Some Like It Hoth

miles_s5.jpg

When an episode title of Lost references Star Wars, we should obviously expect to be in for a treat. Doc Jensen of Entertainment Weekly posted a good article on this week’s episode and specifically how the title could relate to, yes, Star Wars, but also Norse mythology – worth checking out.

ABC’s Official Show Description

Spoiler Alert

“Suspicions about a possible breach intensify after Ben is taken from the infirmary, and a reluctant Miles is forced to work with Hurley when he’s asked to deliver an important package to a top Dharma official.”

The centricity of this episode looks to focus on Miles – an interesting character since his introduction and one that we know very little about beyond the fact that he can speak to dead people. Perhaps tonight we find out how he came to realize that unique ability and more about him in general. Based on the show description it also looks like Miles and Hurley will be going off-Island for a little 1977 adventure to the main land, which should, at a minimum, provide for some sarcastic humor.

Some Like It Hoth Episode Preview

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400 Responses to Some Like It Hoth

  1. Jay says:

    The title “Some Like it Hoth” could simply refer to the fact that Miles and Hurley see Star Wars (it did premiere in 1977), although Hoth did not appear until the Empire Strikes Back. If it is specifically supposed to key off the Empire Strikes Back, the most noticable moment of theat film was at the end where Luke discovered that Vader was his father. Hmm….

  2. PJSander says:

    [quote comment="329759"]The title “Some Like it Hoth” could simply refer to the fact that Miles and Hurley see Star Wars (it did premiere in 1977), although Hoth did not appear until the Empire Strikes Back. If it is specifically supposed to key off the Empire Strikes Back, the most noticable moment of theat film was at the end where Luke discovered that Vader was his father. Hmm….[/quote]

    Good thought there, Jay. I was thinking Hoth = cold and maybe it would mean something about the polar bears.

    : ) P

  3. Miss lost says:

    [quote comment="329759"]The title “Some Like it Hoth” could simply refer to the fact that Miles and Hurley see Star Wars (it did premiere in 1977), although Hoth did not appear until the Empire Strikes Back. If it is specifically supposed to key off the Empire Strikes Back, the most noticable moment of theat film was at the end where Luke discovered that Vader was his father. Hmm….[/quote]
    *****************
    Could it also be that the “empire” is striking back? Is it Widmore’s “empire”? and I like the idea that a father is revealed. Maybe Miles’ or Faradays father is revealed…
    -miss

  4. Rita says:

    [quote comment="329764"][quote comment="329759"]The title “Some Like it Hoth” could simply refer to the fact that Miles and Hurley see Star Wars (it did premiere in 1977), although Hoth did not appear until the Empire Strikes Back. If it is specifically supposed to key off the Empire Strikes Back, the most noticable moment of theat film was at the end where Luke discovered that Vader was his father. Hmm….[/quote]
    *****************
    Could it also be that the “empire” is striking back? Is it Widmore’s “empire”? and I like the idea that a father is revealed. Maybe Miles’ or Faradays father is revealed…
    -miss[/quote]
    ___________________________________
    Yes!! Especially since we have all been wondering for some time now just WHO is the baby at Candle’s house, and WHO are Faraday’s parents. I like the cold Hoth planet idea too – I’m thinking about the FDW.

  5. Duke says:

    ALL NERDS REJOICE. AN EPISODE OF LOST WITH A REFERENCE TO STAR WARS! COME ON YOU KNOW WHO YOU ARE.

  6. JZ says:

    [quote comment="329766"][quote comment="329764"][quote comment="329759"]The title “Some Like it Hoth” could simply refer to the fact that Miles and Hurley see Star Wars (it did premiere in 1977), although Hoth did not appear until the Empire Strikes Back. If it is specifically supposed to key off the Empire Strikes Back, the most noticable moment of theat film was at the end where Luke discovered that Vader was his father. Hmm….[/quote]
    *****************
    Could it also be that the “empire” is striking back? Is it Widmore’s “empire”? and I like the idea that a father is revealed. Maybe Miles’ or Faradays father is revealed…
    -miss[/quote]
    ___________________________________
    Yes!! Especially since we have all been wondering for some time now just WHO is the baby at Candle’s house, and WHO are Faraday’s parents. I like the cold Hoth planet idea too – I’m thinking about the FDW.[/quote]

    *****************

    i think all of these are possibilities and are also discussed in Doc Jensen’s Analysis on ew.com . I like reading his stuff and it makes alot of sense. While he might be wrong on some instances, it def makes you think clearer.

    he explains ‘hoth’ and star wars in a very easy way pertaining to lost (along with some other fun theories). if you have the chance to read it, do it! quite lengthy but totally worth the read!

  7. Duke says:

    Why the implication that they get off the island to deliver the package? Couldn’t a top Dharma offical be on the island? Candle perhaps?

  8. JZ says:

    [quote comment="329773"]Why the implication that they get off the island to deliver the package? Couldn’t a top Dharma offical be on the island? Candle perhaps?[/quote]

    ****************

    why does this guy use so many different names? anyone shed some light on this? it bothers me and i hope we get some answers on that tonight as well

  9. wallyp says:

    If Miles and Hurley get off the island I guess that would put an end to my theory that there is no off island when in a different time… unless they get off the island and its 2007. I say… nobodys getting off the island! (…going to see Star Wars, c’mon, how lame would that be? …no offense)

    I can buy the “I am your father” idea with Miles and Candle’wax though. we’ll seee…

  10. neofunk says:

    The next episode is some like it Hoth besides the obvious SW reference maybe smokie is the egyptian moon God Thoth whom RA
    appointed when he retired from the earth to rule , ordering him to keep a register of those who were there, and to mete out just punishments to them. Thoth became the representation of Ra in the afterlife, seen at the judgement of the dead in the ‘Halls of the Double Ma’at’.Believed to be the author of the spells in the Book of the Dead, he was a helper (and punisher) of the deceased as they try to enter the underworld. As voice of the sun-god Ra, he carried the utchat, or Eye of Ra, the symbol of Ra’s ubiquitous power.Remember Locke saying he looked into the eye of the Island when he saw smokie or that smokie was the eye.Just throwing it out there

  11. PJSander says:

    [quote comment="329777"]If Miles and Hurley get off the island I guess that would put an end to my theory that there is no off island when in a different time… unless they get off the island and its 2007. I say… nobodys getting off the island! (…going to see Star Wars, c’mon, how lame would that be?[/quote]

    No one has to get OFF the island to see Star Wars! The film reels were distributed all OVER the world. Widmore just has to get his hands on one of the reels. Not that I think this will happen, just don’t discount the idea that Star Wars plays into it just because they are on the island.

    : ) P

  12. Amber says:

    ok sooo I have never seen any of the star wars movies….I know im going to get some crap for that, but hey im only 21 so I still have time. Could someone just give me a little info on this hoth thing???

  13. Rumblestilskin says:

    Duke Wrote:
    Why the implication that they get off the island to deliver the package? Couldn’t a top Dharma offical be on the island? Candle perhaps?
    ———————————————–

    The Top Dharma official is definately Hailliwax. Is that who’s being called candle wax?

    Some like I Thoth?

  14. Rumblestilskin says:

    To Amber:

    Hey there, Im 34, so heres the skinny on Hoth:

    Hoth is just the name of the frozen snow planet that the rebels have their base on at the beginning of the movie “The Empire Strikes Back”

    Also, the Egyption God of the moon is named “Thoth”.

    So, there ya go…..Not much up with either of them. Just people (like myself) trying to predict whats going 2 happen 2night by the title of the show : )

  15. Tasha says:

    Amber, I haven’t either. Can you believe that??

    Tis also a story called, The Ring of Thoth. Anyone ever heard of it?
    Anyway, I was thinking about how there is something of bigger purpose the other’s are doing on the island. Before Dharma came along, I wonder what that was? Jacob doesn’t like technology and whatever purpose they had hasn’t been accomplished. The island can’t get exploited because then the outside world would come and what? Look at it? I am a little confused but I guess thinking about that story makes me wonder if the Other’s are “searching” for something, which hasn’t been found.(Which is odd since the island is only so big.) I’m going by the story where they are looking for the ring, but I guess I am just crazy by wondering if the Other’s are searching for something as well that needs to be found to save mankind.(maybe?) Far fetched? Oh well, it may be way off.

  16. JZ says:

    [quote comment="329781"]ok sooo I have never seen any of the star wars movies….I know im going to get some crap for that, but hey im only 21 so I still have time. Could someone just give me a little info on this hoth thing???[/quote]

    *******

    I mentioned this earlier. Doc Jensen on http://www.ew.com gives a good explanation for the star wars theory. very lengthy but if you want to get into the nit and gritty of it all it’s a very interesting and worth while read.

  17. PJSander says:

    [quote comment="329784"]Amber, I haven’t either. Can you believe that??[/quote]

    I haven’t either and I was alive when they came out. Actually, my grandmother was forced to take me to the first movie when I was little, but I don’t remember it. I know the iconic phrases, of course, “Luke I am your father” but only because the are part of pop-culture literacy.

    However, if you don’t want to read Doc Jensens’ verbosity, you can check out the wiki page on Hoth here:

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hoth

    : ) P

  18. Rumblestilskin says:

    The planet Hoth on Star Wars is named after a Jedi General named Hoth that fought in the times of The Old Republic, durring wich an army of Sith were at war with the Jedi.

    You’ll be sorry you got me started—Star Wars geek here!!!

  19. Alfred says:

    What happened to Rose and Bernard and the rest did they just crawl in a hole and die or something?

  20. JZ says:

    i’m wondering now…because that’s what we all do…that maybe mr. paik (sun’s father) and cheng/halliwax/candle (whatever you want to call him) have some sort of connection (with the additional possibility of the miles being the son of cheng/halliwax/candle). I guess i just wonder either why mr. paik is so wealthy and/or because he has so much money widmore got a hold of him to use him some way…

    any thoughts?

  21. JZ says:

    [quote comment="329790"]What happened to Rose and Bernard and the rest did they just crawl in a hole and die or something?[/quote]

    ****************

    GOOD QUESTION !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

  22. Rumblestilskin says:

    [quote comment="329790"]What happened to Rose and Bernard and the rest did they just crawl in a hole and die or something?[/quote]
    ———————————————–

    I’ve been wondering the same thing…….But no ideas

  23. JZ says:

    [quote comment="329793"][quote comment="329790"]What happened to Rose and Bernard and the rest did they just crawl in a hole and die or something?[/quote]
    ———————————————–

    I’ve been wondering the same thing…….But no ideas[/quote]

    ***********

    I guess they are obviously stuck on the island in 2004 right before everyone got rescued. While Juliet and Sawyer were on the island too, I guess they must not have fallen into whatever equation was needed to actually be sent time travelling

  24. Rumblestilskin says:

    Well, since I can’t answer the questions about Rose&Bernard or Halliwax, or Suns dad:

    I do know that the rule that Ben broke was coming back to the island.
    I watched the season 4 finale again last night, and Ben told Locke- “Because he wants me to suffer the consequences………….Whoever moves the island can never come back.”

    IMO, while being responsible 4 Alex’s death is uncool, I dont think that is the “breaking the rules” that he was talkig about.

  25. Vaughn K says:

    [quote comment="329794"][quote comment="329793"][quote comment="329790"]What happened to Rose and Bernard and the rest did they just crawl in a hole and die or something?[/quote]
    ———————————————–

    I’ve been wondering the same thing…….But no ideas[/quote]

    ***********

    I guess they are obviously stuck on the island in 2004 right before everyone got rescued. While Juliet and Sawyer were on the island too, I guess they must not have fallen into whatever equation was needed to actually be sent time travelling[/quote]
    _______________________________________

    they were time traveling with everyone and after they got attacked by the flmae throwers they were supposed to meet up at the river and no one met up…really i think this was just a way for the producers to kill off basically everyone that is not important anymore. prob the only people alive still is maybe rose and bernard and maybe vincent.

  26. Jay says:

    [quote comment="329789"]The planet Hoth on Star Wars is named after a Jedi General named Hoth that fought in the times of The Old Republic, durring wich an army of Sith were at war with the Jedi.

    You’ll be sorry you got me started—Star Wars geek here!!![/quote]
    **
    Me too and an original trekkie. But what if a character lisps tonight and it is nothing more than that?

  27. Rumblestilskin says:

    Perhaps Rose and Bernard were killed by flaming arrows. If a tiger were chasing Rose, Bernard, and myself through the wilderness, I doubt that I’D be the one to be caught : )

  28. Rumblestilskin says:

    Jay,
    I hope the writers are more clever than that. That would suck.

    If that were the case, I would have to give you props 4 calling it though : )

  29. Rita says:

    [quote comment="329798"]Perhaps Rose and Bernard were killed by flaming arrows. If a tiger were chasing Rose, Bernard, and myself through the wilderness, I doubt that I’D be the one to be caught : )[/quote]
    _____________________________________
    I doubt that R & B are dead. It would seem that if they were dead, we would be told about, have a death scene or something, rather than just forget about them.

  30. Rumblestilskin says:

    Rita said:
    I doubt that R & B are dead. It would seem that if they were dead, we would be told about, have a death scene or something, rather than just forget about them.
    ———————————————-

    I have to agree w/you about that. They dont seem 2 important, but even the diamond theif couple got a decent Christian burial.

  31. Adapa1 says:

    [quote comment="329771"]ALL NERDS REJOICE. AN EPISODE OF LOST WITH A REFERENCE TO STAR WARS! COME ON YOU KNOW WHO YOU ARE.[/quote]

    Yes!!!!

  32. Adapa1 says:

    [quote comment="329797"][quote comment="329789"]The planet Hoth on Star Wars is named after a Jedi General named Hoth that fought in the times of The Old Republic, durring wich an army of Sith were at war with the Jedi.

    You’ll be sorry you got me started—Star Wars geek here!!![/quote]
    **
    Me too and an original trekkie. But what if a character lisps tonight and it is nothing more than that?[/quote]

    Yes!!!!!!!! ;-)

  33. Adapa1 says:

    Stars Wars…. the sith ….greatest movie ever.

    Everyone needs to see Yoda fight the Emperor.

  34. LINS says:

    [quote comment="329800"][quote comment="329798"]Perhaps Rose and Bernard were killed by flaming arrows. If a tiger were chasing Rose, Bernard, and myself through the wilderness, I doubt that I’D be the one to be caught : )[/quote]
    _____________________________________
    I doubt that R & B are dead. It would seem that if they were dead, we would be told about, have a death scene or something, rather than just forget about them.[/quote]

    *****************
    I agree, I think we’ll see them before the season is up…don’t worry!

  35. LINS says:

    [quote comment="329789"]The planet Hoth on Star Wars is named after a Jedi General named Hoth that fought in the times of The Old Republic, durring wich an army of Sith were at war with the Jedi.

