website and i’m lost all over again. AND I LOVE IT!!!!

  220. michael says:

    I think Desmond, after he find faridays mother, will have to “timetravel” agin. But this time with a mission. Save the Island!

  221. Dennis says:

    I guess what i was trying to say is that if you found a time machine and could teleport anywhere on a timeline, past or future. Let’s say you choose to go back to 1995, and you decide not to return to your original time period(2009) until 1996. Would you consider yourself to be living in the past? Past, present and future are all relative to where you are.

    If you are living in 1995, tomorrow, even if tomorrow for you is in 1995, would still be the next day, and that would technically be the future. If you live for a year in 1995-1996 and return to 2009, you’d still be a year older. The time you spent in the ‘past’ was still a part of your life. That year didn’t disappear, you can’t say it never happened.

    I think that’s the difference here between time and fate/destiny. Bend, break, move through time all you want, but fate is and will always be a straight line, and time is just a part of that. Fate is already written, and maybe faraday’s fate is to go back in time to create events that affect the future.

    Eh. Still confusing. I’m working on it.

  222. Vaughn K says:

    this isnt really that important but Juliet told sawyer that whatever they had with them when they moved would stay with them when he asked why the boat was there…i think it will be pretty funny if they move again and sawyer isnt going to have a shirt anymore cause when he moved he didnt have one on and they have not moved since he put it on

  223. Hurley's Dad says:

    [quote comment=”308559″]this isnt really that important but Juliet told sawyer that whatever they had with them when they moved would stay with them when he asked why the boat was there…i think it will be pretty funny if they move again and sawyer isnt going to have a shirt anymore cause when he moved he didnt have one on and they have not moved since he put it on[/quote]
    My only problem with this logic (the show’s not yours) is why is the boat considered “with them when they moved” and the kitchenette isn’t?

  224. michael says:

    [quote comment=”308560″][quote comment=”308559″]this isnt really that important but Juliet told sawyer that whatever they had with them when they moved would stay with them when he asked why the boat was there…i think it will be pretty funny if they move again and sawyer isnt going to have a shirt anymore cause when he moved he didnt have one on and they have not moved since he put it on[/quote]
    My only problem with this logic (the show’s not yours) is why is the boat considered “with them when they moved” and the kitchenette isn’t?[/quote]

    The kitchen and stuff was all provided by the island or the plane crash. The boat was from the freighter.

  225. Vaughn K says:

    that is a good point but maybe its because they were touching the raft when they moved cause they were sitting in it obviously…maybe anything that they are touching goes with them? i dont know

  226. Vaughn K says:

    but why would stuff from the freighter go with them and not anything from the plane crash? the plane is not part of the island either it came long after the island started

  227. michael says:

    [quote comment=”308565″]but why would stuff from the freighter go with them and not anything from the plane crash? the plane is not part of the island either it came long after the island started[/quote]

    Good poin. I would agree that anything they are touching, that is not a person would be transfered with then.

  228. Dawn says:

    I thought that when Ben met the older womem he called her Bea Locke did i misunderstand???
    But it would make sense if it was Faradays mom

  229. michael says:

    SO lock killing those soldiers might have caused a riff in time?

  230. Kracken says:

    I’m a bit confused about one point everyone keeps bringing up that Ms. Hawking is Faraday’s mom…

    Faraday tells Des to go to Oxford to see his mother.
    Hurley is at home, and thus not Oxford. Ben is with Hurley.
    Then Ben is with Ms. Hawking, therefore, Ms. Hawking and Ben are not at Oxford, thus Ms. Hawking is not Faraday’s mother. Am I missing something here?

  231. Newbie says:

    [quote comment=”308406″]Am I still the only one that saw Tom get the sharp end of the knife from Locke when Sawyer and Juliet were attacked??/[/quote]
    I thought I saw that too!

  232. Newbie says:

    Could Charlotte’s constant be Ben? Could she be the little girl that Ben was friends with on the Island?

  233. Dawn says:

    Why was Faraday in the Orchid with the Dr.

  234. Hammer says:

    [quote comment=”308572″]I’m a bit confused about one point everyone keeps bringing up that Ms. Hawking is Faraday’s mom…

    Faraday tells Des to go to Oxford to see his mother.
    Hurley is at home, and thus not Oxford. Ben is with Hurley.
    Then Ben is with Ms. Hawking, therefore, Ms. Hawking and Ben are not at Oxford, thus Ms. Hawking is not Faraday’s mother. Am I missing something here?[/quote]
    I follow except location does not make maternity. He could be wrong about where she is located three years into the future. Further, it seem implied that he needs his mother’s help and she’s there doing his calculations, etc. It’s more of leap to say she’s not his mother than she is.

  235. Hammer says:

    [quote comment=”308576″]Why was Faraday in the Orchid with the Dr.[/quote]
    My guess, time traveling to get island info.

  236. Rita says:

    Whew! Got through all the comments! Some excellent thinking out there everyone. Some thoughts of my own:

    To PJ comment 124: I don’t think the soldiers could be from Rousseau’s group because they didn’t seem to be French, and they weren’t scientists.

    To Hammer comment 131 and PJ comment 139: I believe the compass that Alpert gave John is the same one he showed young John. The question then is what would John having it at the next time travel prove to Richard, who says “at the next time travel I won’t recognize you, so show me this” (I paraphrase)

    To Baily Loves Lost comment 133: Is it possible that the Asian woman at the beginning is Jin’s prostitute mother, and the baby is therefore JIN? I thought she looked familiar too.

    To ToeKnee comment 178: You stated that no one else has seen dead people off island, besides Hurley. Does Kate seeing Claire count? Well, we don’t really know yet that she is dead, but I’m thinking she is.

    To SDlost comment 187: I said the same thing about Forgurt when we first saw him last night – long before they killed him, that he was a redshirt for sure!

    To Skweez comment 195: I believe that the reason Des “just remembered” the event/meeting with Dan was that it really did “just happen” in a sense. When Des consciousness traveled earlier, the entry in Dan’s book about Des being his constant wasn’t there until AFTER Des had successfully met up with Dan in the past, and BECAME his constant. In the same way, Des wouldn’t have “remembered” meeting Dan and being told to go to Oxford any sooner, because it really hadn’t “happened” yet. Clear as mud, I know.

    Thanks for listening everyone!

  237. mcotter says:

    can anyone remember if ethan recognized john locke in series one if he does then they knew what they were doin all along

  238. Stymie says:

    When Boone died, Locke couldn’t move his legs. At the time, I never understood why. But in this episode, Locke gets shot in the leg at the same spot and can’t walk. No idea if we can draw any conclusion from this, as too much thinking about time travel makes me go crossed eyed.

  239. agentLOST says:

    This might sound far-fetched but what if Locke going back to the island is so that he can be brought back to life? Ben said something at the end of the episode that if the lady didn’t take care of Locke, none of what they were going to do mattered.

    Perhaps Locke needs to return with the Oceanic 6 to make everything right again?

  240. michael says:

    [quote comment=”308602″]
    To ToeKnee comment 178: You stated that no one else has seen dead people off island, besides Hurley. Does Kate seeing Claire count? Well, we don’t really know yet that she is dead, but I’m thinking she is.
    [/quote]

    Jack saw his dad at the hospital to.

  241. Trixanna says:

    Fantastic posts everyone! It took quite awhile to read through everything but it was well worth it.

    I agree that there is some link between Locke not being able to use his legs while Boone was killed and him being shot in the leg earlier. I am confident this will be explained at some point.

    There was too much close-up screen play for Sawyers foot to not be important too. What did he step on? His foot looked really nasty too, like he has been running around barefoot forever. I see a nasty infection coming on soon. How or if it relates to the 4 toed statue is still a mystery to me.

    As for Hurley, I still like him. He wants to do the right thing and is tortured by this lie he has been telling. His mother loves him so much and knows him so well that she knows he doesn’t lie. When he tells her this terribly confusing story, she has no idea what he is trying to tell her. All she knows is that it is the truth. No, she is NOT nuts, she just loves her son and knows she can believe him.

  242. LostGrrl says:

    Here’s what would be cool… Two years from now, when the show is over (shudder..) and the producers give us all the answers (we hope..), they put out a DVD that shows Lost in a “straight” timeline.

  243. RD says:

    In the church scene, Ben said that he already lost someone. Who did he say he lost and when did it happen?

  244. Scooter says:

    [quote comment=”308627″]In the church scene, Ben said that he already lost someone. Who did he say he lost and when did it happen?[/quote]
    Hugo/Hurley. To the police.

  245. DocH says:

    Dawn wrote: Why was Faraday in the Orchid with the Dr.
    Hammer replied: My guess, time traveling to get island info.
    LostGrrl wrote: Two years from now, when the show is over (shudder..)
    – – – –
    Faraday, who takes great notes, may be gather info… but, he may there to shut the whole thing down and prevent the “power source” from ever being developed/used. He may intend to stop anyone from moving the island – ever. (save the physicist – save the world). What better way to sabotage the place – then as a construction worker.

    LOST isn’t over in two years – it’s over in sixteeen months… if they go out in May 2010.

  246. mikey says:

    [quote comment=”308417″][quote comment=”308319″][quote comment=”308302″]I have to disagree. They specifically say at the beginning of the episode that there is a problem at the Orchid. We even see the donkey wheel in the sonar image the worker shows Chang. The energy in the Orchid is related to time. The energy at the Swan where Des was pushing the button was electromagnetism. Kelvin explained to Des that the button has to be pushed to release the electromagnetic energy every 108 minutes so that it doesn’t become too big to contain. Two seperate stations in two seperate parts of the island and not related to each other based on anything we know at this time.

    Granted, it has been suggested that the purple haze of the Swan implosion did originally cause Des to become unstuck in time and it is possible that event also caused some of the other time weirdness on the island that is revealed in season 4. However I think it’s a bit of a reach to make any connection between the button-pushing at the Swan and the time-travel at the Orchid.[/quote]

    when Desmond gets stuck, Faraday tells him taht large amounts of electromagnetic energy is what can send a conciousness through time… Eloise the mouse was given the ability to go through time by Faraday exposing her to large amounts of EM. So it is possible that the energies in teh wheel room and the swan station are both one and the same thing, and taht unlimited electromagnetic energy causes the time shifts.

    You are right though, the swan station and the orchid are a ways apart. But I’m sure that they are very connected in some way. The doctors warning about releasing the energy at the orchid by breaching the wall, the plate wall and energy release at the swan(as a result of some “cataclysmic event”), and faraday’s presence in the mine right as they are warned not to breach the wall are too close to not be connected in some way.

    The real question here though, is in the trailer for hte next episode, charlotte seems to die of the time sickness that almost killed desmond. Yet she reawakes, her eyes looking really sickly. so that bears the question… zombies?[/quote]

    Yeah that makes sense. I’m starting to get the feeling that the “incident” referred to at the Swan is somehow related to whatever Daniel was doing down at the Orchid. I think that is something that won’t payoff until much later in the season though.

    Unfortunately I haven’t seen the trailer for next week but now I’m intrigued. I can handle everything else Lost has given us, but if we end up with zombies I’m gonna have to call it quits.

  247. DocH says:

    Party Foul…
    The real question here though, is in the trailer for hte next episode, charlotte seems to xxxxxx.

    Rule #4 – right above where ypu type in your comments – “No spoilers or discussion of episode previews.”

    “trailer for hte next episode” is a “discussion of episode previews.”

    not the blog police here… we’ve always held ourself to this standard – Cheers

  248. Circus Mom says:

    [quote comment=”308528″]Might be pointing out something obvious to everyone else already but just watching the new episode(s)… The island isn’t traveling through time, the survivors are. When Locke time travels, no one around him, Ethan or Richard, even when Richard was in the same time period with Locke, before the wheel turned…
    So to me it seems like the survivors are time traveling whereas the island is just traveling through space, hidden possibly by the whole electro-magnetic spectacle.
    quote]

    I think it’s possible that the losties are actually staying in “real time” and the island is moving around. The O6 need to return because they are the islands constant.

  249. Rita says:

    [quote comment=”308662″][quote comment=”308528″]Might be pointing out something obvious to everyone else already but just watching the new episode(s)… The island isn’t traveling through time, the survivors are. When Locke time travels, no one around him, Ethan or Richard, even when Richard was in the same time period with Locke, before the wheel turned…
    So to me it seems like the survivors are time traveling whereas the island is just traveling through space, hidden possibly by the whole electro-magnetic spectacle.
    quote]

    I think it’s possible that the losties are actually staying in “real time” and the island is moving around. The O6 need to return because they are the islands constant.[/quote]
    _________________________________________
    I’m thinking it may turn out to be something more “sciencey” like if the people involved are not all together when the “purple sky” events happen, if they are too far apart or scattered around the world, it destablizes the energy flux and starts the “skipping” through time. They were there when Desmond turned the key (OUR first “purple sky event”) so now they are involved in the energy flux. There was no skipping then because they were all together. It wasn’t until they were separated, at the time of an event, until the skipping started. Just a thought.

  250. Rita says:

    [quote comment=”308687″][quote comment=”308662″][quote comment=”308528″]Might be pointing out something obvious to everyone else already but just watching the new episode(s)… The island isn’t traveling through time, the survivors are. When Locke time travels, no one around him, Ethan or Richard, even when Richard was in the same time period with Locke, before the wheel turned…
    So to me it seems like the survivors are time traveling whereas the island is just traveling through space, hidden possibly by the whole electro-magnetic spectacle.
    quote]

    I think it’s possible that the losties are actually staying in “real time” and the island is moving around. The O6 need to return because they are the islands constant.[/quote]
    _________________________________________
    I’m thinking it may turn out to be something more “sciencey” like if the people involved are not all together when the “purple sky” events happen, if they are too far apart or scattered around the world, it destablizes the energy flux and starts the “skipping” through time. They were there when Desmond turned the key (OUR first “purple sky event”) so now they are involved in the energy flux. There was no skipping then because they were all together. It wasn’t until they were separated, at the time of an event, until the skipping started. Just a thought.[/quote]
    ___________________________________
    OK, me again but I was also thinking that would explain why Walt doesnt’ have to go back (if he doesn’t) because Walt wasn’t on the island during EITHER events, and neither was Frank. Desmond WAS though, so I guess we will see.

  251. PJSander says:

    [quote comment=”308602″]I don’t think the soldiers could be from Rousseau’s group because they didn’t seem to be French, and they weren’t scientists.[/quote]

    I like the idea that they are European soldiers from WWII. However, FWIW, I don’t think their not being French would automatically disqualify them from being in Rousseau’s group. First, Rousseau was not French herself. She SPOKE French, but she speaks English with a middle European accent.

    The fact that they weren’t scientists really doesn’t mean anything either. Keamy, Omar et al were not scientists, but we would consider them part of the “team” from the freighter. Plus Naomi spoke at least four languages and other members of the team were from all over the world. For all we know, those men that were going to cut off Juliet’s hand could have been soldiers hired by Widmore to accompany Rousseau’s science team twenty years ago!

    I am not saying this is the case, just adding alternate theories.

    Speaking of cutting off a hand… what about “Montand’s arm?” Could these have been the same guys that did that?

    : ) P

  252. Leslie says:

    [quote comment=”308412″]Neither Kate nor Jack is the ‘other’ person Sun blames for Jin’s death. She has already told us who they are. She blames her father and Ben.[/quote]

    Last season, Sun said she blamed THREE people for her husband’s death. Last night I thought she was naming Jack as the third but now I think maybe she blames Widmore. The whole “alliance” she has with him could be a trick.

    I think there is a lot more going on with Sun. Showing a baby picture of her child was very strange and also saying the child was with “her grandmother” Surely, Sun would not be leaving her baby with HER mother (while she is trying to destroy her father) or Jin’s mother who abandoned him and later blackmailed Sun. So she is lying, but why?

  253. Rita says:

    [quote comment=”308690″][quote comment=”308602″]I don’t think the soldiers could be from Rousseau’s group because they didn’t seem to be French, and they weren’t scientists.[/quote]

    I like the idea that they are European soldiers from WWII. However, FWIW, I don’t think their not being French would automatically disqualify them from being in Rousseau’s group. First, Rousseau was not French herself. She SPOKE French, but she speaks English with a middle European accent.

    The fact that they weren’t scientists really doesn’t mean anything either. Keamy, Omar et al were not scientists, but we would consider them part of the “team” from the freighter. Plus Naomi spoke at least four languages and other members of the team were from all over the world. For all we know, those men that were going to cut off Juliet’s hand could have been soldiers hired by Widmore to accompany Rousseau’s science team twenty years ago!

    I am not saying this is the case, just adding alternate theories.

    Speaking of cutting off a hand… what about “Montand’s arm?” Could these have been the same guys that did that?

    : ) P[/quote]
    _______________________________________
    I see what you are saying PJ but I can’t help thinking that since Rousseau was broadcasting her message in French, she was expecting to be heard by a French team, her’s, somewhere. Of course though, you are right in saying that even if the team itself was French, not everyone associated with them would necessarily also be French, and the group could also have had mercenary soldiers along with them, from ANYWHERE. However, if it turns out that they are pre-Dharma WW11, could it be that they were the ones who “found” the island and later BROUGHT Dharma (and later, Ben) there? Interesting, in any case.

  254. Rita says:

    [quote comment=”308691″][quote comment=”308412″]Neither Kate nor Jack is the ‘other’ person Sun blames for Jin’s death. She has already told us who they are. She blames her father and Ben.[/quote]

    Last season, Sun said she blamed THREE people for her husband’s death. Last night I thought she was naming Jack as the third but now I think maybe she blames Widmore. The whole “alliance” she has with him could be a trick.

    I think there is a lot more going on with Sun. Showing a baby picture of her child was very strange and also saying the child was with “her grandmother” Surely, Sun would not be leaving her baby with HER mother (while she is trying to destroy her father) or Jin’s mother who abandoned him and later blackmailed Sun. So she is lying, but why?[/quote]
    ____________________________________
    I agree that something is up with Sun. It sort of felt like she was blaming Kate, through all her sweet words about understanding that Kate did what she had to do. I agree that her whole demeanor seemed fake, like she is not just hiding something, but is manipulating the situation, but for what end? What is she trying to get? Where is Ji Yeon? What are her true alliances?

  255. wallyp says:

    [quote comment=”308569″]I thought that when Ben met the older womem he called her Bea Locke did i misunderstand???
    But it would make sense if it was Faradays mom[/quote]

    Hah! My friend thought Ben referred to her as Annie Locke, but actually he said… “any luck?” as in, you know, did she have any luck, and she said yes, but not much… or something. Its definately the Jewlry store lady… prolly Daniels mother… I read the recap on ABC. Com to see what they referred to her as, but that scene was not at all included. They end the recap when John Locke throws the knife.

  256. Rita says:

    OK, one more thought and then I’ll try real hard to be quiet. Could the new soldiers be actually new? Like, when the island moved, it “scooped them up”, like the Black Rock, from where ever they were, and NOW they are on the island, just as confused as everyone else – so THAT’S why they are “shooting first and asking questions later”? OK, I’m done for now.

  257. Marco says:

    [quote comment=”308394″]There is something important about the compass that Richard gave to Locke. John asked what it’s for and Richard said, “It points North, John.” Do you recall back in Season One Locke had a compass that he gave to someone (I want to say Sayid) and he said that he doesn’t need it anymore. Well, when Sayid was looking at teh compass he made a comment about North on the compass being in the wrong directions. I think this is very important.[/quote]

    remember ekos stick? something like “look north john” was inscribed on it? it was some passage from the bible that john took literally, perhaps that has some connection to the compass richard gave him!

    great idea about the O6 being everyones constant and that is why all the losties might die!

    how long did it take for the bloke on the freighter to die from the illness, you know the one with des?
    cuz perhaps thats related to the 70 hours that ben has left!!!

    i think that mrs hawking is the only one who knows where the island is in time and space, with her pendulum plotting when the island has moved!

    god i love this show!!!

  258. vavila says:

    You know, i’m not sure about the O6 being constants of those who stayed on the island. When Des was time travelling he was going to his own past, which was at a different geographical location (he was in the middle of an ocean and he travelled to Oxford, etc.). Also when he travelled, his body in the ‘real time’ collapsed until he returned to the ‘real time’ from his travels. What’s going on with the people on the island is not the same kind of travel as Des went through.

    Des needed a constant to realign the past time travels with real time and return to real time. Now, the losties stuck in different times also will probably need some kind of measure to find out which time they should return to, but it does not have to be a constant like in Des’s travels. These guys travel together as a group in different times without their will and seemingly with no purpose – very different from time travel we saw in the past with Des.

    I also wonder if O6 do come back, then will they even be able to reunite with the losties? O6 may be back in ‘real time’, while the rest of the lsoties may be stuck in time travel they have no control over. Thus they may all be on the island but occupy different timelines… hmm…

  259. Miraks says:

    [quote comment=”308502″]watched it again and had some more thoughts…

    – if miles is candle’s son, and he was born on the island, how would that really be possible since pregnant women die on the island? obviously, there are alternative explanations like the arrived late in the pregnancy ala claire or they arrived after he was born…but what if he really was conceived and born on the island…does that make him “special”?
    “[/quote]
    There is also another pregnant woman in the background in the beginning. I think the problems with fertility started after the purge.

  260. ESB says:

    okay. so i recorded the premier and will watch it again this weekend but here are a few commnets/thoughts (and i have read all the comments on this blog but there are SO MANY of them, i can’t guarantee i won’t repeat something (apologies in advance;)

    -i think it’s pretty obvious that regardless of who else she blames, Sun blames Jack for Jin’s death too…Jack was the one that was convinced the freighter folk were going to rescue them and when Kate said she would go get Jin, Jack stopped her and made her go back to the helicopter…combine that with how strange Sun was acting during her conversation with Kate and the fact that last thing she said was ‘so, how’s Jack?’ with a big old fake smile and it seems pretty obvious to me…

    -i could do with a little less Hurley too, but i think it’s pretty clear he’s a VERY important part of the story, so you all might as well get used to it…there is going to be ALOT of him from here on out…

    -i love the fact that Sun is all cold and secretive now…she’s become a total badass…i don’t think she’s necessarily ‘bad’ or ‘evil’ but she definitely has her own agenda now…and i think she’s ‘using’ Widmore to get whatever it is that she wants, and not necessarily ‘on his side’

    -LOVED seeing Ana Lucia and Ms. Hawkins again…LOVE the idea that Miles is the Asian baby…and LOVE the idea that those guys were WWII soldiers

    -can’t for the life of me figure out why Hurley would turn himself in the cops after Ana Lucia told me to NOT get arrested but i’m super curious to see what Sayid says and does next…he told Hurley not to listen to anything Ben says, so it would appear that Sayid has NO PLANS to go back to the island…

    anyways, GREAT episode (although i do agree that there have been better season openers) and GREAT show…it”s good to be LOST again…my head is still spinning from reading all the comments here and i’m amazed i can write anything even remotely coherant…;)

  261. Miraks says:

    [quote comment=”308507″]I think Sun is setting Whitmore up. Wouldn’t she think that he was to blame for Jin’s death since she believes it was his boat, his people on the island trying to kill them, and therefore probably his explosives. She wouldn’t know that Ben let the scary guy with the bomb attached die. But the best way to get Whitmore would be to have him believe she wants to help him get Ben. Just a thought…[/quote]
    I also think that Whitmore is the other guy she blames, not Ben. As I said, I find it strange that she just happens to call Kate out of the blue, years after they have seen each other last, and it happens to be right after Kate is approached by lawyers from a “secret” client, and right after Sun’s meeting with Whitmore. SOmething is fishy there.

  262. Miraks says:

    [quote comment=”308533″]other things i noticed…miles was talking about widmore to charlotte and mentioned that it took him 20 years to find the island “last time”…seems interesting, i don’t think he was talking about this most recent time that widmore found the island and sent in the mercs to kill everyone
    [/quote]
    Maybe that was the time Russou’s boat landed on the island. The boat could have been on a secret mission, without her knowledge. Not everyone on the freighter knew what their true mission was either.

  263. Melissa says:

    [quote comment=”308266″]Wow. What great episodes! I agree that the crying baby was most likely Miles. Poor Hurley! He thinks he is doing the right thing by listening to Sayid, but is he? As evil and deceptive as Ben is, Anna Lucia DID say to not get arrested and to stay away from the cops. Ben has his own interests at heart (as always) but he may have been the better choice for Hurley. We shall see.[/quote]

    I think Ana Lucia told him that b/c she’s speaking for the island – as are Ms. Hawking and Ben, they’re trying to get the people back. The dead people that show up to talk to real people are the island communicating – like when Ben’s mom showed up to him back in the Dharma days, and when Hurley was seeing his friend in slippers.

  264. Miraks says:

    [quote comment=”308572″]I’m a bit confused about one point everyone keeps bringing up that Ms. Hawking is Faraday’s mom…

    Faraday tells Des to go to Oxford to see his mother.
    Hurley is at home, and thus not Oxford. Ben is with Hurley.
    Then Ben is with Ms. Hawking, therefore, Ms. Hawking and Ben are not at Oxford, thus Ms. Hawking is not Faraday’s mother. Am I missing something here?[/quote]
    I also don’t think they are related. The writers might want us to think so, but I don’t buy it. Mrs. H obviously knows Ben and the island quite well. If she was Faraday’s mom I think he would actually be on the island and one of the Other’s scientist.

  265. Miraks says:

    [quote comment=”308605″]This might sound far-fetched but what if Locke going back to the island is so that he can be brought back to life? Ben said something at the end of the episode that if the lady didn’t take care of Locke, none of what they were going to do mattered.

    Perhaps Locke needs to return with the Oceanic 6 to make everything right again?[/quote]
    I think that might be true in the sense that Jack’s father was brought back to the island in his coffin and is now “alive” on the island.

  266. PJSander says:

    [quote comment=”308707″]remember ekos stick? something like “look north john” was inscribed on it? it was some passage from the bible that john took literally, perhaps that has some connection to the compass richard gave him![/quote]

    The stick said something like “lift up your eyes and look north” followed by “John 3:05.” Interestingly, John 3:5 is anything near this quote (something similar appears in Genesis). John taking it literally was probably the idea. Captain Eyeliner’s comment may well have been purposeful – to remind Locke to go on the same journey he made when he found Eko’s stick (the flame station). Hmmm.

    : ) P

  267. Tasker says:

    A couple of ideas:

    1. (a)They need to all go back to the island to put time back on its normal course (aka ‘course correct’). (b)Similar to an earlier post about everyone being someone else’s constant. If they don’t see their constant they will die. I only saw one post in response to this theory… Any thoughts?

    2. Hilarious to think they might have built the 4-toed statue in honor of Sawyer (if he ends up losing a toe from the splinter). Maybe some natives find him and think he’s a god. I think that is from Ace Ventura or Priates of the Carribean or some Futurama episode.

    All speculation. Good to see everyone back on here… It was DEAD for the last 8 months.

  268. vavila says:

    [quote comment=”308719″]A couple of ideas:

    1. (a)They need to all go back to the island to put time back on its normal course (aka ‘course correct’). quote]

    I think that the whole course correction involves more than O6 coming back and returning all the losties itno the ‘normal time’. I think that the fact that losties’ plane crashed and everything that has been going on since that is some kind of course correction, which Mrs. Hawkins, Ben and Alpert (at least) are aware of and guide to the extent they can.

    When Mrs. Hawkins said that Ben has only 70 hrs, and all the talk about how if Lock’s body won’t be preserved then nothing will matter, or Mrs. Hawkins advice to Des that it was not his time to marry Penny etc, etc. All of these comments allude to a greater course correction mission, which losties are a part of. We still don’t know what exactly the goal of this course correction is and how exactly Mrs Hawkins and Ben and other characters fit into it.

    And ultimately O6 will have to come back not just to save the losties, but for the course correction to take place…

  269. Tasker says:

    [quote comment=”308725″][quote comment=”308719″]A couple of ideas:

    1. (a)They need to all go back to the island to put time back on its normal course (aka ‘course correct’). quote]

    I think that the whole course correction involves more than O6 coming back and returning all the losties itno the ‘normal time’. I think that the fact that losties’ plane crashed and everything that has been going on since that is some kind of course correction, which Mrs. Hawkins, Ben and Alpert (at least) are aware of and guide to the extent they can.

    When Mrs. Hawkins said that Ben has only 70 hrs, and all the talk about how if Lock’s body won’t be preserved then nothing will matter, or Mrs. Hawkins advice to Des that it was not his time to marry Penny etc, etc. All of these comments allude to a greater course correction mission, which losties are a part of. We still don’t know what exactly the goal of this course correction is and how exactly Mrs Hawkins and Ben and other characters fit into it.

    And ultimately O6 will have to come back not just to save the losties, but for the course correction to take place…[/quote]
    ____________________________________

    Yeah, I agree with your theory. It just seems like the O6 (and Locke) getting back to the island is a BIG part of the course correcting. I guess we just don’t have enough pieces of that puzzle yet. May not have them until 2010:(

  270. vavila says:

    Tasker, i hope we’ll be getting more pieces soon :) 2010 seems far away! I just cannot wait to find out more about the overall course correction mission, and i suspect that it may legitimize some of Ben’s actions and even explain his great manipulation abilities – that would be something!

  271. Trixanna says:

    [quote comment=”308706″]OK, one more thought and then I’ll try real hard to be quiet. Could the new soldiers be actually new? Like, when the island moved, it “scooped them up”, like the Black Rock, from where ever they were, and NOW they are on the island, just as confused as everyone else – so THAT’S why they are “shooting first and asking questions later”? OK, I’m done for now.[/quote]

    No need to be quiet, Rita! You have some awesome ideas that really make me think, as do many of the other posters!

    What you are saying is totally possible. Do we know what time frame we are in when this happens? They were skipping around so much, I lost track of time. The soldiers could be scared half to death and fearing for their own lives, who knows what they saw or who they have encountered?

    Also in your post #256, I agree that Sun was acting like she was blaming Kate for Jin’s death. She turned it around at the end but I think she harbors resentment towards Kate. At this point, Sun is NOT to be trusted.

  272. Rita says:

    [quote comment=”308711″]
    -can’t for the life of me figure out why Hurley would turn himself in the cops after Ana Lucia told me to NOT get arrested but i’m super curious to see what Sayid says and does next…he told Hurley not to listen to anything Ben says, so it would appear that Sayid has NO PLANS to go back to the island…
    [/quote]
    __________________________________________
    I see Hurley as good hearted but not a great thinker – he so badly wants to do the right thing, but doesn’t always know what that is. He is caught between trusting Sayid and trusting his own gut. Sayid said to do the opposite of what Ben tells him, so rather than go with Ben, he thinks he needs to do something that will definitely PREVENT him from going with Ben – so off to the cops it is. (He doesn’t trust Ana Lucia because she is part of the visions to him, the part that might be crazy).

    As for Sayid never planning on going back to the island, I don’t think we can say that yet – it might be a case of “I sold my soul to the devil, but don’t you do the same” when he warned Hurley to not listen to Ben.

  273. Miraks says:

    [quote comment=”308711″]

    -can’t for the life of me figure out why Hurley would turn himself in the cops after Ana Lucia told me to NOT get arrested

    …;)[/quote]
    I think it’s because he knows Sayd is real, but he thinks he is just imagining/ is not sure about Anna Lucia.

  274. Miraks says:

    Sorry, just saw that Rita said something similar in the previous post. My server had not shown her reply yet.
    Anyway, they are rebroadcasting Thursday’s episodes on Saturday- in case you want to watch them again.

  275. LostinSev says:

    I like the idea that Jin may be Dr. Candle’s son! Maybe Jin and his mother had to leave the island for some reason when he was still young. The whole story of his mother being a prostitute was an excuse for her abandonment of Jin.??

    What was the man’s name who Hurley was searching for in Australia? The man’s widow did say that he was on a military mission that messed him up. Was he and the crazy man who repeated the numbers in the psychiatric ward together on the island? maybe pushing numbers??

    Well, the widow said something about when he came home a lot of bad things happened. That is why they moved out there to get away from everyone. Even the bad luck was happening to her. Could this be the same thing that is happening to the 06ers??

    I like the Christian Shephard going to the island in a coffin and now Locke may be brought back in a coffin. Is Christain Jacob? Will Locke become the new Jacob??

    I know the Losties are skipping in time now, but how can Des be back too (in the hatch)? Does that mean everyone who was on the island more than three yrs ago are still alive or on the island somewhere? i.e. Patchy! The skipping in time is confussing me. Everytime they skip, is it always back to the same time period?