    You’ll be sorry you got me started—Star Wars geek here!!![/quote]

    There was also a general Hoth that was in the Nazi army and convicted of war crimes…not sure how that would fit in with LOST or tonight’s episode, but we have been told a “war is coming”.

    I think the whole title – Some Like it Hoth – is about opposites. Obviously we think of Some Like it Hot and the the Star Wars reference Hoth, an ice cold planet…hot and cold…

  36. Miss lost says:

    [quote comment="329774"][quote comment="329773"]Why the implication that they get off the island to deliver the package? Couldn’t a top Dharma offical be on the island? Candle perhaps?[/quote]

    ****************

    why does this guy use so many different names? anyone shed some light on this? it bothers me and i hope we get some answers on that tonight as well[/quote]
    *****************

    Just a guess… the Dharma recruits would only see one orientation video depending on where they were stationed. Maybe the leaders of Dharma didn’t care that they used the same guy (since they didn’t see each others videos) but used different names in case they talked about their video and that way it would appear they had more orientation leaders…other than that I really don’t know why he has used so many different names either…or why they so closely related in meaning…
    -miss

  37. Miss lost says:

    Here are a few other things that I thought about that could be related to the show in connection with Star Wars…ok, so we know that it was revealed to Luke that the evil darth Vadar was his father, but Star Wars also revealed that Luke had a twin sister and that they were both hidden to protect their identity from the emperor and Vadar…some said in last weeks thread that maybe Faraday and Penny were twins? Could they be and just not know it…were they hidden to protect them? Just something else to think about…trying to figure out what other connections there could be…
    -miss

  38. Miss lost says:

    Here are a few other things that I thought about that could be related to the show in connection with Star Wars…ok, so we know that it was revealed to Luke that the evil darth Vadar was his father, but Star Wars also revealed that Luke had a twin sister and that they were both hidden to protect their identity from the emperor and Vadar…some said in last weeks thread that maybe Faraday and Penny were twins? Could they be and just not know it…were they hidden to protect them? Just something else to think about…trying to figure out what other connections there could be…
    -miss

  39. Adapa1 says:

    [quote comment="329814"]Here are a few other things that I thought about that could be related to the show in connection with Star Wars…ok, so we know that it was revealed to Luke that the evil darth Vadar was his father, but Star Wars also revealed that Luke had a twin sister and that they were both hidden to protect their identity from the emperor and Vadar…some said in last weeks thread that maybe Faraday and Penny were twins? Could they be and just not know it…were they hidden to protect them? Just something else to think about…trying to figure out what other connections there could be…
    -miss[/quote]

    *****
    I still wonder if Miles and Sun are twins…..

  40. Tasha says:

    [quote comment="329797"][quote comment="329789"]The planet Hoth on Star Wars is named after a Jedi General named Hoth that fought in the times of The Old Republic, durring wich an army of Sith were at war with the Jedi.

    You’ll be sorry you got me started—Star Wars geek here!!![/quote]
    **
    Me too and an original trekkie. But what if a character lisps tonight and it is nothing more than that?[/quote]
    _______________________

    That’s what I was thinking. In the last 2 episodes, the title was a statement coming from someone.

  41. Miraks says:

    [quote comment="329815"]Here are a few other things that I thought about that could be related to the show in connection with Star Wars…ok, so we know that it was revealed to Luke that the evil darth Vadar was his father, but Star Wars also revealed that Luke had a twin sister and that they were both hidden to protect their identity from the emperor and Vadar…some said in last weeks thread that maybe Faraday and Penny were twins? Could they be and just not know it…were they hidden to protect them? Just something else to think about…trying to figure out what other connections there could be…
    -miss[/quote]

    Well, Penny grew up with her dad, so she would not have been hidden very well.

  42. Mateo says:

    FYI, thought you guys might find it interesting (incase you didnt already know) that Ben was not supposed to be a major character, just some guest character in a couple episodes and die off like we see often:

    Q: How did you land the role of Henry/Ben on Lost?

    Michael: “It came, which is unusual because I usually have to jump through hoops of fire to get everything, but it came as an offer. Originally it was not to have been an important part, it was supposed to be a guest turn. I was supposed to do three episodes and then go away, but something clicked – they liked the character, they liked me, they liked how it worked in the storytelling and here I am a series regular. It came to me as an offer because I think the writers and producers had seen me on The Practice when I played William Hinks. It was a dangerous character because it was ambiguous.”

  43. Rumblestilskin says:

    LINS wrote:
    I think the whole title – Some Like it Hoth – is about opposites. Obviously we think of Some Like it Hot and the the Star Wars reference Hoth, an ice cold planet…hot and cold…
    ———————————————

    Its super simple, but I didnt think about that.

  44. PJSander says:

    [quote comment="329800"]I doubt that R & B are dead. It would seem that if they were dead, we would be told about, have a death scene or something, rather than just forget about them.[/quote]

    Agreed. I said as much a few weeks ago. Plus, if we can believe D&C, they said that Rose and Bernard were dear enough to viewers hearts that they wouldn’t just get forever LOST. I suspect that they traveled with Sawyer et al, and we will find out (in time) that Sawyer found them (his missing “crew”) and that they were assimilated into DHARMA along with the rest of them.

    : ) P

  45. PJSander says:

    [quote comment="329821"]FYI, thought you guys might find it interesting (incase you didnt already know) that Ben was not supposed to be a major character, just some guest character in a couple episodes and die off like we see often.[/quote]

    Right. D&C said that originally Ben was supposed to just be one of the Others who eventually takes the O815’ers to his leader. But he was so brilliant, that they made HIM the leader instead.

    : ) P

  46. Rumblestilskin says:

    [quote comment="329823"][quote comment="329800"]I doubt that R & B are dead. It would seem that if they were dead, we would be told about, have a death scene or something, rather than just forget about them.[/quote]

    Agreed. I said as much a few weeks ago. Plus, if we can believe D&C, they said that Rose and Bernard were dear enough to viewers hearts that they wouldn’t just get forever LOST. I suspect that they traveled with Sawyer et al, and we will find out (in time) that Sawyer found them (his missing “crew”) and that they were assimilated into DHARMA along with the rest of them.

    : ) P[/quote]
    ———————————————–
    Whoa Boy!!!
    Well, we certainly dont want to cheat anyone out of there “I said it 1st” credit.
    Having said that, please remember that I am going on record as having said that there is no way in hell that B & R have been with the Dharma folks this whole time without them having been shown 2 us.
    I suppose Faraday’s still there too? Hiding way back in the cut?

  47. Rumblestilskin says:

    P.S- All hail D&C ?????

  48. Rita says:

    [quote comment="329823"][quote comment="329800"]I doubt that R & B are dead. It would seem that if they were dead, we would be told about, have a death scene or something, rather than just forget about them.[/quote]

    Agreed. I said as much a few weeks ago. Plus, if we can believe D&C, they said that Rose and Bernard were dear enough to viewers hearts that they wouldn’t just get forever LOST. I suspect that they traveled with Sawyer et al, and we will find out (in time) that Sawyer found them (his missing “crew”) and that they were assimilated into DHARMA along with the rest of them.

    : ) P[/quote]
    ________________________________________
    Well we know that R & B and the red shirts were flashing along with Sawyer et al, although in a different place, since we saw them on the flaming arrow beach. I don’t think they are Dharma now though, or we would have seen something of them by now. More likely they are having their own island adventures, or have become Hostiles by now.

  49. Rumblestilskin says:

    I dont mean to be a doofis, but can someone please tell me what et al means?

    Im pretty sure its not English :D

  50. LINS says:

    [quote comment="329828"]I dont mean to be a doofis, but can someone please tell me what et al means?

    Im pretty sure its not English :D[/quote]

    Latin for “and others”

  51. Rumblestilskin says:

    Thank you kindly : )

  52. katesFriend says:

    Rumblestiltskin: et al means among others

    It is usually used in citations to note authors. So if a book is by Alice, Beth, and Carol you would cite it as Alice, et al.

    HTH

  53. Rumblestilskin says:

    Thank you kindly too : )

  54. PJSander says:

    [quote comment="329827"]
    Well we know that R & B and the red shirts were flashing along with Sawyer et al, although in a different place, since we saw them on the flaming arrow beach. I don’t think they are Dharma now though, or we would have seen something of them by now. More likely they are having their own island adventures, or have become Hostiles by now.[/quote]

    You may well be right, but I can’t just toss away the idea that they aren’t DHARMA simply because we haven’t seen them. We didn’t see Sayid for two episodes and he is a MAJOR character!

    : ) P

  55. Tasha says:

    I bet wherever R and B are, they are taking care of Vincent!! I bet we get to see them tonight!

  56. intolost says:

    Yes! Dr. Candle featured! I still insist he is vitally important to the story. Can’t wait to find out. Hope Faraday is on tonight. I miss him.

    Oh, my goodness! Okay, I insist you kids here who have not seen the original Star Wars trilogy, please, please do a marathon sometime right away! You must! : )

  57. intolost says:

    Hey, don’t big AT-AT walkers in Empire remind you of the big foot statue on island? Hmmm…..

    I think the blonde girl that held Faraday at gunpoint is Penny’s mom.

  58. Rita says:

    [quote comment="329834"][quote comment="329827"]
    Well we know that R & B and the red shirts were flashing along with Sawyer et al, although in a different place, since we saw them on the flaming arrow beach. I don’t think they are Dharma now though, or we would have seen something of them by now. More likely they are having their own island adventures, or have become Hostiles by now.[/quote]

    You may well be right, but I can’t just toss away the idea that they aren’t DHARMA simply because we haven’t seen them. We didn’t see Sayid for two episodes and he is a MAJOR character!

    : ) P[/quote]
    __________________________________
    It would seem unlikely that they would be Dharma without having gone through some sort of process that would have involved Lafleur. If they were the rest of the crew that he was looking for, it seems that now that they were reunited (if they were), they would be mentioned or shown with Sawyer at some point. Therefore, I respectfully go on record as saying that Rose and Bernard are NOT Dharma at this time and are likely having some romantic alone time (at last!) on their private island beach. Granted, Sayid hadn’t been shown for a couple of episodes, but then, he wasn’t Dharma either. :)

  59. Duke says:

    [quote comment="329777"]If Miles and Hurley get off the island I guess that would put an end to my theory that there is no off island when in a different time… unless they get off the island and its 2007. I say… nobodys getting off the island! (…going to see Star Wars, c’mon, how lame would that be?

    …no offense)

    I can buy the “I am your father” idea with Miles and Candle’wax though. we’ll seee…[/quote]
    ______________________________
    Completely agree with them not getting off island but disagree about there being no off island. There is no way they are getting off the island to see star wars or for any other reason. Hoth doesn’t come into the lexicon until the empire strikes back which didn’t come out in 1977.

  60. PJSander says:

    [quote comment="329838"]It would seem unlikely that they would be Dharma without having gone through some sort of process that would have involved Lafleur. If they were the rest of the crew that he was looking for, it seems that now that they were reunited (if they were), they would be mentioned or shown with Sawyer at some point. [/quote]

    I understand what you’re saying. But we saw only MOMENTS of 1974 before “fast forwarding” to 1977. We didn’t see the process of how Sawyer, Miles, Juliet, Jin or Daniel became part of DHARMA. We know that Sawyer went “looking for his crew” for at least two weeks until that second submarine came. And to be fair, we’ve seen nothing of Daniel since 1974 and he is a far more major character than Rose and Bernard.

    I fully admit that I may be wrong and that Rose and Bernard are off having jungle fever, but I won’t jump to the idea that they CAN’T be DHARMA just because we haven’t SEEN them in DHARMA yet.

    (This might be my runway! LOL)

    : ) P

  61. Amber says:

    [quote comment="329828"]I dont mean to be a doofis, but can someone please tell me what et al means?

    Im pretty sure its not English :D[/quote]
    ————————
    Oh my gosh that is so funny I have been reading this blog for a long time and have always wanted to ask what that meant!

  62. Kathy P says:

    I had said this in this blog a few episodes ago. I think R & B are in the caves where the bones were and where Jack collected the Black & White stones. If they were perhaps jumping around in time they might know the secrets of the bones and stones. Maybe they are connected to that? Don’t know, just a guess. I do think Vincent is with them and I think Vincent does somehow play a role for the Island. Lets hope we see some of that tonight. Also Im wondering if the war were have heard about has something to do with the reason why women cannot carry babies full term. Maybe the stuff in the metal crate is sometype of chemical warfare weapons. Just my thoughts.

  63. hank vega says:

    Hi everybody. Anyone knows what is the fastest way of getting tonight’s episode from outside the us? I use utorrent, but it takes a full day to load.

    One thing I don’t understand is all the fuss about Ben’s integrity. I can’t think of one pure evil thing he has done. He didn’t kill any of the survivors, he killed Abbadon, who was working for his archirival, told sayid to kill widmore’s allies, didn’t kill Danielle, didn’t kill Penny, etc.

    The bad stuff could be lying, which to me is not such a great deal, after all, this world is an illusion where good and bad are just imaginary constructs of equal value. Taking the babies could have been an instruction that came from the almighty Jacob, killing his father is something we all men want to do at some point, killing Locke hasn’t work, so technically it hasn’t happen, etc.

    Kate killed her stepfather, Juliet killed an other, Sawyer killed Tom, Jack tried to kill Locke, etc.I could go on forever. There are many characters in the serie that have done a great deal of terrible things.

    I don’t think I will be following this show with such an insterest if it wasn’t for Ben, so stop trashing Ben you ungrateful bastards!
    Should I make a funny face after that?

  64. Rita says:

    [quote comment="329845"]Hi everybody. Anyone knows what is the fastest way of getting tonight’s episode from outside the us? I use utorrent, but it takes a full day to load.

    One thing I don’t understand is all the fuss about Ben’s integrity. I can’t think of one pure evil thing he has done. He didn’t kill any of the survivors, he killed Abbadon, who was working for his archirival, told sayid to kill widmore’s allies, didn’t kill Danielle, didn’t kill Penny, etc.

    The bad stuff could be lying, which to me is not such a great deal, after all, this world is an illusion where good and bad are just imaginary constructs of equal value. Taking the babies could have been an instruction that came from the almighty Jacob, killing his father is something we all men want to do at some point, killing Locke hasn’t work, so technically it hasn’t happen, etc.

    Kate killed her stepfather, Juliet killed an other, Sawyer killed Tom, Jack tried to kill Locke, etc.I could go on forever. There are many characters in the serie that have done a great deal of terrible things.

    I don’t think I will be following this show with such an insterest if it wasn’t for Ben, so stop trashing Ben you ungrateful bastards!
    Should I make a funny face after that?[/quote]
    _______________________________
    I can’t help thinking that if Ben were your neighbor or your brother-in-law, might you feel differently about him? :) -(did it for you)

  65. hank vega says:

    [quote comment="329845"]

    I can’t help thinking that if Ben were your neighbor or your brother-in-law, might you feel differently about him? :) -(did it for you)[/quote]

    ::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::

    I guess, but I will still buy his action figure.