  276. ESB says:

    don’t get me wrong…i’m sure that Sayid will end up back on the island…but if he’s planning on going back, then he’s going along with Ben and he wouldn’t tell Hurley to do the opposite of anything Ben says…i’m now thinking that Sayid went to get Hurley to keep Ben from getting to him and was going to hide him (especially since he told Hurley ‘IF’ you ever have the misfortune of seeing Benjamin Linus again…)…whereas last season i thought he was going to fetch him FOR Ben…it’ll be really interesting to hear the conversation that Jack and Sayid have next week (at least I sure hope it’s next week and they don’t string it out;)…

  277. Miraks says:

    [quote comment=”308560″][quote comment=”308559″]this isnt really that important but Juliet told sawyer that whatever they had with them when they moved would stay with them when he asked why the boat was there…i think it will be pretty funny if they move again and sawyer isnt going to have a shirt anymore cause when he moved he didnt have one on and they have not moved since he put it on[/quote]
    My only problem with this logic (the show’s not yours) is why is the boat considered “with them when they moved” and the kitchenette isn’t?[/quote]

    ____________
    I do think that whatever you are touching directly moves too. Maybe after one move it just automaticaly keeps moving as well. It has to be something like that because Locke has to be able to keep the compass.
    The only thing that intrigued me about that was that Alpert told Locke to give him the compass to “prove” to him that he was who he is. Since Alpert knows all about the island’s abilities, you would think that it would be enough for Locke to tell him “hey, you told me to talk to you when the island was in a different time”. Unless, of course, there was a time when Alpert did NOT know about the island’s abilities, and Locke will at some point end up in that time frame. Maybe we’ll finally find out who Alpert is and where he came from.

  278. Hurley's Dad says:

    Are Cindy and the kids (Emma and Zach) moving the same as Locke/Losties?

  279. PJSander says:

    [quote comment=”308772″]Are Cindy and the kids (Emma and Zach) moving the same as Locke/Losties?[/quote]

    Good question. We’re not “done” with Cindy and the kids, I imagine. Otherwise, they wouldn’t have kept reminding us about them in stories last season. If they are alive, then I imagine they are skipping around, if they are Whisperers, then who knows!?

    : ) P

  280. ESB says:

    [quote comment=”308775″][quote comment=”308772″]Are Cindy and the kids (Emma and Zach) moving the same as Locke/Losties?[/quote]

    Good question. We’re not “done” with Cindy and the kids, I imagine. Otherwise, they wouldn’t have kept reminding us about them in stories last season. If they are alive, then I imagine they are skipping around, if they are Whisperers, then who knows!?

    : ) P[/quote]

    Cindy and the kids were with the others, right? so i ASSUME they were with Alpert too…which, based on Alpert’s conversation with Locke would mean they are not skipping thru time…right? at least they are not moving with Locke…i think…;)

  281. Dennis says:

    [quote comment=”308775″][quote comment=”308772″]Are Cindy and the kids (Emma and Zach) moving the same as Locke/Losties?[/quote]

    Good question. We’re not “done” with Cindy and the kids, I imagine. Otherwise, they wouldn’t have kept reminding us about them in stories last season. If they are alive, then I imagine they are skipping around, if they are Whisperers, then who knows!?

    : ) P[/quote]
    ————

    This got me thinking back to the device that Faraday’s team disabled when they first landed on the island. Faraday said the device would kill everyone on the island, and it’s assumed that ben would have used this device to target Keamy’s men. Could it be possible that the device was sort of like an energy bomb that would have sent everyone on the island into a time limbo(like the one the losties are in now) until they died of the time sickness(or had been killed by older inhabitants) while floating through time? This would have certainly eliminated Keamy and possibly killed the islanders as was said.

    And if this is the case, it may explain why the others like cindy and the kids were sent to the “temple”, which could have served as a sort of bomb shelter from an energy blast… if they are still in the temple, they would not be affected by the moving of the island, the purple sky, or the device and the resulting time disruption

  282. PJSander says:

    [quote comment=”308752″]I know the Losties are skipping in time now, but how can Des be back too (in the hatch)? Does that mean everyone who was on the island more than three yrs ago are still alive or on the island somewhere? i.e. Patchy! The skipping in time is confussing me. Everytime they skip, is it always back to the same time period?[/quote]

    Here is how I understand it… our survivors (Juliet, Sawyer, Rose, Bernard, Daniel, Miles, Charlotte, possibly a redshirt or two that has yet to be killed off) and Locke are moving in time. After each “purple sky event” or flash, the survivors are in a different time ON the island.

    The first time, the flash moved back in time to when Yemi’s plane first crashed, before O815 crashed. Likely somewhere in the late 1990’s.

    The second time, the flash moved the survivors forward to a time AFTER they had crashed on the island because the hatch had already imploded.

    The third time, the flash moved them back to a time before they discovered the hatch, when Desmond was still down in the hatch. Since Desmond said he had been pushing the “bloody button” for three years, we have to put that as somewhere between 2001 and the time the LOSTies discovered the hatch.

    The fourth time, the flash moved them to an as-yet-unspecified time when they are pelted with flame arrows and later confronted by the three men with questionable accents and militaryish uniforms.

    Each time the people shift to a different TIME on the island and whatever time that is, the people who WERE there at that time will still BE there. D&C have alluded to the fact that no one will be running into former versions of themselves, but that might ONLY apply to Desmond’s type of travel where he moves consciousness to times in HIS OWN LIFE.

    Now, that does NOT address “where” the island went. We saw that ripple effect in the water, but what does that mean. Perhaps the “radius” that Daniel mentioned has to do with the “snow globe” idea that Desmond once said. Perhaps there is some kind of shield-like sphere of protection which prevents the island from being seen. D&C said that you can’t see it on radar or satellite. Maybe the fail-safe key “purple sky event” removed that shield and it took “moving the island” to put it back up again. Putting up that shield might mean releasing all that energy which is what tears the fabric of time.

    Curiouser and curiouser.

    : ) P

  283. LostinSev says:

    So is the island really LOST in the physical sense or in time???

    Was the freighter inside the radius of the island when the purple sky happened?

    If they move forward in time, could it be themselve or their people who after them now?

    I just wonder how Locke is traveling back and forth from the island to the 06ers to get them to come back. I guess we will see that in upcoming episodes.

    So in real time with O6 it has been three yrs since the rescue, but on the island we are watching what is happening right after the island moved. Why are we ahead with the O6 and behind or present with the Losties???

  284. agentLOST says:

    [quote comment=”308779″]

    So in real time with O6 it has been three yrs since the rescue, but on the island we are watching what is happening right after the island moved. Why are we ahead with the O6 and behind or present with the Losties???[/quote]
    ________________________________________________________

    Interesting timeline analysis. All this time variance boggles the mind. I believe the reason we’re not seeing O6er’s and Losties at same point in time yet is because the 3 years will be revealed over the course of the rest of the show. The incident with the flame throwers being just one example. I’ve thought for awhile now the series will return to one timeline as it draws to a close.

  285. PJSander says:

    [quote comment=”308779″]Was the freighter inside the radius of the island when the purple sky happened?
    [/quote]

    Given that Sawyer showed Juliet that the smoke was gone, I would have to guess that the freighter was NOT inside the radius. The question remains that if Jin survived the explosion, could he have managed to swim far enough away from the freighter to be inside the radius?

    [quote comment=”308779″]So in real time with O6 it has been three yrs since the rescue, but on the island we are watching what is happening right after the island moved. Why are we ahead with the O6 and behind or present with the Losties???[/quote]

    I think it is just a story-telling device / license. We saw flash-forwards last season which took us up to about the end of 2007 or early 2008. We have seen what happens to the O6 during that three years. The timeline for “real time” off island stuff seemed to start there this season, but we’re still seeing flashbacks to the beginning of their off-island time.

    There were no flash-forwards for those who remained on the island. I suspect that it really won’t MATTER “what time” they are in anyway because it changes. But yes, in their perspective, the helicopter just left and the freighter just exploded.

    Doesn’t make it any easier does it!? LOL

    : ) P

  286. bold deceiver says:

    So far I’m loving the idea of the island skipping through time. I believe we will see how the Black Rock ended up there. I also think we will see some of the people who were on the ship. In my opinion Widmore was the captain of the Black Rock. This would explain why he bought the journal at auction and has the painting in his bedroom. It would also explain his old school attitude about respect and why he was upset that Sun approached him in that manner. I think he believes it to be his island b/c he thinks he “discovered” it when his ship crashed there.

  287. Circus Mom says:

    Was the freighter inside the radius of the island when the purple sky happened?
    This is a good question. The O6 could no longer see the freighter so we would assume it was in the radius but Sawyer pointed out it could not be seen from the island. If it waa in the radius and Jin was touching it it should have moved with them. This would indicate Jin had jumped off just before the island moved. That would leave Jin alive in the water and the freighter gone.

  288. Circus Mom says:

    [quote comment=”308691″][quote comment=”308412″]Neither Kate nor Jack is the ‘other’ person Sun blames for Jin’s death. She has already told us who they are. She blames her father and Ben.[/quote]

    Last season, Sun said she blamed THREE people for her husband’s death. Last night I thought she was naming Jack as the third but now I think maybe she blames Widmore. The whole “alliance” she has with him could be a trick.

    I think there is a lot more going on with Sun. Showing a baby picture of her child was very strange and also saying the child was with “her grandmother” Surely, Sun would not be leaving her baby with HER mother (while she is trying to destroy her father) or Jin’s mother who abandoned him and later blackmailed Sun. So she is lying, but why?[/quote]

    Sun definetly said two people. She called her mother in previous epi’s to check on the baby also.

  289. Circus Mom says:

    [quote comment=”308710″][quote comment=”308502″]watched it again and had some more thoughts…

    – if miles is candle’s son, and he was born on the island, how would that really be possible since pregnant women die on the island? obviously, there are alternative explanations like the arrived late in the pregnancy ala claire or they arrived after he was born…but what if he really was conceived and born on the island…does that make him “special”?
    “[/quote]
    There is also another pregnant woman in the background in the beginning. I think the problems with fertility started after the purge.[/quote]
    ++++++++++++++++++++
    I am guessing the others can’t have babies but the Dharma people could. Our losties might have been able to. Clair gave birth and Sun left before we verified that she would die if pregnant.

  290. SDlost says:

    Just rewatched the premiere and I have some new thoughts/questions:

    1. Hurley told Sayid that he will not help him if he ever needs anything because he’s making him lie.

    2. Dr. Candle’s record player seems just like the one that Juliet had at her house. Maybe her old house was his prior to the purge.

    3. In the butcher shop, Ben pulls #342 and has a brief discussion with Jill. He tells her that he needs her to watch something for him and her reply is “Is it what I think it is?” Then Ben asks if “Gabriel & Jeffrey have checked-in yet?” Who are these people?

    4. Ms. Hawkins is working on a very old computer that is similar to the dharma computer in the hatch.

    5. Both Dr. Candle and Ms. Hawkings say “God help us all”.

  291. Circus Mom says:

    [quote comment=”308716″][quote comment=”308605″]This might sound far-fetched but what if Locke going back to the island is so that he can be brought back to life? Ben said something at the end of the episode that if the lady didn’t take care of Locke, none of what they were going to do mattered.

    Perhaps Locke needs to return with the Oceanic 6 to make everything right again?[/quote]
    I think that might be true in the sense that Jack’s father was brought back to the island in his coffin and is now “alive” on the island.[/quote]

    I am wondering if Jacks father was on the island before. He could have worked with Dharma before as a doctor. It would make sense since all the dead bodies from 815 did not come alive again.

  292. LostinSev says:

    Could Gabriel and Jeffery be other Losties from the island who came back with Locke (Jeremy Benthan ?sp) to recruit the O6er’s to go back???

    Assume names??

  293. Jaime says:

    [quote comment=”308690″][quote comment=”308602″]I don’t think the soldiers could be from Rousseau’s group because they didn’t seem to be French, and they weren’t scientists.[/quote]

    I like the idea that they are European soldiers from WWII. However, FWIW, I don’t think their not being French would automatically disqualify them from being in Rousseau’s group. First, Rousseau was not French herself. She SPOKE French, but she speaks English with a middle European accent.

    The fact that they weren’t scientists really doesn’t mean anything either. Keamy, Omar et al were not scientists, but we would consider them part of the “team” from the freighter. Plus Naomi spoke at least four languages and other members of the team were from all over the world. For all we know, those men that were going to cut off Juliet’s hand could have been soldiers hired by Widmore to accompany Rousseau’s science team twenty years ago!

    I am not saying this is the case, just adding alternate theories.

    Speaking of cutting off a hand… what about “Montand’s arm?” Could these have been the same guys that did that?

    : ) P[/quote]
    ***********************************************8

    Montand, Ray Mullen & Dr. Marvin Candle (swan video) All have lost an arm, hand.

    This was taken from the 11/28/05 podcast:

    Carlton Cuse: Is there any connection between the loss of Montand’s arm, and the fact that Dr. Marvin Candle has a fake hand?

    Damon Lindelof: Eh, I dunno, is there? We also found a glass eye in the Arrow Station. People just lose body parts I think easily on the Island.

    Carlton Cuse: Exactly.

    Damon Lindelof: It isn’t a widely known fact that actually Marvin Candle has a fake hand. You actually have to watch the film a fair amount of times, so I think that’s a good nugget of podcast exclusivity that you just downloaded there.

    Carlton Cuse: Wow, that’s cool. And would it be possible that in a future episode we would discover why Marvin Candle has a fake hand?

    Damon Lindelof: I suppose anything’s possible, I guess.

    Thoughts????

  294. Rita says:

    [quote comment=”308795″][quote comment=”308690″][quote comment=”308602″] [/quote]
    Speaking of cutting off a hand… what about “Montand’s arm?” Could these have been the same guys that did that?

    : ) P[/quote]
    ***********************************************8

    Montand, Ray Mullen & Dr. Marvin Candle (swan video) All have lost an arm, hand.

    This was taken from the 11/28/05 podcast:

    Carlton Cuse: Is there any connection between the loss of Montand’s arm, and the fact that Dr. Marvin Candle has a fake hand?

    Damon Lindelof: Eh, I dunno, is there? We also found a glass eye in the Arrow Station. People just lose body parts I think easily on the Island.

    Carlton Cuse: Exactly.

    Damon Lindelof: It isn’t a widely known fact that actually Marvin Candle has a fake hand. You actually have to watch the film a fair amount of times, so I think that’s a good nugget of podcast exclusivity that you just downloaded there.

    Carlton Cuse: Wow, that’s cool. And would it be possible that in a future episode we would discover why Marvin Candle has a fake hand?

    Damon Lindelof: I suppose anything’s possible, I guess.

    Thoughts????[/quote]
    _____________________________________
    WOW good catch! That one got right by me. Thanks for the great info Jaime!

  295. Jaime says:

    A few things i was thinking about

    1. If Richard, Ethan and the Others are not affected by the time shifts why is Juliet?

    2. It seems arrows were prominent in the episodes. Pierre filming the Arrow Vid, flaming arrows, Richard telling John the compass points north..possible to the Arrow

    3. Is there an anagram for the law firm Agostini and Norton.

    4. I think the nose bleeds are going to be important. When we first saw Horace his nose was bleeding, he worked at the Arrow. Now Charlotte, maybe she worked at the Arrow at some other time.

    5. I did some research on the type of gun the guys had and it seems it was the standard infantry rifle issued to US troops from 1936 to 1963.

  296. lostmama says:

    Someone please help me out, everyone is saying they *Think* Jin is still alive, I though we *knew* for sure that he was alive? I though when Sun gave Birth they showed Jin and we all thought he was running to give Sun the panda bear to the hospital but it turned out Sun thought he’s dead, but there he was taking a gift to someone else giving birth I believe he was working for Mr.Paik? Does anyone else remember this? Wasn’t it a flash forward? Wouldn’t this mean he’s still alive? That’s why they said Sun believes Jin’s dead. Thanks for clarifying!

  297. lostmama says:

    sorry to waste a post, my mom keeps telling me this is the last season, I though there was at least one more season, please let me know! THXs

  298. PJSander says:

    [quote comment=”308830″]I though when Sun gave Birth they showed Jin and we all thought he was running to give Sun the panda bear to the hospital but it turned out Sun thought he’s dead, but there he was taking a gift to someone else giving birth I believe he was working for Mr.Paik? [/quote]

    That was NOT a flash-forward. It was a flash-back which ran simultaneously with Sun’s flash-forward and was done INTENTIONALLY to throw us off during the episode. Jin was buying the panda for the grandbaby of a Chinese official whose daughter was giving birth in Korea when Jin and Sun were newly married.

    HTH,
    : ) P

  299. PJSander says:

    [quote comment=”308819″]1. If Richard, Ethan and the Others are not affected by the time shifts why is Juliet?[/quote]

    Well see, I think this is one of those things that kind of proves Hammer’s the-Others-are-Whisperers theory. Ethan is DEAD in “current island time” *CIT* (early January 2005). Charlie killed him a “few months ago” when he was after Claire. So Ethan does not exist in CIT. I believe Captain Eyeliner and the Others must not REALLY exist in CIT, or they would have moved WITH Locke. If they are NOT Whisperers, they are at least not of CIT for SOME reason.

    : ) P

  300. TheWhiteHorse says:

    [quote comment=”308830″]Someone please help me out, everyone is saying they *Think* Jin is still alive, I though we *knew* for sure that he was alive? I though when Sun gave Birth they showed Jin and we all thought he was running to give Sun the panda bear to the hospital but it turned out Sun thought he’s dead, but there he was taking a gift to someone else giving birth I believe he was working for Mr.Paik? Does anyone else remember this? Wasn’t it a flash forward? Wouldn’t this mean he’s still alive? That’s why they said Sun believes Jin’s dead. Thanks for clarifying![/quote]
    If you watch that show again, I believe the show is actually a simultaneous flash forward and flash back. Jin’s storyline is a flashback to his early years of working for Mr.Paik and Sun’s storyline is a flash forward after the O6 has been rescued and she is given birth. She calls out for her husband Jin but it seems that in the agony of childbirth and possibly the pain medication she thinks for a moment that he is still alive. The entire episode leads you to believe that Jin is rushing to Sun’s side until the very end when they through the twist at you which is why it is confusing. There is a later scene, I think in a later episode, when Hurley comes to visit Sun and they take the baby to visit Jin’s grave. Hope that helps!

  301. Toeknee says:

    [quote comment=”308831″]sorry to waste a post, my mom keeps telling me this is the last season, I though there was at least one more season, please let me know! THXs[/quote]
    One more season after this. 15 more episodes this season, 17 next season.

  302. PJSander says:

    [quote comment=”308831″]sorry to waste a post, my mom keeps telling me this is the last season, I though there was at least one more season, please let me know! THXs[/quote]

    This is the beginning of Season 5. It will run through May of 2009. There will be a Season 6. It is currently scheduled to run from early 2010 through May 2010. (Barring an actors’ strike, a snow storm in Hawaii, or a freak accident at the Bad Robot offices in Southern California!)

    : ) P

  303. TheWhiteHorse says:

    Just had a thought last night…what if Locke isn’t really dead like many have theorized and Ben just used that spider trick like what happened with Nikki and Paolo to make it appear he’s dead? I don’t know…what do you all think? It seems a little far fetched but it would give some meaning to that whole Nikki/Paolo episode. It was kind of a random episode – sort of like a comic relief that didn’t really flow entirely with the rest of the storyline.

  304. Toeknee says:

    [quote comment=”308571″]SO lock killing those soldiers might have caused a riff in time?[/quote]
    I don’t think there would be a riff in time. I think, within the context of the show, there is just one timeline, and in that timeline, the soldiers are on the island, and they encounter the time-travelling Losties, and some soldiers get killed. Eventually the Losties will go back to their rightful time (I’m assuming), so it may be the surviving soldiers won’t find the people who killed the other soldiers.

  305. TheWhiteHorse says:

    Did anyone notice in the convenience store when Hurley was purchasing his giant yellow “I Heart My Shi Tzu” shirt that the song playing in the background was “Dream Police.” My husband picked up on that one and he just wanted me to point out once again the amazing attention to detail that the writers put into this show. That’s all. Just a neat little FYI!

  306. Toeknee says:

    [quote comment=”308546″][quote comment=”308533″]…what happened to sayid to make him think that way, have we already seen it and i missed something?
    [/quote]
    I was thinking about that too. Something tells we’ll find out Ben had Nadia killed so he could recruit Sayid.[/quote]
    __________________________
    I think this was strongly implied in last season’s episodes (that Ben had Nadia killed), and back then I didn’t think they would ever clearly spell it out in an upcoming episode. But seeing how Sayid is now against Ben, I think you’re right – they’ll show Sayid finding out the truth and this will turn him against Ben.

  307. Toeknee says:

    [quote comment=”308552″]Who was Jill (in the butcher shop)? She looked like Ben’s twin sister.[/quote]
    I don’t think we’ve ever seen her before. Couldn’t be a twin, or even a full sister, because we saw Ben’s birth, and he came out by himself, and then his mother died.

  308. Toeknee says:

    [quote comment=”308606″][quote comment=”308602″]
    To ToeKnee comment 178: You stated that no one else has seen dead people off island, besides Hurley. Does Kate seeing Claire count? Well, we don’t really know yet that she is dead, but I’m thinking she is.
    [/quote]

    Jack saw his dad at the hospital to.[/quote]
    _____________________
    Dang! Good points – yet another hole in my theory! Although I’m of the opinion that Claire is still alive. But I do agree that Christian is dead.

  309. PJSander says:

    [quote comment=”308846″]I think this was strongly implied in last season’s episodes (that Ben had Nadia killed), and back then I didn’t think they would ever clearly spell it out in an upcoming episode. But seeing how Sayid is now against Ben, I think you’re right – they’ll show Sayid finding out the truth and this will turn him against Ben.[/quote]

    While I would not put it past Ben to do this, it would have taken some pretty sly movement in time on his part to do so. Remember that it was not long after he “ended up” in October 2005 (after turning the FDW) that he saw Sayid in the procession. I think even for Ben who always has a plan that might be a stretch. JMO.

    : ) P

  310. PJSander says:

    However (finishing my thought), I suspect it is MORE likely that Widmore didn’t have anything to do with Nadia’s death, but that Ben seized an opportunity to frame him. I thought it was odd that Sayid would trust Ben of all people, with nothing more than a traffic-cam photo as evidence.

    : ) P

  311. Trixanna says:

    [quote comment=”308831″]sorry to waste a post, my mom keeps telling me this is the last season, I though there was at least one more season, please let me know! THXs[/quote]

    Questions like this one will keep you sane! It will keep you from having to find a LostAholics meeting before next week. I know I would go into full panic mode if I thought this was the last season. We need time to prepare ourselves for the ending.

  312. Bobola says:

    IF Ben had Nadia killed it still does not mean he’s bad. Maybe she had it coming…it has not been established that she’s some sort of angel just because Sayid is in love with her. Maybe she’s really a baddie herself.

    I don’t trust Sayid anymore.

  313. Miraks says:

    [quote comment=”308842″]Just had a thought last night…what if Locke isn’t really dead like many have theorized and Ben just used that spider trick like what happened with Nikki and Paolo to make it appear he’s dead? I don’t know…what do you all think? It seems a little far fetched but it would give some meaning to that whole Nikki/Paolo episode. It was kind of a random episode – sort of like a comic relief that didn’t really flow entirely with the rest of the storyline.[/quote]
    I don’t think so, although we did hear an episode of Expose in the background- Hurley’s dad was watching it. It was the episode where Nikki got shot, but was later told by her producer boyfriend that that did not mean she could not be brought back. Hmmm.

  314. Miraks says:

    [quote comment=”308868″]IF Ben had Nadia killed it still does not mean he’s bad. Maybe she had it coming…it has not been established that she’s some sort of angel just because Sayid is in love with her. Maybe she’s really a baddie herself.

    I don’t trust Sayid anymore.[/quote]
    I don’t think it was Ben who had Nadia killed. I think Sayid warns Hurley of Ben because he knows that Ben is not a guy to shy away from hurting people. He knows that he (being a torturer etc.) can handle the lies and deceptions, but Hurley is too kind and in a way innocent to be able to handle it. Remember we saw Sayid kill the guy on the golf course in cold blood- something Hurley could not do in a million years.

  315. Rita says:

    [quote comment=”308869″][quote comment=”308842″]Just had a thought last night…what if Locke isn’t really dead like many have theorized and Ben just used that spider trick like what happened with Nikki and Paolo to make it appear he’s dead? I don’t know…what do you all think? It seems a little far fetched but it would give some meaning to that whole Nikki/Paolo episode. It was kind of a random episode – sort of like a comic relief that didn’t really flow entirely with the rest of the storyline.[/quote]
    I don’t think so, although we did hear an episode of Expose in the background- Hurley’s dad was watching it. It was the episode where Nikki got shot, but was later told by her producer boyfriend that that did not mean she could not be brought back. Hmmm.[/quote]
    _______________________________________
    Lostpedia talks about this idea a bit. Check it out at http://lostpedia.wikia.com/wiki/The_Lie/Theories
    Scroll down to “Locke’s Dead/Comatose Body”. Locke really does seem to be “dead”, but the Expose reference is pretty compelling, so it can’t just be dismissed.

  316. Rita says:

    [quote comment=”308859″][quote comment=”308846″]I think this was strongly implied in last season’s episodes (that Ben had Nadia killed), and back then I didn’t think they would ever clearly spell it out in an upcoming episode. But seeing how Sayid is now against Ben, I think you’re right – they’ll show Sayid finding out the truth and this will turn him against Ben.[/quote]

    While I would not put it past Ben to do this, it would have taken some pretty sly movement in time on his part to do so. Remember that it was not long after he “ended up” in October 2005 (after turning the FDW) that he saw Sayid in the procession. I think even for Ben who always has a plan that might be a stretch. JMO.

    : ) P[/quote]
    ______________________________________
    If Ben had Nadia killed, he wouldn’t have had to be there personally to do it, he would just have ordered it done by his minions (he seems to have plenty of those). I think Ben uses a lot of truth in his lies, which makes it very hard to know which parts are which.

  317. Toeknee says:

    [quote comment=”308809″][quote comment=”308795″][quote comment=”308690″][quote comment=”308602″] [/quote]
    Speaking of cutting off a hand… what about “Montand’s arm?” Could these have been the same guys that did that?

    : ) P[/quote]
    ***********************************************8

    Montand, Ray Mullen & Dr. Marvin Candle (swan video) All have lost an arm, hand.

    This was taken from the 11/28/05 podcast:

    Carlton Cuse: Is there any connection between the loss of Montand’s arm, and the fact that Dr. Marvin Candle has a fake hand?

    Damon Lindelof: Eh, I dunno, is there? We also found a glass eye in the Arrow Station. People just lose body parts I think easily on the Island.

    Carlton Cuse: Exactly.

    Damon Lindelof: It isn’t a widely known fact that actually Marvin Candle has a fake hand. You actually have to watch the film a fair amount of times, so I think that’s a good nugget of podcast exclusivity that you just downloaded there.

    Carlton Cuse: Wow, that’s cool. And would it be possible that in a future episode we would discover why Marvin Candle has a fake hand?

    Damon Lindelof: I suppose anything’s possible, I guess.

    Thoughts????[/quote]
    _____________________________________
    WOW good catch! That one got right by me. Thanks for the great info Jaime![/quote]
    ________________________
    That was a great catch, Jaime! One wrinkle to this that I noticed on rewatching the episode, both of Dr. Chang’s arms/hands were funcional. Maybe it doesn’t mean much, but I found that interesting.

  318. Courtney says:

    I’m late to the game, and I only read up to comment 300-something. So… Me… Off my game, but… In the last scene, I thought Ben said (in the church scene with Fionnula Flanagan,) “Are you Annie Locke?” Obviously, from comments here and on other sites, and Fionnula Flangan’s IMDB page, I’m wrong. I’ve got no problem being wrong, and I’m going to watch it again, but did anyone else hear, “Are you Annie Locke?” in that final scene? I’m having a hard time with, “Annie Locke,” and, “Mrs. Hawking”, sounding the same.

    Either way, I’m going to re-watch the premiere and will be happily surprised if I catch my error. :D

  319. jay says:

    I am new to this site, but I have to say it’s nearly unavoidable that Locke is still alive, comatose from the spider venom.

    Directly after Jack asks if he’s actually dead (Ben doesn’t answer), it switches right to Hugo’s dad watching Expose. That’s too obvious. Locke is alive.

  320. Toeknee says:

    Maybe this is too obvious, but I don’t remember anyone specifically mentioning it, so I’ll go ahead and do it. The guys in Sayid’s safe house shot him with a tranquilizer gun, and that makes me think they’re part of Ben’s team – they were there to capture Sayid so he can be brought to the island. And to take this a step further, this must mean the guy outside of Santa Rosa whom Sayid killed last season was probably also part of Ben’s team, waiting to get Hurley out of there to bring him to the island too.

  321. Toeknee says:

    [quote comment=”308877″]I’m late to the game, and I only read up to comment 300-something. So… Me… Off my game, but… In the last scene, I thought Ben said (in the church scene with Fionnula Flanagan,) “Are you Annie Locke?” Obviously, from comments here and on other sites, and Fionnula Flangan’s IMDB page, I’m wrong. I’ve got no problem being wrong, and I’m going to watch it again, but did anyone else hear, “Are you Annie Locke?” in that final scene? I’m having a hard time with, “Annie Locke,” and, “Mrs. Hawking”, sounding the same.

    Either way, I’m going to re-watch the premiere and will be happily surprised if I catch my error. :D[/quote]
    see comment 257

  322. Toeknee says:

    [quote comment=”308878″]I am new to this site, but I have to say it’s nearly unavoidable that Locke is still alive, comatose from the spider venom.

    Directly after Jack asks if he’s actually dead (Ben doesn’t answer), it switches right to Hugo’s dad watching Expose. That’s too obvious. Locke is alive.[/quote]
    I can buy that. But two things make me think he really is dead:
    1. Alpert says to Locke that he’s going to have to die in order to get the O6 to come back to the island. Alpert didn’t say he’ll have to fake his death.
    2. For him to be alive, the funeral home would have to be in on the hoax too. Otherwise, the funeral home would have embalmed his body. Although, I suppose it’s possible that the funeral home is in on it.
    3.the effect of the spider’s bite only last for a few hours. So to maintain this hoax, Ben would have to routinely stop by to have another spider bite Locke. Possible, of course, but a bit far-fetched, IMHO.

  323. PJSander says:

    Rewatched “Because You Left” with my hubby tonight. He caught up (from non-watcher to addict) over the break, so he had a few newbie questions. One funny one was, “So if Sawyer chops down a tree, and then stands on the stump when the sky turns white…”

    [quote comment=”308879″]Maybe this is too obvious, but I don’t remember anyone specifically mentioning it, so I’ll go ahead and do it. The guys in Sayid’s safe house shot him with a tranquilizer gun, and that makes me think they’re part of Ben’s team – they were there to capture Sayid so he can be brought to the island. And to take this a step further, this must mean the guy outside of Santa Rosa whom Sayid killed last season was probably also part of Ben’s team, waiting to get Hurley out of there to bring him to the island too.[/quote]

    Good point. Of course the guy watching Hurley might have been working for just about ANYONE trying to keep Hurley safe. Widmore, Paik, Abaddon, Charlie. *gg*

    : ) P

  324. DocH says:

    [quote] Remember that it was not long after he “ended up” in October 2005 (after turning the FDW) that he saw Sayid in the procession.
    – – – –
    If Ben had Nadia killed, he wouldn’t have had to be there personally to do it, he would just have ordered it done by his minions (he seems to have plenty of those). I think Ben uses a lot of truth in his lies, which makes it very hard to know which parts are which.[/quote]
    – – – – According to LP
    20 Oct 05: Nadia assassinated SoCal.
    24 Oct 05: Ben arrives Tunisia, sees Sayid on TV.
    25 Oct 05: Ben & Sayid in Iraq.
    26 Oct 05: Sayid kills assassin.

    With all of the ‘Time Jumping’, Bens’ butcher friend in LA probably knew he was coming at a certain time and ‘took care’ of Nadia, so Ben could recruit Sayid – ultimately to get him back to the island. Makes sense that the safe house ambush was part of Team-Ben corraling Sayid, once he strayed from his earlier recruitment.

  325. jay says:

    [quote comment=”308881″][quote comment=”308878″]I am new to this site, but I have to say it’s nearly unavoidable that Locke is still alive, comatose from the spider venom.