  66. hank vega says:

    I mention this in the previous tread, and I was misunderstood. What I was trying to say is that Faraday is missing his left feet in the season 5’s poster, while the four toes statue is missing everything but the left feet.

    Did anybody saw a blue alien in the background of that poster? I saw something going up the stairs in one of the buildings.

  67. Rita says:

    [quote comment="329849"]I mention this in the previous tread, and I was misunderstood. What I was trying to say is that Faraday is missing his left feet in the season 5’s poster, while the four toes statue is missing everything but the left feet.

    Did anybody saw a blue alien in the background of that poster? I saw something going up the stairs in one of the buildings.[/quote]
    ____________________________
    Do you have a good screen cap of what you are looking at because I just don’t see it, and I have looked!

  68. Circus Mom says:

    Thoth reference led me to several interesting things.

    Thoth sometimes appears as a ibis or as a goose laying a golden egg. Hurley Bird?

    Thoth also leads to Hermes in Greek culture. “in Greek mythology. An Olympian god, he is also the patron of boundaries and of the travelers who cross them, of shepherds and cowherds, of thieves and road travelers,”

    To the Thoth Tarot deck, which leads to “Liber AL vel Legis”, or “The book of the Law.”

  69. Circus Mom says:

    Here is the story Tasha mentioned.

    http://gaslight.mtroyal.ca/rngthoth.htm

  70. JZ says:

    [quote comment="329817"][quote comment="329814"]Here are a few other things that I thought about that could be related to the show in connection with Star Wars…ok, so we know that it was revealed to Luke that the evil darth Vadar was his father, but Star Wars also revealed that Luke had a twin sister and that they were both hidden to protect their identity from the emperor and Vadar…some said in last weeks thread that maybe Faraday and Penny were twins? Could they be and just not know it…were they hidden to protect them? Just something else to think about…trying to figure out what other connections there could be…
    -miss[/quote]

    *****
    I still wonder if Miles and Sun are twins…..[/quote]
    __________________

    YES! or at least the mr. paik and widmore have a connection….i def have thought about a miles and sun twin connection….

    i don’t know why but i can’t see the penny/faraday twin connection, but of course could feel completely wrong!

  71. nick Riale says:

    Do any of you think lost might have something to do w/ the Mayans and/or the 2012 idea of a world enlightment???

  72. nick Riale says:

    and do you think charlie was Desmonds son. the whole time…?

  73. Tasha says:

    [quote comment="329854"]Do any of you think lost might have something to do w/ the Mayans and/or the 2012 idea of a world enlightment???[/quote]
    ____________________

    I went with that whole idea after season 1 and 2. In the dharma video there is a Mayan Calender and I swore TO EVERYONE this show was about Dec. 21, 2012. I thought the the show would end on that day. The end of the Long Count and galactic alignment. Then it turned to the Egyptians but that is why I have said in the past I always thought this would be about the Mayans. Anyway,s maybe my original theory might be true, but I won’t hold my breath. I have changed my mind like a billion times since then LOL.

  74. nick Riale says:

    lol ya i have changed my mind a bunch also. This was also one of my first ideas… The Egyptians are also linked to 2012 also though so it is very possible…

  75. JZ says:

    5 minutes!!!!!!

  76. Adapa1 says:

    Rainier-Canton Rainier-Canton

  77. wingman says:

    @ hank vega there are sooooooooooooooooo many places to get lost eps your eyes might bleed…Torrents are alright, but you seem to be a direct download kinda 3guy…There are literally a million sites, but since I don’t have time to list them all try http://www.seriesgringas.us/ they usually have it pretty quick, but I don’t watch eps until Friday, so I look for the HQ eps and dl before I go to bed…

    Parting is such sweet sorrow, see ya guys later, this site is dead to me, well until after I watch Friday night…

  78. Adapa1 says:

    [quote comment="329854"]Do any of you think lost might have something to do w/ the Mayans and/or the 2012 idea of a world enlightment???[/quote]

    *****
    I did for a moment and then couldn’t really make it stick because of him having that brother who’s name I can’t recall.

  79. Adapa1 says:

    [quote comment="329854"]Do any of you think lost might have something to do w/ the Mayans and/or the 2012 idea of a world enlightment???[/quote]

    *****
    I did for a moment and then couldn’t really make it stick because of him having that brother who’s name I can’t recall.

  80. Tasha says:

    [quote comment="329845"]Hi everybody. Anyone knows what is the fastest way of getting tonight’s episode from outside the us? I use utorrent, but it takes a full day to load.

    quote]

    ____________

    Youtube but it is split up in Parts like 1-4 usually:) Usually it’s posted by next morning.

  81. Jack Christian Kate John says:

    what really happened miles

  82. Jack Christian Kate John says:

    catch the global warming hint from Hurley… which if you dont remember him and Sayaid talking when they got a music signal on the radio saying “Or what time. Just kidding dude.” But it turned out that time did factor in w/ lost. So does global warming have something to do w/ it. I also caught a possible hint from Juliette last episode Dead is Dead saying ” Its for the Ailiens.” ???????? MAYBE, what do you guys think. But i am still strong w/ 2012.

  83. Rumblestilskin says:

    OMG!!! Halliwax IS Miles’ Dad.
    I remember someone calling that earlier in this blog.
    Whoever called that gets mad props :D

  84. Hammer says:

    Two mysteries solved.

    Tapping on a beer can doesn’t stop it from fizzing over….and Cheng is Miles’ dad.

  85. Bruno says:

    When Hurley writes in his note book, the note book has a bar code clearly visible at the front. I wonder when bar codes became common in retail? This is not a clue or anything but probably simply an oversight.

  86. Circus Mom says:

    [quote comment="329852"]Here is the story Tasha mentioned.

    http://gaslight.mtroyal.ca/rngthoth.htm%5B/quote%5D

    Makes me think of Adam and Eve????

    Going away now. Lost starts in 2 hours and 18 minutes here. No one posting says to be you can’t leave the TV.

  87. Rumblestilskin says:

    Episode title mystery solved.

    Ive wished I could do that as a rock band more than a few times : )

  88. Rumblestilskin says:

    Hurley makes a good point.

    Although I didnt realize it when I was 10, Ewoks do suck.

  89. Larla says:

    [quote comment="329867"]Two mysteries solved.

    Tapping on a beer can doesn’t stop it from fizzing over….and Cheng is Miles’ dad.[/quote]

    ***
    Haha Hammer you are too funny

  90. JZ says:

    that guy that takes miles on the street is one of ilana’s guys on the island!!!!! they ARE working for Ben!

    p.s. one more daddy issue story to add to the list!!!

    that convo with miles cheng and hurley in the van was great! along with so many other great things

    FARADAY is BACK!!!!! and miles KNEW him!

    sorry my mind is just rambling :)

  91. Mr. $tuart says:

    Well, this episode ranks right up there with Stranger in a Strange Land as being one of the worst episodes ever. They hyped it up like we were going to learn what everyone’s destiny was. I’m calling B.S. on this one. Oh wow, Candle is Miles dad? No way. What a bunch of crap.

  92. Rumblestilskin says:

    I dont think that they hyped it up any more than any other episode.

    Every one isnt going 2B the best one ever.

  93. Hammer says:

    Okay, so Miles WAS ABLE to look at his younger self. What are the implications there? Char didn’t die so that she wouldn’t see herself…did she die because she didn’t have a constant?

  94. PJSander says:

    We got so MANY answers!

    Chang is Miles’ dad. Miles WAS born on the island and left as a baby (presumably).

    We also now know that the plane at the bottom of the Sundra Trench really WAS put there by Widmore (at not Ben as there was a hint).

    We know why Miles asked Ben for $3.2MM.

    We know that Ilana et al do NOT work for Widmore, since the guy in the van that kidnapped Miles and his fish taco, is Ilana’s henchman from the beach.

    We have an IDEA of what’s been up with Daniel.

    You can call it filler if you like, but I disagree.

    : ) P

  95. tsunami says:

    awww sheet mutha fucka that was a fucking tightttt episode dawgggggggg

  96. Toeknee says:

    [quote comment="329875"]Well, this episode ranks right up there with Stranger in a Strange Land as being one of the worst episodes ever. They hyped it up like we were going to learn what everyone’s destiny was. I’m calling B.S. on this one. Oh wow, Candle is Miles dad? No way. What a bunch of crap.[/quote]
    I suggest not watching previews – IMHO they taint the viewing experience

  97. josh says:

    Man this show is great, when Dan climbed out of the sub and Miles said his name and Dan said to Miles long time its been, chills oup and down my spine. Ever since this show was released its been excellent cant wait for next’s weeks episode.

  98. Toeknee says:

    [quote comment="329868"]When Hurley writes in his note book, the note book has a bar code clearly visible at the front. I wonder when bar codes became common in retail? This is not a clue or anything but probably simply an oversight.[/quote]

    Per Wikipedia:
    Although various companies had UPC Scanning systems in the back of stores, the first UPC marked item ever scanned at a retail checkout (Marsh’s supermarket in Troy, Ohio) was at 8:01 a.m. on June 26, 1974, and was a 10-pack of Wrigley’s Juicy Fruit chewing gum. The entire shopping cart also had barcoded items in it, but the gum was merely the first one picked up by the cashier. This item is currently on display at the Smithsonian Museum in Washington, D.C.

  99. Toeknee says:

    [quote comment="329877"]Okay, so Miles WAS ABLE to look at his younger self. What are the implications there? Char didn’t die so that she wouldn’t see herself…did she die because she didn’t have a constant?[/quote]
    I don’t think there are any implications of Miles seeing his younger self. Perhaps if they got very close to each other, there may have been an issue, like we saw in the Orchid video with the two bunnies. But, maybe that’s more of a “constant” type of thing – the bunny might recognize itself, but not know how to make sense of what it’s seeing, and its brain would fry. Whereas Miles has a firm understanding of why he was seeing his younger self, so it didn’t create any short-circuits in his brain.

  100. Hammer says:

    [quote comment="329881"]Man this show is great, when Dan climbed out of the sub and Miles said his name and Dan said to Miles long time its been, chills oup and down my spine. Ever since this show was released its been excellent cant wait for next’s weeks episode.[/quote]
    ++++++++++++
    Yeah, I think Dan took ‘the next sub’ out when Juliette decided not to….did some more research…just got back.

  101. Toeknee says:

    [quote comment="329873"]that guy that takes miles on the street is one of ilana’s guys on the island!!!!! they ARE working for Ben!

    [/quote]
    Do we know they’re working for Ben? Could they be a third party?

  102. Hammer says:

    [quote comment="329885"][quote comment="329877"]Okay, so Miles WAS ABLE to look at his younger self. What are the implications there? Char didn’t die so that she wouldn’t see herself…did she die because she didn’t have a constant?[/quote]
    I don’t think there are any implications of Miles seeing his younger self. Perhaps if they got very close to each other, there may have been an issue, like we saw in the Orchid video with the two bunnies. But, maybe that’s more of a “constant” type of thing – the bunny might recognize itself, but not know how to make sense of what it’s seeing, and its brain would fry. Whereas Miles has a firm understanding of why he was seeing his younger self, so it didn’t create any short-circuits in his brain.[/quote]
    +++++++++++++
    Your’s makes more sense than mine…just hanging on to the ‘constant’ thing. Some folks thought that Char had to die so she wouldn’t run into her younger self….

  103. PJSander says:

    [quote comment="329885"]
    I don’t think there are any implications of Miles seeing his younger self. Perhaps if they got very close to each other, there may have been an issue, like we saw in the Orchid video with the two bunnies. But, maybe that’s more of a “constant” type of thing – the bunny might recognize itself, but not know how to make sense of what it’s seeing, and its brain would fry. Whereas Miles has a firm understanding of why he was seeing his younger self, so it didn’t create any short-circuits in his brain.[/quote]

    Okay, Toeknee, got to call you on this one. The bunny “recognized itself” really? Do you know many bunnies who have mirrors? Can smell themselves?

    I suspect that the whole “keep the bunny away from itself” thing was important because of something that had happened, but not that. LOL

    : ) P

  104. PJSander says:

    [quote comment="329887"][/quote]
    Do we know they’re working for Ben? Could they be a third party?[/quote]

    I agree. I think we’re talking third party.

    : ) P

  105. Jim in Georgia says:

    [quote comment="329849"]I mention this in the previous tread, and I was misunderstood. What I was trying to say is that Faraday is missing his left feet in the season 5’s poster, while the four toes statue is missing everything but the left feet.

    Did anybody saw a blue alien in the background of that poster? I saw something going up the stairs in one of the buildings.[/quote]

    * * * * *

    Can’t help you with the blue alien, but the drift over on the LP was that Daniel lost his foot to a poor job of photoshopping. All those individual shots were pasted into a master background. Danial’s foot is somewhere in a Windows swap file!

    8) Jim

  106. Hammer says:

    [quote comment="329887"][quote comment="329873"]that guy that takes miles on the street is one of ilana’s guys on the island!!!!! they ARE working for Ben!

    [/quote]
    Do we know they’re working for Ben? Could they be a third party?[/quote]
    ++++++++++++
    I’m thinking Alpert…Ben likely doesn’t even know about them. Ben is on the outs and Alpert et al still need to win the ‘war’ vs. Widmore.

  107. JZ says:

    So we know the guy in the van DOESN’T work for widmore…i’m calling that they work for Ben since we see him on the island after the 316 crash. Ilana was to get Sayid on the plane and Ben knew he had to get on the plane to re-create the scenario of 815.

    I’m wondering about this war that is coming. I’m wondering between who because the time should be 2007 to them. They didn’t time travel (or maybe they did to an alternate time). But if it IS 2007 the war doesn’t involve Dharma because of the “purge” that supposedly still happened and wiped them out. There’s no way anyone (ben, widmore, losties, etc) could have known that they were going to TT right??!!??

    Now if Widmore was convinced if Locke wasn’t on the island the wrong side is going to win. And then guy in the Van (Bram?) said that they WERE going to win. It’s just interesting to see how these sides play out and who is going to be the winner and the loser…and hopefully it’ll play out in a way that’s satisfying to us (the viewers)…

    ramblin…SORRY!…tell me to stop if you want to :)

  108. Toeknee says:

    [quote comment="329889"][quote comment="329885"]
    I don’t think there are any implications of Miles seeing his younger self. Perhaps if they got very close to each other, there may have been an issue, like we saw in the Orchid video with the two bunnies. But, maybe that’s more of a “constant” type of thing – the bunny might recognize itself, but not know how to make sense of what it’s seeing, and its brain would fry. Whereas Miles has a firm understanding of why he was seeing his younger self, so it didn’t create any short-circuits in his brain.[/quote]

    Okay, Toeknee, got to call you on this one. The bunny “recognized itself” really? Do you know many bunnies who have mirrors? Can smell themselves?