    Directly after Jack asks if he’s actually dead (Ben doesn’t answer), it switches right to Hugo’s dad watching Expose. That’s too obvious. Locke is alive.[/quote]
    I can buy that. But two things make me think he really is dead:
    1. Alpert says to Locke that he’s going to have to die in order to get the O6 to come back to the island. Alpert didn’t say he’ll have to fake his death.
    2. For him to be alive, the funeral home would have to be in on the hoax too. Otherwise, the funeral home would have embalmed his body. Although, I suppose it’s possible that the funeral home is in on it.
    3.the effect of the spider’s bite only last for a few hours. So to maintain this hoax, Ben would have to routinely stop by to have another spider bite Locke. Possible, of course, but a bit far-fetched, IMHO.[/quote]

    I agree it seems far-fetched, but the show thrives on that.
    1. I think that Alpert’s comment would work either way. Locke “died” to the O6 in order to get them to come back. Death was the only way to move them to action.
    2. It’s clearly a low-budget funeral home that Ben/the Others could’ve used as part of the hoax.
    3. As I recall, the spider bite lasted for quite a while, and I’m sure a concentrated dose would have longer effects. One could probably harvest the venom to use as a weapon.

    The only other option is that the writers are trying to trick us into thinking that by placing the show directly after that conversation, which is always a possibility!

  326. Amber says:

    The comment about Widmore being the captian of the black rock and him “discovering” it first such a good theory!!! I love lost and have never been on here and spent all night reading this stuff! Keep more coming

  327. LizS says:

    Love reading all the comments, though my head is officially spinning! I didn’t think I’d go back to LOST, because of all the deaths of fav characters, but I did, and I have to say I liked it loads. Tho I’m still upset reg. Charlie. Eh, life goes on, in one form or another, and apparently some afterlife as well.

    Just a few comments–no theories!

    1.Locke-shot–leg collapse in the past/future: Oh, that is good! I got a chill when I read that one

    2.Whispers–awesome re: echoes of time-traveling folks

    3.Redshirt blaze-o-glory flameout–well, you could see it coming, but it was still funny, in that dastardly sick way. Love Rose & Bernard, but hopefully they will have more story and less bicker-banter, more loving-amusing-bicker banter. They’re great characters, don’t mess!!!!

    4.Time-travel–even when you do it well, and it eventually kinda makes sense, it’s confusing, so I reserve judgment. As long as it keeps its own logic, I’m good. We got one rule–you can’t change the past. So who died, is dead, boo hoo. But if you time travel to the ‘past’, you could do something in the past and still not be changing anything, since you, uh, already did it, just not YET. So Daniel talking to Des, can be seen in that light, but Sawyer knocking got nowhere.

    5.4 toed statue–LOL re Sawyer and the ‘lost’ toe. That is so awesome and funny. We’ll see!

    6.And I do love Hurley–I thought he came back into his own these eps. Sun, she’s definitely playing Kate. Whidmore–love, love, love the Black Rock captain idea. And Jack, I’m afraid he’s doomed to be the next Jacob. If he isn’t already. Jack short for… Well, y’all probably went there already. : )

    Y’all are pretty amazing! Thanks for all the fun theory to digest. Cheers.

  328. Hammer says:

    [quote comment=”308604″]When Boone died, Locke couldn’t move his legs. At the time, I never understood why. But in this episode, Locke gets shot in the leg at the same spot and can’t walk. No idea if we can draw any conclusion from this, as too much thinking about time travel makes me go crossed eyed.[/quote]
    Yeah Stymie, that scene I think was to show more evidence of Locke’s destiny and connection to the island. You can uncross your eyes if you remove your preconceived ideas of time travel like in “Back to the Future” and let the show tell you their version.

  329. Hammer says:

    [quote comment=”308838″][quote comment=”308819″]1. If Richard, Ethan and the Others are not affected by the time shifts why is Juliet?[/quote]

    Well see, I think this is one of those things that kind of proves Hammer’s the-Others-are-Whisperers theory. Ethan is DEAD in “current island time” *CIT* (early January 2005). Charlie killed him a “few months ago” when he was after Claire. So Ethan does not exist in CIT. I believe Captain Eyeliner and the Others must not REALLY exist in CIT, or they would have moved WITH Locke. If they are NOT Whisperers, they are at least not of CIT for SOME reason.

    : ) P[/quote]
    ++++++++
    Thanks PJ, you have a firm grasp of my theory. Which doesn’t prove it correct, but at least understandable. :)

  330. Hammer says:

    [quote comment=”308846″][quote comment=”308546″][quote comment=”308533″]…what happened to sayid to make him think that way, have we already seen it and i missed something?
    [/quote]
    I was thinking about that too. Something tells we’ll find out Ben had Nadia killed so he could recruit Sayid.[/quote]
    __________________________
    I think this was strongly implied in last season’s episodes (that Ben had Nadia killed), and back then I didn’t think they would ever clearly spell it out in an upcoming episode. But seeing how Sayid is now against Ben, I think you’re right – they’ll show Sayid finding out the truth and this will turn him against Ben.[/quote]
    ++++++++++
    I really don’t think Ben’s people killed Nadia, they don’t operate that way. They don’t kill innocent people. I think Ben used her accidental death against Widmore. I think Sayid figures that out or figures that he doesn’t want to be part of Ben’s deal, which is a mistake as Ben’s deal is to save ‘us all’.

  331. Nikki Loves Lost says:

    I am new to the site. We still need to see when and how Locke tries to convince the 6 survivors to come back to the island. What was his ALIAS? They did state they had some contact with him since getting off the island right? Also the Annie Locke question I rewound that part because I thought Ben said “any luck?”
    Just my observation. Maybe my hearing is bad.

  332. Rita says:

    [quote comment=”308989″]I am new to the site. We still need to see when and how Locke tries to convince the 6 survivors to come back to the island. What was his ALIAS? They did state they had some contact with him since getting off the island right? Also the Annie Locke question I rewound that part because I thought Ben said “any luck?”
    Just my observation. Maybe my hearing is bad.[/quote]
    ___________________________________
    I’m with you Nikki, Ben already knows the woman, clearly, so he wouldn’t have had to ask her to confirm her identity. Her response was appropriate for the question “any luck?”, not “Annie Locke?”. I heard what you heard.

  333. Hammer says:

    [quote comment=”308989″]I am new to the site. We still need to see when and how Locke tries to convince the 6 survivors to come back to the island. What was his ALIAS? They did state they had some contact with him since getting off the island right? Also the Annie Locke question I rewound that part because I thought Ben said “any luck?”
    Just my observation. Maybe my hearing is bad.[/quote]
    Welcome.

    His alias was Jeremy Bentham.

    And yes, this Anne Locke stuff is funny. That doesn’t even make sense in the conversation. He asks “Any luck?”, she affirms then asks the same of him. If he asked “Anne Lock?” and she affirms and asks the same, his answer of his status of getting the group together wouldn’t fit. :)

  334. PJSander says:

    [quote comment=”308604″]When Boone died, Locke couldn’t move his legs. At the time, I never understood why. But in this episode, Locke gets shot in the leg at the same spot and can’t walk. No idea if we can draw any conclusion from this, as too much thinking about time travel makes me go crossed eyed.[/quote]

    One idea we can draw from this is that D&C really DID know EXACTLY how things were going to go when they started all this! Crazy brilliant!

    : ) P

  335. Hammer says:

    [quote comment=”308994″][quote comment=”308604″]When Boone died, Locke couldn’t move his legs. At the time, I never understood why. But in this episode, Locke gets shot in the leg at the same spot and can’t walk. No idea if we can draw any conclusion from this, as too much thinking about time travel makes me go crossed eyed.[/quote]

    One idea we can draw from this is that D&C really DID know EXACTLY how things were going to go when they started all this! Crazy brilliant!

    : ) P[/quote]
    Preach on PJ. I still people on our local morning radio shows that think it is being made up as they go and also still hearing that some people still think it’s all in Hugo’s head. Funny…

  336. Bobola says:

    Anyone else notice the Promo photo of Hurley on this site has him standing with black shirt on in front of plane wreckage…(now at the top portion before you click to get into this section)…
    AND;
    the trees in the background are not like any on the island and don’t look tropical at all?
    Is this just some mistake by the photo team?
    Or does it mean something?

    It looks mire like he’s in Northern California or even further north.

    Personally I’m hoping Hurley makes it back to the island into a time zone where there are cannibals and they have him over for a big feast.

    If you were in a lifeboat I’m sure you’d have to kill Hurley just to get your fair share of provisions to survive. Hurley has acted like a little scared girl for me once too often…I’m rooting for him to be gone asap. Just like I don’t miss Charlie and his awful music and sad puppy dog demeanor.
    I like the men who act like men. Even the bad ass ones.
    Ben looks better all the time; he is a man on a Mission and sees past good and bad to do what must be done. His face shows that he does not like injustice (as when his daughter is killed).
    Sayid has shown himself to be WAY OFF as when he tortured Sawyer when he already promised himself NEVER to do that again.
    The Doc is looking better now that he seems to have his own mission again. Bet he and Freckles finally hook up; seems inevitable.
    Where did Freckles get that stash of money?
    She been hitting banks again?
    Or did the Airlines pay her off?
    But why wouldn’t the Police want to know what the hell happened to the guy who had Freckles in custody?
    Doesn’t add up that she’s free now. Hope they write in some dialogue to clear that up because it’s a HUGE hole in the plot for me.
    Sawyer is the best with the cute names for people; wonder what he’d call himself now? Gimpy? Tenderfoot? Red-foot Redneck?
    I guess Miles knew how long that dead animal he brought to camp was because he can communicate with the dead?
    That sure was a weird flaming arrow attack on the Losties; but why FLAMING arrows? That seemed silly.
    Oh so Hollywood. They sure were some bad shots too. And where to hell did they get bows? Bows are not easy to make; you need particular woods and even arrows need a lot of skill to make; and they were shooting them off willy nilly. Pretty fake.
    Hell of a lot easier to pick up rocks and throw them.
    And easier still to wait until everyone’s asleep to attack.
    So very Hollywood.

  337. Lost Chicka says:

    I’m not sure if anyone else has corrected this yet, but the problem is not giving birth on the island, it is concepting on the island! That’s why Ben wanted Kate & Sawyer to hook up, why they were searching for their pregnant women like Sun! So if Miles was just born, not concepted on the island, he would be like Aaron.

  338. Rita says:

    [quote comment=”308998″]I’m not sure if anyone else has corrected this yet, but the problem is not giving birth on the island, it is concepting on the island! That’s why Ben wanted Kate & Sawyer to hook up, why they were searching for their pregnant women like Sun! So if Miles was just born, not concepted on the island, he would be like Aaron.[/quote]
    __________________________
    Good point LOST Chicka, but if Juliette was telling the truth, then Ji Yeon WAS concieved on the island (but born off). I guess then, that SHE is the real special one.

  339. SerbianChris says:

    These are the important things I checked/noticed regarding the first 2 eps.

    First it’s not TOM who gets killed by Locke. His name tag says something like “Matten…” and he looks nothing like Tom, so thats out.

    The old lady hawkings is looking for the island and finds it somewhere near Australia, someone above mentioned Tunisia, I dont know where you got that from, you’re off by half the planet.
    The map hawkings looks at on her pc also shows other locations for the island, we can see that the island move not only in time but also in space. The island ventures close to the poles sometimes, which explains the polar bears on the island.

    The beer in Episode 1 says : Jekyll Island Red Brew.
    Jekyll Island is Georgia beach vacation destination, but im not sure that has anythign to do with georgia.

    The group that’s on the island is moving thru time and is usually 3 years behind the people that are on land in LA. When Des wakes up he had just been talking to Faraday in the past 3 years ago.
    Also Desmond is waiting for his replacement, he asks faraday if he’s the replacement, which means that the old geezer that Kelvin had already died at that point..

    Sun was not sent to LA by Widmore like someone suggested, she was on her way there when Widmore intercepted her at the airport. Sun was also calling someone from her cellphone at the airport and that person didnt pick up, who could it be?

    Sun shows a picture of her baby to Kate, is it because the baby doesnt not grow up, unless it’s on the island? Was sun’s baby born on the island? i forgot.
    if so maybe that means that the baby is always bound to island time, which means the baby cannot grow, it stays the same age unless it’s on the island.

    People born on the island have special powers, like miles for example. and like Richard. Richard too does not age, that is, he stays constant to “Island time”, so basically he does age, but relative to the others who are moving thru time, he stays of constant age. (he meets ben as a child then again later, same with locke).

    Richard also tells locke when he finds him that he didnt go anywhere after the flash, he tells john that only HE did. So richard doesnt not move thru time at all like the others do, his time is bound to that of the island. He’s a constant to it.
    Also th compass he gives john does not point north at all, when we get a look at it it seems to point west.

    And one last thing, I noticed that the young soldier that catches Sawyer and juliet’s name tag is JONES.
    That could be John Simon Jones who later becomes a the travel agent sending people to the island, in one of the episodes.
    It could also possibly be Locke’s great uncle. We know that Locke’s great aunts name was beatrice Jones.
    Just a thought..

  340. Hammer says:

    [quote comment=”308998″]I’m not sure if anyone else has corrected this yet, but the problem is not giving birth on the island, it is concepting on the island! That’s why Ben wanted Kate & Sawyer to hook up, why they were searching for their pregnant women like Sun! So if Miles was just born, not concepted on the island, he would be like Aaron.[/quote]
    Sorry but your are wrong, many women conceived on the island…then died giving premature birth.

    In fact, I think it is why the Others were beginning to have a falling out with Ben. IMO the reason the women were have the problem is because Ben took over this island AND his mom died while giving premature birth to him….seems that the Others were growing impatient with Ben’s inability to fix the problem. And seems the island was ‘punishing’ the Others for following Ben.

    Also, Sun conceived on the island.

  341. Rita says:

    [quote comment=”309002″][quote comment=”308998″]I’m not sure if anyone else has corrected this yet, but the problem is not giving birth on the island, it is concepting on the island! That’s why Ben wanted Kate & Sawyer to hook up, why they were searching for their pregnant women like Sun! So if Miles was just born, not concepted on the island, he would be like Aaron.[/quote]
    Sorry but your are wrong, many women conceived on the island…then died giving premature birth.

    In fact, I think it is why the Others were beginning to have a falling out with Ben. IMO the reason the women were have the problem is because Ben took over this island AND his mom died while giving premature birth to him….seems that the Others were growing impatient with Ben’s inability to fix the problem. And seems the island was ‘punishing’ the Others for following Ben.

    Also, Sun conceived on the island.[/quote]
    ___________________________________
    Hi Hammer. I think LOST Chicka meant that there is a problem giving birth AFTER HAVING CONCIEVED ON the island. Sun is our only known exception, but she didn’t give birth ON the island, so that is probably important.

  342. Nikki Loves Lost says:

    [quote comment=”308979″]Love reading all the comments, though my head is officially spinning! I didn’t think I’d go back to LOST, because of all the deaths of fav characters, but I did, and I have to say I liked it loads. Tho I’m still upset reg. Charlie. Eh, life goes on, in one form or another, and apparently some afterlife as well.

    Just a few comments–no theories!

    1.Locke-shot–leg collapse in the past/future: Oh, that is good! I got a chill when I read that one

    2.Whispers–awesome re: echoes of time-traveling folks

    3.Redshirt blaze-o-glory flameout–well, you could see it coming, but it was still funny, in that dastardly sick way. Love Rose & Bernard, but hopefully they will have more story and less bicker-banter, more loving-amusing-bicker banter. They’re great characters, don’t mess!!!!

    4.Time-travel–even when you do it well, and it eventually kinda makes sense, it’s confusing, so I reserve judgment. As long as it keeps its own logic, I’m good. We got one rule–you can’t change the past. So who died, is dead, boo hoo. But if you time travel to the ‘past’, you could do something in the past and still not be changing anything, since you, uh, already did it, just not YET. So Daniel talking to Des, can be seen in that light, but Sawyer knocking got nowhere.

    5.4 toed statue–LOL re Sawyer and the ‘lost’ toe. That is so awesome and funny. We’ll see!

    6.And I do love Hurley–I thought he came back into his own these eps. Sun, she’s definitely playing Kate. Whidmore–love, love, love the Black Rock captain idea. And Jack, I’m afraid he’s doomed to be the next Jacob. If he isn’t already. Jack short for… Well, y’all probably went there already. : )

    Y’all are pretty amazing! Thanks for all the fun theory to digest. Cheers.[/quote]

    I agree with the Jack/Jacob theory because Claire and Christian are the only other ones you see in there. Family connection.

  343. PJSander says:

    [quote comment=”308979″]
    6.And I do love Hurley–I thought he came back into his own these eps. Sun, she’s definitely playing Kate. Whidmore–love, love, love the Black Rock captain idea. And Jack, I’m afraid he’s doomed to be the next Jacob. If he isn’t already. Jack short for… Well, y’all probably went there already. : )
    [/quote]

    Well actually Jack is a nickname for John. Jake would be the short version of Jacob. But I DO like the family connection thing.

    : ) P

  344. Hammer says:

    Oh I see. At any rate, I don’t think Miles had to be concieved off the island because I think the problem started after the purge, IMO that’s when the ‘punishment’ began.

  345. SerbianChris says:

    #
    [Read Comment]
    Hurley’s Dad
    Comment 225, posted 1 day, 18 hours ago – Quote and reply

    My only problem with this logic (the show’s not yours) is why is the boat considered “with them when they moved” and the kitchenette isn’t?

    Regarding this , it’s pretty simple really. Things that were “built” AFTER the time frame they are in obviously wont be there , it hasnt been built yet.
    But the boat was. The boat WAS built before that point in that so it’s still there.
    That’s all..

  346. Hammer says:

    [quote comment=”309007″]#
    [Read Comment]
    Hurley’s Dad
    Comment 225, posted 1 day, 18 hours ago – Quote and reply

    My only problem with this logic (the show’s not yours) is why is the boat considered “with them when they moved” and the kitchenette isn’t?

    Regarding this , it’s pretty simple really. Things that were “built” AFTER the time frame they are in obviously wont be there , it hasnt been built yet.
    But the boat was. The boat WAS built before that point in that so it’s still there.
    That’s all..[/quote]
    +++++++++++
    Maybe, But if it were about when it were built, then they would have been naked in the time line. The were ON the boat when their traveling started, so it’s with them….like their clothes, etc.

  347. SerbianChris says:

    Regarding the Time line , i think that’s pretty straight forward too.

    When the island disappeared it went approximately 3 years into the past. While the Ocean 6 are in the present relatively speaking.
    So there’s a 3 year difference between the 2 groups.
    But relatively to us the viewers, its all happening at the same time, in the present.
    [The desmond/faraday discussion proves that, as well as other details]

    [Sorry about the multiple posts, my ideas are scattered in time too ;)]

  348. SerbianChris says:

    [quote comment=”309008″][quote comment=”309007″]#
    [Read Comment]
    Hurley’s Dad
    Comment 225, posted 1 day, 18 hours ago – Quote and reply

    My only problem with this logic (the show’s not yours) is why is the boat considered “with them when they moved” and the kitchenette isn’t?

    Regarding this , it’s pretty simple really. Things that were “built” AFTER the time frame they are in obviously wont be there , it hasnt been built yet.
    But the boat was. The boat WAS built before that point in that so it’s still there.
    That’s all..[/quote]
    +++++++++++
    Maybe, But if it were about when it were built, then they would have been naked in the time line. The were ON the boat when their traveling started, so it’s with them….like their clothes, etc.[/quote]
    ————————————————

    I disagree. Here’s why:
    There’s no reason why they’d be naked.
    Their clothes were made before that time line too.
    It’s not about when they wore them, it’s about when the clothes/objects were made. Those clothes had been made way before the plane crash itself. So at that point in time the clothes existed already, but not the tents.
    Faraday explicitly asks for “man made objects or things” in episode 1. Those things have had to be made before the time they are in for them to be there logically.
    The clothes and the boat had already been in existence prior to the time they are in.
    So they’d still be around at that point

  349. PJSander says:

    [quote comment=”309009″]When the island disappeared it went approximately 3 years into the past. While the Ocean 6 are in the present relatively speaking.
    So there’s a 3 year difference between the 2 groups.
    But relatively to us the viewers, its all happening at the same time, in the present.[/quote]

    I don’t agree. We are seeing the OFF island folks in late 2007 or early 2008 because in Season 4, we saw their off-island “flashforwards” during that three year period.

    The ON island folks didn’t GET flashforwards in Season 4. In CIT (from THEIR perspective) it is in the few hours since the helicopter took off and the freighter blew up (real time early 2005).

    [quote comment=”309009″]
    [The desmond/faraday discussion proves that, as well as other details]
    [/quote]

    Again, no. Faraday had the discussion with Desmond somewhere between 2001 and 2004. It just happens that Desmond “remembers” that in early 2008.

    : ) P

  350. Hammer says:

    [quote comment=”309010″][quote comment=”309008″][quote comment=”309007″]#
    [Read Comment]
    Hurley’s Dad
    Comment 225, posted 1 day, 18 hours ago – Quote and reply

    My only problem with this logic (the show’s not yours) is why is the boat considered “with them when they moved” and the kitchenette isn’t?

    Regarding this , it’s pretty simple really. Things that were “built” AFTER the time frame they are in obviously wont be there , it hasnt been built yet.
    But the boat was. The boat WAS built before that point in that so it’s still there.
    That’s all..[/quote]
    +++++++++++
    Maybe, But if it were about when it were built, then they would have been naked in the time line. The were ON the boat when their traveling started, so it’s with them….like their clothes, etc.[/quote]
    ————————————————

    I disagree. Here’s why:
    There’s no reason why they’d be naked.
    Their clothes were made before that time line too.
    It’s not about when they wore them, it’s about when the clothes/objects were made. Those clothes had been made way before the plane crash itself. So at that point in time the clothes existed already, but not the tents.
    Faraday explicitly asks for “man made objects or things” in episode 1. Those things have had to be made before the time they are in for them to be there logically.
    The clothes and the boat had already been in existence prior to the time they are in.
    So they’d still be around at that point[/quote]
    +++++
    I get ya, but why is plane wreckage gone?

  351. SerbianChris says:

    So where in time would you put the on-island group?

    you say that:
    (from THEIR perspective) it is in the few hours since the helicopter took off and the freighter blew up (real time early 2005).

    and I completely agree. But from the perspective of the oceanic six, 3 yrs have passed, correct?

    So there’s a 3 year gap between them, relatively to us. one group is still where they left them and the other is 3 years down the line.

    Which is what i was saying.

    And when Faraday spoke to Desmond he created a new memory that Desmond “remembered” 3 years later in his bed.
    But in fact those events happened simultaneously.

  352. SerbianChris says:

    ————————————————

    I disagree. Here’s why:
    There’s no reason why they’d be naked.
    Their clothes were made before that time line too.
    It’s not about when they wore them, it’s about when the clothes/objects were made. Those clothes had been made way before the plane crash itself. So at that point in time the clothes existed already, but not the tents.
    Faraday explicitly asks for “man made objects or things” in episode 1. Those things have had to be made before the time they are in for them to be there logically.
    The clothes and the boat had already been in existence prior to the time they are in.
    So they’d still be around at that point

    +++++
    I get ya, but why is plane wreckage gone?

    ++++++++++

    Well the plane hasn’t crashed yet!

  353. Hammer says:

    Now your losing me. If the plane didn’t crash, then freighter didn’t come yet, so the zodiac isn’t there yet….so then how do they have the zodiac?

  354. PJSander says:

    [quote comment=”309013″]So where in time would you put the on-island group?[/quote]

    The CIT from the survivors’ perspective is early 2005. The helicopter has just left and the freighter has just exploded. Where they are in “REAL” time depends on which flash just occurred. See comment 284.

    [quote comment=”309013″]
    and I completely agree. But from the perspective of the oceanic six, 3 yrs have passed, correct?[/quote]

    The off-island characters are living in a time which is three years later. But I believe that is because that is the time we are being SHOWN by the producers, NOT because the times are running simultaneously.

    [quote comment=”309013″]
    And when Faraday spoke to Desmond he created a new memory that Desmond “remembered” 3 years later in his bed.
    But in fact those events happened simultaneously.[/quote]

    TO US, yes, they happened simultaneously, because that is what we were SHOWN. But from the characters’ perspectives, I do not think they were simultaneous. The truth is that to be TRUE to the timeline, the scene where we saw Desmond wake up from the dream/memory SHOULD have happened while Desmond et al were still on the life raft. Since it didn’t, we have to accept that Desmond “remembered” the dream three years after it happened.

    The good news, I think, is that the on-island survivors aren’t jumping around in time for three years *from their perspective* while they wait for Desmond to have that dream/memory.

    : ) P

  355. PJSander says:

    [quote comment=”309001″]
    Sun shows a picture of her baby to Kate, is it because the baby doesnt not grow up, unless it’s on the island? Was sun’s baby born on the island? i forgot.[/quote]

    Sun’s baby was conceived on the island and born off island. Remember she was pregnant, which is why Juliet said she should go on the zodiak first.

    [quote comment=”309001″]The old lady hawkings is looking for the island and finds it somewhere near Australia, someone above mentioned Tunisia, I dont know where you got that from, you’re off by half the planet.[/quote]

    If you are referring to my comment 139, I said: I need to find a screenshot of the stuff that Mrs. Hawking was working on… I thought the markings might be the places like Tunisia, and Australia – where anomalies are taking place. The markings appear to have been mostly over water, though. Perhaps those areas coincide with where the island has been or will be.

    I said that I wanted to see Mrs. Hawking’s map more closely to see if Tunisia or Australia were targeted. Tunisia is one of the places where odd things have happened. A polar bear skeleton was found there. Ben “woke up” there after turning the FDW. It is also known as being a place where there are magnetic anomalies.

    Hope that clarifies it.

    : ) P

  356. Hammer says:

    [quote comment=”309017″][quote comment=”309013″]So where in time would you put the on-island group?[/quote]

    The CIT from the survivors’ perspective is early 2005. The helicopter has just left and the freighter has just exploded. Where they are in “REAL” time depends on which flash just occurred. See comment 284.

    [quote comment=”309013″]
    and I completely agree. But from the perspective of the oceanic six, 3 yrs have passed, correct?[/quote]

    The off-island characters are living in a time which is three years later. But I believe that is because that is the time we are being SHOWN by the producers, NOT because the times are running simultaneously.

    [quote comment=”309013″]
    And when Faraday spoke to Desmond he created a new memory that Desmond “remembered” 3 years later in his bed.
    But in fact those events happened simultaneously.[/quote]

    TO US, yes, they happened simultaneously, because that is what we were SHOWN. But from the characters’ perspectives, I do not think they were simultaneous. The truth is that to be TRUE to the timeline, the scene where we saw Desmond wake up from the dream/memory SHOULD have happened while Desmond et al were still on the life raft. Since it didn’t, we have to accept that Desmond “remembered” the dream three years after it happened.

    The good news, I think, is that the on-island survivors aren’t jumping around in time for three years *from their perspective* while they wait for Desmond to have that dream/memory.
    +++++++++++++++
    I like this explaination. I think you are correct that the folks skipping through time are not experiencing an actual 3 years of off island time while skipping around.
    : ) P[/quote]

  357. Circus Mom says:

    [quote comment=”309022″][quote comment=”309017″][quote comment=”309013″]So where in time would you put the on-island group?[/quote]

    The CIT from the survivors’ perspective is early 2005. The helicopter has just left and the freighter has just exploded. Where they are in “REAL” time depends on which flash just occurred. See comment 284.

    [quote comment=”309013″]
    and I completely agree. But from the perspective of the oceanic six, 3 yrs have passed, correct?[/quote]

    The off-island characters are living in a time which is three years later. But I believe that is because that is the time we are being SHOWN by the producers, NOT because the times are running simultaneously.

    [quote comment=”309013″]
    And when Faraday spoke to Desmond he created a new memory that Desmond “remembered” 3 years later in his bed.
    But in fact those events happened simultaneously.[/quote]

    TO US, yes, they happened simultaneously, because that is what we were SHOWN. But from the characters’ perspectives, I do not think they were simultaneous. The truth is that to be TRUE to the timeline, the scene where we saw Desmond wake up from the dream/memory SHOULD have happened while Desmond et al were still on the life raft. Since it didn’t, we have to accept that Desmond “remembered” the dream three years after it happened.

    The good news, I think, is that the on-island survivors aren’t jumping around in time for three years *from their perspective* while they wait for Desmond to have that dream/memory.
    +++++++++++++++
    I like this explaination. I think you are correct that the folks skipping through time are not experiencing an actual 3 years of off island time while skipping around.
    : ) P[/quote][/quote]
    ++++++++++++++
    If the O6 return to the island while it is in 2004 then in effect they will have never left. This could be the course correction.

  358. Circus Mom says:

    [quote comment=”309015″]Now your losing me. If the plane didn’t crash, then freighter didn’t come yet, so the zodiac isn’t there yet….so then how do they have the zodiac?[/quote]
    SerbianChris, I’m with Hammer. Just going by Daniels comment that what is with them stays with them it’s clear that it is what they are touching or wearing.

  359. Circus Mom says:

    The women at the butcher shop was at the auction for the black rock journal.

  360. duke says:

    [quote comment=”308877″]I’m late to the game, and I only read up to comment 300-something. So… Me… Off my game, but… In the last scene, I thought Ben said (in the church scene with Fionnula Flanagan,) “Are you Annie Locke?” Obviously, from comments here and on other sites, and Fionnula Flangan’s IMDB page, I’m wrong. I’ve got no problem being wrong, and I’m going to watch it again, but did anyone else hear, “Are you Annie Locke?” in that final scene? I’m having a hard time with, “Annie Locke,” and, “Mrs. Hawking”, sounding the same.

    Either way, I’m going to re-watch the premiere and will be happily surprised if I catch my error. :D[/quote]
    Ben said ANY LUCK not annie locke. He was referencing her find the time to make it back to the island

  361. Byanka says:

    [quote comment=”308372″]I just read up on Charlotte….

    some things I just noticed. (If it’s true)

    She was raised with 2 younger sisters…who might they be?

    She attended Oxford University.

    I am sure almost everyone knows this but I forgot and am sure someone might find it interesting.

    Oh yeah….and what is the significance that she can’t remember her Mother’s Maiden name? Maybe it’s a clue. Someone we already know about?

    You know something else I just realized….it would seem like most of the main characters from lost are an only child. I am sure everyone knew that from season 1 but I guess I get so caught up in the deep stuff i miss the obvious.[/quote]

  362. Byanka says:

    about the only child part…but Jack is not an only child…claire is his 1/2 sister.

  363. PJSander says:

    [quote comment=”309123″]about the only child part…but Jack is not an only child…claire is his 1/2 sister.[/quote]

    True. Except that he THOUGHT he was an only child and was certainly RAISED as an only child.

    Anyway, I think Tasha’s point was that MOST of the main characters were only children. Indeed MOST of the characters didn’t have much waiting for them back home.

    : ) P

  364. Circus Mom says:

    Charlie also had a brother.

  365. intolost says:

    This season is going to be awesome!
    1. Dr. Candle!!! Woohoo!!!!
    2. Am I crazy or was that Sun and Jack together and they have a baby? Did anyone else think that?
    3. The rules, the rules, the rules…. I think figuring out “the rules” is going to be a big part of this season. This is part of some overall larger “game.” So, “the rules” have to do with the time travel? Didn’t Alpert say the rules don’t apply to Locke? I still want to know how and why Widmore “changed the rules.” How and why does Alpert know the rules? So, Widmore, Ben, and Alpert know the rules. I suppose Jacob does too. Hmmmmm….
    4. Did Ben decide to move the island since Widmore changed the rules? The rules changed, so now the effects of moving the island are irrelevant and meaningless to Ben? I wonder if Ben really cares about protecting the island. He’s just out to get Widmore and or win “the game.”
    5. I hope Charlotte has a constant.
    6. Should be real interesting to see how Ben manages to get Sun, Sayid, and Hurley back to the island. Did Widmore change the rules once again, since whatever Ben’s plan is seems to have been foiled in at least one aspect by Hurley’s arrest?
    7. Why did Des kept having “flashes,” in the previous seasons, i.e. Charlie’s deaths in “Flashed Before Your Eyes,” and the other losties didn’t?
    8. Charlotte can’t remember her mom’s maiden name? Okay, so who is Charlotte a half-sister to?
    9. Yeah, where’s Charlie?
    10. Penny, are you running???
    11. Yes, they want Aaron for testing. Whoever they are, that is.

  366. Circus Mom says:

    Interlost,

    #2 That was Marvin Candle and his wife and the baby was probably Miles.

    #3 Daniele said the rules don’t apply to Desmond.

    #7 Because Des turned the fail safe key and was closer to the event.

    #8 Charlotte has two sisters. We don’t know who they are or might be yet.