    I suspect that the whole “keep the bunny away from itself” thing was important because of something that had happened, but not that. LOL

    : ) P[/quote]
    _________________________
    LOL I know it sounds funny, but I guess I’m thinking there’s some sort of animal sense. Sort of like how dogs sniff each other’s butts – what are they sniffing for? Does that tell them if it’s a friend or foe?

    Anyways it’s just a guess, I don’t know what the issue is with needing to keep the bunnies apart in that video.

  109. JZ says:

    [quote comment="329887"][quote comment="329873"]that guy that takes miles on the street is one of ilana’s guys on the island!!!!! they ARE working for Ben!

    [/quote]
    Do we know they’re working for Ben? Could they be a third party?[/quote]
    _____

    I guess we don’t KNOW for sure, i went on to rambling a bit more in my above post (#107)….didn’t mean to ASSume

  110. JZ says:

    [quote comment="329887"][quote comment="329873"]that guy that takes miles on the street is one of ilana’s guys on the island!!!!! they ARE working for Ben!

    [/quote]
    Do we know they’re working for Ben? Could they be a third party?[/quote]
    _____

    I guess we don’t KNOW for sure, i went on to rambling a bit more in my above post (#107)….didn’t mean to ASSume….but a third party sounds like too much to add to the story…but then again there is a whole other season (season 6) to explain it if they wanted to…

  111. flgrl says:

    Note that when Naomi is giving Miles his proposition she says that there are lots of dead people “residing” on the island and not that there are lots of dead people buried on the island or existing on the island, but residing. That and the last scene with Faraday were definitely the most important to me.

  112. Toeknee says:

    [quote comment="329895"][quote comment="329887"][quote comment="329873"]that guy that takes miles on the street is one of ilana’s guys on the island!!!!! they ARE working for Ben!

    [/quote]
    Do we know they’re working for Ben? Could they be a third party?[/quote]
    _____

    I guess we don’t KNOW for sure, i went on to rambling a bit more in my above post (#107)….didn’t mean to ASSume[/quote]
    _________________________
    LOL “ASSume”. I wasn’t sure if I missed something that told us for sure they work for Ben. Like if that van was the same van Ben used to cart Locke’s dead body around. One thing the guy in the van said that made me think it’s possible they work for Ben is when he said something to Miles about joining the wrong team. The way he said it made me think there were only two teams in the battle, team Widmore, and team Ben. But I’m not 100% sure that’s what he meant.

  113. Jim in Georgia says:

    [quote comment="329889"][quote comment="329885"]
    I don’t think there are any implications of Miles seeing his younger self. Perhaps if they got very close to each other, there may have been an issue, like we saw in the Orchid video with the two bunnies. But, maybe that’s more of a “constant” type of thing – the bunny might recognize itself, but not know how to make sense of what it’s seeing, and its brain would fry. Whereas Miles has a firm understanding of why he was seeing his younger self, so it didn’t create any short-circuits in his brain.[/quote]

    Okay, Toeknee, got to call you on this one. The bunny “recognized itself” really? Do you know many bunnies who have mirrors? Can smell themselves?

    I suspect that the whole “keep the bunny away from itself” thing was important because of something that had happened, but not that. LOL

    : ) P[/quote]

    * * * * *

    The bunny had to be kept away from itself because they were nearly — one version was only milliseconds older than the other; they contained the same atoms. MilesMan is thirty(?) years older than MilesBaby. MilesMan has experiences and he swapped out the atoms years ago.

    8) Jim

  114. Toeknee says:

    Some random thoughts….

    Numbers – room 4 in the scene with young Miles; Naomi offered Miles $1.6 million (variant of 16)

    Speaking of the numbers I thought it was interesting that they were referred to as “serial numbers”. Like something that just came off an assembly line. No apparent meaning or magic to them at all.

    And speaking of Naomi, I thought she looked quite hot tonight.

    I was glad to see Jack being level-headed, not trying to do too much, just offering Sawyer some info and walking away

    The way that Alvarez got killed was interesting – evidence of the strong electromagnetism.

    Judging by the age of baby Miles, this episode takes place at roughly the same time as the opening scene at the beginning of the season, when Faraday bumps into Chang at the Orchid station. So, if Faraday is a “scientist” from Ann Arbor, why did he appear to be just another construction worker whom Chang treats like dirt in that first episode?

  115. Hammer says:

    [quote comment="329897"]Note that when Naomi is giving Miles his proposition she says that there are lots of dead people “residing” on the island and not that there are lots of dead people buried on the island or existing on the island, but residing. That and the last scene with Faraday were definitely the most important to me.[/quote]
    ++++++++++++++
    flgrl, great catch. Widmore wasn’t counting on Miles needing the bodies be there or that Miles can only find out what they ‘knew’ up until they died. Widmore needs Hurly to find out what they know NOW.

  116. hank vega says:

    [quote comment="329860"]@ hank vega there are sooooooooooooooooo many places to get lost eps your eyes might bleed…Torrents are alright, but you seem to be a direct download kinda 3guy…There are literally a million sites, but since I don’t have time to list them all try http://www.seriesgringas.us/ they usually have it pretty quick, but I don’t watch eps until Friday, so I look for the HQ eps and dl before I go to bed…

    Parting is such sweet sorrow, see ya guys later, this site is dead to me, well until after I watch Friday night…[/quote]

    ::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::

    Thanks for the tip wingman.

  117. Hammer says:

    [quote comment="329900"]Judging by the age of baby Miles, this episode takes place at roughly the same time as the opening scene at the beginning of the season, when Faraday bumps into Chang at the Orchid station. So, if Faraday is a “scientist” from Ann Arbor, why did he appear to be just another construction worker whom Chang treats like dirt in that first episode?[/quote]
    ++++++++++++++
    Just a thought, but maybe because Dan was
    ‘sneaking’ into the site to sabotage? If I remember correctly, he didn’t look Dan in the face.

  118. Toeknee says:

    [quote comment="329905"][quote comment="329900"]Judging by the age of baby Miles, this episode takes place at roughly the same time as the opening scene at the beginning of the season, when Faraday bumps into Chang at the Orchid station. So, if Faraday is a “scientist” from Ann Arbor, why did he appear to be just another construction worker whom Chang treats like dirt in that first episode?[/quote]
    ++++++++++++++
    Just a thought, but maybe because Dan was
    ‘sneaking’ into the site to sabotage? If I remember correctly, he didn’t look Dan in the face.[/quote]
    _______________________
    Could be. Daniel had his head down, as if he didn’t want to be recognized by Chang.

  119. Hammer says:

    Bedtime for Bonzo.

    If Faraday was off the island for three years…did he go talk to his younger self in the outside world…put a bunch of entries into his notebook and come back with a way to change WHH?

  120. lola says:

    Here are my thoughts:

    First of all, I’m pissed b/c last week’s preview for this week stated that everyone was on the island for a reason…did we find out the reason’s?-no!

    I think Ilana and company(the other dude that took Miles in the van and told him not to work for Widmore) are working for Eloise Hawking, Faraday’s mother. She arranged for the 06’ers to get on flight 316. She got Sayid and Hurley(how, for Hurley, we don’t know yet) on that same flight. She set up Ilana and group to be on that specific flight also. I believe she is the true protector of the island. Widmore and Ben are both too selfish. She somehow managed to get Faraday back there in 1977, and b/c of her, also had Widmore fund Faraday’s experiments.

    Jack’s scene w/ Ben’s dad was weird-I realize Jack doesn’t have a place in this setting yet, but his character is strange to me right now.

    I think Miles’s mom was lying to him to cover for his Dad, or perhaps his Dad acted like he didn’t care about them to keep them out of harm’s way.

    Funniest line of the episode to me was Hurley to Miles, “maybe you can change your own diaper”.

  121. PJSander says:

    [quote comment="329910"]If Faraday was off the island for three years…did he go talk to his younger self in the outside world…put a bunch of entries into his notebook and come back with a way to change WHH?[/quote]

    YES! Great thought, Bonzo, I mean Hammer.

    : ) P

  122. PJSander says:

    [quote comment="329911"]First of all, I’m pissed b/c last week’s preview for this week stated that everyone was on the island for a reason…did we find out the reason’s?-no![/quote]

    Makes me glad I work so hard to avoid the previews!

    [quote comment="329911"]I think Ilana and company(the other dude that took Miles in the van and told him not to work for Widmore) are working for Eloise Hawking, Faraday’s mother. She arranged for the 06’ers to get on flight 316. She got Sayid and Hurley(how, for Hurley, we don’t know yet) on that same flight. She set up Ilana and group to be on that specific flight also. I believe she is the true protector of the island. Widmore and Ben are both too selfish. She somehow managed to get Faraday back there in 1977, and b/c of her, also had Widmore fund Faraday’s experiments.[/quote]

    I like your thinking here. Working for Hawking AGAINST Widmore. Very good.

    : ) P

  123. Hammer says:

    [quote comment="329911"]
    I think Ilana and company(the other dude that took Miles in the van and told him not to work for Widmore) are working for Eloise Hawking…[/quote]
    +++++++++++++++++
    Oh, good one…I might like that better than working for Alpert. I’ll stick to Alpert for now…but I like the Eloise thing.

  124. lola says:

    [quote comment="329914"][quote comment="329911"]
    I think Ilana and company(the other dude that took Miles in the van and told him not to work for Widmore) are working for Eloise Hawking…[/quote]
    +++++++++++++++++
    Oh, good one…I might like that better than working for Alpert. I’ll stick to Alpert for now…but I like the Eloise thing.[/quote]

    ——————————–

    remember Eloise told Jack-it MUST be flight 316 they had to be on, no other.
    She also didn’t seem too concerned that Ben wasn’t able to gather everyone, even tho she said it had to be everyone on the plane…
    b/c she already arranged it! Maybe she works w/Alpert too. Richard didn’t really seem to care that Widmore was being sent away, and was into Locke taking over for Ben as leader.

  125. Vaughn K says:

    i really hope that we dont have to wait too many episodes to find out where dan has been. i think he is the most important character in this show now as far as information goes and actually knowing whats going on. hurley and miles make a good tandem they should kick it more mayve even with chang that would be fun. lol

    on a side not i am pissed that we have to wait two weeks but i am interested in what they are showing next week. i wonder what kind of info that will uncover.

  126. lost4ever says:

    [quote comment="329898"][quote comment="329895"][quote comment="329887"][quote comment="329873"]that guy that takes miles on the street is one of ilana’s guys on the island!!!!! they ARE working for Ben!

    [/quote]
    Do we know they’re working for Ben? Could they be a third party?[/quote]
    _____

    I guess we don’t KNOW for sure, i went on to rambling a bit more in my above post (#107)….didn’t mean to ASSume[/quote]
    _________________________
    LOL “ASSume”. I wasn’t sure if I missed something that told us for sure they work for Ben. Like if that van was the same van Ben used to cart Locke’s dead body around. One thing the guy in the van said that made me think it’s possible they work for Ben is when he said something to Miles about joining the wrong team. The way he said it made me think there were only two teams in the battle, team Widmore, and team Ben. But I’m not 100% sure that’s what he meant.[/quote]
    ++++++++++
    I like the original thought of a third party. Not sure if team implicates that there can only be 2. I remember playing Risk as a kid with 4 or 5 teams.

  127. lost4ever says:

    [quote comment="329912"][quote comment="329910"]If Faraday was off the island for three years…did he go talk to his younger self in the outside world…put a bunch of entries into his notebook and come back with a way to change WHH?[/quote]

    YES! Great thought, Bonzo, I mean Hammer.

    : ) P[/quote]
    ++++++++++
    Also maybe building the Lamp Post?

  128. lola says:

    : ) P[/quote]
    ++++++++++
    Also maybe building the Lamp Post?[/quote]

    ——-===============
    the Lamp Post is currently also being run by Eloise, see she’s in control of many things…

  129. lost4ever says:

    [quote comment="329878"]We got so MANY answers!

    Chang is Miles’ dad. Miles WAS born on the island and left as a baby (presumably).

    We also now know that the plane at the bottom of the Sundra Trench really WAS put there by Widmore (at not Ben as there was a hint).

    We know why Miles asked Ben for $3.2MM.

    We know that Ilana et al do NOT work for Widmore, since the guy in the van that kidnapped Miles and his fish taco, is Ilana’s henchman from the beach.

    We have an IDEA of what’s been up with Daniel.

    You can call it filler if you like, but I disagree.

    : ) P[/quote]
    I also learned that Miles and Sun are NOT twins.

    I’ll go on record as saying that they have never had a filler episode, JMO. Some episodes don’t fare as well as others because the previous week was fantastic, as is the case here. I think they all relate to telling the overall story or the 118 episodes.

    I was hoping to see a little more than Miles just closing his eyes and having a “feeling” ( I think that’s what he said ) to explain his ability.

    I was most intrigued by the scene with Bram?.

  130. lost4ever says:

    [quote comment="329924"]: ) P[/quote]
    ++++++++++
    Also maybe building the Lamp Post?[/quote]

    ——-===============
    the Lamp Post is currently also being run by Eloise, see she’s in control of many things…[/quote]
    +++++++++++++++
    Right. I do like Eloise as the possible third party and it really makes sense. But, if so, why would Eloise tell Ben about 316? Meaning why would she help him get back to the island? Ben had no idea about her until just b4 he killed Locke, at least I think that’s what Ben meant when told Locke that Locke had info he needed.

  131. LINS says:

    I liked Hurley talking about Star Wars and how Luke got his hand cut off because he didn’t know his father, and isn’t Chang the guy that loses an arm?

    I did think it was interesting that Daniel had been a scientist from Ann Arbor. I’m thinking the scene that we already saw with Dan and Chang in the Orchid must have happened after tonight, so what was Dan learning about off-island?

    Kimmel’s LOST secrets for tonight – from Hurley – Furley from Three’s Company was always arguing with Jack…

    All I have to say is…the next (new) episode is the 100th – it had better include Faraday and it had better be good!!!

  132. lola says:

    [quote comment="329929"][quote comment="329924"]: ) P[/quote]
    ++++++++++
    Also maybe building the Lamp Post?[/quote]

    ——-===============
    the Lamp Post is currently also being run by Eloise, see she’s in control of many things…[/quote]
    +++++++++++++++
    Right. I do like Eloise as the possible third party and it really makes sense. But, if so, why would Eloise tell Ben about 316? Meaning why would she help him get back to the island? Ben had no idea about her until just b4 he killed Locke, at least I think that’s what Ben meant when told Locke that Locke had info he needed.[/quote]
    —————————————–

    what do u mean by he had no idea about her? she wasn’t surprised to see Ben. In fact, she said to Ben, “I told you it had to be all of them” and he said that” was the best he could do”, so they were in “cahoots” trying to gather the 06 together. I think she is playing both Widmore and Ben. It doesn’t matter to her if Ben goes back, he is out of favor with the island. She’s arranging something-the impending war? I’m not sure…maybe by Locke telling Ben about finding her, he knew John must have met up with Widmore and that is the “all the info he needed”?

  133. rew says:

    I bet you miles talks to Candle/Hallowix about how he has to leave his wife and daughter and get them off the island in order to save them.

  134. DocH says:

    What did I miss? Mister Furley, missing an arm, is the third party?

    And who said that Daniel is a scientist from Ann Arbor. He could be the bag-boy (luggage monkey) from Ann Arbor. We saw him hauling construction equipment in the Orchid… certainly NOT duties consistent with one of Chang’s peers in this world changing endeavour they call – the DHARMA Initiative.

  135. lost4ever says:

    [quote comment="329933"]

    what do u mean by he had no idea about her? she wasn’t surprised to see Ben. In fact, she said to Ben, “I told you it had to be all of them” and he said that” was the best he could do”, so they were in “cahoots” trying to gather the 06 together. [/quote]
    Right, I think all that happened AFTER Ben killed Locke.

  136. Amber says:

    [quote comment="329887"][quote comment="329873"]that guy that takes miles on the street is one of ilana’s guys on the island!!!!! they ARE working for Ben!
    —————
    [/quote]
    Do we know they’re working for Ben? Could they be a third party?[/quote]
    —————-
    I remember I think on last weeks thread we were trying to find why miles told ben he owed him 3.2 million. Im guessing the van people were Bens people. He wanted them to double the 1.6 million to work with them. They said he was going with the wrong side. I guess he figured that he was with the wrong side when he got on the freighter and to the island. Basically saying to Ben hey im with you and your guys you owe me double. just my opinion

  137. Bobola says:

    Hurley continues to prove what a stupid piece of shit he is. He just can’t shut up and then he’s always thinking like a 10 year old….Star Wars? Not much of a mind there at all.

    Miles; he’s an interesting character but the episode sure dragged along after last weeks great pace.

    Now what is Sawyer going to do with the guy who saw him on the video? I’d think he might be the first guy to go into the bottom of the dead Dharma guy pile. The Roger, Then Hurley to squish it all down flat.
    Then cover it all with Polar Bear poop.

    Kate; wow, jut brilliant there almost spilling the beans to Roger. Ya think ya might just be in a dangerous situation where the wrong words could getcha killed? Ya think? No you don’t…Dummie.

  138. lola says:

    [quote comment="329937"][quote comment="329933"]

    what do u mean by he had no idea about her? she wasn’t surprised to see Ben. In fact, she said to Ben, “I told you it had to be all of them” and he said that” was the best he could do”, so they were in “cahoots” trying to gather the 06 together. [/quote]
    Right, I think all that happened AFTER Ben killed Locke.[/quote]
    ————————————–
    yeah, i agree. i guessed i’m confused by your original question she had a relationship w/young ben when he was on the island right? i don’t think she “helped” him to get back to the island, she only cared about everyone else getting back.

  139. lola says:

    [quote comment="329937"][quote comment="329933"]

    what do u mean by he had no idea about her? she wasn’t surprised to see Ben. In fact, she said to Ben, “I told you it had to be all of them” and he said that” was the best he could do”, so they were in “cahoots” trying to gather the 06 together. [/quote]
    Right, I think all that happened AFTER Ben killed Locke.[/quote]
    ————————————–
    yeah, i agree. i guessed i’m confused by your original question. she had a relationship w/young ben when he was on the island right? i don’t think she “helped” him to get back to the island, she only cared about everyone else getting back.

  140. Amber says:

    [quote comment="329934"]I bet you miles talks to Candle/Hallowix about how he has to leave his wife and daughter and get them off the island in order to save them.[/quote]
    ———————–
    WOW good thought. It looked to me like Candle was a good dad. Didnt seem like he would just walk out on them

  141. RGS says:

    Not bad, not bad. Team Widmore is feeling pretty good right about now. Random thoughts.

    I don’t think the scene with Miles/Naomi/Dead Delivery Man, confirms it was Widmore, or Ben who planted the plane. It could be the third party, and Delivery Man gathered the info that Widmore was looking to get.

    Pretty much can’t be Widmore’s body in the metal crate.

    I had a small issue with Mr. Linus threatening to get security, then having his ADD kick in and start swinging on the swingset drinking beer.

    Also as was pointed out previously, they really are business as usual despite lil Ben getting shot.

  142. lost4ever says:

    [quote comment="329936"]

    And who said that Daniel is a scientist from Ann Arbor. He could be the bag-boy (luggage monkey) from Ann Arbor. We saw him hauling construction equipment in the Orchid… certainly NOT duties consistent with one of Chang’s peers in this world changing endeavour they call – the DHARMA Initiative.[/quote]
    Not sure what you mean by your first question but I think you may be onto something with Faraday not being the scientist. Especially if you agree with LINS and think the scene we saw at the beginning of the season is forthcoming. Wasn’t Chang preparing baby formula then? IMO, Faraday tried to avoid Chang in that scene. If he was the scientist, why avoid Chang?

  143. Amber says:

    Again they brought up the what lies in the shadow of the statue…hmmm

  144. lost4ever says:

    [quote comment="329940"]
    yeah, i agree. i guessed i’m confused by your original question she had a relationship w/young ben when he was on the island right? [/quote]
    She did?

  145. Shadow says:

    Everyone’s probably gone to bed now, but here on the west coast, I just finished watching about an hour ago. I love the idea of Eloise being the third party. I don’t think at this point in the show, there’s really time to introduce an unknown third party, so it would make sense for it to be Eloise. Also, how much do we really know about her? We haven’t learned much at all about her so far, but she’s definitely someone with a great deal of power. She knows how to send people back to the island! That’s a BIG deal!
    OK, with that said, How many times has Dan been to the island? I’m losing track of where and when he’s been and how many times. I would appreciate some help here. My other question is, of all the original 815 losties, how many are left?
    I thought it was a great episode, but I love all of them. Curious to see what Sawyer will do with the guy who found the tape.

  146. lost4ever says:

    [quote comment="329938"]
    I remember I think on last weeks thread we were trying to find why miles told ben he owed him 3.2 million. Im guessing the van people were Bens people. He wanted them to double the 1.6 million to work with them. They said he was going with the wrong side. I guess he figured that he was with the wrong side when he got on the freighter and to the island. Basically saying to Ben hey im with you and your guys you owe me double. just my opinion[/quote]
    +++++++++++
    Miles was trying to confirm with Ben that he would be on his team for double his fee from team Widmore. Now if Bram worked for Ben, Ben would have understood what Miles meant about 3.2 Mil. Did he? I can’t remember.
    ,

  147. Miss lost says:

    [quote comment="329944"][quote comment="329936"]

    And who said that Daniel is a scientist from Ann Arbor. He could be the bag-boy (luggage monkey) from Ann Arbor. We saw him hauling construction equipment in the Orchid… certainly NOT duties consistent with one of Chang’s peers in this world changing endeavour they call – the DHARMA Initiative.[/quote]
    Not sure what you mean by your first question but I think you may be onto something with Faraday not being the scientist. Especially if you agree with LINS and think the scene we saw at the beginning of the season is forthcoming. Wasn’t Chang preparing baby formula then? IMO, Faraday tried to avoid Chang in that scene. If he was the scientist, why avoid Chang?[/quote]
    *****************

    Don’t we know though that Faraday helps Chang make that video…the plea for help? Somehow he (chang) is convinced that Faraday (and maybe Miles) know what they are talking about…and it obviously happens pretty soon, b/c in the video, Miles the baby is still a young baby. By the way, how old did Chang say his baby was? I thought I heard 3 months, but the baby on his lap seemed older than that…will try to rewatch tom.
    -Miss

  148. lola says:

    [quote comment="329946"][quote comment="329940"]
    yeah, i agree. i guessed i’m confused by your original question she had a relationship w/young ben when he was on the island right? [/quote]
    She did?[/quote]

    ========================
    this is funny-
    i guess i’m assuming she did as both her and widmore’s names were mentioned when alpert was willing to take a hurt ben in. We’re not sure when she left the island, but if it wasn’t when Ben was young, they must have met at some point in order for her to allow him to help get everybody together. She obviously knows Widmore was banned because of him-so I guess i’m saying I think she knows Ben more than by name alone-how and when they met I don’t know, but I feel it was long ago, long before flight 815 ever crashed.

  149. lola says:

    [quote comment="329950"][quote comment="329944"][quote comment="329936"]

    Don’t we know though that Faraday helps Chang make that video…the plea for help?

    _______________________________________________
    i know the video you’re talking about-but why do you think Faraday helped him make it?

  150. Miss lost says:

    [quote comment="329951"][quote comment="329946"][quote comment="329940"]
    yeah, i agree. i guessed i’m confused by your original question she had a relationship w/young ben when he was on the island right? [/quote]
    She did?[/quote]

    ========================
    this is funny-
    i guess i’m assuming she did as both her and widmore’s names were mentioned when alpert was willing to take a hurt ben in. We’re not sure when she left the island, but if it wasn’t when Ben was young, they must have met at some point in order for her to allow him to help get everybody together. She obviously knows Widmore was banned because of him-so I guess i’m saying I think she knows Ben more than by name alone-how and when they met I don’t know, but I feel it was long ago, long before flight 815 ever crashed.[/quote]
    ********************
    I don’t think we know if a young ben ever knew her…I guess if we are assuming she was some sort of a leader then it would seem to be a fair guess that their paths would have crossed. but when they showed a young ben, we only say Widmore talking to him and comforting him…

  151. lola says:

    [quote comment="329947"]E My other question is, of all the original 815 losties, how many are left?
    ======================
    the main people and rose & bernard. who knows what happened to cindy (the stewardess) and the 2 little kids? also walt’s dog whose name escapes me cuz i’m so freaking tired!
    enough for me-eyes half closed-i’m out
    good night

  152. Miss lost says:

    [quote comment="329897"]Note that when Naomi is giving Miles his proposition she says that there are lots of dead people “residing” on the island and not that there are lots of dead people buried on the island or existing on the island, but residing. That and the last scene with Faraday were definitely the most important to me.[/quote]
    ************************
    i think some of us have hinted that they are trapped souls…could this be why they are residing? For some reason they have unfinished business and Miles needs to talk to them…but i really like Hammers idea (i think it was his) that Hurley could also be needed to talk to the dead (whisperers) as well…maybe his purpose!

  153. lost4ever says:

    [quote comment="329950"][quote comment="329944"][quote comment="329936"]

    And who said that Daniel is a scientist from Ann Arbor. He could be the bag-boy (luggage monkey) from Ann Arbor. We saw him hauling construction equipment in the Orchid… certainly NOT duties consistent with one of Chang’s peers in this world changing endeavour they call – the DHARMA Initiative.[/quote]
    Not sure what you mean by your first question but I think you may be onto something with Faraday not being the scientist. Especially if you agree with LINS and think the scene we saw at the beginning of the season is forthcoming. Wasn’t Chang preparing baby formula then? IMO, Faraday tried to avoid Chang in that scene. If he was the scientist, why avoid Chang?[/quote]
    *****************

    Don’t we know though that Faraday helps Chang make that video…the plea for help? Somehow he (chang) is convinced that Faraday (and maybe Miles) know what they are talking about…and it obviously happens pretty soon, b/c in the video, Miles the baby is still a young baby. By the way, how old did Chang say his baby was? I thought I heard 3 months, but the baby on his lap seemed older than that…will try to rewatch tom.
    -Miss[/quote]
    +++++++++++++
    I heard 3 months also. I also agree that video will be made soon, the one from last summer. That is not the same thing we saw in the opening scene from this year which is the one I think LINS was referring to. My question is if Faraday IS the scientist, why was he trying to hide is identity from Chang in the opening scene?

  154. Miss lost says:

    [quote comment="329952"][quote comment="329950"][quote comment="329944"][quote comment="329936"]

    Don’t we know though that Faraday helps Chang make that video…the plea for help?

    _______________________________________________
    i know the video you’re talking about-but why do you think Faraday helped him make it?[/quote]
    *********************
    It is Faraday’s voice you can hear giving Chang directions. So we know he is filming the video. I think this is the video we saw in which most started speculating that the baby was Miles…good guess!

  155. lost4ever says:

    [quote comment="329952"][quote comment="329950"][quote comment="329944"][quote comment="329936"]

    Don’t we know though that Faraday helps Chang make that video…the plea for help?

    _______________________________________________
    i know the video you’re talking about-but why do you think Faraday helped him make it?[/quote]
    +++++++++++++
    Maybe to warn them about the purge? Which explains why Chang would send his wife and his son off the island. Maybe Chang isn’t a bad father as Miles now sees him and will see him in a different light after learning why he sent them away. Then Miles will be able to find what “lies in the shadow of the statue”, whatever that means.

  156. lola says:

    [quote comment="329961"][quote comment="329952"][quote comment="329950"][quote comment="329944"][quote comment="329936"]

    Don’t we know though that Faraday helps Chang make that video…the plea for help?

    _______________________________________________
    i know the video you’re talking about-but why do you think Faraday helped him make it?[/quote]
    *********************
    It is Faraday’s voice you can hear giving Chang directions. So we know he is filming the video. I think this is the video we saw in which most started speculating that the baby was Miles…good guess![/quote]

    _____________________________________________

    would you please tell me what episode this is in? i’d like to go back and watch it-thanks

  157. lost4ever says:

    [quote comment="329963"]

    would you please tell me what episode this is in? i’d like to go back and watch it-thanks[/quote]
    It wasn’t in any episode. It was a video released at comic-con last summer. After watching the video again he mentions a professor brought from Ann Arbor.

  158. Rita says:

    [quote comment="329960"][quote comment="329950"][quote comment="329944"][quote comment="329936"]

    And who said that Daniel is a scientist from Ann Arbor. He could be the bag-boy (luggage monkey) from Ann Arbor. We saw him hauling construction equipment in the Orchid… certainly NOT duties consistent with one of Chang’s peers in this world changing endeavour they call – the DHARMA Initiative.[/quote]
    Not sure what you mean by your first question but I think you may be onto something with Faraday not being the scientist. Especially if you agree with LINS and think the scene we saw at the beginning of the season is forthcoming. Wasn’t Chang preparing baby formula then? IMO, Faraday tried to avoid Chang in that scene. If he was the scientist, why avoid Chang?[/quote]
    *****************

    Don’t we know though that Faraday helps Chang make that video…the plea for help? Somehow he (chang) is convinced that Faraday (and maybe Miles) know what they are talking about…and it obviously happens pretty soon, b/c in the video, Miles the baby is still a young baby. By the way, how old did Chang say his baby was? I thought I heard 3 months, but the baby on his lap seemed older than that…will try to rewatch tom.
    -Miss[/quote]
    +++++++++++++
    I heard 3 months also. I also agree that video will be made soon, the one from last summer. That is not the same thing we saw in the opening scene from this year which is the one I think LINS was referring to. My question is if Faraday IS the scientist, why was he trying to hide is identity from Chang in the opening scene?[/quote]
    ________________________________________
    Even scientists from Ann Arbor need a reason to be any particular place. For all we know, they were there to study the polar bear poop, so they might not have a legitimate reason to be in the Orchid. If that is the case, Daniel may have had to sneek in there as a workman to do what he came to do. We can’t rule him out as one of the scientists yet.