  367. Toeknee says:

    [quote comment=”309133″]
    2. Am I crazy or was that Sun and Jack together and they have a baby? Did anyone else think that?
    [/quote]
    I did think that at first – see comment #210. (I’m glad I wasn’t the only one who thought that)

  368. Toeknee says:

    [quote comment=”309087″]The women at the butcher shop was at the auction for the black rock journal.[/quote]
    Is that true!? If so, great catch, CircusMom! Now, what does that mean…?

  369. PJSander says:

    [quote comment=”309087″]The women at the butcher shop was at the auction for the black rock journal.[/quote]

    I looked at the screencaps of the auction and see a woman who looks similar, but do not see Jill from the butcher shop.

    http://tinyurl.com/auctionfolk

    Which one is it that you think is Jill?

    : ) P

  370. PJSander says:

    Here is another:

    http://tinyurl.com/auctionfolk2

    : ) P

  371. Hammer says:

    Forgive me if this was already brought this EXTRA SUPPORT that Ms. Hawking is Dan’s mom….we know Dan told Des that he’s the only one that can help them and to find Dan’s mom…since Ms. Hawking is the only one that knows where the island is and it seems Dan knows this… Ms. Hawking = Dan’s mom.

  372. curlygirl says:

    Hey – I am new to this site – but have been a reader for a while now. You guys are GREAT!

    Here’s my thought – flight 815 crashes with all of our favorite characters – (who’s lives have all been intertwined in various ways) and a coffin carrying Christian Shepard. Now we’re trying to find a way to get John Locke’s coffin and the O6 back to the island.

    Maybe the crash of 815 was a similar quest. Maybe there was a group of people who had left the island and they “had to come back” just like our “losties” are doing now!

    I hope that makes sense…

  373. curlygirl says:

    Regarding Faraday:

    When Sawyer goes to knock on the door to the hatch – Faraday says “if it didnt happen – it can’t happen” then after everyone leaves, he goes to the door and bangs on it and Desmond comes out — So clearly Faraday has knocked on the door before…

    He also tells Desmond to go back to “where we met” – when he tells him to go to Oxford.

    What if Faraday put his “constant” on the island purposely, by toying with the weather (from the Hawking as mother nature post above)during the boatrace?

    Also – Not sure if this came up – but Faraday doesnt age either. He looked exactly the same back when they were building the Orchid.

  374. PJSander says:

    [quote comment=”309144″]Forgive me if this was already brought this EXTRA SUPPORT that Ms. Hawking is Dan’s mom….we know Dan told Des that he’s the only one that can help them and to find Dan’s mom…since Ms. Hawking is the only one that knows where the island is and it seems Dan knows this… Ms. Hawking = Dan’s mom.[/quote]

    Along this line of thinking… if Mrs. Hawking is Dan’s mother, and she works with Ben, then either he is on a mission AGAINST his mother or is double-crossing Widmore. Not sure if Dan has the fortitude for that kind of shenanigans, but it is a thought.

    Also, in Daniel’s first flashback, we see him crying while watching the footage of the faux O815 on the ocean floor, but he tells the woman with him that he doesn’t know why he is so upset. Could this be because subconsciously he knows what really happened because he has already been there, but doesn’t remember time-traveling there?

    : ) P

  375. Miraks says:

    Few things after re-watching the show.
    1. In the beginning we see the woman tell the man to get the BABY, not him or her. We also never see the man’s face, although we are led to believe that it is the dr. who walks into the studio later on. Could the baby actually be Sun?

    2. Before we see the Islanders for the first time there is a screen caption that says “three years earlier”. I think that is a pretty strong indicator that we are seeing the Islanders three years back, not in the same time that the O6 are. I think this season we’ll see what the O6 are doing in the 70 hour span that they have between now and them returning to the island. At the same time we’ll see what happened to the Islanders in the three years since the O6 left.

    3. Faraday tells Juliett “we are, your people are not” when explaining to Sawyer that they are moving through time on the way to the hatch.

    4. Talking about time jumping.
    Sawyer: How can we stop it?
    Faraday: We can’t.
    Sawyer: Then who can?
    No answer.
    Later Faraday tells Desmond that he is special and the only one who can help them.

    5. Hurley asks Sayid why he killed the guy outside of the asylum. Sayid says that he is “not taking any risks after Locke died”. Does that mean Locke was killed and it was made to look like suicide?

    6. Very iffy on Sun nowadays. She shows up just as KAte goes on the run. It is also pretty obvious that they have not kept in touch or seen each other in the last three years. (Sun shows Kate picture of baby AND tells her the babies name- something Kate would have known if they had stayed in touch). After Kate tells her about her problem Sun asks: Wouldn’t you do anything to keep Aaron? Kate replies: What kind of person do you think I am? Sounds to me like Sun was seeing if she could recruit Kate for something.

  376. Bobola says:

    Just saw a rerun of the new episodes tonite;
    Man, they are really pushing this series bigtime.

    Another point about how dumb as rocks Hurley is;
    He’s on the run and doesn’t even change his looks except to buy a shirt that the gal at check out can later tell the cops about;
    a distinctive design with a Chiwawa (or some other little doggie)!
    Not haircut, or even pulling back that horrid mess into a ponytail, no sunglasses, no hat….
    Oh yeah; He hates “to lie”….ha.
    And he’s stupid enough to hang out over the railing at the safe house holding a weapon everyone to see…and think he’s been the killer.
    Dumbsville. OK, just have some more “comfort food”.

    And when Ben shows up in the kitchen he throws the burrito at the wall like a 10 year little sissy.
    I just saw the writers on TV saying he’s central to the series?
    They may lose me as a viewer soon.
    My friend who has been really in to LOST has just said the same.
    More Albert, more Sun, more Sawyer, more Miles, hell, more Polar bear…anyone but that Hurley.

  377. SerbianChris says:

    [quote comment=”309015″]Now your losing me. If the plane didn’t crash, then freighter didn’t come yet, so the zodiac isn’t there yet….so then how do they have the zodiac?[/quote]

    ——————————————-
    Hammer,

    Remember at that point we are around the time when Desmond had recently arrived to the island he’s still wearing the suit. Also At that point Yemi’s plane hasn’t crashed yet either, it crashes a little later in front of Locke.
    And we know that these events happen before the Oceanic plane crash. Which is why the actual oceanic wreckage isnt there at that point in time.

    Keep in mind that time travel is full of paradoxes not to mention impossible. You wont find easy answers, this is just the way they wrote the story. :)

  378. SerbianChris says:

    PJSanders wrote:

    “The truth is that to be TRUE to the timeline, the scene where we saw Desmond wake up from the dream/memory SHOULD have happened while Desmond et al were still on the life raft. Since it didn’t, we have to accept that Desmond “remembered” the dream three years after it happened.”

    This is why im saying that there’s a 3 yr gap.
    Because desmond remembers it when he does. (3yrs later, while it just happened 3 yrs earlier)
    I beleive the timeline is correct, although i do see your point, you’re making sense.
    But Desmond remembers this event right after his memory was formed. (which is present island time, and 3 yrs later off-island time)

    Similar thing happen with desmond/faraday with the whole eloise thing last season.
    After desmond “traveled” to the past and spoke to young faraday, the old faraday (in the present) remembered the event and found it in his notes (note regarding desmond “was formed” in the present

    At the end of the day, it’s all relative to each party. There are 3 timeline perspectives here. Ours (the viewer’s) the island’s and the O6’s.
    We the viewers are looking down at a paper with 2 dots on a line, the dots being the off and on island group. those dots are moving at the same time to us looking at it, one of them is moving at a constant normal speed straight forward(the O6) and the other (on-island group) keeps moving around all over that line. So it’s all relative to each perspective.

    In any case, this issue isnt that important, i mean that isnt going to help us figure out too much whats going on there, we know that time travel is there.
    We need to know why and how, whats special Richard and Walt, and miles, who’s hawkings, what is “the plan” and why do ben and widmore have so much beef, what exactly did Sawyer step on and why is it important, this is what i want to know, among a million other things haha :D

  379. SerbianChris says:

    [quote comment=”309174″]Few things after re-watching the show.
    1. In the beginning we see the woman tell the man to get the BABY, not him or her. We also never see the man’s face, although we are led to believe that it is the dr. who walks into the studio later on. Could the baby actually be Sun?

    ————————————————

    -> It’s possible , everythign is, could be Sun, Jin, Miles or none of the above. But it isnt very likely, how does the baby being Sun help the plot at all?
    Besides We know what Sun’s parents look like already, and it’s not them.

    ——————————————-

    3. Faraday tells Juliett “we are, your people are not” when explaining to Sawyer that they are moving through time on the way to the hatch.
    —————————————————-
    -> I just saw that part again, Farady tell Juliet:
    “it’s just as likely that we’re moving (thru time) , your people AND US”

    and NOT “we are, your people are not”
    “your people And US” is what he says.

    —————————————————
    4. Talking about time jumping.
    Sawyer: How can we stop it?
    Faraday: We can’t.
    Sawyer: Then who can?
    No answer.
    Later Faraday tells Desmond that he is special and the only one who can help them.
    —————————————————
    -> True , good point. But right after Sawyer says, “Then who can?” The camera shows us Locke.
    I dont think thats a coincidence. I believe locke plays a important role in stopping it
    ————————————————–

    5. Hurley asks Sayid why he killed the guy outside of the asylum. Sayid says that he is “not taking any risks after Locke died”. Does that mean Locke was killed and it was made to look like suicide?
    ————————————————–
    -> thats a good point. but why would you say suicide?
    Do we know that Locke committed suicide?

    ————————————————-

    6. Very iffy on Sun nowadays. She shows up just as KAte goes on the run. It is also pretty obvious that they have not kept in touch or seen each other in the last three years. (Sun shows Kate picture of baby AND tells her the babies name- something Kate would have known if they had stayed in touch). After Kate tells her about her problem Sun asks: Wouldn’t you do anything to keep Aaron? Kate replies: What kind of person do you think I am? Sounds to me like Sun was seeing if she could recruit Kate for something.[/quote]
    ———————————————
    -> I dont think they stayed in touch, cause one lives in Korea the other in LA and when Sun calls Kate seems very surprised to hear her, it’s obvious they arent very close.
    As far at Sun recruiting Kate, I dont see it. I think Sun knows something we dont, she obviously has some information and some kind of plan. And I think she sees the importance of Aaron and encourages Kate to do anything in her power to protect him, but thats all.

  380. SerbianChris says:

    Few things after re-watching the show.
    1. In the beginning we see the woman tell the man to get the BABY, not him or her. We also never see the man’s face, although we are led to believe that it is the dr. who walks into the studio later on. Could the baby actually be Sun?

    ————————————————

    -> It’s possible , everythign is, could be Sun, Jin, Miles or none of the above. But it isnt very likely, how does the baby being Sun help the plot at all?
    Besides We know what Sun’s parents look like already, and it’s not them.

    ——————————————-

    3. Faraday tells Juliett “we are, your people are not” when explaining to Sawyer that they are moving through time on the way to the hatch.
    —————————————————-
    -> I just saw that part again, Farady tell Juliet:
    “it’s just as likely that we’re moving (thru time) , your people AND US”

    and NOT “we are, your people are not”
    “your people And US” is what he says.

    —————————————————
    4. Talking about time jumping.
    Sawyer: How can we stop it?
    Faraday: We can’t.
    Sawyer: Then who can?
    No answer.
    Later Faraday tells Desmond that he is special and the only one who can help them.
    —————————————————
    -> True , good point. But right after Sawyer says, “Then who can?” The camera shows us Locke.
    I dont think thats a coincidence. I believe locke plays a important role in stopping it
    ————————————————–

    5. Hurley asks Sayid why he killed the guy outside of the asylum. Sayid says that he is “not taking any risks after Locke died”. Does that mean Locke was killed and it was made to look like suicide?
    ————————————————–
    -> thats a good point. but why would you say suicide?
    Do we know that Locke committed suicide?

    ————————————————-

    6. Very iffy on Sun nowadays. She shows up just as KAte goes on the run. It is also pretty obvious that they have not kept in touch or seen each other in the last three years. (Sun shows Kate picture of baby AND tells her the babies name- something Kate would have known if they had stayed in touch). After Kate tells her about her problem Sun asks: Wouldn’t you do anything to keep Aaron? Kate replies: What kind of person do you think I am? Sounds to me like Sun was seeing if she could recruit Kate for something.
    ———————————————
    -> I dont think they stayed in touch, cause one lives in Korea the other in LA and when Sun calls Kate seems very surprised to hear her, it’s obvious they arent very close.
    As far at Sun recruiting Kate, I dont see it. I think Sun knows something we dont, she obviously has some information and some kind of plan. And I think she sees the importance of Aaron and encourages Kate to do anything in her power to protect him, but thats all.

  381. SerbianChris says:

    [quote comment=”309149″]Regarding Faraday:

    When Sawyer goes to knock on the door to the hatch – Faraday says “if it didnt happen – it can’t happen” then after everyone leaves, he goes to the door and bangs on it and Desmond comes out — So clearly Faraday has knocked on the door before…

    He also tells Desmond to go back to “where we met” – when he tells him to go to Oxford.

    What if Faraday put his “constant” on the island purposely, by toying with the weather (from the Hawking as mother nature post above)during the boatrace?

    Also – Not sure if this came up – but Faraday doesnt age either. He looked exactly the same back when they were building the Orchid.[/quote]

    As far as Faraday knocking on the hatch before it’s possible. But I think that Faraday realizes he can change something after he sees his Charlotte’s nose bleed.
    I think that its a very important detail. Her nose bleed is the cue. It triggers something for Faraday who realizes he can make a change at that point, which is why he runs to his bag and pull out the notes.

    -its possible that her nose bleed is due to the lack of a constant? is this why he sends Desmond to his mom? Then that would mean that there’s a connection between Charlotte, The mom, and Faraday.

    As far as faraday aging, i think he does. Those who dont age (like richard) dont time travel either.
    We know that faraday does time travel (during the purple sky events) so he does age.
    I think he was the same age at the orchid because he succeeded in time traveling there. but we’ll know more about this later.

  382. SerbianChris says:

    [quote comment=”309076″][quote comment=”309015″]Now your losing me. If the plane didn’t crash, then freighter didn’t come yet, so the zodiac isn’t there yet….so then how do they have the zodiac?[/quote]
    SerbianChris, I’m with Hammer. Just going by Daniels comment that what is with them stays with them it’s clear that it is what they are touching or wearing.[/quote]

    When did Faraday say that?
    What he said is, that things didn’t disappear “they arent there cause they werent built yet” at that point.
    Which is logical of course, I think thats pretty straight forward.

    Touching something doesnt make any common sense from a physics point of view, or otherwise.
    And if that were true then most of the camp would still be there cause a lot of people were in the camp (like rose who was in the church), and the whole camp disapeared while people were in it and “touching” it.
    No logic there..

  383. Hammer says:

    [quote comment=”309292″][quote comment=”309076″][quote comment=”309015″]Now your losing me. If the plane didn’t crash, then freighter didn’t come yet, so the zodiac isn’t there yet….so then how do they have the zodiac?[/quote]
    SerbianChris, I’m with Hammer. Just going by Daniels comment that what is with them stays with them it’s clear that it is what they are touching or wearing.[/quote]

    When did Faraday say that?
    What he said is, that things didn’t disappear “they arent there cause they werent built yet” at that point.
    Which is logical of course, I think thats pretty straight forward.

    Touching something doesnt make any common sense from a physics point of view, or otherwise.
    And if that were true then most of the camp would still be there cause a lot of people were in the camp (like rose who was in the church), and the whole camp disapeared while people were in it and “touching” it.
    No logic there..[/quote]
    +++++++
    We’ll have to agree to diagree because what’s isn’t logical is the zodiac being there. It didn’t happen yet, so the only logicial reason I see is that they were using during the shift. Just like Locke’s knifes were on his belt and everyone’s clothes are on them. You had mentioned once that it wouldn’t make sense that they show up naked….remember Des showing up naked after his turning of the key??? I guess this is one of those “not so important” details too.

  384. Hammer says:

    [quote comment=”309146″]Hey – I am new to this site – but have been a reader for a while now. You guys are GREAT!

    Here’s my thought – flight 815 crashes with all of our favorite characters – (who’s lives have all been intertwined in various ways) and a coffin carrying Christian Shepard. Now we’re trying to find a way to get John Locke’s coffin and the O6 back to the island.

    Maybe the crash of 815 was a similar quest. Maybe there was a group of people who had left the island and they “had to come back” just like our “losties” are doing now!

    I hope that makes sense…[/quote]
    Welcome.

    It makes sense. I would think that person would be Widmore. The only problem is he didn’t come back with his ‘group’. Keep hold of this one and look for supporting info.

  385. Rita says:

    [quote comment=”309289″]
    -> I dont think they stayed in touch, cause one lives in Korea the other in LA and when Sun calls Kate seems very surprised to hear her, it’s obvious they arent very close.
    As far at Sun recruiting Kate, I dont see it. I think Sun knows something we dont, she obviously has some information and some kind of plan. And I think she sees the importance of Aaron and encourages Kate to do anything in her power to protect him, but thats all.[/quote]
    _________________________________________
    Something you said sparked a thought for me: You’re right, they obviously didn’t stay in touch or Sun would not have to be telling Kate what the baby’s name is. So, if they were THAT far out of touch, why does Sun just ASSUME that Kate would know how Jack is? How does Sun know that Kate and Jack are together? There was something weird about WHEN AND HOW Sun asked Kate about Jack. Sun is definitely up to something, and it has to do with Jack.

  386. Rita says:

    [quote comment=”309296″][quote comment=”309146″]Hey – I am new to this site – but have been a reader for a while now. You guys are GREAT!

    Here’s my thought – flight 815 crashes with all of our favorite characters – (who’s lives have all been intertwined in various ways) and a coffin carrying Christian Shepard. Now we’re trying to find a way to get John Locke’s coffin and the O6 back to the island.

    Maybe the crash of 815 was a similar quest. Maybe there was a group of people who had left the island and they “had to come back” just like our “losties” are doing now!

    I hope that makes sense…[/quote]
    Welcome.

    It makes sense. I would think that person would be Widmore. The only problem is he didn’t come back with his ‘group’. Keep hold of this one and look for supporting info.[/quote]
    ____________________________________
    I’ve given this idea some thought and can’t help thinking that this would just leave too much to chance: Even if Widmore didn’t go with his group, in order to plant the fake plane and then clear the island with his mercs before coming himself (reasonable plan), you have to have Desmond off killing Kelvin at just the right moment (so he is late pushing the button, which brings the plane – with the “group” in it), but you also run a lot of risk introducing all the extra people (our heros + all the red shirts). On the other hand, Widmore DOES seem arrogant enough to discount the effects of the extra people, but what about Desmond? Is he really in with Widmore?

  387. DocH says:

    [quote] I really don’t think Ben’s people killed Nadia, they don’t operate that way. [/quote]
    Who says Nadia was an “innocent”? There may be more to her than meets the eye. Ben’s people may operate that way now because the ‘rules have changed’ following the death of Alex.

  388. Trixanna says:

    [quote comment=”309306″][quote comment=”309289″]
    -> I dont think they stayed in touch, cause one lives in Korea the other in LA and when Sun calls Kate seems very surprised to hear her, it’s obvious they arent very close.
    As far at Sun recruiting Kate, I dont see it. I think Sun knows something we dont, she obviously has some information and some kind of plan. And I think she sees the importance of Aaron and encourages Kate to do anything in her power to protect him, but thats all.[/quote]
    _________________________________________
    Something you said sparked a thought for me: You’re right, they obviously didn’t stay in touch or Sun would not have to be telling Kate what the baby’s name is. So, if they were THAT far out of touch, why does Sun just ASSUME that Kate would know how Jack is? How does Sun know that Kate and Jack are together? There was something weird about WHEN AND HOW Sun asked Kate about Jack. Sun is definitely up to something, and it has to do with Jack.[/quote]
    ——————————————–
    Interesting. If they are that far out of touch, which I think they are, then how did Sun have Kate’s cell phone number? Do you suppose Sun is out to get Aaron as revenge somehow? I don’t think Sun can be trusted any longer. She’s not the same sweet Sun we knew on the island.

  389. Amber says:

    Maybe Ben told Sun about the time travel stuff, that there might be a chance that Jin is alive. So Ben told her to set up Widmore. Maybe she wants to get back to the island to look for Jin. just a thought

  390. Circus Mom says:

    [quote comment=”309334″][quote comment=”309296″][quote comment=”309146″]Hey – I am new to this site – but have been a reader for a while now. You guys are GREAT!

    Here’s my thought – flight 815 crashes with all of our favorite characters – (who’s lives have all been intertwined in various ways) and a coffin carrying Christian Shepard. Now we’re trying to find a way to get John Locke’s coffin and the O6 back to the island.

    Maybe the crash of 815 was a similar quest. Maybe there was a group of people who had left the island and they “had to come back” just like our “losties” are doing now!

    I hope that makes sense…[/quote]
    Welcome.

    It makes sense. I would think that person would be Widmore. The only problem is he didn’t come back with his ‘group’. Keep hold of this one and look for supporting info.[/quote]
    ____________________________________
    I’ve given this idea some thought and can’t help thinking that this would just leave too much to chance: Even if Widmore didn’t go with his group, in order to plant the fake plane and then clear the island with his mercs before coming himself (reasonable plan), you have to have Desmond off killing Kelvin at just the right moment (so he is late pushing the button, which brings the plane – with the “group” in it), but you also run a lot of risk introducing all the extra people (our heros + all the red shirts). On the other hand, Widmore DOES seem arrogant enough to discount the effects of the extra people, but what about Desmond? Is he really in with Widmore?[/quote]
    +++++++++
    I think there is something here, we just havn’t gotten to the bottom of it yet. Perhaps someone who is dead can find the island, or comunicate with it. I always felt that Christian had been there before. Widmore would be like Ben, Christian and Locke play the same roles in returning. When Ben turned the donkey wheele he had tole Locke that whoever moves the island can never return. That may be what Widmore thought. Now Ben is trying anyway?

  391. Circus Mom says:

    OK, I have come up with a simple way to explain why Desmond dosn’t remember to go to Mrs. Hawkins untill 2008.

    If 2004 Daniel had told Desmond to go then he, Desmond, could remember it in 2004.

    Since 2008 Daniel time traveled and told Desmond in 2001-04 he, Desmond, couldn’t remember it until 2008 Daniel actualy existed. Otherwise it could never happen.

    This could be a part of explaining the rules and why Alex couldn’t/shouldn’t be killed. Perhaps someone had traveled to the future and she had been there. If her future self affected the current, or the past, then she had to stay alive or risk not being there to find.

  392. SerbianChris says:

    [quote comment=”309295″][quote comment=”309292″][quote comment=”309076″][quote comment=”309015″]Now your losing me. If the plane didn’t crash, then freighter didn’t come yet, so the zodiac isn’t there yet….so then how do they have the zodiac?[/quote]
    SerbianChris, I’m with Hammer. Just going by Daniels comment that what is with them stays with them it’s clear that it is what they are touching or wearing.[/quote]

    When did Faraday say that?
    What he said is, that things didn’t disappear “they arent there cause they werent built yet” at that point.
    Which is logical of course, I think thats pretty straight forward.

    Touching something doesnt make any common sense from a physics point of view, or otherwise.
    And if that were true then most of the camp would still be there cause a lot of people were in the camp (like rose who was in the church), and the whole camp disapeared while people were in it and “touching” it.
    No logic there..[/quote]
    +++++++
    We’ll have to agree to diagree because what’s isn’t logical is the zodiac being there. It didn’t happen yet, so the only logicial reason I see is that they were using during the shift. Just like Locke’s knifes were on his belt and everyone’s clothes are on them. You had mentioned once that it wouldn’t make sense that they show up naked….remember Des showing up naked after his turning of the key??? I guess this is one of those “not so important” details too.[/quote][b]Hmmm..[/b]

    We can agree to disagree on this one.
    But here’s a few things to consider.

    First, I think that you cannot use desmond as an example, he comes back where he left off, same time frame. So nothing should have happened there.
    He only traveled mentally (his consciousness traveled like eloise).
    Desmond traveled multiple times after that, and he wasnt naked every time. :)

    And Second, you just killed your own theory here, based on what you believe if he was touching his clothes they shouldn’t have disappeared!
    So that sorta eliminates the touching theory.

    And as far as knifes go, just like the clothes they existed prior to that time, they weren’t build/created after that event, so no reason they wouldnt be there. They are likely from the island, from Ben’s camp..

    Anyhow, I really dont see the logic of touching something from a physics stand point, it really doesnt make any sense. But obviously if you built something in the future it wont exist yet the the past. Faraday does say that the camp isnt there cause it wasnt built yet.
    The camp disappeared when some of the houses/church had people in it. Just like the zodiac did. ;)

    You ask why the zodiac is there?
    I ask you , why are the losties there!
    After all the plane hasnt crashed yet remember?
    There’s a limit to how far you can go with time travel paradoxes.

  393. gmta leah says:

    [quote comment=”309344″]OK, I have come up with a simple way to explain why Desmond dosn’t remember to go to Mrs. Hawkins untill 2008.

    If 2004 Daniel had told Desmond to go then he, Desmond, could remember it in 2004.

    Since 2008 Daniel time traveled and told Desmond in 2001-04 he, Desmond, couldn’t remember it until 2008 Daniel actualy existed. Otherwise it could never happen.

    This could be a part of explaining the rules and why Alex couldn’t/shouldn’t be killed. Perhaps someone had traveled to the future and she had been there. If her future self affected the current, or the past, then she had to stay alive or risk not being there to find.[/quote]
    hi , good to be back. may i simplyfy further, in saying . if you want to change the future ,you change something in the past .
    Desmond being faradays constant .Desmond was the only thing he had in his past ,present and future .Telling him to go to oxford and find his mother, was something that had happened in the past that they both shared. desmond remembered in 2008 because the memory had been planted in his mind .

  394. gmta leah says:

    could someone remind me whats the zodiac?

  395. SerbianChris says:

    [quote comment=”309346″][quote comment=”309344″]OK, I have come up with a simple way to explain why Desmond dosn’t remember to go to Mrs. Hawkins untill 2008.

    If 2004 Daniel had told Desmond to go then he, Desmond, could remember it in 2004.

    Since 2008 Daniel time traveled and told Desmond in 2001-04 he, Desmond, couldn’t remember it until 2008 Daniel actualy existed. Otherwise it could never happen.

    This could be a part of explaining the rules and why Alex couldn’t/shouldn’t be killed. Perhaps someone had traveled to the future and she had been there. If her future self affected the current, or the past, then she had to stay alive or risk not being there to find.[/quote]
    hi , good to be back. may i simplyfy further, in saying . if you want to change the future ,you change something in the past .
    Desmond being faradays constant .Desmond was the only thing he had in his past ,present and future .Telling him to go to oxford and find his mother, was something that had happened in the past that they both shared. desmond remembered in 2008 because the memory had been planted in his mind .[/quote]

    I agree with you Leah.
    It’s as simple as that. The memory was implanted in his head at a certain point and he remembers it right away although he’s living in a different time frame.

    If you go too deep in thoughts you go into a loop of confusion. Because then you can argue that Desmond actually met Faraday when we has in the Scottish regimen, thats when he went to oxford to meet a certain professor faraday the first time, in 1996. So when he opened the hatch door , he would have remembered him.
    As you see, we’d go into an infinite loop of confusion with this. We gotta take the simplest explanation to move forward with the plot.
    And that explanation is, He told faraday, memory was created, and immediately Desmond remembers it altho he’s physically 3 yrs ahead.

  396. SerbianChris says:

    [quote comment=”309347″]could someone remind me whats the zodiac?[/quote]

    The zodiac is the little raft they were on when the island disappeared. The one they came back to the island with.

  397. SerbianChris says:

    [quote comment=”309347″]could someone remind me whats the zodiac?[/quote]

    The zodiac is the little raft they were on when the island disappeared. The one they came back to the shore with.

  398. Hammer says:

    [quote comment=”309345″][quote comment=”309295″][quote comment=”309292″][quote comment=”309076″][quote comment=”309015″]Now your losing me. If the plane didn’t crash, then freighter didn’t come yet, so the zodiac isn’t there yet….so then how do they have the zodiac?[/quote]
    SerbianChris, I’m with Hammer. Just going by Daniels comment that what is with them stays with them it’s clear that it is what they are touching or wearing.[/quote]

    When did Faraday say that?
    What he said is, that things didn’t disappear “they arent there cause they werent built yet” at that point.
    Which is logical of course, I think thats pretty straight forward.

    Touching something doesnt make any common sense from a physics point of view, or otherwise.
    And if that were true then most of the camp would still be there cause a lot of people were in the camp (like rose who was in the church), and the whole camp disapeared while people were in it and “touching” it.
    No logic there..[/quote]
    +++++++
    We’ll have to agree to diagree because what’s isn’t logical is the zodiac being there. It didn’t happen yet, so the only logicial reason I see is that they were using during the shift. Just like Locke’s knifes were on his belt and everyone’s clothes are on them. You had mentioned once that it wouldn’t make sense that they show up naked….remember Des showing up naked after his turning of the key??? I guess this is one of those “not so important” details too.[/quote][b]Hmmm..[/b]

    We can agree to disagree on this one.
    But here’s a few things to consider.

    First, I think that you cannot use desmond as an example, he comes back where he left off, same time frame. So nothing should have happened there.
    He only traveled mentally (his consciousness traveled like eloise).
    Desmond traveled multiple times after that, and he wasnt naked every time. :)

    And Second, you just killed your own theory here, based on what you believe if he was touching his clothes they shouldn’t have disappeared!
    So that sorta eliminates the touching theory.

    And as far as knifes go, just like the clothes they existed prior to that time, they weren’t build/created after that event, so no reason they wouldnt be there. They are likely from the island, from Ben’s camp..

    Anyhow, I really dont see the logic of touching something from a physics stand point, it really doesnt make any sense. But obviously if you built something in the future it wont exist yet the the past. Faraday does say that the camp isnt there cause it wasnt built yet.
    The camp disappeared when some of the houses/church had people in it. Just like the zodiac did. ;)

    You ask why the zodiac is there?
    I ask you , why are the losties there!
    After all the plane hasnt crashed yet remember?
    There’s a limit to how far you can go with time travel paradoxes.[/quote]
    +++++++++=
    I’ll concede all of you points except one…how is the zodiac there if it hasn’t happended yet? Until the show explains that inconsistency, I will believe that if they had it with them it went with them….just like Juliette said:

    SAWYER: Still in one piece?

    JULIET: As far as I can tell.

    SAWYER: Figured it would have disappeared with the rest of our stuff.

    JULIET: I guess whatever we had with us when we moved is along for the ride.

    …which is the writers way of saying that it is how it happened. So if you want to say ‘touching’ isn’t the reason, fine…but that’s just symantics to me.

  399. Hammer says:

    [quote comment=”309344″]
    This could be a part of explaining the rules and why Alex couldn’t/shouldn’t be killed. Perhaps someone had traveled to the future and she had been there. If her future self affected the current, or the past, then she had to stay alive or risk not being there to find.[/quote]
    +++++
    I am convinced that Ben ‘knew’ Keamy wouldn’t kill Alex because he already knew the future had her in it. I believe that is first rule break that occured. Now Ben is out breaking rules to exact revenge. Ben even admitted that even though he is trying to save the island/world, it’s a secondary motive.

  400. RGS says:

    Well I finally got to watch the episodes on Thursday, and have been too busy with work to read up and comment until today. Lots of good stuff and bad stuff (to me) and definitely lots of comedy, (intentional and unintentional).

    Anyway, I don’t have much to add at this point but I will mention these things:

    1) PJ, I’m going to print up a T-shirt with Charlie’s image on it, similar to the multicolored images of Pres. Obama, with the word HOPE underneath it.

    2) Toeknee I think Michael sees dead Libby twice also.

    3) There will definitely be some unavoidable inconsistencies with the time travel paradox. We just have to accept them and roll with the punches/storyline. A great example is Serbian’s point about Desmond recognizing Daniel when he opens the hatch based on their 1996 meeting. Maybe these things can be explained but I’m thinking it will get chalked up to island mystery.

    4) I think island is moving through time and space. The island disappeared when the folks on the helicopter were looking at it. Someone also pointed out how the drug running plane (bcuz of its size) could not have possibly flown from Africa to Australia, so the island had moved to a point where it suddenly crashed. If it weren’t moving in space, it wouldn’t have disappeared, and Whidmore would have a general idea of where it is at this point.

    5) 2 dudes Ben asks Jill the butcher could possibly be the dudes sent to spook Kate. (Unless you’re living in NYC, and even that I’m sketchy about, who goes to a butcher shop to get meat? How is that place surviving in this economy?)