  159. LostJunkie says:

    Just throwing this out there to discuss…what if the question “what lies in the shadow of the statue?” is being asked because only the person who is really Jacob would be able to answer that? And if somebody answers it correctly, that person IS Jacob? And it’s being asked because somebody is trying to find out who Jacob is?

    Am I losing my marbles or does that sound plausible to anyone?

  160. Hoof_Hearted says:

    something that doesn’t make sense to me.

    The body in the bodybag that miles picked up from Radzinski was picked up at the Swan while it is under construction (the original hatch where desmond pushed the buttons) and then transported first to Dharmaville and then to The Orchid while it is also under construction.

    What I don’t understand is that the electromagnetic pull from Jughead is/was buried at the Orchid I thought (like when we saw Faraday during construction I thought he was at the orchid) but if that is the case how was the dead mans filling pulled from his head while working on the Swan?

  161. Sam says:

    What happened to Rose and Bernard and the rest did they just crawl in a hole and die or something?

    I didnt read all of the comments, but did anyone think that maybe they are actually “Adam and Eve”? Remember in I think season 3 when they found two skeletons and they called them Adam and Eve because it was a man and woman?

    Maybe when all the time jumping was taking place they were somewhere that had not be built yet and got crushed…I would be very sad if this were true, but I guess we’ll just have to see!!

  162. Mia says:

    Now IF Eloise is leading the team against Widmore, I find it strange that Widmore would send Desmond to her (recall that Desmond came to Widmore to find Faraday’s mother). I’m still one of the few that thinks Eloise is not Faraday’s mother…

  163. Sam says:

    [quote comment="329975"]something that doesn’t make sense to me.

    The body in the bodybag that miles picked up from Radzinski was picked up at the Swan while it is under construction (the original hatch where desmond pushed the buttons) and then transported first to Dharmaville and then to The Orchid while it is also under construction.

    What I don’t understand is that the electromagnetic pull from Jughead is/was buried at the Orchid I thought (like when we saw Faraday during construction I thought he was at the orchid) but if that is the case how was the dead mans filling pulled from his head while working on the Swan?[/quote]

    I thought it meant that his tooth went flying out beacuse he was shot. i am probablt wrong, but that what i thought they meant.

  164. Sam says:

    [quote comment="329911"]Here are my thoughts:

    First of all, I’m pissed b/c last week’s preview for this week stated that everyone was on the island for a reason…did we find out the reason’s?-no!

    I think Ilana and company(the other dude that took Miles in the van and told him not to work for Widmore) are working for Eloise Hawking, Faraday’s mother. She arranged for the 06’ers to get on flight 316. She got Sayid and Hurley(how, for Hurley, we don’t know yet) on that same flight. She set up Ilana and group to be on that specific flight also. I believe she is the true protector of the island. Widmore and Ben are both too selfish. She somehow managed to get Faraday back there in 1977, and b/c of her, also had Widmore fund Faraday’s experiments.

    Jack’s scene w/ Ben’s dad was weird-I realize Jack doesn’t have a place in this setting yet, but his character is strange to me right now.

    I think Miles’s mom was lying to him to cover for his Dad, or perhaps his Dad acted like he didn’t care about them to keep them out of harm’s way.

    Funniest line of the episode to me was Hurley to Miles, “maybe you can change your own diaper”.[/quote]

    I think you’re right!!! amazing theory!

  165. dukes909 says:

    Wow, things are start to unravel now. When I saw Phil with that smirk on his face I knew that Sawyer was going to deck him one. Now, what to do with him..

    P.S. You tap the top of the beer can to push the center of the tab down, so that the end of the tab goes “up” making it easier to open, not to try and keep it from exploding. Kate looks to be a pro.

  166. Tasha says:

    Just out of curiousity, I wanted to see if anything interesting was in the March 14, 1977 issue of SI that Mile’s was reading. He doesn’t take me as a S[orts fan. Anyways, Only article I found was, “Buried But Still A Treasure”
    Reversing the practice of stripping sunken ships, salvors of the “Evangelista” in the Bahamas restored the frigate’s cannon for the pleasure of sightseeing divers.

    Didn’t seem that interesting, but for those interested in skimming thru the articles,

    http://vault.sportsillustrated.cnn.com/vault/cover/toc/8528/index.htm

  167. flgrl says:

    [quote comment="329974"]Just throwing this out there to discuss…what if the question “what lies in the shadow of the statue?” is being asked because only the person who is really Jacob would be able to answer that? And if somebody answers it correctly, that person IS Jacob? And it’s being asked because somebody is trying to find out who Jacob is?

    Am I losing my marbles or does that sound plausible to anyone?[/quote]

    ***************************

    It also doesn’t really seem like a password anymore because how would Miles know what the answer is if he had just been recruited? I guess there might be an actual answer to question.

  168. lola says:

    [quote comment="329978"]Now IF Eloise is leading the team against Widmore, I find it strange that Widmore would send Desmond to her (recall that Desmond came to Widmore to find Faraday’s mother). I’m still one of the few that thinks Eloise is not Faraday’s mother…[/quote]

    ————————————-

    that’s the thing-both Ben and Widmore have no idea what Eloise is up to b/c they’re too wrapped up in their own selfish interests. I don’t think she’s against one more so than the other-also she probably needs their unknowing help, ex-Ben helping find everyone

  169. flgrl says:

    Where are we with the nosebleeds and Charlotte’s death? I understand that they stopped when they stopped jumping but it really doesn’t make much sense to me. Obviously Miles was there for a while at least and he wasn’t that bad and so was Daniel. Did anyone ever resolve this?

  170. dukes909 says:

    By the way, if Bram/Ilana is not working for Widmore, and obviously not Ben, then who??..

  171. Brad says:

    I think the reference to The Empire Strikes Back is probably foreshadowing Miles (either the older future version, or the baby version) will be the reason that we see Dr. Candle without an arm in the Station videos. At the end of The Empire Strikes Luke loses his hand to Vader (it’s king of a backwards thought; this time the son cuts off the fathers appendage). That’s what I took from the whole “Star Wars” chat.

  172. PJSander says:

    [quote comment="329975"]something that doesn’t make sense to me.

    The body in the bodybag that miles picked up from Radzinski was picked up at the Swan while it is under construction (the original hatch where desmond pushed the buttons) and then transported first to Dharmaville and then to The Orchid while it is also under construction.

    What I don’t understand is that the electromagnetic pull from Jughead is/was buried at the Orchid I thought (like when we saw Faraday during construction I thought he was at the orchid) but if that is the case how was the dead mans filling pulled from his head while working on the Swan?[/quote]

    What Faraday saw at the Orchid was the FDW, not Jughead.

    I don’t think that the electromagnetic pull at the Swan is necessarily from Jughead, but whatever the source, when CONTROLLED, the magnetic pull was strong enough to lift the key from around Jack’s neck. When uncontrolled, it pulled everything in the hatch. It would definitely be strong enough to pull a filling out of a tooth and slice through the brain. (Yuck)

    : ) P

  173. Ikkiv says:

    Yo. Been lurking here for a while, first time posting! No one else seems to have mentioned it yet, but in the scene with Ben’s dad and Jack in the school, on the blackboard that Jack’s cleaning there’s a load of stuff about Egyptians! Dividing it into three time periods.

    Why were the DHARMA kids learning about egyptians? Coincidence? Or have the DHARMA learnt about the origins of the island?

  174. Ikkiv says:

    have just rewatched the scene: the blackboard says
    Old Egyptian
    2600 BC – 2000BC Tripling idcograms, phanog (?) and determinatives
    Middle Egyptian
    2000 BC – 1300 BC
    classic stage of language
    Late Egyptian
    cant really read it
    and on the other side of the board are actual hyeroglyphics…

  175. RGS says:

    Third party doesn’t necessarily have to be some well developed force, they can be just someone trying to get control of the island…we may never know who their leader is, just that it would be bad if they took over.

    Re 159: Plausible but not bloddy likely. Henchman said if he didn’t know the answer then he wasn’t ready to go to the island. Also make me feel strongly that they aren’t connected to Ben either, because they don’t care about money.

    Has to be an actual answer to that question and not just a passphrase.

    Re flgrl 169: Charlotte had been on the island longer than any of the other Losties, (she was born there, and was at least 3 before Miles was born) hence she’s the first to die.

    The use of the word residing can also plainly mean, the bodies are present. Not necessarily dwelling, as I think some of you are speculating (just offering another take).

    Shadow 145: Dan’s been to the ISLAND one time, in 2004. He TT back to ISLAND74, left for a bit on the sub, and is now returning. We don’t know what he was doing off island…yet.

  176. dukes909 says:

    Anyone else notice the 3:16 on the microwave at the opening scene?

  177. LuliB says:

    [quote comment="329933"][quote comment="329929"][quote comment="329924"]: ) P[/quote]
    ++++++++++
    Also maybe building the Lamp Post?[/quote]

    ——-===============
    the Lamp Post is currently also being run by Eloise, see she’s in control of many things…[/quote]
    +++++++++++++++
    Right. I do like Eloise as the possible third party and it really makes sense. But, if so, why would Eloise tell Ben about 316? Meaning why would she help him get back to the island? Ben had no idea about her until just b4 he killed Locke, at least I think that’s what Ben meant when told Locke that Locke had info he needed.[/quote]

    —————————-

    Back to the lamppost bit — I think the lamppost was built by Dharma to originally find the Island — not by Faraday in the 3years he was off island. I’m pretty sure that’s what Eloise first told the 06’ers when we first see the Lamppost.

    If our speculation is right about Ellie at the time of Jughead being in fact, Eloise, then Eloise is not original Dharma and her being on the island predated Dharma. She could not have been involved in building the Lamppost.

    Interesting to me that the Lamppost off island seems to be abandoned by Dharma just as all the stations on island were abandoned by Dharma. That doesn’t bode well for Dharma making a comeback in my opinion. Dharma played a role, they were intruders on that island, but I think that role is over.

  178. LuliB says:

    [quote comment="329992"][quote comment="329975"]something that doesn’t make sense to me.

    The body in the bodybag that miles picked up from Radzinski was picked up at the Swan while it is under construction (the original hatch where desmond pushed the buttons) and then transported first to Dharmaville and then to The Orchid while it is also under construction.

    What I don’t understand is that the electromagnetic pull from Jughead is/was buried at the Orchid I thought (like when we saw Faraday during construction I thought he was at the orchid) but if that is the case how was the dead mans filling pulled from his head while working on the Swan?[/quote]

    What Faraday saw at the Orchid was the FDW, not Jughead.

    I don’t think that the electromagnetic pull at the Swan is necessarily from Jughead, but whatever the source, when CONTROLLED, the magnetic pull was strong enough to lift the key from around Jack’s neck. When uncontrolled, it pulled everything in the hatch. It would definitely be strong enough to pull a filling out of a tooth and slice through the brain. (Yuck)

    : ) P[/quote]

    ===============

    Agree. Also think there is more than one electromagnetic hot spot on the island.

  179. Tasha says:

    [quote comment="330005"]Anyone else notice the 3:16 on the microwave at the opening scene?[/quote]
    ____________

    I did.

    Now I am trying to get a better picture of what was underneath the Llement table in the classroom. There is an easle to the rt of the chalkboard. Looks INTERESTING. Seems alien or asteroid like but not sure. It shows something going toward the island, from space? Maybe? Not sure I need a better pic!

  180. Jimmy63 says:

    Long time reader 1st time poster.I found the SI cover story title interesting “New Boss In LA”.Dodger fans what kind of change in command was that? I also found the chalkboard and classroom to be rather interesting Jack sure can wipe the slate clean pretty fast for a newbie janitor ! LOL

  181. wallyp says:

    Ok, the shadow of the statue thing. The minute they mentioned that my nose started bleeding. Ahhhh- HELP!!!

    But anyway, the dudes in the van seemed like hooligans sort of. Like they should have thrown empty beer cans at Miles as they were driving away hoopin it up about the side thats gonna win… but they also seemed alot more enlightened about things.

    I have been on the theory that Eloise is in cahoots with Alpert for weeks now. It makes perfect sense to me, she has the same recources as widmore, …I want to say that she was not banished from the island, but rather sent away to keep tabs on widmore by Alpert(widmore may be under the impression that she was banished.)

    To take it further, I think that she has had her doubts about Widmore (her BROTHER) ever since she talked to Faraday in 1954. I might even say that Widmore had something to do with the Jughead being put on the island- but I’d have to explain that one in length and I dont know if I even can, long story short, she has realized for a long time that Widmore is using his power on the island for selfish reasons.

    Anyway, Eloise definately has got it together, secretly on the one up against widmore AND Ben.

    Faraday is a prime example of her right hand man (adopted?) and a good example of how Eloise could be acting like she is on sides with Widmore by giving up info useful to Widmore but actually using it against him. Faraday is tight with Hawking, NOT Widmore. Widmore just thinks that they are all HIS.

    Also, it makes complete sense that the “incident” is the reason that ALL children and mothers are required to leave. Things gonna start getting KA-RA-ZEEE. Maybe Ben doesn’t leave cuz he’s still in the jungle. baby Ethan may end up out there too.

  182. Miraks says:

    [quote comment="329890"][quote comment="329887"][/quote]
    Do we know they’re working for Ben? Could they be a third party?[/quote]

    I agree. I think we’re talking third party.

    : ) P[/quote]

    Could the third party be Sun’s daddy? Mr. Paik? He has to be connected to the story more than just being Sun’s dad.

    I think Dan went back to the mainland three years ago (74), [maybe became the "mad scientist" that did all those weird experiments later on (the one Desmond was told about when he was looking for Hawkins) in England], and now has returned with the Ann Arbor team (Ann Arbor HAS been mentioned before). The reason he tries to hide his face from Chang later on, is that he has no reason to be in that location, and is trying to “sneak” past him- maybe to find a way to get all the Losties “back to the future”.

    Kate- never really liked her, but lately she has been more annoying than Hurley and Charlie combined.