    6) Love how Kate just barely rolls into the gas station and shuts the engine off. What in the world? You can’t pull into a parking spot?

    7) Place where Hurley gets pulled over by Ana is different from the place he leaves from (parking spot paint on the street before but not after) maybe that suggests that he was imagining it?

    Good stuff folks, good to see the old “faces” and some new “faces” posting after this long hiatus.

  401. RGS says:

    Lol, reading all these posts someone got me to spell Widmore wrong too.

  402. Hammer says:

    SerbianChris…BTW, I don’t if you’ve been hanging out here long enough to know my tendencies, so I want you to know that whenever I get into a debate with folks I usually comment that it’s nothing personal because I never know if my text is coming accross offensive. So I just wanted to say that I appreciate your comments and respect them because they are intelligent and thoughful.

  403. Hammer says:

    [quote comment=”309363″]
    4) I think island is moving through time and space. The island disappeared when the folks on the helicopter were looking at it. Someone also pointed out how the drug running plane (bcuz of its size) could not have possibly flown from Africa to Australia, so the island had moved to a point where it suddenly crashed. If it weren’t moving in space, it wouldn’t have disappeared, and Whidmore would have a general idea of where it is at this point.[/quote]

    Hey RGS. I just wanted to point out that in the past we (posters) agreed that we can discuss official D&C podcasts of episode ‘re-hash’ where they confirm facts for us. There was one the other day and they confirmed that the island did move and the losties are also skipping through time. So it’s both and it’s confirmed. I don’t know how to link things or I would put it here, but it’s easy enough to find.

  404. Hammer says:

    [quote comment=”309363″]5) 2 dudes Ben asks Jill the butcher could possibly be the dudes sent to spook Kate. (Unless you’re living in NYC, and even that I’m sketchy about, who goes to a butcher shop to get meat? How is that place surviving in this economy?)[/quote]

    Good catch.

  405. Hammer says:

    [quote comment=”309346″][quote comment=”309344″]OK, I have come up with a simple way to explain why Desmond dosn’t remember to go to Mrs. Hawkins untill 2008.

    If 2004 Daniel had told Desmond to go then he, Desmond, could remember it in 2004.

    Since 2008 Daniel time traveled and told Desmond in 2001-04 he, Desmond, couldn’t remember it until 2008 Daniel actualy existed. Otherwise it could never happen.

    This could be a part of explaining the rules and why Alex couldn’t/shouldn’t be killed. Perhaps someone had traveled to the future and she had been there. If her future self affected the current, or the past, then she had to stay alive or risk not being there to find.[/quote]
    hi , good to be back. may i simplyfy further, in saying . if you want to change the future ,you change something in the past .
    Desmond being faradays constant .Desmond was the only thing he had in his past ,present and future .Telling him to go to oxford and find his mother, was something that had happened in the past that they both shared. desmond remembered in 2008 because the memory had been planted in his mind .[/quote]
    +++++++++++++++

    Hey gmta leah.

    I think everyone is on the right tract with this. By Dan telling Des that he is special and the rules don’t apply to him, we know that they are ‘bending’ rules of time travel somehow to explain how they are doing it.

  406. Hammer says:

    [quote comment=”309367″]Lol, reading all these posts someone got me to spell Widmore wrong too.[/quote]
    That was probablly me. I do a real crappy job of editing before I submit. Shocking revelation eh?

  407. Hammer says:

    [quote comment=”309336″][quote] I really don’t think Ben’s people killed Nadia, they don’t operate that way. [/quote]
    Who says Nadia was an “innocent”? There may be more to her than meets the eye. Ben’s people may operate that way now because the ‘rules have changed’ following the death of Alex.[/quote]
    +++++++++
    I did because we haven’t seen anything yet. But you bring up a good point. Ben did decide to ignore the innocents on the freighter while plunging a knife into Keamy.

  408. SerbianChris says:

    [quote comment=”309357″]
    +++++++++=
    I’ll concede all of you points except one…how is the zodiac there if it hasn’t happended yet? Until the show explains that inconsistency, I will believe that if they had it with them it went with them….just like Juliette said:

    SAWYER: Still in one piece?

    JULIET: As far as I can tell.

    SAWYER: Figured it would have disappeared with the rest of our stuff.

    JULIET: I guess whatever we had with us when we moved is along for the ride.

    …which is the writers way of saying that it is how it happened. So if you want to say ‘touching’ isn’t the reason, fine…but that’s just symantics to me.[/quote]

    —————————————————-

    I think that what they mean is that what was within the radius of the island when it moved stayed. Cause the camp was with them too when they moved yet it isnt along for the ride.

    Dont get me wrong, its very confusing !
    I agree with you on that, the raft being there although its prior to the crash doesnt make common sense you’re right, but neither does the fact that the losties are there since the plane hasnt cashed yet. And so many other things get confusing at that point if you think about them too hard. Like the desmond thing and so many others.

    Time travel is the most confusing paradoxical event ever.

    If I was to travel back in time and kill my own Grandfather before he fathered my father, would I ever come to exist? More importantly if I didn’t exist, who went back and killed my Grandfather?

    There’s no straight forward solution for this, even quantum physisist cant give you answers there. They’ll tell you that if you had travelled in the past your sheer existence there would change the world drastically, so much so that you would detach from your previous universe and go into a parallel one. But that discussion is for another time and a place :)

    we need to take the simplest explanation to go with the plot. Which ever you choose if fine, i dont think that is so important as far as the plot goes. We have so many other things to figure out. Like the relationship between all the people and how the all know each other.

    Here’s one for you:

  409. SerbianChris says:

    How was Hawkings able to meet Desmond in one of his old travels, how did she know where he would appear and when (when she met him at the jewelry store last season after he time traveled there)
    Thats an important one.
    Does she have the power to control each ones consciousness travels? where in time they go and when?
    Does he Pendulum also predict the losties whereabouts in time and space? How did she know that guy with the red shoes was about to die, at that time and in that place?

  410. SerbianChris says:

    [quote comment=”309368″]SerbianChris…BTW, I don’t if you’ve been hanging out here long enough to know my tendencies, so I want you to know that whenever I get into a debate with folks I usually comment that it’s nothing personal because I never know if my text is coming across offensive. So I just wanted to say that I appreciate your comments and respect them because they are intelligent and thoughful.[/quote]

    Thats very nice of you to say, and I enjoy my debates with you as well!
    And of course not, your comments are great not at all offensive, they are very respectful and i appreciate your take on it all.
    Hope you dont get that feeling from me either.
    I would never get offended here, Lost is our favorite show and that makes us all automatic buddies ;)

  411. Rita says:

    [quote comment=”309006″]Oh I see. At any rate, I don’t think Miles had to be concieved off the island because I think the problem started after the purge, IMO that’s when the ‘punishment’ began.[/quote]
    _______________________________________
    Hammer I’m worried that I offended you. I’m so very sorry, I never would do that to you or anyone if I could help it. I respect your oppinions so much and really look forward to your comments. Please forgive me?

  412. Hammer says:

    [quote comment=”309389″]How was Hawkings able to meet Desmond in one of his old travels, how did she know where he would appear and when (when she met him at the jewelry store last season after he time traveled there)
    Thats an important one.
    Does she have the power to control each ones consciousness travels? where in time they go and when?
    Does he Pendulum also predict the losties whereabouts in time and space? How did she know that guy with the red shoes was about to die, at that time and in that place?[/quote]
    For now, I write this off as she has done some time traveling in advance and knows what’s going to happen. Here’s why I think that:

    Several people seem to know what’s going to happen and when. Seems to me that Widmore has been doing it as well as Alpert. Alpert comment to Locke ‘well you are about to’ tell him that Locke was shot implied that he’s been there before and knew what to do to keep Locke going. Ms. Hawking knew to be at the jewelry shop to stop Des. But most important…Ben was in the future and ‘knew’ Keamy wouldn’t kill Alex…dun, dun, dun….but he DID. Which is the big rule breaker that has sent the island into a tizzy. Ben’s lack of focus because Widmore ‘broke the rules’ let the innocents die on the freighter, let several folks off the island that were not supposed to leave and has endangered ‘us all’.

    Whoa…I’m bleeding from my nose…. ;)

  413. mcotter says:

    i think its easy to assume now that jin is dead. the freighter was definitley outside of the radius as they had to follow the co ordinates coreectly to enter the island, jin therefore could have jumped off but he could not have swam into the radius on the correct co ordinates in the time it took for the island to move. As it is unlikely that this happened he must have drowned even if he did make it off the boat, this does however leave it open to jin possibly making it back to the real world as the island is moved he is back in the normal world.

  414. Hammer says:

    [quote comment=”309392″][quote comment=”309006″]Oh I see. At any rate, I don’t think Miles had to be concieved off the island because I think the problem started after the purge, IMO that’s when the ‘punishment’ began.[/quote]
    _______________________________________
    Hammer I’m worried that I offended you. I’m so very sorry, I never would do that to you or anyone if I could help it. I respect your oppinions so much and really look forward to your comments. Please forgive me?[/quote]
    ++++++++++++
    No, no, no. Look what I did…started another group hug moment. :) I was having a hearty debate with SC because I didn’t recognize the name, I wanted to make sure. You and I have been around long enough to know each other!

  415. Hammer says:

    [quote comment=”309395″]i think its easy to assume now that jin is dead. the freighter was definitley outside of the radius as they had to follow the co ordinates coreectly to enter the island, jin therefore could have jumped off but he could not have swam into the radius on the correct co ordinates in the time it took for the island to move. As it is unlikely that this happened he must have drowned even if he did make it off the boat, this does however leave it open to jin possibly making it back to the real world as the island is moved he is back in the normal world.[/quote]
    ++++++
    Okay I’ve been working on this one a little. I think may be alive and is skipping around in time apart from the group like Locke is. He may have made it into the radius. The reason I came up with this is two fold. First Damon said the clip show before the premiere that Sun ‘believes’ her husband is dead…ponderous. Second, was Dan’s question, is everyone in your group accounted for? Sawyer left out Claire, who we are lead to believe surived the blast and just walked away with Christian. But this left me thinking that if Locke is skipping around, just in a different location on the island, then maybe Jin is doing the same. I mean, Bernard and Rose are NOW doing it too because they separated from Sawyer and Juliette.

  416. Rita says:

    [quote comment=”309395″]i think its easy to assume now that jin is dead. the freighter was definitley outside of the radius as they had to follow the co ordinates coreectly to enter the island, jin therefore could have jumped off but he could not have swam into the radius on the correct co ordinates in the time it took for the island to move. As it is unlikely that this happened he must have drowned even if he did make it off the boat, this does however leave it open to jin possibly making it back to the real world as the island is moved he is back in the normal world.[/quote]
    ____________________________________
    VERY INTERESTING idea! That plot thickens…. What would happen to the lie if Jin should show up? But it’s been three years off island, so if he is alive THERE, he either doesn’t know who he is (amnesia) or is being kept prisoner somewhere (by whom? Does Sun know? Is that REALLY where Ji is?). It doesn’t seem likely that he would be alive ON the island, because if the freighter didn’t go with the island’s move, no way Jin did either. So, if Jin IS alive (and somehow, I think he is), where is he then?

  417. Circus Mom says:

    [quote comment=”309395″]i think its easy to assume now that jin is dead. the freighter was definitley outside of the radius as they had to follow the co ordinates coreectly to enter the island, jin therefore could have jumped off but he could not have swam into the radius on the correct co ordinates in the time it took for the island to move. As it is unlikely that this happened he must have drowned even if he did make it off the boat, this does however leave it open to jin possibly making it back to the real world as the island is moved he is back in the normal world.[/quote]
    The freighter had to be iside the radius. They couldn’t see it from the helo after the island moved. I think Jin jumped off in time and is traveling in time with the losties. He wasn’t on the freighter any longer so it didn’t travel with them.

  418. Hammer says:

    [quote comment=”309401″][quote comment=”309395″]i think its easy to assume now that jin is dead. the freighter was definitley outside of the radius as they had to follow the co ordinates coreectly to enter the island, jin therefore could have jumped off but he could not have swam into the radius on the correct co ordinates in the time it took for the island to move. As it is unlikely that this happened he must have drowned even if he did make it off the boat, this does however leave it open to jin possibly making it back to the real world as the island is moved he is back in the normal world.[/quote]
    The freighter had to be iside the radius. They couldn’t see it from the helo after the island moved. I think Jin jumped off in time and is traveling in time with the losties. He wasn’t on the freighter any longer so it didn’t travel with them.[/quote]
    +++++++
    That makes sense. The freighter is in the same time line as the plane wreckage if Jin jumped off or was ‘blown’ off and survived…it is still TV. :)

  419. Rita says:

    [quote comment=”309401″][quote comment=”309395″]i think its easy to assume now that jin is dead. the freighter was definitley outside of the radius as they had to follow the co ordinates coreectly to enter the island, jin therefore could have jumped off but he could not have swam into the radius on the correct co ordinates in the time it took for the island to move. As it is unlikely that this happened he must have drowned even if he did make it off the boat, this does however leave it open to jin possibly making it back to the real world as the island is moved he is back in the normal world.[/quote]
    The freighter had to be iside the radius. They couldn’t see it from the helo after the island moved. I think Jin jumped off in time and is traveling in time with the losties. He wasn’t on the freighter any longer so it didn’t travel with them.[/quote]
    __________________________________
    I’ve been wondering about this too. They couldn’t see the freighter from the island any more either (they HAD been able to see the smoke before the move – Sawyer commented on it) so I guess I had just thought it didn’t move with them. The helicopter was a lot closer to the island than the freighter was when the island moved, but it didn’t go with the move. If we’re going with the “had to be touching” idea, then the freighter COULD have gone, even if the heli didn’t, because it was “touching” the water (as was the island) but the heli wasn’t? Back to the original question – where is Jin??

  420. Hammer says:

    [quote comment=”309403″][quote comment=”309401″][quote comment=”309395″]i think its easy to assume now that jin is dead. the freighter was definitley outside of the radius as they had to follow the co ordinates coreectly to enter the island, jin therefore could have jumped off but he could not have swam into the radius on the correct co ordinates in the time it took for the island to move. As it is unlikely that this happened he must have drowned even if he did make it off the boat, this does however leave it open to jin possibly making it back to the real world as the island is moved he is back in the normal world.[/quote]
    The freighter had to be iside the radius. They couldn’t see it from the helo after the island moved. I think Jin jumped off in time and is traveling in time with the losties. He wasn’t on the freighter any longer so it didn’t travel with them.[/quote]
    __________________________________
    I’ve been wondering about this too. They couldn’t see the freighter from the island any more either (they HAD been able to see the smoke before the move – Sawyer commented on it) so I guess I had just thought it didn’t move with them. The helicopter was a lot closer to the island than the freighter was when the island moved, but it didn’t go with the move. If we’re going with the “had to be touching” idea, then the freighter COULD have gone, even if the heli didn’t, because it was “touching” the water (as was the island) but the heli wasn’t? Back to the original question – where is Jin??[/quote]
    ++++++++++++
    So far we only know about the horizontal radius, no mention of the vertical ‘snow globe’ radius. So even if the chopper was closer, maybe it was out of the grasp of the islands movement because it was in the air. Putting Jin swimming to shore like Sawyer and now skipping around on a different part of the island than the group and/or Locke.

  421. PJSander says:

    [quote comment=”309404″]So far we only know about the horizontal radius, no mention of the vertical ‘snow globe’ radius. So even if the chopper was closer, maybe it was out of the grasp of the islands movement because it was in the air. Putting Jin swimming to shore like Sawyer and now skipping around on a different part of the island than the group and/or Locke.[/quote]

    It’s a Charlie thing I am sure, but I really want Jin to be alive, so yes, I am trying to figure out ways to make sure he is. I like the framework that Rita and Circus Mom started and Hammer has worked with.

    The freighter WAS inside the radius, it would seem. This makes sense because those in the helicopter didn’t see the wreckage after the flash.

    So let’s say Jin jumped, the freighter WAS inside the radius, but because no one but Jin (and perhaps a redshirt or two) was alive and he wasn’t ON the freighter, the freighter disappeared. Even if the freighter DIDN’T disappear, the black smoke trailing up WOULD HAVE disappeared because of the time jump (and that is all Juliet and Sawyer could see anyway).

    Okay, so the logic exists that Jin moved in time WITH Daniel, the redshirts on the zodiac and all the island folk. So Jin starts swimming ashore (we know he is a good swimmer, he swam from the wreckage of the raft) and the sky flashes. To HIM nothing changes because all he can see is water and the island. The sky flashes a few more times, still only water and island. Finally, he gets ashore – only the beach is littered with flaming arrows. What does he do? Well who knows, but as far as I am concerned, it could take all season for him to find Sawyer and the gang, so I will continue to hold out hope for Jin.

    [quote comment=”309396″]Look what I did…started another group hug moment. :)[/quote]

    ROFLOL. Hammer, you make me giggle. *bg*

    : ) P

  422. Circus Mom says:

    For those concerned with the numbers and Ben being given 70 hours to complete his task.

    70 hours is 4200 minutes.

  423. gmta leah says:

    Didnt goodwin own a ww2 army knife?

  424. LINS says:

    i still think that the pregnancy conception issues happened before the purge, the only example to even slightly confirm would be rousseau who was able to give birth on the island but was 8 (i think) months pregnant when she got there and that was before the purge. i think the island’s “unique properties” make conception an issue. it will be interesting to see who the baby was though, i guess it could technically be jin, sun, or miles although i still think it’s miles.

    i also agree that ben was not responsible for the death of nadia, i think something else happened to cause sayid to not trust him. just one more unknown event that we’ll have to wait and see!

    and annie locke? seriously? that wouldn’t even make sense…i do like the fact that widmore and butcher shop lady (i think her name was jill?) were both at the black rock auction!

    can’t wait for this wednesday!

  425. Circus Mom says:

    Sorry Lins, I thik I was wrong about Jill being at the auction. I would have liked it too.

  426. Amber says:

    So maybe ben got to sun. told her all he knows about the time travel thing, gives her hope that Jin could be alive. Tells her to help him set up widmore and he can help her get back to the island to look for Jin. Maybe he thinks if he gets her on board she can guilt kate and jack back on the island to help find jin??? I know its out there but i so want jin to be alive

  427. Amber says:

    I just dont think we can sun cant be trusted yet. Its obviouse she has her own agenda but i think it has to do with finding out if jin is alive or dead. they do say that she “believes” he is dead

  428. mcotter says:

    all good posts people but i just don’t understand why make shuch emphasis on the co ordinates last year to travel to and from the island if someone can just have a swim around in the ocean and make it back willy nilly.How did the freighter then make to an island which d&l have made clear that is only touching the real world not a part of it (like alice and wonderland)if it was already inside of the radius. I don’t beleive that just the hatch implosion and the island becoming visible for a few seconds counts, i believe that just allowed widmore to discover the co ordinates and follow them to the island. The whole co ordinates idead made sense, that following them was the ONLY way these people could make it to the island, if they didn’t they not only wouldnt make it there but it would screw up their brains because of the time thing, a perfect defence for the island no?

  429. jimbo says:

    hi allways enjoy reading all the posts on this site. iv had an theroey thats been bugging me since watching the season opener was hoping for your views? i think sayid might have killed locke on bens orders if you remeber last season where we found out sayid was working for ben, ben told sayid he had another name for him and sayid looked looked shocked?

  430. jimbo says:

    hi allways enjoy reading all the posts on this site. iv had an theroey thats been bugging me since watching the season opener was hoping for your views? i think sayid might have killed locke on bens orders if you remeber last season where we found out sayid was working for ben, ben told sayid he had another name for him and sayid looked looked shocked?

  431. jimbo says:

    or am i talking rubbish????????? :{

  432. Hammer says:

    [quote comment=”309474″]all good posts people but i just don’t understand why make shuch emphasis on the co ordinates last year to travel to and from the island if someone can just have a swim around in the ocean and make it back willy nilly.How did the freighter then make to an island which d&l have made clear that is only touching the real world not a part of it (like alice and wonderland)if it was already inside of the radius. I don’t beleive that just the hatch implosion and the island becoming visible for a few seconds counts, i believe that just allowed widmore to discover the co ordinates and follow them to the island. The whole co ordinates idead made sense, that following them was the ONLY way these people could make it to the island, if they didn’t they not only wouldnt make it there but it would screw up their brains because of the time thing, a perfect defence for the island no?[/quote]
    Well I think the reason for being able to swim in is because the freighter got closer and closer to the island and ended up in radius and is why Juliette could see the smoke from the explosion. The coordinates don’t matter anymore once you are within the island’s radius.

  433. SerbianChris says:

    [quote comment=”309403″]i think its easy to assume now that jin is dead. the freighter was definitley outside of the radius as they had to follow the co ordinates coreectly to enter the island, jin therefore could have jumped off but he could not have swam into the radius on the correct co ordinates in the time it took for the island to move. As it is unlikely that this happened he must have drowned even if he did make it off the boat, this does however leave it open to jin possibly making it back to the real world as the island is moved he is back in the normal world.[/quote]
    The freighter had to be iside the radius. They couldn’t see it from the helo after the island moved. I think Jin jumped off in time and is traveling in time with the losties. He wasn’t on the freighter any longer so it didn’t travel with them.
    __________________________________
    I’ve been wondering about this too. They couldn’t see the freighter from the island any more either (they HAD been able to see the smoke before the move – Sawyer commented on it) so I guess I had just thought it didn’t move with them. The helicopter was a lot closer to the island than the freighter was when the island moved, but it didn’t go with the move. If we’re going with the “had to be touching” idea, then the freighter COULD have gone, even if the heli didn’t, because it was “touching” the water (as was the island) but the heli wasn’t? Back to the original question – where is Jin??[/quote]
    ————————————————
    Hmmm…The way I see it, Jin just died, like so many others did. We dont have a reason to believe otherwise. why would he survive?
    He might appear as a whisperer or in a past time frame as still living.
    The freighter did disappear and so did the helicopter, the only thing that was in the radius was the raft/zodiac.

    The “touching” water theory isn’t consistent, the helicopter was in the air true, But Air and Water are the same, they are both bodies made of particles of matter. They’d have the same proprieties. In that case everything is touching everything.

    I think it’s just about being in the radius of time travel or not. And the freighter+Jin weren’t anywhere near it.

  434. mcotter says:

    Well I think the reason for being able to swim in is because the freighter got closer and closer to the island and ended up in radius and is why Juliette could see the smoke from the explosion. The coordinates don’t matter anymore once you are within the island’s radius.[/quote]

    How could the freighter have got closer and closer when the engines were sabotaged by Michael

  435. PJSander says:

    [quote comment=”309438″]So maybe ben got to sun. told her all he knows about the time travel thing, gives her hope that Jin could be alive. Tells her to help him set up widmore and he can help her get back to the island to look for Jin. Maybe he thinks if he gets her on board she can guilt kate and jack back on the island to help find jin??? I know its out there but i so want jin to be alive[/quote]

    This is a probable scenario which explains a lot about Sun’s behavior. The only flaw is that I would have expected her to tell Kate the truth. I guess she still might.

    : ) P

  436. PJSander says:

    [quote comment=”309527″]How could the freighter have got closer and closer when the engines were sabotaged by Michael[/quote]

    Michael FIXED the engines. Desmond ran to the bridge and told the new captain, who started to take the freighter in. Then, because of unknown interference (which turned out to be Keamy’s signal for the C4), he couldn’t see the depth. He said that until the interference was removed, he wouldn’t take the freighter any closer than five miles because he didn’t want to risk running up on the reef. The freighter WAS moving inland.

    : ) P

  437. SerbianChris says:

    [quote comment=”309537″][quote comment=”309438″]So maybe ben got to sun. told her all he knows about the time travel thing, gives her hope that Jin could be alive. Tells her to help him set up widmore and he can help her get back to the island to look for Jin. Maybe he thinks if he gets her on board she can guilt kate and jack back on the island to help find jin??? I know its out there but i so want jin to be alive[/quote]

    This is a probable scenario which explains a lot about Sun’s behavior. The only flaw is that I would have expected her to tell Kate the truth. I guess she still might.

    : ) P[/quote]
    —————————————————

    Dont think she would tell her openly.
    Kate isn’t willing to go back. Jack tried to convince her at the runway (season3 end)
    Plus Clair warned her about going back.
    So if thats the plan, Sun wouldnt be open about it, she’d have to trick her into going back. Which is what might be happening here.

  438. SerbianChris says:

    [quote comment=”309538″][quote comment=”309527″]How could the freighter have got closer and closer when the engines were sabotaged by Michael[/quote]

    Michael FIXED the engines. Desmond ran to the bridge and told the new captain, who started to take the freighter in. Then, because of unknown interference (which turned out to be Keamy’s signal for the C4), he couldn’t see the depth. He said that until the interference was removed, he wouldn’t take the freighter any closer than five miles because he didn’t want to risk running up on the reef. The freighter WAS moving inland.

    : ) P[/quote]
    ————————————————–
    If the freighter had traveled with the island it’d still be there when they time shifted. And so would the helicopter cause it was even closer. Doesn’t hold water for me..

  439. PJSander says:

    [quote comment=”309495″]The freighter did disappear and so did the helicopter, the only thing that was in the radius was the raft/zodiac.[/quote]

    I guess this is a matter of perspective again.

    TO THOSE IN THE HELICOPTER: The island AND the freighter disappeared

    TO THOSE ON THE ISLAND: The helicopter was already out of sight. The freighter was never IN sight. The only thing that changed to THEM was that there was no longer black smoke. To THEM, the freighter disappeared.

    To me, this says that the freighter moved WITH the island, but since the island went back to a time BEFORE the freighter was there, it disappeared.

    : ) P

  440. SerbianChris says:

    [quote comment=”309542″][quote comment=”309495″]The freighter did disappear and so did the helicopter, the only thing that was in the radius was the raft/zodiac.[/quote]

    I guess this is a matter of perspective again.

    TO THOSE IN THE HELICOPTER: The island AND the freighter disappeared

    TO THOSE ON THE ISLAND: The helicopter was already out of sight. The freighter was never IN sight. The only thing that changed to THEM was that there was no longer black smoke. To THEM, the freighter disappeared.

    To me, this says that the freighter moved WITH the island, but since the island went back to a time BEFORE the freighter was there, it disappeared.

    : ) P[/quote]
    —————————————————-

    But then you run into another problem.
    Why would the freighter disapear and not the zodiac.
    The island went back to a time before the zodiac was there too. So that doesnt work..

  441. PJSander says:

    [quote comment=”309541″]
    If the freighter had traveled with the island it’d still be there when they time shifted. And so would the helicopter cause it was even closer. Doesn’t hold water for me..[/quote]

    Well Hammer already explained why this could be. If the radius that Daniel talks about is the radius of a sphere, then the helicopter could well have been above the vertical limit of the “bubble” in which the island sits.

    I don’t expect to convince you that I am right, SC. We’re all just speculating after all! Just wanted you to see why I disagree with you! LOL.

    : ) P

  442. PJSander says:

    [quote comment=”309543″]But then you run into another problem.

    Why would the freighter disapear and not the zodiac.
    The island went back to a time before the zodiac was there too. So that doesnt work..[/quote]

    The zodiac had people in it. Anyone left on the freighter would have been charcoal.

    : ) P

  443. SerbianChris says:

    [quote comment=”309545″]

    I don’t expect to convince you that I am right, SC. We’re all just speculating after all! Just wanted you to see why I disagree with you! LOL.

    : ) P[/quote]
    —————————————————–
    Granted :) same here.
    But that still doesnt explain why the zodiac would be there and not the freighter according to that theory. Any ideas?

    So far i’m still thinking, only the zodiac moved and Jin is dead in the water. pun intended. :P

  444. SerbianChris says:

    [quote comment=”309546″]

    The zodiac had people in it. Anyone left on the freighter would have been charcoal.

    : ) P[/quote]
    ————————————————–
    So in order to move thru time you have to be in the radius AND have living non-combusted humans aboard?
    Jeeeez, i think we reached new heights in confusion theories here :)

  445. SerbianChris says:

    Here’s an easier one for you PJ, The freighter moved with the island, but they cant see it from the shore, because all they could see was smoke before right?
    SO since we went back to a time before the explosion, the freighter is still there, intact, but they cant see it now because there’s no smoke coming from it, the explosion hasnt happened.
    That way the theory makes sense.

    Except i dont know why we want the freighter with us so bad. hehe :)

  446. PJSander says:

    [quote comment=”309548″]So in order to move thru time you have to be in the radius AND have living non-combusted humans aboard?
    Jeeeez, i think we reached new heights in confusion theories here :)[/quote]

    I think considering any kind of time travel requires a leap of faith. I am simply going by what Juliet said about how the zodiac is with them. I believe that Juliet’s response was D&C’s way of explaining how THEIR version of time travel works.

    If you are touching it the first time time jumps, it stays with you for subsequent jumps. This is why the clothes they are wearing and their packs are still there, but not the food and water et al they had at camp.

    : ) P

  447. Sawyer's Constant says:

    [quote comment=”308525″][quote comment=”308506″][quote comment=”308495″][quote comment=”308486″]Hello everyone…

    – Dez and Penny have been sailing for the last 3 years, but when Dan tells him about going to Oxford on the island, it’s 3 years in the past, why did he “just” get the “memory”
    ++++++++
    I think we are supposed to believe that the experiences that the castaways are having have THEM ONLY suspended in time. It doesn’t elapse for 3 years. That’s the disconnect, the castaways started jumping time immediately, but it has taken 3 years time off island for Ben to get things to this point.[/quote]

    That might just have to do with the writing of the show so everything flows or…

    Where Desmond is 3years in the future is the present. There fore nothing before that time can be change. And that’s why he doesn’t get this memory until this time. If he had it would have been in the past, and you can’t change the past. Does that make since. Sounds like theres some logic missing, But I think they get away with that by labeling Desmond as special.[/quote]

    This reminded me of, I think it was Back to the Future III, where the idea is brought up that a person’s future could lie in the past. If you went back in time, sure you’d be in the past, but at the same time you’re moving forward in your own timeline. So assuming that time is already written(we’ll call it fate), at some point in time, faraday goes to the past and connects with desmond. Therefore in his future he goes to the past.

    The island, being the only place where one has the ability to do this is still a part of the universe, and connected to the timeline of the people off the island. So if faraday creates an event(connecting with desmond) on his timeline, it would only change and the memory would arrive in desmonds head at the point in time of which faraday created it.

    God this is confusing. I hope someone kinda understands what I’m saying.

    This is really hard to explain without drawing a picture, i hope someone gets what I’m trying to say and can explain it better.[/quote]

    You did a great job explaining your theory and if I understand what you are saying, I think others will get it too. Thanks. It really cleared things up for me.

  448. Hammer says:

    [quote comment=”309551″][quote comment=”309548″]So in order to move thru time you have to be in the radius AND have living non-combusted humans aboard?
    Jeeeez, i think we reached new heights in confusion theories here :)[/quote]

    I think considering any kind of time travel requires a leap of faith. I am simply going by what Juliet said about how the zodiac is with them. I believe that Juliet’s response was D&C’s way of explaining how THEIR version of time travel works.

    If you are touching it the first time time jumps, it stays with you for subsequent jumps. This is why the clothes they are wearing and their packs are still there, but not the food and water et al they had at camp.

    : ) P[/quote]
    +++++++
    That’s pretty much what I’ve said too. Agree with you PJ>

  449. RGS says:

    I think I missed where the folks in the heli could no longer see the exploded freightor, were they even looking for it? Why would they? I thought shortly after the island disappeared they ran out of fuel and crashed into the water.

    If Jin is alive because he swam in, it will be one of those bitter pills we’d have to swallow and chalk up to island mystery. There will not be an easy answer as to how/why he was able to make it on shore other than possibly him floating/swimming in on a coordinate that put him into the future on the island.

    I don’t see how the freightor was within the island radius, or the point of having charred up remains of people from the freightor moving with the island.

  450. mcotter says:

    i think that the fact that sawyer and juliet could see the smoke is confusing us all, my opinion is that the people can see into the distance but if they wanted to swim out to it, they couldn’t, like a snowglobe they can see it but cant touch it, they are stuck in the islands radius unless they follow the correct co ordinates (remember desmond got no where, the raft got no where, there is one way only off the island, through the appropriate co ordinates, the ones that the others knew for the submarine, presumably what the dharma knew, yemi’s plane,the black rock and 815 all landed via chance or fate by travelling through those exact co cordinates when they crashed.Daniel knew, presumably he was told them by naomi, abandon, someone for widmore, who learnt them when penny did when the hatch imploded). The helicopter wasnt out of the radius when sawyer jumped so he was fine to swim back, they followed the correct co ordinates so they found the freighter OUTSIDE the radius. It blew up jin may have survived but that is irrelevant, the helicopter went back towards the island but were just outside the radius when it moved hence they did not go with it, daniel was inside so he did, if the helicopter wasn’t in the radius how could the freighter be, seriously? THEY SAW IT MOVE, they must have been very close. The reason why it disappeared is because the survivors went back in time nothing else, if their camp disappeared its logical to assume the freighter would as well. To jin, the only logical solution for him to return is in the real world with the O6 or in dreams, if he turns up on the island there are some serious plot holes

  451. Hammer says:

    [quote comment=”309572″]i think that the fact that sawyer and juliet could see the smoke is confusing us all, my opinion is that the people can see into the distance but if they wanted to swim out to it, they couldn’t, like a snowglobe they can see it but cant touch it, they are stuck in the islands radius unless they follow the correct co ordinates (remember desmond got no where, the raft got no where, there is one way only off the island, through the appropriate co ordinates, the ones that the others knew for the submarine, presumably what the dharma knew, yemi’s plane,the black rock and 815 all landed via chance or fate by travelling through those exact co cordinates when they crashed.Daniel knew, presumably he was told them by naomi, abandon, someone for widmore, who learnt them when penny did when the hatch imploded). The helicopter wasnt out of the radius when sawyer jumped so he was fine to swim back, they followed the correct co ordinates so they found the freighter OUTSIDE the radius. It blew up jin may have survived but that is irrelevant, the helicopter went back towards the island but were just outside the radius when it moved hence they did not go with it, daniel was inside so he did, if the helicopter wasn’t in the radius how could the freighter be, seriously? THEY SAW IT MOVE, they must have been very close. The reason why it disappeared is because the survivors went back in time nothing else, if their camp disappeared its logical to assume the freighter would as well. To jin, the only logical solution for him to return is in the real world with the O6 or in dreams, if he turns up on the island there are some serious plot holes[/quote]
    Actually I think they made it clear that there would be side effects if you travel to the island outside of the bearing, not that you couldn’t get through. Minkowski got into the radius and began getting side effects and turned back. The doctor’s dead body washed up on shore, did his body just manage to float throught the correct bearing? I think that the island won’t ‘LET’ you leave unless you use the correct bearing, but you can get in with side effects.

  452. Hammer says:

    Another reason I think the ship made it into the radius was the female freighter person that decided to put on a metal chain bathing suit and go for a dip. She was clearly having side effects and never even left the freighter.

  453. Miraks says:

    [quote comment=”309408″]i still think that the pregnancy conception issues happened before the purge, the only example to even slightly confirm would be rousseau who was able to give birth on the island but was 8 (i think) months pregnant when she got there and that was before the purge. i think the island’s “unique properties” make conception an issue. ![/quote]
    Rousseau came after the purge, when Ben was already in charge. That is why/ how he adopted Alex.

  454. Miraks says:

    [quote comment=”308217″]just a random thought that probably couldn’t actually be true, but thought i would throw it out there anyway, but what is widmore was the island’s “ben” before ben took over? what is widmore had to move the island and can’t come back, then dharma took over, then ben took over and now widmore is mad and wants control back…? how does he really know so much about the island, enough to create a secondary protocol if ben heads to the orchid, etc.? like i said, just a random thought…[/quote]
    I thought about this, but I don’t think so. I think Widmore was funding/ in charge of the Dharma initiative, probably trying to harness the island’s abilities for his own financial benefit. When Ben led the purge, he essentialy “stole” the island from Widmore. Widmore has spend 20 years looking for the island. This would mean that given that Alex is about 16 years old now, Russeou and her people landed on the island 3-4 years after the purge. Eversince then Ben has been hiding the island from Widmore who has been trying to find it. This is why Widmore was so interested in the Black Rock diaries, he is trying to get all possible clues to finding the island again.

  455. PJSander says:

    [quote comment=”309580″]Rousseau came after the purge, when Ben was already in charge. That is why/ how he adopted Alex.[/quote]

    Well, except that Rousseau’s distress call has been repeating for sixteen years – so it started no later than 1988, and the purge was in 1992.

    : ) P

  456. Scottc13 says:

    I have tried to read all 450+ posts, and I did not see this theory in any of them.

    In regards to Juliet time jumping with the losties, even though she was an other. I think that Smokey flashing her will have a lot to do with it. Maybe the others have some sort of constant flashed into their memories (like carl being brainwashed in the Othersville movie theater) When Smokey flashes her, maybe he erases that constant to help protect the island.

  457. PJSander says:

    [quote comment=”309585″]In regards to Juliet time jumping with the losties, even though she was an other. I think that Smokey flashing her will have a lot to do with it. Maybe the others have some sort of constant flashed into their memories (like carl being brainwashed in the Othersville movie theater) When Smokey flashes her, maybe he erases that constant to help protect the island.[/quote]

    I don’t see Juliet as an “Other” in this case. We, ans the LOSTies call everyone that didn’t crash an Other. This includes the DI and the Hostiles. Ben, together with the Hostiles, purged the DI and recruited people to work for him. They are still two separate groups, as I see them. The Others are now Captain Eyeliner and his group. Of the rest of them, we only know Juliet and Ben to still be alive. Ben is off island and Juliet is with Sawyer, et al.

    The Others (formerly Hostiles) are the ones that Hammer (and others, including me) think are visible Whisperers.

    But your post brings up a new question for me… did SMOKEY travel with Sawyer’s group?

    : ) P

  458. michael says:

    There was a lot of time travel talk goin on earlier. Who all has actually travel though time. You have the losties on the island who are traveling through time and space apparently. Desmond has only traveled through time in conscience. And Ben has traveled through space as far as I know.

  459. Hammer says:

    [quote comment=”309583″][quote comment=”308217″]just a random thought that probably couldn’t actually be true, but thought i would throw it out there anyway, but what is widmore was the island’s “ben” before ben took over? what is widmore had to move the island and can’t come back, then dharma took over, then ben took over and now widmore is mad and wants control back…? how does he really know so much about the island, enough to create a secondary protocol if ben heads to the orchid, etc.? like i said, just a random thought…[/quote]
    I thought about this, but I don’t think so. I think Widmore was funding/ in charge of the Dharma initiative, probably trying to harness the island’s abilities for his own financial benefit. When Ben led the purge, he essentialy “stole” the island from Widmore. Widmore has spend 20 years looking for the island. This would mean that given that Alex is about 16 years old now, Russeou and her people landed on the island 3-4 years after the purge. Eversince then Ben has been hiding the island from Widmore who has been trying to find it. This is why Widmore was so interested in the Black Rock diaries, he is trying to get all possible clues to finding the island again.[/quote]
    +++++++++
    Yeah, but I’m still not sure what Widmore’s connection to the island is. When he said Ben stole it, he said it was his and ‘always was’. Was he using for financial gain? Or is he a permanent resident that decided to spin the wheel one day and has been trying to get back on ever since? I think he started up DHARMA to help him get back on the island and Ben stopped him.

  460. michael says:

    [quote comment=”309588″][quote comment=”309583″][quote comment=”308217″]just a random thought that probably couldn’t actually be true, but thought i would throw it out there anyway, but what is widmore was the island’s “ben” before ben took over? what is widmore had to move the island and can’t come back, then dharma took over, then ben took over and now widmore is mad and wants control back…? how does he really know so much about the island, enough to create a secondary protocol if ben heads to the orchid, etc.? like i said, just a random thought…[/quote]
    I thought about this, but I don’t think so. I think Widmore was funding/ in charge of the Dharma initiative, probably trying to harness the island’s abilities for his own financial benefit. When Ben led the purge, he essentialy “stole” the island from Widmore. Widmore has spend 20 years looking for the island. This would mean that given that Alex is about 16 years old now, Russeou and her people landed on the island 3-4 years after the purge. Eversince then Ben has been hiding the island from Widmore who has been trying to find it. This is why Widmore was so interested in the Black Rock diaries, he is trying to get all possible clues to finding the island again.[/quote]
    +++++++++
    Yeah, but I’m still not sure what Widmore’s connection to the island is. When he said Ben stole it, he said it was his and ‘always was’. Was he using for financial gain? Or is he a permanent resident that decided to spin the wheel one day and has been trying to get back on ever since? I think he started up DHARMA to help him get back on the island and Ben stopped him.[/quote]

    Don’t think Widmore ever lived on the Island. Doesn’t seem like the type first of all. Threes been no allusion to widmore being gonna from penny for any length of time or to him being older than he really is. I can see him being heavily invested in Dharma. And once Ben took over he cut all communication to widmore and dharma. That’s why Widmore is looking for it.

  461. Hammer says:

    [quote comment=”309587″]There was a lot of time travel talk goin on earlier. Who all has actually travel though time. You have the losties on the island who are traveling through time and space apparently. Desmond has only traveled through time in conscience. And Ben has traveled through space as far as I know.[/quote]
    Alpert may have since we saw him look about the same age when he saw Locke as a child.

  462. ESB says:

    [quote comment=”309590″][quote comment=”309588″][quote comment=”309583″][quote comment=”308217″]just a random thought that probably couldn’t actually be true, but thought i would throw it out there anyway, but what is widmore was the island’s “ben” before ben took over? what is widmore had to move the island and can’t come back, then dharma took over, then ben took over and now widmore is mad and wants control back…? how does he really know so much about the island, enough to create a secondary protocol if ben heads to the orchid, etc.? like i said, just a random thought…[/quote]
    I thought about this, but I don’t think so. I think Widmore was funding/ in charge of the Dharma initiative, probably trying to harness the island’s abilities for his own financial benefit. When Ben led the purge, he essentialy “stole” the island from Widmore. Widmore has spend 20 years looking for the island. This would mean that given that Alex is about 16 years old now, Russeou and her people landed on the island 3-4 years after the purge. Eversince then Ben has been hiding the island from Widmore who has been trying to find it. This is why Widmore was so interested in the Black Rock diaries, he is trying to get all possible clues to finding the island again.[/quote]
    +++++++++
    Yeah, but I’m still not sure what Widmore’s connection to the island is. When he said Ben stole it, he said it was his and ‘always was’. Was he using for financial gain? Or is he a permanent resident that decided to spin the wheel one day and has been trying to get back on ever since? I think he started up DHARMA to help him get back on the island and Ben stopped him.[/quote]

    Don’t think Widmore ever lived on the Island. Doesn’t seem like the type first of all. Threes been no allusion to widmore being gonna from penny for any length of time or to him being older than he really is. I can see him being heavily invested in Dharma. And once Ben took over he cut all communication to widmore and dharma. That’s why Widmore is looking for it.[/quote]

    just an opinion but i have always been under the impression that Widmore was behind the DI (at the very least financially, if not in other ways too) and that Ben ‘stole’ the island when he and the ‘others’ (or natives in this case) killed off the DI and took it over…but come to think of it, i can’t think of any real proof that that is the case…is there any proof that is NOT the case?

    the real question in my opinion is how Widmore came to be the ‘owner’ of the island…i love the thoery that he may have been on and/or the captian of the Black Rock and i think it makes sense (in a weird Lost-time-travel-what-the-heck-is-going-on sorta way ;)

  463. Hurley's Dad says:

    [quote comment=”309566″][quote comment=”309551″][quote comment=”309548″]So in order to move thru time you have to be in the radius AND have living non-combusted humans aboard?
    Jeeeez, i think we reached new heights in confusion theories here :)[/quote]

    I think considering any kind of time travel requires a leap of faith. I am simply going by what Juliet said about how the zodiac is with them. I believe that Juliet’s response was D&C’s way of explaining how THEIR version of time travel works.

    If you are touching it the first time time jumps, it stays with you for subsequent jumps. This is why the clothes they are wearing and their packs are still there, but not the food and water et al they had at camp.

    : ) P[/quote]
    +++++++
    That’s pretty much what I’ve said too. Agree with you PJ>[/quote]
    +++++++
    I’ll add that they can add things to the jump, so it’s not necessarily just things you’re touching during the first jump.

    Alpert/Locke’s compass comes to mind.

  464. agentLOST says:

    [quote comment=”308997″]
    Oh so Hollywood. They sure were some bad shots too. And where to hell did they get bows? Bows are not easy to make; you need particular woods and even arrows need a lot of skill to make; and they were shooting them off willy nilly. Pretty fake.
    Hell of a lot easier to pick up rocks and throw them.
    And easier still to wait until everyone’s asleep to attack.
    So very Hollywood.[/quote]
    ______________________________________________________

    Well, LOST is a TV show so you have to suspend reality a little bit. The bows and arrows could have been brought to the island for all we know. But as a fan from day one, I can say LOST is still one of the best shows on right now.

  465. LizS says:

    [quote comment=”308994″][quote comment=”308604″]One idea we can draw from this is that D&C really DID know EXACTLY how things were going to go when they started all this! Crazy brilliant!

    : ) P[/quote]
    LOL, good try, PJ–but that puppy got off the leash and was digging in the neighbors garden quite some time and had to be tackled and wrestled back into his collar, the frisky little devil. I think Locke’s leg biz could have been something they ‘knew’ when they did it way back when, or it could have worked out in this fortuitous fashion to be an aha for us, but after the time-traveling fact. But we’d have to go back in time and sit in on that meeting to be sure…

  466. Hurley's Dad says:

    Questions to ponder.

    Why did Ben defend Jack to Jill (that sounds funny :))?
    Does Ms. Hawking work for Ben or the other way around?

  467. Circus Mom says:

    Someone comented that Ben may have given Locks name to Sayid. Perhaps he gave him Jeremy Bentham and Sayid killed him before he knew it was Locke and that is why he dosn’t trust Ben anymore.

  468. Circus Mom says:

    [quote comment=”309566″][quote comment=”309551″][quote comment=”309548″]So in order to move thru time you have to be in the radius AND have living non-combusted humans aboard?
    Jeeeez, i think we reached new heights in confusion theories here :)[/quote]

    I think considering any kind of time travel requires a leap of faith. I am simply going by what Juliet said about how the zodiac is with them. I believe that Juliet’s response was D&C’s way of explaining how THEIR version of time travel works.

    If you are touching it the first time time jumps, it stays with you for subsequent jumps. This is why the clothes they are wearing and their packs are still there, but not the food and water et al they had at camp.

    : ) P[/quote]
    +++++++
    That’s pretty much what I’ve said too. Agree with you PJ>[/quote]
    ++++++++++++++++
    I’m with Hammer and PJ on this one.

  469. Rita says:

    I’ve been wondering about why Alpert told Locke that at his next “jump”, he (Alpert) wouldn’t remember Locke (thus he gave him the compass). Why wouldn’t he remember him? Because the last time he saw him Locke was 10 years old, so he didn’t recognize him as an adult? Or because Locke jumps back so far in time that Alpert hasn’t yet learned about the unique properties of the island, so has no knowledge yet of Locke? This makes me think that the “rules” of “time jumping” are:
    * You only go back to times in which YOU were not present at the new time period (so you can’t run into yourself in the past).
    * This explains why Juliette can jump but the Others don’t – she came much later to the island.
    * Alpert goes back in time and meets young Locke – expecting John to remember something of his future – did he believe that John was time traveling too, as his adult self in the young body?
    Therefore:
    * If you time travel to a period in which you were present, you go back into/as your younger self (ala Desmond going back to his earlier self – when we called it “conciousness travel”.
    Just trying to sort this all out!
    Did anyone else notice that Alpert has really laid off on the guy-liner this season, or is it just me?

  470. Rita says:

    [quote comment=”309542″][quote comment=”309495″]
    To me, this says that the freighter moved WITH the island, but since the island went back to a time BEFORE the freighter was there, it disappeared.

    : ) P[/quote]
    ________________________________
    I’m trying to get my head around this concept! Are you saying that the freighter moved in time, but a different time, so that’s why the islanders don’t see it? Everyone/thing doesn’t move together – same place/time?

  471. michael says:

    [quote comment=”309598″][quote comment=”309590″][quote comment=”309588″][quote comment=”309583″][quote comment=”308217″]just a random thought that probably couldn’t actually be true, but thought i would throw it out there anyway, but what is widmore was the island’s “ben” before ben took over? what is widmore had to move the island and can’t come back, then dharma took over, then ben took over and now widmore is mad and wants control back…? how does he really know so much about the island, enough to create a secondary protocol if ben heads to the orchid, etc.? like i said, just a random thought…[/quote]
    I thought about this, but I don’t think so. I think Widmore was funding/ in charge of the Dharma initiative, probably trying to harness the island’s abilities for his own financial benefit. When Ben led the purge, he essentialy “stole” the island from Widmore. Widmore has spend 20 years looking for the island. This would mean that given that Alex is about 16 years old now, Russeou and her people landed on the island 3-4 years after the purge. Eversince then Ben has been hiding the island from Widmore who has been trying to find it. This is why Widmore was so interested in the Black Rock diaries, he is trying to get all possible clues to finding the island again.[/quote]
    +++++++++
    Yeah, but I’m still not sure what Widmore’s connection to the island is. When he said Ben stole it, he said it was his and ‘always was’. Was he using for financial gain? Or is he a permanent resident that decided to spin the wheel one day and has been trying to get back on ever since? I think he started up DHARMA to help him get back on the island and Ben stopped him.[/quote]

    Don’t think Widmore ever lived on the Island. Doesn’t seem like the type first of all. Threes been no allusion to widmore being gonna from penny for any length of time or to him being older than he really is. I can see him being heavily invested in Dharma. And once Ben took over he cut all communication to widmore and dharma. That’s why Widmore is looking for it.[/quote]

    just an opinion but i have always been under the impression that Widmore was behind the DI (at the very least financially, if not in other ways too) and that Ben ‘stole’ the island when he and the ‘others’ (or natives in this case) killed off the DI and took it over…but come to think of it, i can’t think of any real proof that that is the case…is there any proof that is NOT the case?

    the real question in my opinion is how Widmore came to be the ‘owner’ of the island…i love the thoery that he may have been on and/or the captian of the Black Rock and i think it makes sense (in a weird Lost-time-travel-what-the-heck-is-going-on sorta way ;)[/quote]

    ++++++++++++++++++++++

    Didn’t Sun find a prego test with Widmore’s company name on it on the island?

  472. Trixanna says:

    This may be off subject but I was thinking about who else knows about “the lie”. Frank Lapidus. What do we know about Frank? Is he someone we can trust? I’ve always assumed he was but I am rethinking that now. If he wasn’t going to be important in all this, he would have drowned when the helicopter went down. There is a reason they are keeping him around. He may have told Widmore about the O6 and their lie. He was working on the freighter to take the scientists to the island so was he working for Widmore?

  473. mcotter says:

    [quote comment=”309610″]I’ve been wondering about why Alpert told Locke that at his next “jump”, he (Alpert) wouldn’t remember Locke (thus he gave him the compass). Why wouldn’t he remember him? Because the last time he saw him Locke was 10 years old, so he didn’t recognize him as an adult? Or because Locke jumps back so far in time that Alpert hasn’t yet learned about the unique properties of the island, so has no knowledge yet of Locke?

    I believe that locke is going to go so far back that Alpert doesn’t recognize him, he will give Alpert the compass which at that point in time will belong to Locke, not future alpert, so when alpert visits locke when he s a child he offers him the compass and asks if it belongs to him because it was his

  474. michael says:

    [quote comment=”309604″]Questions to ponder.

    Why did Ben defend Jack to Jill (that sounds funny :))?
    Does Ms. Hawking work for Ben or the other way around?[/quote]

    +++++++++++++++++++++

    I would say that they both work for the island or have Coinciding interst with the island. Ms. Hawkings doesn’t come off as a lady That would cater to or do Bens bidding. I thought it was funny when Ben asked her what happens if he can’t get everyone. He looked scared, she looked annoyed.

  475. Hurley's Dad says:

    [quote comment=”309613″]This may be off subject but I was thinking about who else knows about “the lie”. Frank Lapidus. What do we know about Frank? Is he someone we can trust? I’ve always assumed he was but I am rethinking that now. If he wasn’t going to be important in all this, he would have drowned when the helicopter went down. There is a reason they are keeping him around. He may have told Widmore about the O6 and their lie. He was working on the freighter to take the scientists to the island so was he working for Widmore?[/quote]

    Good point. How about he was supposed to be the pilot of 815?

    He was supposed to be on the plane and since he wasn’t, Smokey killed “Hero” Grunberg (a question we’ve never had answered was why the Pilot was killed so quickly) and “course corrected” to get Frank back there.

  476. Circus Mom says:

    [quote comment=”309613″]This may be off subject but I was thinking about who else knows about “the lie”. Frank Lapidus. What do we know about Frank? Is he someone we can trust? I’ve always assumed he was but I am rethinking that now. If he wasn’t going to be important in all this, he would have drowned when the helicopter went down. There is a reason they are keeping him around. He may have told Widmore about the O6 and their lie. He was working on the freighter to take the scientists to the island so was he working for Widmore?[/quote]
    Frank is one of the good guys. I’m sure of it. Sure of Rose and Bernard too.

  477. PJSander says:

    [quote comment=”309611″][quote comment=”309542″][quote comment=”309495″]
    To me, this says that the freighter moved WITH the island, but since the island went back to a time BEFORE the freighter was there, it disappeared.

    : ) P[/quote]
    ________________________________
    I’m trying to get my head around this concept! Are you saying that the freighter moved in time, but a different time, so that’s why the islanders don’t see it? Everyone/thing doesn’t move together – same place/time?[/quote]

    ————————————-

    I think the freighter moved when the island did – but not the way you suggest.

    Think of the freighter like the tents and the “kitchen” that the LOSTies had built. The island jumped BACK in time and anything within the radius went with it. If the island jumps to a time BEFORE those inanimate objects existed, they will disappear (except if you are touching it when the jump happens as per Juliet). Therefore the freighter, tents and kitchen are not there (and the zodiac is).

    Hope that makes sense.

    : ) P

  478. PJSander says:

    [quote comment=”309608″]Someone comented that Ben may have given Locks name to Sayid. Perhaps he gave him Jeremy Bentham and Sayid killed him before he knew it was Locke and that is why he dosn’t trust Ben anymore.[/quote]

    OOOH. Good thought, CM.

    : ) P

  479. michael says:

    [quote comment=”309613″]This may be off subject but I was thinking about who else knows about “the lie”. Frank Lapidus. What do we know about Frank? Is he someone we can trust? I’ve always assumed he was but I am rethinking that now. If he wasn’t going to be important in all this, he would have drowned when the helicopter went down. There is a reason they are keeping him around. He may have told Widmore about the O6 and their lie. He was working on the freighter to take the scientists to the island so was he working for Widmore?[/quote]

    +++++

    Was just thinking about him. When Jack asked if he was on board for the story he said yes very easly and quicky, like he didn’t care or it didn’t matter to him what they said. They guy how recruited Naomi and the rest, did he recruit Frank? If so, I’m sure Frank would have to report back to him and not widmore.

  480. LostinSev says:

    Post #343 Didn’t Locke’s mother have him very early and he survived.

    Post #369 Could Charlotte’s sisters be Penny and Libby?

    Post #374 Who is there with Dan when he sees the footage on TV?

    Post #375 I like that idea!! It did seem like a lot of the people in that plane crash wanted to get back there. They may have needed to get Christain back there like they are going to get Locke back. Remember the Flight Attendant with the children??

    Post #392 Maybe she knows that Jin is ALIVE!!

    I think Jin is alive! I think the freighter moved with the island and it may be anyway within the radius of the island.

    Who is Kate in touch with????? Who is she secretly talking to. If it is Ben or Benthan, then why is she not willing to go back. Why do I remember thinking she was talking to Sawyer?????? Does anyone think that Sawyer’s daughter will ever be a part of the equation?

  481. michael says:

    [quote comment=”309619″][quote comment=”309611″][quote comment=”309542″][quote comment=”309495″]
    To me, this says that the freighter moved WITH the island, but since the island went back to a time BEFORE the freighter was there, it disappeared.

    : ) P[/quote]
    ________________________________
    I’m trying to get my head around this concept! Are you saying that the freighter moved in time, but a different time, so that’s why the islanders don’t see it? Everyone/thing doesn’t move together – same place/time?[/quote]

    ————————————-

    I think the freighter moved when the island did – but not the way you suggest.

    Think of the freighter like the tents and the “kitchen” that the LOSTies had built. The island jumped BACK in time and anything within the radius went with it. If the island jumps to a time BEFORE those inanimate objects existed, they will disappear (except if you are touching it when the jump happens as per Juliet). Therefore the freighter, tents and kitchen are not there (and the zodiac is).

    Hope that makes sense.

    : ) P[/quote]
    +++++++++++++++++

    Like it

  482. SerbianChris says:

    [quote comment=”309609″]
    If you are touching it the first time time jumps, it stays with you for subsequent jumps. This is why the clothes they are wearing and their packs are still there, but not the food and water et al they had at camp.

    : ) P[/quote]
    +++++++
    That’s pretty much what I’ve said too. Agree with you PJ>[/quote]
    ++++++++++++++++
    I’m with Hammer and PJ on this one.[/quote]
    [quote comment=”309611″][quote comment=”309542″][quote comment=”309495″]
    To me, this says that the freighter moved WITH the island, but since the island went back to a time BEFORE the freighter was there, it disappeared.

    : ) P[/quote]
    ________________________________
    I’m trying to get my head around this concept! Are you saying that the freighter moved in time, but a different time, so that’s why the islanders don’t see it? Everyone/thing doesn’t move together – same place/time?[/quote]
    —————————————————–
    No it is my understanding that PJSanders believes the freighter was within the radius of the island when the island moved, but didnt move with it because the people on it were dead. PJ correct me if Im wrong.

    My opinion is that IF the freighter Was in the radius, then it logically had to move with the rest of the losties, however I do not subscribe to this point of view, it is more likely that the Freighter wasnt in the radius, only the raft was. Thats what we know for sure so far anyway. But I guess we’ll find out soon. They do move together as a group, anyone within the radius/island moves back and forth together.

  483. PJSander says:

    [quote comment=”309622″]Post #369 Could Charlotte’s sisters be Penny and Libby?
    [/quote]

    I have always thought it odd that we never knew Libby’s last name, maiden or married. Thusly, I have always suspected she was a Widmore.

    I also think that Charlotte’s back story seemed a bit contrived. I figured that it was an alias and that explains why she was so shocked when Ben told her history and used the fake one. She could be a Widmore, Annie, Jacob’s daughter, another of Christian’s offspring.

    : ) P

  484. SerbianChris says:

    [quote comment=”309623″]

    Think of the freighter like the tents and the “kitchen” that the LOSTies had built. The island jumped BACK in time and anything within the radius went with it. If the island jumps to a time BEFORE those inanimate objects existed, they will disappear (except if you are touching it when the jump happens as per Juliet). Therefore the freighter, tents and kitchen are not there (and the zodiac is).

    Hope that makes sense.

    : ) P[/quote]
    +++++++++++++++++

    Like it[/quote]

    —————————————————-

    But weren’t people on the freighter too? Thus touching it?
    In that case it should have moved like the Zodiac dont you think?

  485. PJSander says:

    [quote comment=”309625″]
    No it is my understanding that PJSanders believes the freighter was within the radius of the island when the island moved, but didnt move with it because the people on it were dead. PJ correct me if Im wrong.
    [/quote]

    You’re sort of right. *bg*. I already answered this – see comment 480.

    : ) P

  486. PJSander says:

    [quote comment=”309627″]
    But weren’t people on the freighter too? Thus touching it?
    In that case it should have moved like the Zodiac dont you think?[/quote]

    Anyone who was on the freighter when it exploded is overcooked fish food, therefore inanimate. The freighter had no human passenger with which to hitch a ride.

    : ) P

  487. Circus Mom says:

    [quote comment=”309627″][quote comment=”309623″]

    Think of the freighter like the tents and the “kitchen” that the LOSTies had built. The island jumped BACK in time and anything within the radius went with it. If the island jumps to a time BEFORE those inanimate objects existed, they will disappear (except if you are touching it when the jump happens as per Juliet). Therefore the freighter, tents and kitchen are not there (and the zodiac is).

    Hope that makes sense.

    : ) P[/quote]
    +++++++++++++++++

    Like it[/quote]

    —————————————————-

    But weren’t people on the freighter too? Thus touching it?
    In that case it should have moved like the Zodiac dont you think?[/quote]
    +++++++
    Those on the freighter either died and didn’t time travel or jumped off and wern’t touching it. The freighter is still right where it was. In the islands radius, burning, between Christmas and New Years Eve, 2004.

  488. SerbianChris says:

    [quote comment=”309628″]

    You’re sort of right. *bg*. I already answered this – see comment 480.

    : ) P[/quote]
    —————————————————
    Yep, I was giving Micheal the lowdown tho.

  489. SerbianChris says:

    Also, PJ, you say this:

    “those inanimate objects existed, they will disappear (except if you are touching it when the jump happens as per Juliet). Therefore the freighter, tents and kitchen are not there”

    except they Were touching some of the tents people were in them, and rose was in the church. How do you explain that.

  490. Trixanna says:

    [quote comment=”309618″][quote comment=”309613″]This may be off subject but I was thinking about who else knows about “the lie”. Frank Lapidus. What do we know about Frank? Is he someone we can trust? I’ve always assumed he was but I am rethinking that now. If he wasn’t going to be important in all this, he would have drowned when the helicopter went down. There is a reason they are keeping him around. He may have told Widmore about the O6 and their lie. He was working on the freighter to take the scientists to the island so was he working for Widmore?[/quote]
    Frank is one of the good guys. I’m sure of it. Sure of Rose and Bernard too.[/quote]
    I’d like to believe that Frank is a good guy too but I am starting to wonder. According to Lostpedia (not my horrible memory) he knew that Juliet was not part of the manifest. What reason would he have to know that? To memorize the manifest?? I still think that if we weren’t going to see any more of Frank, he would have died when the helicopter went down.

    I used to trust everyone but as time goes on, I am trusting fewer and fewer people. I think Aaron is innocent ;-)

  491. duke says:

    Purple sky……..the only time the sky turned purple was when Des turned the fail safe key. It glows a very bright white when it jumps through time. The island did not jump through time when the fail safe key was turned or it would have disappeared then too. If purple sky event means time traveling then it would have happened then as well. Am I crazy or do others feel the same way.

  492. SerbianChris says:

    Someone above mentioned old lady Hawking and her whereabouts in that last scene of episode 2. She does seem to be at Oxford, she’s at that church, and most likely it is the church Desmond used to be at, at oxford.
    Also I looked it up, when Desmond used to be a priest in one of the old episodes they show you a picture of Hawking on the desk in that church, so that connects her to it. Maybe it is his mother?
    The photo of Ms. Hawking with Brother Campbell seems to be a composite tho, and it was obviously done on purpose. That’s been bugging me for a while, what does it all mean?

  493. SerbianChris says:

    [quote comment=”309635″]Purple sky……..the only time the sky turned purple was when Des turned the fail safe key. It glows a very bright white when it jumps through time. The island did not jump through time when the fail safe key was turned or it would have disappeared then too. If purple sky event means time traveling then it would have happened then as well. Am I crazy or do others feel the same way.[/quote]
    —————————————————-

    Well if you’re crazy then I am too, cause I concur :)

  494. PJSander says:

    [quote comment=”309633″]except they Were touching some of the tents people were in them, and rose was in the church. How do you explain that.[/quote]

    Rose was in the church. Do you know what the church was? It was a framework of narrow logs and nothing else. No floor, no ceiling, no walls.

    Who was touching tents? They were AT camp, but no one said anything about touching tents or anything else. Unless you saw a scene I didn’t?

    : ) P

  495. SerbianChris says:

    [quote comment=”309638″][quote comment=”309633″]except they Were touching some of the tents people were in them, and rose was in the church. How do you explain that.[/quote]

    Rose was in the church. Do you know what the church was? It was a framework of narrow logs and nothing else. No floor, no ceiling, no walls.

    Who was touching tents? They were AT camp, but no one said anything about touching tents or anything else. Unless you saw a scene I didn’t?

    : ) P[/quote]
    —————————————————-

    Right, but we’re going with assumptions. You’re assuming that touching something makes it travel, and you’re assuming Rose and others weren’t touching a thing.
    I’m assuming that those people looking lost and standing where the camp used to be had to be in them. After all there were many people there, someone had to be sitting on a makeshift chair or holding an object or lying down on a makeshift bed. What are the chances no one was touching anything at all.
    It’s one assumption vs another. we’re both guessing.

  496. SerbianChris says:

    Faraday does explicitly say that the whole camp disappeared/isnt there because it hasnt been built yet. No touching was mentioned. And he would know.