  183. lost4ever says:

    [quote comment="330017"]

    But anyway, the dudes in the van seemed like hooligans sort of. Like they should have thrown empty beer cans at Miles as they were driving away hoopin it up about the side thats gonna win… but they also seemed alot more enlightened about things.
    [/quote]
    I thought Frank the Tank was gonna be in the van.:)

  184. wallyp says:

    [quote comment="329867"]Two mysteries solved.

    Tapping on a beer can doesn’t stop it from fizzing over….and Cheng is Miles’ dad.[/quote]

    Does that happen everytime Kate opens a beer? It’s like she has that move down perfect. I sware I’ve seen her do the exact same thing before? Two taps and a tilt, and a “ooops I spilled some.”

  185. Duke says:

    [quote comment="329873"]that guy that takes miles on the street is one of ilana’s guys on the island!!!!! they ARE working for Ben!

    p.s. one more daddy issue story to add to the list!!!

    that convo with miles cheng and hurley in the van was great! along with so many other great things

    FARADAY is BACK!!!!! and miles KNEW him!

    sorry my mind is just rambling :)[/quote]
    ___________________________
    Why wouldn’t Miles know Faraday? He came to the island with him on the freighter. You make NO SENSE.

  186. Duke says:

    [quote comment="329877"]Okay, so Miles WAS ABLE to look at his younger self. What are the implications there? Char didn’t die so that she wouldn’t see herself…did she die because she didn’t have a constant?[/quote]
    ________________________________
    Looking at one’s past self has never been talked about in my recollection. However, he couldn’t have been more than 15-20 feet away from him self so that kinda narrows the whole “how close is too close” first discussed with the ORchid video and the rabbits. We now know that 15-20 feet does cause a major catastrophe.

  187. lost4ever says:

    [quote comment="330021"][quote comment="329873"]that guy that takes miles on the street is one of ilana’s guys on the island!!!!! they ARE working for Ben!

    p.s. one more daddy issue story to add to the list!!!

    that convo with miles cheng and hurley in the van was great! along with so many other great things

    FARADAY is BACK!!!!! and miles KNEW him!

    sorry my mind is just rambling :)[/quote]
    ___________________________
    Why wouldn’t Miles know Faraday? He came to the island with him on the freighter. You make NO SENSE.[/quote]
    ++++++++++
    There’s the duck we know, not very kind or helpful.

  188. Duke says:

    [quote comment="329877"]Okay, so Miles WAS ABLE to look at his younger self. What are the implications there? Char didn’t die so that she wouldn’t see herself…did she die because she didn’t have a constant?[/quote]
    ________________________________
    Looking at one’s past self has never been talked about in my recollection. However, he couldn’t have been more than 15-20 feet away from him self so that kinda narrows the whole “how close is too close” first discussed with the ORchid video and the rabbits. We now know that 15-20 feet doesn’t cause a major catastrophe.

  189. new losty says:

    One thing I noticed was in the DHARMA van when miles and hurly were driveing the song that was playing had a lot of the numbers in it

  190. Duke says:

    [quote comment="329877"]Okay, so Miles WAS ABLE to look at his younger self. What are the implications there? Char didn’t die so that she wouldn’t see herself…did she die because she didn’t have a constant?[/quote]
    ________________________________
    Looking at one’s past self has never been talked about in my recollection. However, he couldn’t have been more than 15-20 feet away from him self so that kinda narrows the whole “how close is too close” first discussed with the ORchid video and the rabbits. We now know that 15-20 feet doesn’t [quote comment="329903"][quote comment="329897"]Note that when Naomi is giving Miles his proposition she says that there are lots of dead people “residing” on the island and not that there are lots of dead people buried on the island or existing on the island, but residing. That and the last scene with Faraday were definitely the most important to me.[/quote]
    ++++++++++++++
    flgrl, great catch. Widmore wasn’t counting on Miles needing the bodies be there or that Miles can only find out what they ‘knew’ up until they died. Widmore needs Hurly to find out what they know NOW.[/quote]
    cause a major catastrophe.

  191. Rumblestilskin says:

    [quote comment="329929"][quote comment="329924"]: ) P[/quote]
    ++++++++++
    Also maybe building the Lamp Post?[/quote]

    ——-===============
    the Lamp Post is currently also being run by Eloise, see she’s in control of many things…[/quote]
    +++++++++++++++
    Right. I do like Eloise as the possible third party and it really makes sense. But, if so, why would Eloise tell Ben about 316? Meaning why would she help him get back to the island? Ben had no idea about her until just b4 he killed Locke, at least I think that’s what Ben meant when told Locke that Locke had info he needed.[/quote]
    ———————————-

    I also think that Eloise is the 3rd party. She didnt give Widmore access 2 the lighthouse, as he found his way there after his daughter’s Tracking Station picked up the anomolie.

    I dont think that, despite appearences, Eloise had planned to be in leauge w/Ben, since he didnt even know where she was until Locke gave up that “Vital Information” B4 he was killed.

    IMO, If there is a 3rd party, its her.

  192. Duke says:

    [quote comment="330024"][quote comment="330021"][quote comment="329873"]that guy that takes miles on the street is one of ilana’s guys on the island!!!!! they ARE working for Ben!

    p.s. one more daddy issue story to add to the list!!!

    that convo with miles cheng and hurley in the van was great! along with so many other great things

    FARADAY is BACK!!!!! and miles KNEW him!

    sorry my mind is just rambling :)[/quote]
    ___________________________
    Why wouldn’t Miles know Faraday? He came to the island with him on the freighter. You make NO SENSE.[/quote]
    ++++++++++
    There’s the duck we know, not very kind or helpful.[/quote]
    _____________________________
    Just pointing out that that guy was wrong. Everyone else on here gets to do it why not me? Get off my back. I can give my opinions just like the rest of you idiots.

  193. marco says:

    I’m thinking what lies in the shadow of the statue is an ancient spaceship that had previously been in tunesia and influenced the egyptions until one day somebody accidentally moved it. Taking the surounding terrain with it turning it into an island.

  194. Duke says:

    [quote comment="329903"][quote comment="329897"]Note that when Naomi is giving Miles his proposition she says that there are lots of dead people “residing” on the island and not that there are lots of dead people buried on the island or existing on the island, but residing. That and the last scene with Faraday were definitely the most important to me.[/quote]
    ++++++++++++++
    flgrl, great catch. Widmore wasn’t counting on Miles needing the bodies be there or that Miles can only find out what they ‘knew’ up until they died. Widmore needs Hurly to find out what they know NOW.[/quote]
    _____________________________
    Are you suggesting that Hurley actually talks to the dead? He talks to people that have died that he has already interacted with. Not sure how he would communicate with the dead on the island or why you would suggest that Widmore needs him to do it. He was in a mental institution after all.

  195. marco says:

    I’m thinking what lies in the shadow of the statue is an ancient spaceship that had previously been in tunesia and influenced the egyptions until one day somebody accidentally moved it. Taking the surrounding terrain with it turning it into an island. Remember Ben said there was a wall around the “Temple” but locke said we’re going under.

  196. Duke says:

    [quote comment="329903"][quote comment="329897"]Note that when Naomi is giving Miles his proposition she says that there are lots of dead people “residing” on the island and not that there are lots of dead people buried on the island or existing on the island, but residing. That and the last scene with Faraday were definitely the most important to me.[/quote]
    ++++++++++++++
    flgrl, great catch. Widmore wasn’t counting on Miles needing the bodies be there or that Miles can only find out what they ‘knew’ up until they died. Widmore needs Hurly to find out what they know NOW.[/quote]
    _____________________________
    Are you suggesting that Hurley actually talks to the dead? He talks to people that have died that he has already interacted with. Not sure how he would communicate with the dead on the island or why you would suggest that Widmore needs him to do it. He was in a mental institution after all.[quote comment="329905"][quote comment="329900"]Judging by the age of baby Miles, this episode takes place at roughly the same time as the opening scene at the beginning of the season, when Faraday bumps into Chang at the Orchid station. So, if Faraday is a “scientist” from Ann Arbor, why did he appear to be just another construction worker whom Chang treats like dirt in that first episode?[/quote]
    ++++++++++++++
    Just a thought, but maybe because Dan was
    ‘sneaking’ into the site to sabotage? If I remember correctly, he didn’t look Dan in the face.[/quote]
    _______________________________________
    Why do you think Faradya was sneaking into the sight to sabotage? I think he was just surveying the situation knowing that he could possibly help if/when he was needed.

  197. Duke says:

    [quote comment="329914"][quote comment="329911"]
    I think Ilana and company(the other dude that took Miles in the van and told him not to work for Widmore) are working for Eloise Hawking…[/quote]
    +++++++++++++++++
    Oh, good one…I might like that better than working for Alpert. I’ll stick to Alpert for now…but I like the Eloise thing.[/quote]
    ________________________________
    You are supposed to be in bed Bozo, uh, I mean Bonzo. ROTFLMFAO

  198. Miss lost says:

    help us Obi Won…your our only hope!

  199. Duke says:

    [quote comment="329939"]Hurley continues to prove what a stupid piece of shit he is. He just can’t shut up and then he’s always thinking like a 10 year old….Star Wars? Not much of a mind there at all.

    Miles; he’s an interesting character but the episode sure dragged along after last weeks great pace.

    Now what is Sawyer going to do with the guy who saw him on the video? I’d think he might be the first guy to go into the bottom of the dead Dharma guy pile. The Roger, Then Hurley to squish it all down flat.
    Then cover it all with Polar Bear poop.

    Kate; wow, jut brilliant there almost spilling the beans to Roger. Ya think ya might just be in a dangerous situation where the wrong words could getcha killed? Ya think? No you don’t…Dummie.[/quote]
    ________________________________________
    The guy that saw the video mentioned telling/showing it to Horace and then mentioned someone named Porter. By his tone it seemed like that Porter may be higher up on the Dharma food chain. I do not recall any mention of a Porter before. Found this to be VERY interesting. Any thoughts?

  200. PJSander says:

    [quote comment="330033"]Just pointing out that that guy was wrong. Everyone else on here gets to do it why not me? Get off my back. I can give my opinions just like the rest of you idiots.[/quote]

    Of course you can give your opinions.

    The difference is that generally, if someone disagrees with another’s theory, we explain WHY and say we have a different idea. Instead you just told the other poster that s/he made NO SENSE. That’s wasn’t “kind or helpful” at all. If you THINK the post doesn’t make sense, explain why.

    : ) P

  201. Duke says:

    [quote comment="329959"][quote comment="329897"]Note that when Naomi is giving Miles his proposition she says that there are lots of dead people “residing” on the island and not that there are lots of dead people buried on the island or existing on the island, but residing. That and the last scene with Faraday were definitely the most important to me.[/quote]
    ************************
    i think some of us have hinted that they are trapped souls…could this be why they are residing? For some reason they have unfinished business and Miles needs to talk to them…but i really like Hammers idea (i think it was his) that Hurley could also be needed to talk to the dead (whisperers) as well…maybe his purpose![/quote]
    ____________________________________
    Hurley has ONLY “talked” to Charlie, Ana Lucia, and Eko. Three people that he previously had contact with not really feeling that he can actually communicate with the dead.

  202. Jay says:

    I have no data to support this but an errant thought that came my way was that somehow the Jughead bomb causes another time “dilation” and the incident sending the losties from 1977 back into the present and somehow causing a blast in the past that takes out the statue. I know there are a million reasons the statue could be gone but I also know how the writers like to tie things together. Of couse a blast would have wiped out the “temple” etc but maybe those things were built after the statue was destroyed., Just random musings…

  203. Tasha says:

    [quote comment="330035"][quote comment="329903"][quote comment="329897"]Note that when Naomi is giving Miles his proposition she says that there are lots of dead people “residing” on the island and not that there are lots of dead people buried on the island or existing on the island, but residing. That and the last scene with Faraday were definitely the most important to me.[/quote]
    ++++++++++++++
    flgrl, great catch. Widmore wasn’t counting on Miles needing the bodies be there or that Miles can only find out what they ‘knew’ up until they died. Widmore needs Hurly to find out what they know NOW.[/quote]
    _____________________________
    Are you suggesting that Hurley actually talks to the dead? He talks to people that have died that he has already interacted with. Not sure how he would communicate with the dead on the island or why you would suggest that Widmore needs him to do it. He was in a mental institution after all.[/quote]
    __________________________________

    He was in the institution because he was seeing dead people.

  204. maybe says:

    With the whole magnetic field effect on fillings…does this mean that between Locke, Charlie, desmond and Ekko (during the hatch explosion sequence), not a single one of them had any metal fillings?

    How about pins/rods/screws that would have been required to set Locke’s back in place after it was broken?

    Nothing!!

  205. Duke says:

    [quote comment="330041"][quote comment="330033"]Just pointing out that that guy was wrong. Everyone else on here gets to do it why not me? Get off my back. I can give my opinions just like the rest of you idiots.[/quote]

    Of course you can give your opinions.

    The difference is that generally, if someone disagrees with another’s theory, we explain WHY and say we have a different idea. Instead you just told the other poster that s/he made NO SENSE. That’s wasn’t “kind or helpful” at all. If you THINK the post doesn’t make sense, explain why.

    : ) P[/quote]
    __________________________
    I stated that Miles and Faraday came over on the freighter together so why wouldn’t he know him. That is why I said that dude didn’t make sense which he didn’t.

  206. Tasha says:

    [quote comment="330048"]With the whole magnetic field effect on fillings…does this mean that between Locke, Charlie, desmond and Ekko (during the hatch explosion sequence), not a single one of them had any metal fillings?

    How about pins/rods/screws that would have been required to set Locke’s back in place after it was broken?

    Nothing!![/quote]
    ________________________

    The writer’s are scratching there heads wondering how to finish this show off without everyone analyzing every detail LOL. Sux for them. Sorry I just thought it was funny you asked that because I am pretty sure we aren’t supposed to think about it. LOL

  207. Duke says:

    Hello

  208. Tasha says:

    Duke, I also noticed they said Porter. I may have missed something. The only other Porter was Brian Porter, Walt’s dad….or you know what I mean. Anyway, WHO is Porter?

  209. Tasha says:

    I thought I posted this already….

    Duke, I noticed Porter too. WHO is Porter? The only other one on the show that I recall is Brian Porter, Walt’s adopted dad. So I am wondering the same thing unless I missed something. What is that guy’s name that Sawyer knocked out?

  210. PDXJeremy says:

    What lies in the shadow of the statue?

    My two theories:

    1. The Hydrogen Bomb

    2. The top of the shadow, at some specific point in the day, reveals the location of Jacobs cabin.

    I think the question is a password phrase used to identify who has been on the island, and what team they are on.