  497. michael says:

    Did [quote comment=”309639″][quote comment=”309638″][quote comment=”309633″]except they Were touching some of the tents people were in them, and rose was in the church. How do you explain that.[/quote]

    Rose was in the church. Do you know what the church was? It was a framework of narrow logs and nothing else. No floor, no ceiling, no walls.

    Who was touching tents? They were AT camp, but no one said anything about touching tents or anything else. Unless you saw a scene I didn’t?

    : ) P[/quote]
    —————————————————-

    Right, but we’re going with assumptions. You’re assuming that touching something makes it travel, and you’re assuming Rose and others weren’t touching a thing.
    I’m assuming that those people looking lost and standing where the camp used to be had to be in them. After all there were many people there, someone had to be sitting on a makeshift chair or holding an object or lying down on a makeshift bed. What are the chances no one was touching anything at all.
    It’s one assumption vs another. we’re both guessing.[/quote]

    +++++++

    Daniel made a comment to sawyer that may help or confuse things. Sawyer said he was going to rearm himself or something like that. And Daniel said that he couldn’t. What do you think he meant by that.

  498. LostinSev says:

    Back to last season when Locke ran into the Dharma guy cutting down the tree (forgot his name), well it looked like he was skipping in time (??). He was repeating himself and then his nose started to bleed. Then all of the sudden his nose was clean and he was cutting the same tree down. It also seemed like to same tree fell twice. Was that a FF, FB or CIT? Does that have anything to do with the whispers?

  499. PJSander says:

    [quote comment=”309642″]Back to last season when Locke ran into the Dharma guy cutting down the tree (forgot his name), well it looked like he was skipping in time (??). He was repeating himself and then his nose started to bleed. Then all of the sudden his nose was clean and he was cutting the same tree down. It also seemed like to same tree fell twice. Was that a FF, FB or CIT? Does that have anything to do with the whispers?[/quote]

    That was a dream Locke had – or perhaps a vision in his sleep? Horace Goodspeed had died in the purge.

    : ) P

  500. SerbianChris says:

    [quote comment=”309641″]
    +++++++

    Daniel made a comment to sawyer that may help or confuse things. Sawyer said he was going to rearm himself or something like that. And Daniel said that he couldn’t. What do you think he meant by that.[/quote]
    ——————————————————-

    Not sure it does help. I just rewatched that part.
    Basically he was just telling Faraday that he’s goign to get supplies from the hatch, food water etc, Faraday told him it wouldnt work, cause Sawyer and Desmond didnt meet yet, and if they hadnt met they couldnt meet, “if it never happened it wont happen”.

    Which is probably why it did work with Faraday when he knocked. Cause unlike Sawyer, Faraday had already met Desmond in the past , more precisely in 1996 back in oxford.

    And that’s probably why Faraday thinks desmond is so special, Because when desmond travels he’s able to initiate new contacts and meet people even if he didnt know them yet. Which defies the rules of time travel according to Faraday.
    Like he did when he met faraday in 1996, Which explains that Desmond can cause a change in his travels, he can change the past! but the other fail no matter how hard they try. Desmond is the key here.

    et voila!

  501. LostinSev says:

    What was the conversation Locke and Horrace had in that dream ??? Could that have been an encounter like he had with Ethan? I mean…each time both Horrace and Ethan were dead. Well, that is if you consider Ethan dead. I know Ethan was not dead when the airplane crashed.

    Does anyone have an idea who Kate is secretly talking to??

  502. Amber says:

    I have decided just not to think about the time travel thing all together. It makes my head hurt. Im just gonna go with it and see what happens lol

  503. SerbianChris says:

    [quote comment=”309645″]What was the conversation Locke and Horrace had in that dream ??? Could that have been an encounter like he had with Ethan? I mean…each time both Horrace and Ethan were dead. Well, that is if you consider Ethan dead. I know Ethan was not dead when the airplane crashed.

    Does anyone have an idea who Kate is secretly talking to??[/quote]

    ——————————————–
    I dont remember Kate secretly talking to anyone, remind me of that part. If you mean on the phone in the car, she was talking to Sun.
    In my view Ethan/horrace arent similar events. Horrace seems to be like a time glitch or a dream/vision, whereas Ethan is very real. Locke traveled back to a time when Ethan was still alive and met him.

    BTW

    This beg the question: If (as faraday says) you cant meet someone you havent met yet, then how was Locke able to meet Ethan??
    He told sawyer he couldnt meet desmond because both men hadnt met yet at that time.
    So how were locke and Ethan the exception?
    Does that mean that they had met even earlier? Maybe off the island? It’s the only logical explanation.
    Anyone?

  504. PJSander says:

    [quote comment=”309639″]Right, but we’re going with assumptions. You’re assuming that touching something makes it travel, and you’re assuming Rose and others weren’t touching a thing.

    I’m assuming that those people looking lost and standing where the camp used to be had to be in them. After all there were many people there, someone had to be sitting on a makeshift chair or holding an object or lying down on a makeshift bed. What are the chances no one was touching anything at all.
    It’s one assumption vs another. we’re both guessing.[/quote]

    I will give you that we are both making assumptions. I am simply going with what Juliet said. In fairness though, when they said “their camp disappeared,” I am not sure anyone WOULD HAVE SAID “even the bottle of water I was holding.” They are all in shock. Regardless, we don’t KNOW the answers here, and as you said, are guessing.

    The difficult part for me now, is that you conclude that the logic doesn’t hold that the zodiac is still there, if the freighter, camp, plane wreckage etc., still are. Logical to you or not, the zodiac IS still there – as are their clothes and their backpacks. I am just providing a scenario (per Juliet) in which that actually COULD happen.

    : ) P

  505. PJSander says:

    [quote comment=”309648″]
    The difficult part for me now, is that you conclude that the logic doesn’t hold that the zodiac is still there, if the freighter, camp, plane wreckage etc., still are. [/quote]

    Sorry, this should read
    logic doesn’t hold that the zodiac is still there, if the freighter, camp, plane wreckage etc., are NOT.

  506. LostinSev says:

    Kate was secretly talking to someone when she and Jack were playing house. He confronted her about it and she told him that he needs to trust her!! (Well, she lied about it at first) This was last season after Kate’s trial and before Jack left her and went wacko.

  507. SerbianChris says:

    [quote comment=”309648″]

    The difficult part for me now, is that you conclude that the logic doesn’t hold that the zodiac is still there, if the freighter, camp, plane wreckage etc., still are. Logical to you or not, the zodiac IS still there – as are their clothes and their backpacks. I am just providing a scenario (per Juliet) in which that actually COULD happen.

    : ) P[/quote]
    —————————————————-
    Agreed.
    ok. I’ll try to be brief. Yeah right ;)

    1.First – to travel you have to be in the radius of island. So losties + island + raft in Radius. Check.

    2.Second – For it to exist in the past where they went, it had to “exist” – be build/created at that point it time, logical.
    Everything moved to the past minus the whole camp [built in a later time]

    Now the Zodiac is there because
    A.it was in the radius
    B.It had been physically built/in existence before that time already
    C.[and this is where we agree] It was with them. This is why Juliet explains the raft being there. i.e. They brought it into the radius with them, no reason it wont stay there.”its with us so along for the ride”

    So I’m sure we agree so far, the only issue is the “touching” thing. Cause what is “touching”?, you’re touching your shoes and they’re touching the floor and it’s touching the water etc etc etc. so it’s not a solid concept and too general.
    and all im saying here is that even if you touch something if you go into the past to a time when it wasnt created, then you’re in a time when it’s not created. so touching or not, it doesnt exist yet. Which is why the camps gone.

    Freighter not there cause it was outside the radius [At least as far as we know until now]
    Wreckage not there because this is a time PRIOR to the crash so obviously it wont be there.

    To travel, Had to be in Existence obviously and Has to be in Radius.

    I’ve broken my thoughts down as much as I could. Hope I’m making sense.

  508. PJSander says:

    [quote comment=”309652″]
    2.Second – For it to exist in the past where they went, it had to “exist” – be build/created at that point it time, logical.
    Everything moved to the past minus the whole camp [built in a later time][/quote]

    Okay, I understand what you are saying. I still don’t agree with you on the “touching” thing, but that is moot.

    However, your logic does not completely ring true as far as I am concerned. The camp was made up of all KINDS of things that existed before – tarps, suitcases, plane seats, water bottles, not just jungle detritus. In your scenario, should those things not have “stuck around” and moved with the people?

    At any rate, I think we have battered this subject to death and are really just circling the drain repeatedly, so I will save everyone ELSE from this seemingly mobius discussion by ending my part in it now! *bg*

    : ) P

  509. SerbianChris says:

    [quote comment=”309653″]
    However, your logic does not completely ring true as far as I am concerned. The camp was made up of all KINDS of things that existed before – tarps, suitcases, plane seats, water bottles, not just jungle detritus. In your scenario, should those things not have “stuck around” and moved with the people?
    : ) P[/quote]
    ————————————————-

    Haha you’re right, but let me just respond to this.
    it is true that the camp was built with all these things but you are forgetting something:

    “tarps, suitcases, plane seats, water bottles”

    All those come from the plane, but the plane hasnt crashed yet at that point in time, which is why they arent there :)

  510. SerbianChris says:

    Now that we put that one aside, I’d like your opinion on my comments/questions 503 and 506. :)

  511. curlygirl says:

    [quote comment=”309334″][quote comment=”309296″][quote comment=”309146″]Hey – I am new to this site – but have been a reader for a while now. You guys are GREAT!

    Here’s my thought – flight 815 crashes with all of our favorite characters – (who’s lives have all been intertwined in various ways) and a coffin carrying Christian Shepard. Now we’re trying to find a way to get John Locke’s coffin and the O6 back to the island.

    Maybe the crash of 815 was a similar quest. Maybe there was a group of people who had left the island and they “had to come back” just like our “losties” are doing now!

    I hope that makes sense…[/quote]
    Welcome.

    It makes sense. I would think that person would be Widmore. The only problem is he didn’t come back with his ‘group’. Keep hold of this one and look for supporting info.[/quote]
    ____________________________________
    I’ve given this idea some thought and can’t help thinking that this would just leave too much to chance: Even if Widmore didn’t go with his group, in order to plant the fake plane and then clear the island with his mercs before coming himself (reasonable plan), you have to have Desmond off killing Kelvin at just the right moment (so he is late pushing the button, which brings the plane – with the “group” in it), but you also run a lot of risk introducing all the extra people (our heros + all the red shirts). On the other hand, Widmore DOES seem arrogant enough to discount the effects of the extra people, but what about Desmond? Is he really in with Widmore?[/quote]

    Believe me, I totally agree – it just sounds a little too familiar…as far as the storyline goes…As far as Widmore not coming back with his group – – that’s actually perfect – because Ben supposedly can’t go back either.

    Just another little note – what if the reason that Sun doesnt have an older picture of Ji Yeon is because maybe Ben grabbed her? Only because she kept saying to Kate that she’d do anything it takes to protect her child – – hmmm….

  512. Rita says:

    [quote comment=”309657″][quote comment=”309334″][quote comment=”309296″][quote comment=”309146″]
    [/quote]
    [/quote]
    Just another little note – what if the reason that Sun doesnt have an older picture of Ji Yeon is because maybe Ben grabbed her? Only because she kept saying to Kate that she’d do anything it takes to protect her child – – hmmm….[/quote]
    __________________________________________
    Ah ha! This could make some kind of sense. I had the feeling that Sun was testing Kate’s response – like she would have said more if Kate’s reaction had been different. Instead, she changed the subject – to a sweet, faky, “so..how’s Jack?”. I think Sun WOULD do ANYTHING to protect Ji. Maybe SHE hasn’t seen Ji in all this time either. The plot thickens again….. :)

  513. LINS says:

    wouldn’t it be nice to know what all the “rules” are in regards to time travel in LOST!?!

    two more days…bring on more questions and fewer answers!

  514. Hammer says:

    PJ and Serbian, I want my last word on the subject too. I just want to say that I will be waiting for my ‘na na na boo boo’ moment. But will admit defeat if you are correct Serbian. :)

  515. Hammer says:

    [quote comment=”309642″]Back to last season when Locke ran into the Dharma guy cutting down the tree (forgot his name), well it looked like he was skipping in time (??). He was repeating himself and then his nose started to bleed. Then all of the sudden his nose was clean and he was cutting the same tree down. It also seemed like to same tree fell twice. Was that a FF, FB or CIT? Does that have anything to do with the whispers?[/quote]
    At first I thought it was a whisper deal. But I now think it was just a clue to this season that time was going to be skipping.

  516. Hammer says:

    [quote comment=”309656″]Now that we put that one aside, I’d like your opinion on my comments/questions 503 and 506. :)[/quote]
    I would like to comment that in past seasons on this blog I ‘predicted’ that Des and Penny were central to the story. With that I added that Des and Penny are our Adam and Eve. I guess they may be as central as I thought, but Des and Penny are very important to what is going on.

    Also, you question about Locke being able to meet Ethan. I don’t know if this is the deal, but here is a thought.

    Did Dan say Sawyer can’t meet Des or just that it wou’t work. What won’t work? Banging on the door? Or Desmond letting Sawyer get supplies? See, Ethan meeting Locke didn’t work either, he didn’t recognize Locke and he was going to kill him….because they weren’t suppose to meet. Make sense? Ethan would have killed Locke if another skip didn’t happen…so I guess it DIDN’T work.

  517. gmta leah says:

    I know your all sick of the time travel thingy ! yawn , yawn .So il try not to mention it …… Apart from this observation . Jin will be alive in the past, before the explosion!.
    “Always was”widmore said to ben, is that not a strange thing to say?’always will be’or ‘always has ‘ would have been better english . Also calling him “boy”?there s definatly something odd about that conversation between ben and widmore…like a father talkin to his wayward son.? maybe nothing. lastly , could the girl in the butchers shop be one of the children from the beech ,the others kidnapped?

  518. gmta leah says:

    here s another point , after the first flash and skip ,the camp had gone , but the hatch was imploded! it was only after the second flash did it re-appear intact.Id also just like to say . maybe we should try not thinking in terms of past=back ,future=forward . What about ‘side to side , and parallel?Who said anything about the island atually going any where ?perhaps every thing around it moved and the island stayed exactly where its always been ?…..well after that im going to bed .its five in the mornin here and im starting to halucinate and my spelling is slipping .

  519. Circus Mom says:

    [quote comment=”309663″]PJ and Serbian, I want my last word on the subject too. I just want to say that I will be waiting for my ‘na na na boo boo’ moment. But will admit defeat if you are correct Serbian. :)[/quote]
    +++++++++++++++++++++++++
    I am with Hammer on this one two. Time will only tell inthis and we could discuss it to death to no availe. We shall see.

  520. Laura says:

    Wow- Just finished reading all the posts, sorry if I missed something though!

    I like the Mrs. Hawkings as Faraday’s mom thing, but if she is so buddy buddy with Ben, why did Faraday set out on a mission to catch Ben? (supposedly working for the other side…)

    I think that in a way the manmade things serve as constants for the losties. Faraday’s original explanation for a need for a constant was that in order for Desmond to understand where he was he needed something to anchor him down. Because he was in a different time AND different location it was much more difficult. If he had been having these flashes, for example, in his hometown he would have been able to place the relative time of things based on his surroundings and he would not have needed Penny.

    Following this theory, the losties have been on the island long enough to have some ability to place themselves in time based on the things around them. They can see if there is a campsite, if the hatch is blown, if the hatch is built… a variety of things that I think would at least anchor them long enough to allow them to last longer in this environment.

    The freighter tots, however, don’t have this sense, which I believe is why Charlotte is being affected so suddenly. Miles and Faraday have a better understanding of what is going on (miles by speaking to the dead or whatever and faraday through his physics) so that is why Charlotte is getting affected so quickly.

    next week i have to read up sooner so it doesnt take me so long to post!!

  521. Rita says:

    [quote comment=”309714″]
    The freighter tots, however, don’t have this sense, which I believe is why Charlotte is being affected so suddenly. Miles and Faraday have a better understanding of what is going on (miles by speaking to the dead or whatever and faraday through his physics) so that is why Charlotte is getting affected so quickly.

    (/quote]
    ____________________________
    I like this Laura, except that Charlotte does have Dan with her and people can be used as constants – unless they are traveling WITH you perhaps?

  522. SerbianChris says:

    [quote comment=”309666″]

    Did Dan say Sawyer can’t meet Des or just that it wou’t work. What won’t work? Banging on the door? Or Desmond letting Sawyer get supplies? See, Ethan meeting Locke didn’t work either, he didn’t recognize Locke and he was going to kill him….because they weren’t suppose to meet. Make sense? Ethan would have killed Locke if another skip didn’t happen…so I guess it DIDN’T work.[/quote]

    ————————————————–
    I think this is very important, i cant belive i missed this issue before.

    Daniel told Sawyer that:
    He could not meet with desmond, because they hadn’t met yet.

    This is the sentence he used:
    “If you didnt meet yet, then you Cant meet”

    So desmond and sawyer wouldnt be able to have any contact because they dont know each other yet that the time. That is specifically how he explained it.

    and yet Locke and Ethan did meet, and spoke.
    not only did they meet but he got shot by him so Locke ended up with a bullet in his leg, the past was changed drastically in this case.
    There’s something very important going on here.
    The only explanation is that Ethan and Locke had to have know each other in the past. Maybe at that drug factory or maybe they’re related somehow.

  523. Hammer says:

    [quote comment=”309687″]Who said anything about the island atually going any where ?perhaps every thing around it moved and the island stayed exactly where its always been ?…..[/quote]
    D & C confirmed in a podcast that this island is moving as well as the losties skipping through time.

  524. LostinSev says:

    So…are the whispers “others” or “dead Dharma” (mass grave) trying to CHANGE what they can’t change? Like they are trying to communicate with the Losties to change or stop the SKIPPING they are experiencing?? It is like the Losties could feel and hear things and sometimes sees someone for brief moments. ?? I don’t think I explained my thoughts very well here.

    Someone mentioned the picture of Hurley at the top of this page…

    He looks like he is off the coast of Oregon or Washington!!!

  525. RGS says:

    [quote comment=”309852″][quote comment=”309666″]

    Did Dan say Sawyer can’t meet Des or just that it wou’t work. What won’t work? Banging on the door? Or Desmond letting Sawyer get supplies? See, Ethan meeting Locke didn’t work either, he didn’t recognize Locke and he was going to kill him….because they weren’t suppose to meet. Make sense? Ethan would have killed Locke if another skip didn’t happen…so I guess it DIDN’T work.[/quote]

    ————————————————–
    I think this is very important, i cant belive i missed this issue before.

    Daniel told Sawyer that:
    He could not meet with desmond, because they hadn’t met yet.

    This is the sentence he used:
    “If you didnt meet yet, then you Cant meet”

    So desmond and sawyer wouldnt be able to have any contact because they dont know each other yet that the time. That is specifically how he explained it.

    and yet Locke and Ethan did meet, and spoke.
    not only did they meet but he got shot by him so Locke ended up with a bullet in his leg, the past was changed drastically in this case.
    There’s something very important going on here.
    The only explanation is that Ethan and Locke had to have know each other in the past. Maybe at that drug factory or maybe they’re related somehow.[/quote]

    Admittedly I had not been following your debate regarding the time travel/freightor moving/ Polar Bear telepathic communication/ who’s on first, what’s on second mind bender, but I think, try as you may to justify it, you have discovered another plot hole in the Locke/Ethan meeting.

    I believe that it is a minor enough detail that they will not show this meeting in a way that would justify your premise, that they had met before. There are too many other mysteries to explain and they claim they are trying to answer more questions than they bring up.

  526. PJSander says:

    [quote comment=”309859″]I believe that it is a minor enough detail that they will not show this meeting in a way that would justify your premise, that they had met before. There are too many other mysteries to explain and they claim they are trying to answer more questions than they bring up.[/quote]

    Okay, so Daniel tells Sawyer, “Because Desmond didn’t know you when he first came out of there. That means you never met which means you can’t meet. ”

    Right now, we are questioning this because Locke later sees Ethan. MAYBE, Daniel wasn’t telling Sawyer the truth because he didn’t want Sawyer to spook Desmond and sabotage Daniel’s chance to get a message to his mother.

    Just a thought.

    : ) P

  527. LostinSev says:

    Ethan left the island often like Richard. Ethan was in the Miami Hospital where they recruited Juliet. But, the only problem with this is that we haven’t seen this encounter (Locke and Ethan) to prove or disprove this theory.

    Why did they show Bennard and Rose so much?? They bickered a lot!! How important are they? Adam and Eve…black and white stone…
    Was it their son who took over Jack’s position in the hospital?? They are still around and I think they are going to be an important part of this puzzle.

  528. Hurley's Dad says:

    [quote comment=”309860″][quote comment=”309859″]I believe that it is a minor enough detail that they will not show this meeting in a way that would justify your premise, that they had met before. There are too many other mysteries to explain and they claim they are trying to answer more questions than they bring up.[/quote]

    Okay, so Daniel tells Sawyer, “Because Desmond didn’t know you when he first came out of there. That means you never met which means you can’t meet. ”

    Right now, we are questioning this because Locke later sees Ethan. MAYBE, Daniel wasn’t telling Sawyer the truth because he didn’t want Sawyer to spook Desmond and sabotage Daniel’s chance to get a message to his mother.

    Just a thought.

    : ) P[/quote]
    I’m leaning towards this line of thinking. Isn’t it entirely plausible Daniel wants the Losties to touch as few things as possible in the past, but he feels more comfortable doing it himself?

    Isn’t that why Daniel made contact with pre-crash Desmond? Or was that solely to get in touch with his constant so his nose doesn’t start bleeding….

  529. Hurley's Dad says:

    [quote comment=”309861″]Ethan left the island often like Richard. Ethan was in the Miami Hospital where they recruited Juliet. But, the only problem with this is that we haven’t seen this encounter (Locke and Ethan) to prove or disprove this theory.

    Why did they show Bennard and Rose so much?? They bickered a lot!! How important are they? Adam and Eve…black and white stone…
    Was it their son who took over Jack’s position in the hospital?? They are still around and I think they are going to be an important part of this puzzle.[/quote]
    I know there are a lot of theories about Adam & Eve, I’m going with Rose/Bernard now mainly because we know they could’ve traveled in the past, do not want to leave the island, and the black/white stones correlation.

    As far as the doc in TTLG, highly unlikely. R&B married each other when they were in their 50’s.

  530. LostinSev says:

    would you say Richard is Locke’s constant?

    What about Sawyer’s daughter? Does anyone think she or the girl’s mom will come back into the picture. I know she (Sawyer’s daughter) never meet him but she want to search for him!

    Just a thought!?

    If Sawyer and Daniel have never met until after the white light, then why is Daniel calling Sawyer, James??? when everyone is calling him Sawyer???

  531. Miraks says:

    [quote comment=”309852″][quote comment=”309666″]

    Did Dan say Sawyer can’t meet Des or just that it wou’t work. What won’t work? Banging on the door? Or Desmond letting Sawyer get supplies? See, Ethan meeting Locke didn’t work either, he didn’t recognize Locke and he was going to kill him….because they weren’t suppose to meet. Make sense? Ethan would have killed Locke if another skip didn’t happen…so I guess it DIDN’T work.
    ————————————————–
    I think this is very important, i cant belive i missed this issue before.

    Daniel told Sawyer that:
    He could not meet with desmond, because they hadn’t met yet.

    This is the sentence he used:
    “If you didnt meet yet, then you Cant meet”

    So desmond and sawyer wouldnt be able to have any contact because they dont know each other yet that the time. That is specifically how he explained it.

    and yet Locke and Ethan did meet, and spoke.
    not only did they meet but he got shot by him so Locke ended up with a bullet in his leg, the past was changed drastically in this case.
    There’s something very important going on here.
    The only explanation is that Ethan and Locke had to have know each other in the past. Maybe at that drug factory or maybe they’re related somehow.[/quote]
    ___________________________________________
    I don’t think that is what it means. I don’t think he meant it was impossible, more of a “can’t” in the sense that it’s futile. To me it meant: you haven’t met yet, and if you knock on his door now and have him come out, there won’t be enough time to explain everything (since the Losties don’t understand what is going on themselves). You will spook Dezmond and it won’t do any good, because you won’t be able to stop the jumping anyway. At best Dez will be completely freaked out and shoot someone.
    Which is what happened between Locke and Ethan.

  532. Miraks says:

    [quote comment=”309866″]

    If Sawyer and Daniel have never met until after the white light, then why is Daniel calling Sawyer, James??? when everyone is calling him Sawyer???[/quote]
    Daniel is going by the name that was on the plane’s manifest- which was Sawyer’s real name.

  533. LostinSev says:

    So you are saying that Daniel knew the manifest and when they first encountered each other and Sawyer said he was Sawyer, then why would Dan continue to call him James.

    Unless Daniel knew or met Sawyer prior and Dan knew him as James. Daniel has done some time travel that we know!!

    This may not be anything at all but….I was surprised to see Daniel at the Orchid and that he had that brushed encounter with Dr. Candle. Daniel kept a real low profile while down in the Orchid.

  534. Miraks says:

    [quote comment=”309870″]So you are saying that Daniel knew the manifest and when they first encountered each other and Sawyer said he was Sawyer, then why would Dan continue to call him James.

    Unless Daniel knew or met Sawyer prior and Dan knew him as James. Daniel has done some time travel that we know!!

    This may not be anything at all but….I was surprised to see Daniel at the Orchid and that he had that brushed encounter with Dr. Candle. Daniel kept a real low profile while down in the Orchid.[/quote]
    Well Daniel isn’t the only one who calls him James. I don’t really think there is any more to this.

    As far as Daniel being down in the Orchid, I think that was a flash forward/ back, as in it hasn’t happened yet. Sometime this season we’ll see Daniel being able to go back to that particular time with some definite goals to somehow help the group in the now. Not sure I put it in a way that makes sense.

  535. Hammer says:

    R & B would be an interesting A & E. Maybe the get killed during a time skip and end up in the caves? Of course that would be something that happened that didn’t happen. :)

  536. PJSander says:

    [quote comment=”309872″]As far as Daniel being down in the Orchid, I think that was a flash forward/ back, as in it hasn’t happened yet. Sometime this season we’ll see Daniel being able to go back to that particular time with some definite goals to somehow help the group in the now. Not sure I put it in a way that makes sense.[/quote]

    I agree. At some point this season, Daniel will travel back to that time period (perhaps even with the rest of the group in a time jump) and do some reconnaissance work.

    : ) P

  537. Dharma34 says:

    Okay……. Season one claire has a dream about Locke telling her that she gave her baby away and now everyone suffers because of it. Secondly the pyscic she went to see knew the plane was going to crash and put her on it to make sure claire ccouldnt give the baby away he said it was crucial that she raised the baby for it’s and evryones safety. Arron is subtly the most important character to get back to the island

  538. PJSander says:

    [quote comment=”309873″]R & B would be an interesting A & E. Maybe the get killed during a time skip and end up in the caves? Of course that would be something that happened that didn’t happen. :)[/quote]

    Well yes… but how is ANYONE we already know going to end up as A&E if it isn’t something that happened that didn’t already happen?

    : ) P

  539. PJSander says:

    [quote comment=”309876″]Okay……. Season one claire has a dream about Locke telling her that she gave her baby away and now everyone suffers because of it. Secondly the pyscic she went to see knew the plane was going to crash and put her on it to make sure claire ccouldnt give the baby away he said it was crucial that she raised the baby for it’s and evryones safety. Arron is subtly the most important character to get back to the island[/quote]

    And this is why I think that it takes the entire season to see the O6 return to the island. That and D&C confirm that we will not see Emilie de Ravin this season!

    : ) P

  540. Laura says:

    [quote comment=”309873″]R & B would be an interesting A & E. Maybe the get killed during a time skip and end up in the caves? Of course that would be something that happened that didn’t happen. :)[/quote]

    Oooh and it goes with the whole Black & White theme from first season!

    [quote comment=”309844″]
    I like this Laura, except that Charlotte does have Dan with her and people can be used as constants – unless they are traveling WITH you perhaps?[/quote]

    I agree. The point of a constant is to ground you in some time. Having Daniel with you, when he is bouncing around in time with you, can’t ground you, because seeing him doesn’t help you understand where in time you are.

  541. Hammer says:

    [quote comment=”309877″][quote comment=”309873″]R & B would be an interesting A & E. Maybe the get killed during a time skip and end up in the caves? Of course that would be something that happened that didn’t happen. :)[/quote]

    Well yes… but how is ANYONE we already know going to end up as A&E if it isn’t something that happened that didn’t already happen?

    : ) P[/quote]
    Ahhhh….good point.

  542. Circus Mom says:

    [quote comment=”309883″][quote comment=”309877″][quote comment=”309873″]R & B would be an interesting A & E. Maybe the get killed during a time skip and end up in the caves? Of course that would be something that happened that didn’t happen. :)[/quote]

    Well yes… but how is ANYONE we already know going to end up as A&E if it isn’t something that happened that didn’t already happen?

    : ) P[/quote]
    Ahhhh….good point.[/quote]
    ++++++++++++++++++++++
    Unless it already happened but just hasn’t happened yet. What I mean is, it happenes before 2008 but after the initial time jumps.

  543. Circus Mom says:

    We should all remember that Adam and Eve don’t have to be a couple. I think Rose and Bernard would have been laying together, not several feet apart. I also think Adam and Eve need to die in that cave in order to save everyone else.

  544. Miraks says:

    [quote comment=”309895″]We should all remember that Adam and Eve don’t have to be a couple. I think Rose and Bernard would have been laying together, not several feet apart. I also think Adam and Eve need to die in that cave in order to save everyone else.[/quote]
    I agree. We’re assumimg they are a couple, BUT
    1. it was Locke who called them Adam and Eve
    2. only one of them was in possesion of the stones
    also
    3. they pre-date Dharma by 10-20 years

    What is they are not a couple, but on opposite sides?

  545. LINS says:

    Also, remember that Dan told Des that a constant “could” be a person, but apparently doesn’t have to be one…I know we like to try and pick whos constant is who’s, but it doesn’t have to be a person…

  546. ESB says:

    [quote comment=”309613″]This may be off subject but I was thinking about who else knows about “the lie”. Frank Lapidus. What do we know about Frank? Is he someone we can trust? I’ve always assumed he was but I am rethinking that now. If he wasn’t going to be important in all this, he would have drowned when the helicopter went down. There is a reason they are keeping him around. He may have told Widmore about the O6 and their lie. He was working on the freighter to take the scientists to the island so was he working for Widmore?[/quote]

    i was re-watching the episodes last night and my wife brought up a good point…at this point the lie is totally pointless…since the people that they are trying to protect the remaining survivors against know they’re lying, know the island exists and are still looking for it, and since none of the Oceanic 6 know where it is or how in the hell to get back…
    i mean i understand if you’re gonna lie because you’ll sound crazy or because you don’t want someone getting information out of you but saying you have to lie to protect the ones you left behind, when you know NOTHING and you’re fooling NONE of the bad guys, is ridiculous…
    i mean, is Widmore gonna stop looking for the island because they lied about where they were??? he just had a conversation with Ben about the island for crying out loud…he’s not gonna stop looking for it just because the Oceanic 6 made up some story…
    so somebody please, please explain to me who the lie is supposed to be fooling?? ;)

  547. ESB says:

    [/quote]

    just an opinion but i have always been under the impression that Widmore was behind the DI (at the very least financially, if not in other ways too) and that Ben ‘stole’ the island when he and the ‘others’ (or natives in this case) killed off the DI and took it over…but come to think of it, i can’t think of any real proof that that is the case…is there any proof that is NOT the case?

    the real question in my opinion is how Widmore came to be the ‘owner’ of the island…i love the thoery that he may have been on and/or the captian of the Black Rock and i think it makes sense (in a weird Lost-time-travel-what-the-heck-is-going-on sorta way ;)[/quote]

    ++++++++++++++++++++++

    Didn’t Sun find a prego test with Widmore’s company name on it on the island?[/quote]

    __________________________________________________

    yes, she did…Kate too i think…

  548. Amber says:

    Im really confused on the adam and eve thing and the stones can someone tell me what episode that is so i can watch it

  549. agentLOST says:

    [quote comment=”309610″]
    * You only go back to times in which YOU were not present at the new time period (so you can’t run into yourself in the past).
    _______________________________________________________

    This makes perfect sense. I do hope this “rule” can be adhered to or the show might otherwise threaten to jump the shark, so to speak.

  550. Hurley's Dad says:

    [quote comment=”309904″]Im really confused on the adam and eve thing and the stones can someone tell me what episode that is so i can watch it[/quote]
    House of the Rising Sun – S1xE6

  551. Hurley's Dad says:

    [quote comment=”309905″][quote comment=”309610″]
    * You only go back to times in which YOU were not present at the new time period (so you can’t run into yourself in the past).
    _______________________________________________________

    This makes perfect sense. I do hope this “rule” can be adhered to or the show might otherwise threaten to jump the shark, so to speak.[/quote]

    I agree. Holding to this rule might explain why the Alperts of the island don’t jump. They’ve always been on the island and can’t jump anywhere on the timeline, while the Losties/Juliet can.

  552. LostinSev says:

    So the Losties will travel/skip through time but never in the time period when they were on the island (that three to four month period)?? What about the future? Does this indicate that they will all be rescued? Do you think they will all remain and become the new Others?

    If Dan could talk to Des and Locke could talk to Ethan, then how come the Losties can’t communicate with anyone else they know from the past. Like Danielle? OR Alex?

  553. SerbianChris says:

    [quote comment=”309863″][quote comment=”309860″][quote comment=”309859″]I believe that it is a minor enough detail that they will not show this meeting in a way that would justify your premise, that they had met before. There are too many other mysteries to explain and they claim they are trying to answer more questions than they bring up.[/quote]

    Okay, so Daniel tells Sawyer, “Because Desmond didn’t know you when he first came out of there. That means you never met which means you can’t meet. ”

    Right now, we are questioning this because Locke later sees Ethan. MAYBE, Daniel wasn’t telling Sawyer the truth because he didn’t want Sawyer to spook Desmond and sabotage Daniel’s chance to get a message to his mother.

    Just a thought.

    : ) P[/quote]
    I’m leaning towards this line of thinking. Isn’t it entirely plausible Daniel wants the Losties to touch as few things as possible in the past, but he feels more comfortable doing it himself?

    Isn’t that why Daniel made contact with pre-crash Desmond? Or was that solely to get in touch with his constant so his nose doesn’t start bleeding….[/quote]
    —————————————————

    RGS you might be right it can always be a plot hole, but it’s definitely not “normal”. Somthing’s up I guess we’ll see.

    PJ and hurleysDad you might be right too, but what makes me doubt that , is the fact that Daniel runs to his backpack to check his notes then knock and prays that it works.
    Which suggests that he’s not sure things are goign to work in his favor, i.e. doesnt seem like his plan was premeditated.
    Besides, When sawyer knocked multiple times, desmond didnt open at all which might prove Daniel’s theory to be actually correct. The door was only opened when daniel knocked alone, which is consistent.
    Could be a coincidence, but so far everything we’ve seen on the show had some kind of significance.
    I guess we’ll know soon, but I feel there’s more to this than we think. I have a strong feeling there’s a past connection between Ethan and Locke.

  554. LostinSev says:

    Des did ask Dan if he was the one knocking on his door for the last 20 minutes. Could Des have heard Sawyer knock and by the time he got his yellow suit on and gun, only Daniel was there?

  555. Hurley's Dad says:

    Continuity error or something we should be discussing? I’m doing this by memory, so I hope I’m not wrong…

    Events happen in this order:
    *Faraday shoos everyone away from the Desmond Door. Everyone heads to the beach.
    *Faraday reads his notes and makes contact with Desmond.
    *At the end of the conversation, bright light and for dramatic affect just before we find out Dan’s mom’s name.
    *Two hours later, Dan walks on the beach.

    Was Faraday the ONLY one to move in time?

  556. PJSander says:

    [quote comment=”309901″]i was re-watching the episodes last night and my wife brought up a good point…at this point the lie is totally pointless…since the people that they are trying to protect the remaining survivors against know they’re lying, know the island exists and are still looking for it, and since none of the Oceanic 6 know where it is or how in the hell to get back…
    i mean i understand if you’re gonna lie because you’ll sound crazy or because you don’t want someone getting information out of you but saying you have to lie to protect the ones you left behind, when you know NOTHING and you’re fooling NONE of the bad guys, is ridiculous…
    i mean, is Widmore gonna stop looking for the island because they lied about where they were??? he just had a conversation with Ben about the island for crying out loud…he’s not gonna stop looking for it just because the Oceanic 6 made up some story…
    so somebody please, please explain to me who the lie is supposed to be fooling?? ;)[/quote]

    My thought is that they aren’t lying just so that Widmore won’t find the island, they are lying so that no one ELSE will LOOK for the island. If the public heard their story (and actually believed it), there would be an investigation into the faux plane, who put it there, why, etc. I think that this might actually put the O6 in jeopardy of retribution from Widmore. If they are voluntarily lying about what happened, he may think he is safe.

    How their going back will protect the remaining LOSTies, I don’t know. So I don’t know how their lie protects them either.

    : ) P

  557. Rita says:

    [quote comment=”309941″]

    Was Faraday the ONLY one to move in time?[/quote]
    ___________________________________________
    No, because he was able to join the rest on the beach – if he had been the only one to move in time, he would have had to move BACK to their time, or else he would have been in a different time line. Just my humble opinion.

  558. PJSander says:

    [quote comment=”309947″]No, because he was able to join the rest on the beach – if he had been the only one to move in time, he would have had to move BACK to their time, or else he would have been in a different time line. Just my humble opinion.[/quote]

    I agree. I suspect that he may well have had to knock on the door for a while, and then got lost, just as he said he did. Or maybe he went somewhere else on the island to investigate (back to the 70’s perhaps?) and got lost.

    : ) P

  559. ESB says:

    [quote comment=”309946″][quote comment=”309901″]i was re-watching the episodes last night and my wife brought up a good point…at this point the lie is totally pointless…since the people that they are trying to protect the remaining survivors against know they’re lying, know the island exists and are still looking for it, and since none of the Oceanic 6 know where it is or how in the hell to get back…
    i mean i understand if you’re gonna lie because you’ll sound crazy or because you don’t want someone getting information out of you but saying you have to lie to protect the ones you left behind, when you know NOTHING and you’re fooling NONE of the bad guys, is ridiculous…
    i mean, is Widmore gonna stop looking for the island because they lied about where they were??? he just had a conversation with Ben about the island for crying out loud…he’s not gonna stop looking for it just because the Oceanic 6 made up some story…
    so somebody please, please explain to me who the lie is supposed to be fooling?? ;)[/quote]

    My thought is that they aren’t lying just so that Widmore won’t find the island, they are lying so that no one ELSE will LOOK for the island. If the public heard their story (and actually believed it), there would be an investigation into the faux plane, who put it there, why, etc. I think that this might actually put the O6 in jeopardy of retribution from Widmore. If they are voluntarily lying about what happened, he may think he is safe.

    How their going back will protect the remaining LOSTies, I don’t know. So I don’t know how their lie protects them either.

    : ) P[/quote]

    haha, awesome…thanks for calming me down PJ…;)

  560. SerbianChris says:

    [quote comment=”309953″]

    Was Faraday the ONLY one to move in time?
    ___________________________________________
    No, because he was able to join the rest on the beach – if he had been the only one to move in time, he would have had to move BACK to their time, or else he would have been in a different time line. Just my humble opinion.[/quote]
    ———————————————-
    My thought exactly. :)
    Im my opinion they all move together. Everything within the Radius/island

  561. JotBar says:

    My first time here and dont really know what has been discussed but i do know that in season one Locke mentions that michael needs to treat Walt like an adult to help him reach his “full ptential”. Arron on the other hand is unborn but the others have great interest in him. also the pyscic and an unnatural force that wont let claire sign him over to the adoptive parents want claire to raise this baby and the psycic even says its crucial. something tells me both walt and arron should be on the island

  562. SerbianChris says:

    JotBar, Hello and Welcome I’m relatively new too.
    You might want to scroll through this page a little to get a sense of what’s been discussed. The topic here is Episodes 1 and 2 of season 5, and themes relating to them.
    Enjoy.

  563. duke says:

    It also seems funny to me that we only got a brief glimpse of Jacob one time and to me he looked an awful lot like LOCKE. The first time Locke went to the cabin we see him but every other time it is Christian that we see. I think Locke is Jacob. agree/disagree?

  564. PJSander says:

    [quote comment=”310010″]It also seems funny to me that we only got a brief glimpse of Jacob one time and to me he looked an awful lot like LOCKE. The first time Locke went to the cabin we see him but every other time it is Christian that we see. I think Locke is Jacob. agree/disagree?[/quote]

    If you are talking about the time when Jacob was in the rocking chair, and we caught a glimpse of him in half light, I am not sure we can take that too literally. In the DVD extras, D&C admitted that the guy in the rocking chair was the production’s prop master (I think – someone who works behind the scenes at any rate).

    : ) P

  565. Toeknee says:

    OK I’m finally gonna chime in on some of the time-travelling issues being discussed. I can only read a few of these posts at a time because my head really starts spinning. But there are a lot of great ideas being thrown out here. You should all be proud of yourselves!

    However, I have to disagree with some of SerbianChris’ points regarding the issues with Desmond and Daniel seeing each other, and Ethan and Locke seeing each other. Nothing personal, SerbianChris, because I have to say I have agreed with most of the points you’ve been making. Anyways, here I go….

    SerbianChris said this in comment #525:
    “Daniel told Sawyer that: He could not meet with desmond, because they hadn’t met yet. This is the sentence he used: “If you didnt meet yet, then you Cant meet” So desmond and sawyer wouldnt be able to have any contact because they dont know each other yet that the time.”

    Then Miraks responded in his comment #534:
    “I don’t think he meant it was impossible, more of a “can’t” in the sense that it’s futile. To me it meant: you haven’t met yet, and if you knock on his door now and have him come out, there won’t be enough time to explain everything”

    I very much agree with Miraks on this issue, but I’d take it a step further. Like Miraks, I don’t think Daniel’s statements meant that time traveling people can only meet up with people they had met at a prior time. Whether or not a time-traveling person makes contact with another person in a different era is just a matter of what happened the first time around on the timeline. In my mind, I keep going back to what Daniel and Mrs. Hawkings have said, that you can’t change the past. So history is only one timeline (Daniel’s analogy about a road was a good one) and the events that occurred at any point in time always occurred in exactly the same way, no matter how many times you go to revisit that point in time. So I interpret Daniel’s statement to Sawyer as meaning that back in season 2, when Desmond first encountered all the Losties, and in particular when he met Sawyer, he didn’t recognize Sawyer. So that means that in 2003 (or whatever date it was that that scene took place), as Desmond’s sitting in the Swan, waiting for the timer to run down, he hears knocking on the door so he answers the door and he sees the time-traveling Daniel there. He didn’t see Sawyer, or else there would have been a scene in season 2 where Des says to Sawyer “do I know you?” So, because 2004 Des didn’t recognize Sawyer, that means the time-traveling Sawyer didn’t go into the hatch in 2003, which is why Daniel says they can’t meet. Like Miraks said, it is futile, it’s impossible – no matter how hard the time-traveling Sawyer might try, the forces that be are apparently preventing him from meeting the 2003 Desmond. It didn’t happen the first time through, it can’t happen no matter how many times he might go back to that particular time and try to get into the hatch.

    And, in that scene, the 2003 meeting of Desmond and Daniel had nothing to do with a possible theory that Desmond and Daniel met each other at some point prior to 2003. Yes Daniel and Desmond’s 2004 consciousness did meet in “The Constant”, and that’s a major plot point of course, but that is not what enabled the time-traveling 2004 Daniel to meet with Desmond in 2003, while the time-travelling 2004 Sawyer could not. IMHO

    Similarly, I don’t think the reason the time-travelling 2004 Locke encountered 2003 Ethan has anything to do with a theory that they met each other at some point prior to 2003. That is not the jist of what Daniel was saying to Sawyer. IMHO

    I see the Ethan-Locke situation this way: On the day in 2003 (or whatever date it was that that scene took place) that Yemi’s plane crashed on the island, Ethan went out for a walk with his gun. Along the way he encountered the time-traveling 2004 Locke, a person who he (Ethan) had never seen before, and shot him. Then Locke time-travels again, back to 2004 (and apparently disappears from right under Ethan’s nose). Time goes on, O815 crashes on the island, and Ethan infiltrates the ranks of the Losties. Being an Other, and a fairly high-ranking Other, Ethan knows all about the strange aspects of the island, including time-traveling, so he can’t let on that he already encountered Locke a year or so earlier. Time goes on, Ethan gets killed. More time goes on, Ben turns the Donkey wheel in late 2004, and Locke time travels back to the day in 2003 that Yemi’s plane crashes, and has the exact same encounter with Ethan. After getting shot, he time travels back to January 2005. That’s what happened on that day in 2003 – Yemi’s plane always crashes, time-traveling 2004 Locke always arrives on the island for a short visit, Ethan always shoots him. Because you can’t change history.

    Of course all of this is JMHO and may be wrong. Sorry for the length. I hope it made some sense.

  566. Amber says:

    Ok so this is what i am wondering…when “Daniel told Sawyer that: He could not meet with desmond, because they hadn’t met yet. this may sound stupid but does that mean desmond didnt even hear sawyer knocking, or if he just came outside he wouldnt even see sawyer, but would see daniel because they had meet before. and if thats the case would that mean that ethan and locke had meet off the island so they were able to “meet again”

  567. PJSander says:

    [quote comment=”310022″]
    I see the Ethan-Locke situation this way: On the day in 2003 (or whatever date it was that that scene took place) that Yemi’s plane crashed on the island, Ethan went out for a walk with his gun. Along the way he encountered the time-traveling 2004 Locke, a person who he (Ethan) had never seen before, and shot him. Then Locke time-travels again, back to 2004 (and apparently disappears from right under Ethan’s nose). Time goes on, O815 crashes on the island, and Ethan infiltrates the ranks of the Losties. Being an Other, and a fairly high-ranking Other, Ethan knows all about the strange aspects of the island, including time-traveling, so he can’t let on that he already encountered Locke a year or so earlier. Time goes on, Ethan gets killed. More time goes on, Ben turns the Donkey wheel in late 2004, and Locke time travels back to the day in 2003 that Yemi’s plane crashes, and has the exact same encounter with Ethan. After getting shot, he time travels back to January 2005. That’s what happened on that day in 2003 – Yemi’s plane always crashes, time-traveling 2004 Locke always arrives on the island for a short visit, Ethan always shoots him. Because you can’t change history.[/quote]

    I like this, Toeknee. My head hurts, and I think I may have popped a vein in the frontal lobe of my cerebral cortex just THINKING about it. But I like it.

    : ) P
    (oh mylanta, is my NOSE bleeding?!)

  568. RGS says:

    [quote comment=”310022″]OK I’m finally gonna chime in on some of the time-travelling issues being discussed. I can only read a few of these posts at a time because my head really starts spinning. But there are a lot of great ideas being thrown out here. You should all be proud of yourselves!

    However, I have to disagree with some of SerbianChris’ points regarding the issues with Desmond and Daniel seeing each other, and Ethan and Locke seeing each other. Nothing personal, SerbianChris, because I have to say I have agreed with most of the points you’ve been making. Anyways, here I go….

    SerbianChris said this in comment #525:
    “Daniel told Sawyer that: He could not meet with desmond, because they hadn’t met yet. This is the sentence he used: “If you didnt meet yet, then you Cant meet” So desmond and sawyer wouldnt be able to have any contact because they dont know each other yet that the time.”

    Then Miraks responded in his comment #534:
    “I don’t think he meant it was impossible, more of a “can’t” in the sense that it’s futile. To me it meant: you haven’t met yet, and if you knock on his door now and have him come out, there won’t be enough time to explain everything”

    I very much agree with Miraks on this issue, but I’d take it a step further. Like Miraks, I don’t think Daniel’s statements meant that time traveling people can only meet up with people they had met at a prior time. Whether or not a time-traveling person makes contact with another person in a different era is just a matter of what happened the first time around on the timeline. In my mind, I keep going back to what Daniel and Mrs. Hawkings have said, that you can’t change the past. So history is only one timeline (Daniel’s analogy about a road was a good one) and the events that occurred at any point in time always occurred in exactly the same way, no matter how many times you go to revisit that point in time.

    So I interpret Daniel’s statement to Sawyer as meaning that back in season 2, when Desmond first encountered all the Losties, and in particular when he met Sawyer, he didn’t recognize Sawyer. So that means that in 2003 (or whatever date it was that that scene took place), as Desmond’s sitting in the Swan, waiting for the timer to run down, he hears knocking on the door so he answers the door and he sees the time-traveling Daniel there. He didn’t see Sawyer, or else there would have been a scene in season 2 where Des says to Sawyer “do I know you?”

    So, because 2004 Des didn’t recognize Sawyer, that means the time-traveling Sawyer didn’t go into the hatch in 2003, which is why Daniel says they can’t meet. Like Miraks said, it is futile, it’s impossible – no matter how hard the time-traveling Sawyer might try, the forces that be are apparently preventing him from meeting the 2003 Desmond. It didn’t happen the first time through, it can’t happen no matter how many times he might go back to that particular time and try to get into the hatch.

    And, in that scene, the 2003 meeting of Desmond and Daniel had nothing to do with a possible theory that Desmond and Daniel met each other at some point prior to 2003. Yes Daniel and Desmond’s 2004 consciousness did meet in “The Constant”, and that’s a major plot point of course, but that is not what enabled the time-traveling 2004 Daniel to meet with Desmond in 2003, while the time-travelling 2004 Sawyer could not. IMHO

    Similarly, I don’t think the reason the time-travelling 2004 Locke encountered 2003 Ethan has anything to do with a theory that they met each other at some point prior to 2003. That is not the jist of what Daniel was saying to Sawyer. IMHO

    I see the Ethan-Locke situation this way: On the day in 2003 (or whatever date it was that that scene took place) that Yemi’s plane crashed on the island, Ethan went out for a walk with his gun. Along the way he encountered the time-traveling 2004 Locke, a person who he (Ethan) had never seen before, and shot him. Then Locke time-travels again, back to 2004 (and apparently disappears from right under Ethan’s nose). Time goes on, O815 crashes on the island, and Ethan infiltrates the ranks of the Losties. Being an Other, and a fairly high-ranking Other, Ethan knows all about the strange aspects of the island, including time-traveling, so he can’t let on that he already encountered Locke a year or so earlier. Time goes on, Ethan gets killed. More time goes on, Ben turns the Donkey wheel in late 2004, and Locke time travels back to the day in 2003 that Yemi’s plane crashes, and has the exact same encounter with Ethan. After getting shot, he time travels back to January 2005. That’s what happened on that day in 2003 – Yemi’s plane always crashes, time-traveling 2004 Locke always arrives on the island for a short visit, Ethan always shoots him. Because you can’t change history.

    Of course all of this is JMHO and may be wrong. Sorry for the length. I hope it made some sense.[/quote]

    People seem to be a little concerned with why Desmond didn’t answer the door when Sawyer knocked, while all the theories that have been presented are sound, a simple one may be that he was waiting to push the button at the time they were knocking on the door. Thus he couldn’t answer because whatever altercation that ensued may have caused him to miss pushing the button. Hence contributing to “the forces” not allowing he and Sawyer to meet.

    My problem with what you just posted however is that Daniel and Desmond actually DID meet in 1996. That wasn’t merely Desmond’s conscious. That means that if we interpret “can’t meet” as impossible to meet, that meeting in 1996 directly contradicts that theory because they had not met prior to 2003/4. It’s circular.

    It also sorta contradicts the “won’t be enough time to explain” because if Daniel felt that way, then he shoulda thought sending Desmond to Oxford woulda been futile because Des was slipping in and out of time periods at an unpredictable rate…the same rate that Daniel now fears the island is slipping in and out of, so it would be inconsistent.

  569. SerbianChris says:

    [quote comment=”310063″]

    My problem with what you just posted however is that Daniel and Desmond actually DID meet in 1996. That wasn’t merely Desmond’s conscious. That means that if we interpret “can’t meet” as impossible to meet, that meeting in 1996 directly contradicts that theory because they had not met prior to 2003/4. It’s circular.[/quote]

    —————————————————

    **ToeKnee, I give you credit for a sound theory.
    It very well might be the case. I’m still inclined towards my own theory a little for reasons i’ve mentioned above, but i dont want to get repetitive, I’m sure this will be clarified in the next 2 episodes.

    **RGS , I see what you mean, your doubts are well founded. And I agree with you.
    However, There’s a chance that Desmond might be the exception to the rule, which is why Faraday thinks he’s so special?
    Desmond might be the only one who has the power to meet people he hasn’t and make changes to the past.
    Please refer to post 503 to see what I’m talking about.

  570. Rita says:

    [quote comment=”310083″][quote comment=”310063″]

    My problem with what you just posted however is that Daniel and Desmond actually DID meet in 1996. That wasn’t merely Desmond’s conscious. That means that if we interpret “can’t meet” as impossible to meet, that meeting in 1996 directly contradicts that theory because they had not met prior to 2003/4. It’s circular.[/quote]

    —————————————————

    **ToeKnee, I give you credit for a sound theory.
    It very well might be the case. I’m still inclined towards my own theory a little for reasons i’ve mentioned above, but i dont want to get repetitive, I’m sure this will be clarified in the next 2 episodes.

    **RGS , I see what you mean, your doubts are well founded. And I agree with you.
    However, There’s a chance that Desmond might be the exception to the rule, which is why Faraday thinks he’s so special?
    Desmond might be the only one who has the power to meet people he hasn’t and make changes to the past.
    Please refer to post 503 to see what I’m talking about.[/quote]
    ______________________________________
    Only one problem: If Desmond is an exception, and Daniel knows it, then Dan shouldn’t have been concerned about Sawyer meeting Desmond – it wouldn’t have mattered because Desmond is an exception. Therefore, I think the explanation is something else, something we don’t know yet, but might find out tonight???!!!

  571. SerbianChris says:

    [quote comment=”310014″][quote comment=”310010″]It also seems funny to me that we only got a brief glimpse of Jacob one time and to me he looked an awful lot like LOCKE. The first time Locke went to the cabin we see him but every other time it is Christian that we see. I think Locke is Jacob. agree/disagree?[/quote]

    If you are talking about the time when Jacob was in the rocking chair, and we caught a glimpse of him in half light, I am not sure we can take that too literally. In the DVD extras, D&C admitted that the guy in the rocking chair was the production’s prop master (I think – someone who works behind the scenes at any rate).

    : ) P[/quote]
    ————————————————–
    Agreed.
    Also if we go by the screenshot we got on some sites of Jacob’s half-lit face he looks nothing like John Locke.

    I have a theory here regarding this.
    When Locke tells Ethan that Ben assigned him as the “Other’s Leader” then disappears, Ethan goes to Ben and tells him what just happened.
    That’s when Ben realizes that this John Locke person will at some point be who he says he is.
    That’s why Ben is doubtful of Locke from the minute he meets him and later assigns him as leader so he wouldn’t break the time rule [Even though Locke fails the “test” of killing his father]

  572. SerbianChris says:

    [quote comment=”310095″]
    ______________________________________
    Only one problem: If Desmond is an exception, and Daniel knows it, then Dan shouldn’t have been concerned about Sawyer meeting Desmond – it wouldn’t have mattered because Desmond is an exception. Therefore, I think the explanation is something else, something we don’t know yet, but might find out tonight???!!![/quote]
    ——————————————————–
    True, but what if Desmond can change things and meet people when He travels thru time.
    In this case he hasnt traveled, he was actually there.
    It’s sawyer who made the trip. This is where the difference may lie.
    Hopefully tonight’s episode will shed some light on the issue. :)

  573. Hammer says:

    I dare the ‘Dan and Des horse’ and the ‘time traveling/touching objects horse’ to try get up…just try it. :)

  574. Toeknee says:

    [quote comment=”310063″]
    My problem with what you just posted however is that Daniel and Desmond actually DID meet in 1996. That wasn’t merely Desmond’s conscious. That means that if we interpret “can’t meet” as impossible to meet, that meeting in 1996 directly contradicts that theory because they had not met prior to 2003/4. It’s circular.
    [/quote]
    You’re right in that when Des and Dan meet in 1996 at Oxford, their bodies are physically in each others’ presence. However, it’s Dan’s 1996 consciousness, and Des’s 2004 consciousness. Desmond’s 1996 consciousness has no idea that they met. So in the ensuing years, all the way up to the scene where Dan knocks on hatch door and Des answers it, Des still doesn’t know who Dan is, and has no recollection of meeting him. So I don’t think there’s a contradiction with the “can’t meet” rule.

    Again, the “can’t meet”, to me, means there is only one sequence of events that has occurred throughout history, and that sequence did not include a time-travelling 2004 Sawyer meeting Desmond at the hatch in 2003. So if in 2003 Desmond didn’t meet Sawyer, there’s nothing Sawyer can do to change that. 2004 Sawyer “can’t meet” 2003 Desmond.

    But with

  575. Hammer says:

    Beat it!!! Beat that horse!!!! :)

  576. Toeknee says:

    [quote comment=”310147″]Beat it!!! Beat that horse!!!! :)[/quote]
    Another 9 hours or so should do the trick!

  577. Rita says:

    [quote comment=”310147″]Beat it!!! Beat that horse!!!! :)[/quote]
    Like I said, Maybe we will find out tonight. We really don’t have any more information until we see what they have for us tonight. The dead horse is still dead.

  578. Nikki Loves Lost says:

    Can’t wait until tonight’s episode!!! We’ll start fresh with new info yeah!!

  579. Rita says:

    Yea! The Jughead blog is up – see you all there!

  580. Hammer says:

    [quote comment=”310152″][quote comment=”310147″]Beat it!!! Beat that horse!!!! :)[/quote]
    Like I said, Maybe we will find out tonight. We really don’t have any more information until we see what they have for us tonight. The dead horse is still dead.[/quote]
    +++++++
    Well it’s dead now. But after tonights episode, all the folks on this blog will ‘skip’ back to earlier today…and find the horse standing…ready for a new beating. :)

  581. Rita says:

    [quote comment=”310158″][quote comment=”310152″][quote comment=”310147″]Beat it!!! Beat that horse!!!! :)[/quote]
    Like I said, Maybe we will find out tonight. We really don’t have any more information until we see what they have for us tonight. The dead horse is still dead.[/quote]
    +++++++
    Well it’s dead now. But after tonights episode, all the folks on this blog will ‘skip’ back to earlier today…and find the horse standing…ready for a new beating.

    :)[/quote]
    ____________________________________
    yeah Hammer you’re right, but maybe it will be a different color and we’ll have a different stick to hit it with!

  582. SerbianChris says:

    Hahah that’s what’s fun tho, us analyzing and discussing things we’re completely clueless about :)
    Besides it’s safer to beat a dead horse than a live one
    I expect the debate to be even more heated after Jughead, who knows what new mysteries await!
    I’ll meet you all on Thursday, after I’ve watched re-watched and dissected Episode 3 to death

  583. Rita says:

    [quote comment=”310161″]Hahah that’s what’s fun tho, us analyzing and discussing things we’re completely clueless about :)
    Besides it’s safer to beat a dead horse than a live one
    I expect the debate to be even more heated after Jughead, who knows what new mysteries await!
    I’ll meet you all on Thursday, after I’ve watched re-watched and dissected Episode 3 to death[/quote]
    ___________________________
    Looking forward to it! “See” you tomorrow!

  584. RGS says:

    Yeah I don’t think we will get an answer to those issues, based on how LOST likes to do things.

  585. michael says:

    [quote comment=”310138″][quote comment=”310063″]
    My problem with what you just posted however is that Daniel and Desmond actually DID meet in 1996. That wasn’t merely Desmond’s conscious. That means that if we interpret “can’t meet” as impossible to meet, that meeting in 1996 directly contradicts that theory because they had not met prior to 2003/4. It’s circular.
    [/quote]
    You’re right in that when Des and Dan meet in 1996 at Oxford, their bodies are physically in each others’ presence. However, it’s Dan’s 1996 consciousness, and Des’s 2004 consciousness. Desmond’s 1996 consciousness has no idea that they met. So in the ensuing years, all the way up to the scene where Dan knocks on hatch door and Des answers it, Des still doesn’t know who Dan is, and has no recollection of meeting him. So I don’t think there’s a contradiction with the “can’t meet” rule.

    Again, the “can’t meet”, to me, means there is only one sequence of events that has occurred throughout history, and that sequence did not include a time-travelling 2004 Sawyer meeting Desmond at the hatch in 2003.

    So if in 2003 Desmond didn’t meet Sawyer, there’s nothing Sawyer can do to change that. 2004 Sawyer “can’t meet” 2003 Desmond.

    But with[/quote]

    Very nice.

  586. Jaime says:

    [quote comment=”308838″][quote comment=”308819″]1. If Richard, Ethan and the Others are not affected by the time shifts why is Juliet?[/quote]

    Well see, I think this is one of those things that kind of proves Hammer’s the-Others-are-Whisperers theory. Ethan is DEAD in “current island time” *CIT* (early January 2005). Charlie killed him a “few months ago” when he was after Claire. So Ethan does not exist in CIT. I believe Captain Eyeliner and the Others must not REALLY exist in CIT, or they would have moved WITH Locke. If they are NOT Whisperers, they are at least not of CIT for SOME reason.

    : ) P[/quote]
    *********************************************
    Was it you that had the theory last season about Charlie…..i was thinking, When Des turned the fail safe key all of the Losties noticed the purple sky except Charlie. He remembered nothing about the discharge. hmmmmmmm????

  587. Jaime says:

    [quote comment=”308876″][quote comment=”308809″][quote comment=”308795″][quote comment=”308690″][quote comment=”308602″] [/quote]
    Speaking of cutting off a hand… what about “Montand’s arm?” Could these have been the same guys that did that?

    : ) P[/quote]
    ***********************************************8

    Montand, Ray Mullen & Dr. Marvin Candle (swan video) All have lost an arm, hand.

    This was taken from the 11/28/05 podcast:

    Carlton Cuse: Is there any connection between the loss of Montand’s arm, and the fact that Dr. Marvin Candle has a fake hand?

    Damon Lindelof: Eh, I dunno, is there? We also found a glass eye in the Arrow Station. People just lose body parts I think easily on the Island.

    Carlton Cuse: Exactly.

    Damon Lindelof: It isn’t a widely known fact that actually Marvin Candle has a fake hand. You actually have to watch the film a fair amount of times, so I think that’s a good nugget of podcast exclusivity that you just downloaded there.

    Carlton Cuse: Wow, that’s cool. And would it be possible that in a future episode we would discover why Marvin Candle has a fake hand?

    Damon Lindelof: I suppose anything’s possible, I guess.

    Thoughts????[/quote]
    _____________________________________
    WOW good catch! That one got right by me. Thanks for the great info Jaime![/quote]
    ________________________
    That was a great catch, Jaime! One wrinkle to this that I noticed on rewatching the episode, both of Dr. Chang’s arms/hands were funcional. Maybe it doesn’t mean much, but I found that interesting.[/quote]
    *******************************************

    Check out this video

    http://lostpedia.wikia.com/wiki/Dharma_booth_video

    there’s a point where he is talking about the purge and time and how they are “powerless to stop it” he then looks down at his arm and grasps it. Almost like he already knows he will be losing it

  588. Rita says:

    [quote comment=”310220″][quote comment=”308876″][quote comment=”308809″][quote comment=”308795″][quote comment=”308690″][quote comment=”308602″] [/quote]
    [/quote]
    [/quote]
    [/quote]
    [/quote]
    Check out this video

    http://lostpedia.wikia.com/wiki/Dharma_booth_video

    [/quote]
    _________________________________
    Enjoyed the video Jaime, thanks!

  589. gmta leah says:

    [quote comment=”310161″]Hahah that’s what’s fun tho, us analyzing and discussing things we’re completely clueless about :)
    Besides it’s safer to beat a dead horse than a live one
    I expect the debate to be even more heated after Jughead, who knows what new mysteries await!
    I’ll meet you all on Thursday, after I’ve watched re-watched and dissected Episode 3 to death[/quote]
    ///////////////////////////
    And il meet you all next sunday night .to put my two penneth in .by the time i arrive your all bored and waiting for the next episode.ah well!

  590. dadmandrama says:

    [quote comment=”309407″]Didnt goodwin own a ww2 army knife?[/quote]

    Hi gtma leah–I am an old fan who reads this blog and seldom writes because everyone else is so smart; plus it takes me so long to read through everything. But this time I want to exclaim yes! That old knife has haunted me since it first appeared, and then we see WW II era soldiers on the show. Finally a connection. Thanks for pointing it out–I feel that the episode on 1/28 clarified this even more. See you on that strand.

  591. 6th here we come says:

    Hey all–what’s up with Hurley seeing dead island peeps off the Island? He seems to be the only one of the Oceanic 6 who this happens to.

  592. Mad Boss says:

    How was lost last nite?

  593. Glad i discovered this web site.I added “Lost Season 5 Premiere: Destiny Calls – The Lost Blog” to my bookmark!

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