  211. JZ says:

    [quote comment="329938"][quote comment="329887"][quote comment="329873"]that guy that takes miles on the street is one of ilana’s guys on the island!!!!! they ARE working for Ben!
    —————
    [/quote]
    Do we know they’re working for Ben? Could they be a third party?[/quote]
    —————-
    I remember I think on last weeks thread we were trying to find why miles told ben he owed him 3.2 million. Im guessing the van people were Bens people. He wanted them to double the 1.6 million to work with them. They said he was going with the wrong side. I guess he figured that he was with the wrong side when he got on the freighter and to the island. Basically saying to Ben hey im with you and your guys you owe me double. just my opinion[/quote]

    ______________

    I’m going to continue reading after this point, but I’ve only gotten myself caught up until this point.

    In the beginning of Dead is Dead Ben came across Ilana and the others of the big box with “unknown items” in it. There is a weird exchange, like Ben knew exactly what they were doing, and asked “can i help” knowing that they really didn’t…and trying to play out that they were strangers when in fact they have met before (probably off the island during the recruit of Sayid to get him on the plane).

  212. Toeknee says:

    [quote comment="330051"][quote comment="330041"][quote comment="330033"]Just pointing out that that guy was wrong. Everyone else on here gets to do it why not me? Get off my back. I can give my opinions just like the rest of you idiots.[/quote]

    Of course you can give your opinions.

    The difference is that generally, if someone disagrees with another’s theory, we explain WHY and say we have a different idea. Instead you just told the other poster that s/he made NO SENSE. That’s wasn’t “kind or helpful” at all. If you THINK the post doesn’t make sense, explain why.

    : ) P[/quote]
    __________________________
    I stated that Miles and Faraday came over on the freighter together so why wouldn’t he know him. That is why I said that dude didn’t make sense which he didn’t.[/quote]
    ________________________
    Actually, JZ’s comment made perfect sense. We didn’t know which version of Daniel that was that came out of the sub – could have been a time-travelling pre-2004 version of Daniel, who had not yet met Miles. Or, if Daniel does not age, as has been theorized by some here, then it could have been a 1977 version of Daniel, who had not yet met Miles.

  213. Duke says:

    [quote comment="330058"][quote comment="330051"][quote comment="330041"][quote comment="330033"]Just pointing out that that guy was wrong. Everyone else on here gets to do it why not me? Get off my back. I can give my opinions just like the rest of you idiots.[/quote]

    Of course you can give your opinions.

    The difference is that generally, if someone disagrees with another’s theory, we explain WHY and say we have a different idea. Instead you just told the other poster that s/he made NO SENSE. That’s wasn’t “kind or helpful” at all. If you THINK the post doesn’t make sense, explain why.

    : ) P[/quote]
    __________________________
    I stated that Miles and Faraday came over on the freighter together so why wouldn’t he know him. That is why I said that dude didn’t make sense which he didn’t.[/quote]
    ________________________
    Actually, JZ’s comment made perfect sense. We didn’t know which version of Daniel that was that came out of the sub – could have been a time-travelling pre-2004 version of Daniel, who had not yet met Miles. Or, if Daniel does not age, as has been theorized by some here, then it could have been a 1977 version of Daniel, who had not yet met Miles.[/quote]
    __________________________________________
    MIles would have still known who faraday was whether it was the version that he spent time with or not. There aren’t two different Faradays no matter how many multiples of him may be out there. Although I will completely disagree that it was some other version. Faraday stated long time no see meaning that he also recognized Miles or it wouldn’t have made the statement.

  214. Duke says:

    [quote comment="330055"]I thought I posted this already….

    Duke, I noticed Porter too. WHO is Porter? The only other one on the show that I recall is Brian Porter, Walt’s adopted dad. So I am wondering the same thing unless I missed something. What is that guy’s name that Sawyer knocked out?[/quote]
    __________________________________________
    Paul is the name of the guy Sawyer knocked the f out. Good job on remembering a Porter from the show although I do not think you are saying that that guy was talking about Walt’s stepfather. Are You?

  215. RGS says:

    I don’t think the third party is associated with Alpert. Alpert and Locke are for the same goals. Walt has already stated that the 316ers will try to hurt Locke. That would put them at odds with Alpert.

    I believe Alpert and the Others would have come out of hiding by now, as I’m sure their intimate connection with the Island would let them know when people have landed on it. So if they are working together, then it would be time to unite.

    That leaves Hawkings, who I do not believe is working against the Island and is therefore not aligned with the 316ers. So I am more inclined to believe they will be with a third party…the main third party that Widmore claims he was protecting the island from for over 30yrs.

  216. Duke says:

    [quote comment="330058"][quote comment="330051"][quote comment="330041"][quote comment="330033"]Just pointing out that that guy was wrong. Everyone else on here gets to do it why not me? Get off my back. I can give my opinions just like the rest of you idiots.[/quote]

    Of course you can give your opinions.

    The difference is that generally, if someone disagrees with another’s theory, we explain WHY and say we have a different idea. Instead you just told the other poster that s/he made NO SENSE. That’s wasn’t “kind or helpful” at all. If you THINK the post doesn’t make sense, explain why.

    : ) P[/quote]
    __________________________
    I stated that Miles and Faraday came over on the freighter together so why wouldn’t he know him. That is why I said that dude didn’t make sense which he didn’t.[/quote]
    ________________________
    Actually, JZ’s comment made perfect sense. We didn’t know which version of Daniel that was that came out of the sub – could have been a time-travelling pre-2004 version of Daniel, who had not yet met Miles. Or, if Daniel does not age, as has been theorized by some here, then it could have been a 1977 version of Daniel, who had not yet met Miles.[/quote]
    ________________________________________-
    Daniel stated long time no see which indicates to me that he also recognized Miles. Even if your absurd theory that it was a “different”version of the Daniel we have seen then Miles would have still recognized him. It wasn’t like he looked different or anything. That was my explanation for the NO SENSE part of my comment. Daniel could have conceivably not known Miles IF he was as you state a pre 1977 version of him who doesn’t age or a pre 2004 version who had yet to meet Miles. The key to it being one and the same Faraday is him saying LONG TIME NO SEE. THis generally means it has been a long time without my seeing you. Something that you would say to someone you had a relationship in the past with not some random dude on a dock when you exit a submarine. There everyone was that both kind and helpful.

  217. Duke says:

    Something is wrong when I go to post things. Sorry for the multiple postings it is inadverdant. :(

  218. Duke says:

    Sorry for the multiple posts. Something is not working right when I submit my comment. Please forgive the extras. NOT TRYING TO BE AN ASS BY POSTING MULTIPLE VERSIONS OF THE SAME COMMENT. :(

  219. DocH says:

    he said “REPORT HER” (kate)

    NOT

    “PORTER” (Walt’s step dad)

    it was in the CC.

  220. Nick says:

    [quote comment="330065"]Something is wrong when I go to post things. Sorry for the multiple postings it is inadverdant. :([/quote]
    Yeah, it’s been a long day for the lostblog. It appears to have been sick all day, but should be better now.

  221. FFam5 says:

    __________________________________________
    Paul is the name of the guy Sawyer knocked the f out. Good job on remembering a Porter from the show although I do not think you are saying that that guy was talking about Walt’s stepfather. Are You?[/quote]

    ******

    I thought his name was Phil

  222. RGS says:

    What Dharma logo was Dan wearing when he exited the sub?

  223. Halliwax says:

    Apparently I’m a douche of a dad

    I previously pointed out the pre-hieroglyphic language in Smokey’s lair in the DID thread.. glad to see confirmation on the blackboard in the children’s classroom with the info about the evolution of egyptian language through time.. the left side of the board had some early hieroglyphs apparently for teaching.. the middle had descriptions of the evolving language during the different time periods (although there were discrepancies in the time periods they had written).. and the right had the words ‘phonetic’ and ‘motives’ from what I picked up.. I think it’s guaranteed now there will be a major Egyptian twist coming at us before all is said and done

  224. Duke says:

    [quote comment="330069"]__________________________________________
    Paul is the name of the guy Sawyer knocked the f out. Good job on remembering a Porter from the show although I do not think you are saying that that guy was talking about Walt’s stepfather. Are You?[/quote]

    ******

    I thought his name was Phil[/quote]
    ___________________________
    I stand corrected. It was Phil. Thanks.

  225. Duke says:

    [quote comment="330064"][quote comment="330058"][quote comment="330051"][quote comment="330041"][quote comment="330033"]Just pointing out that that guy was wrong. Everyone else on here gets to do it why not me? Get off my back. I can give my opinions just like the rest of you idiots.[/quote]

    Of course you can give your opinions.

    The difference is that generally, if someone disagrees with another’s theory, we explain WHY and say we have a different idea. Instead you just told the other poster that s/he made NO SENSE. That’s wasn’t “kind or helpful” at all. If you THINK the post doesn’t make sense, explain why.

    : ) P[/quote]
    __________________________
    I stated that Miles and Faraday came over on the freighter together so why wouldn’t he know him. That is why I said that dude didn’t make sense which he didn’t.[/quote]
    ________________________
    Actually, JZ’s comment made perfect sense. We didn’t know which version of Daniel that was that came out of the sub – could have been a time-travelling pre-2004 version of Daniel, who had not yet met Miles. Or, if Daniel does not age, as has been theorized by some here, then it could have been a 1977 version of Daniel, who had not yet met Miles.[/quote]
    ________________________________________-
    Daniel stated long time no see which indicates to me that he also recognized Miles. Even if your absurd theory that it was a “different”version of the Daniel we have seen then Miles would have still recognized him. It wasn’t like he looked different or anything. That was my explanation for the NO SENSE part of my comment. Daniel could have conceivably not known Miles IF he was as you state a pre 1977 version of him who doesn’t age or a pre 2004 version who had yet to meet Miles. The key to it being one and the same Faraday is him saying LONG TIME NO SEE. THis generally means it has been a long time without my seeing you. Something that you would say to someone you had a relationship in the past with not some random dude on a dock when you exit a submarine. There everyone was that both kind and helpful.[/quote]
    _________________________________
    He also said Hey Miles when he exited the sub so there you go. I guess he did know him.

  226. lola says:

    [quote comment="330035"][quote comment="329903"][quote comment="329897"]Note that when Naomi is giving Miles his proposition she says that there are lots of dead people “residing” on the island and not that there are lots of dead people buried on the island or existing on the island, but residing. That and the last scene with Faraday were definitely the most important to me.[/quote]
    ++++++++++++++
    flgrl, great catch. Widmore wasn’t counting on Miles needing the bodies be there or that Miles can only find out what they ‘knew’ up until they died. Widmore needs Hurly to find out what they know NOW.[/quote]
    _____________________________
    Are you suggesting that Hurley actually talks to the dead? He talks to people that have died that he has already interacted with. Not sure how he would communicate with the dead on the island or why you would suggest that Widmore needs him to do it. He was in a mental institution after all.[/quote]
    ——————————————

    i agree w/ duke, hurley doesn’t necessarily talk w/ the dead-a few (just 2 in fact, hurley and mr eko, right?) came back to talk to him.

  227. lola says:

    i forgot about hurley also seeing ana lucia-duh

  228. Circus Mom says:

    [quote comment="330051"][quote comment="330041"][quote comment="330033"]Just pointing out that that guy was wrong. Everyone else on here gets to do it why not me? Get off my back. I can give my opinions just like the rest of you idiots.[/quote]

    Of course you can give your opinions.

    The difference is that generally, if someone disagrees with another’s theory, we explain WHY and say we have a different idea. Instead you just told the other poster that s/he made NO SENSE. That’s wasn’t “kind or helpful” at all. If you THINK the post doesn’t make sense, explain why.

    : ) P[/quote]
    __________________________
    I stated that Miles and Faraday came over on the freighter together so why wouldn’t he know him. That is why I said that dude didn’t make sense which he didn’t.[/quote]
    +++++++
    Also, everyone would know they knew each other. They showed up in Dharmaville together in 2004.

  229. Circus Mom says:

    RGS I thought it was Widmore in the box because I thought Ilana was working for him. I still think it’s a body, whoever her boss is now.

    Where are all teh pieces of the statue that would be littered around the ground when it was destroyed? Was the fot possibly time traveled there because someone was touching it after a turn of the Donkey Wheel?

  230. Circus Mom says:

    [quote comment="329900"]Some random thoughts….

    Numbers – room 4 in the scene with young Miles; Naomi offered Miles $1.6 million (variant of 16)

    Speaking of the numbers I thought it was interesting that they were referred to as “serial numbers”. Like something that just came off an assembly line. No apparent meaning or magic to them at all.

    And speaking of Naomi, I thought she looked quite hot tonight.

    I was glad to see Jack being level-headed, not trying to do too much, just offering Sawyer some info and walking away

    The way that Alvarez got killed was interesting – evidence of the strong electromagnetism.

    Judging by the age of baby Miles, this episode takes place at roughly the same time as the opening scene at the beginning of the season, when Faraday bumps into Chang at the Orchid station. So, if Faraday is a “scientist” from Ann Arbor, why did he appear to be just another construction worker whom Chang treats like dirt in that first episode?[/quote]
    +++++

    Not really sugesting this but maiby there are several Changs due to time travel. Each version has a different related name. Perhaps traveling through time or meeting himself is what causes him to loose his arm?

  231. Circus Mom says:

    [quote comment="330018"][quote comment="329890"][quote comment="329887"][/quote]
    Do we know they’re working for Ben? Could they be a third party?[/quote]

    I agree. I think we’re talking third party.

    : ) P[/quote]

    Could the third party be Sun’s daddy? Mr. Paik? He has to be connected to the story more than just being Sun’s dad.

    I think Dan went back to the mainland three years ago (74), [maybe became the "mad scientist" that did all those weird experiments later on (the one Desmond was told about when he was looking for Hawkins) in England], and now has returned with the Ann Arbor team (Ann Arbor HAS been mentioned before). The reason he tries to hide his face from Chang later on, is that he has no reason to be in that location, and is trying to “sneak” past him- maybe to find a way to get all the Losties “back to the future”.

    Kate- never really liked her, but lately she has been more annoying than Hurley and Charlie combined.[/quote]
    +++++++
    I was thinking Paik myself. I def don’t think it’s Ellie or RA that they are working for. They seem like mercenaries and Paik has been known to hire bullies. And not for the good of the island or anyone else.

  232. Circus Mom says:

    [quote comment="330056"]What lies in the shadow of the statue?

    My two theories:

    1. The Hydrogen Bomb

    2. The top of the shadow, at some specific point in the day, reveals the location of Jacobs cabin.

    I think the question is a password phrase used to identify who has been on the island, and what team they are on.[/quote]
    +++++++
    I like number 2 as a possibility. I’m with the group that thinks there is a answer and it’s not a password.

  233. Toeknee says:

    [quote comment="330064"][quote comment="330058"]
    ________________________
    Actually, JZ’s comment made perfect sense. We didn’t know which version of Daniel that was that came out of the sub – could have been a time-travelling pre-2004 version of Daniel, who had not yet met Miles. Or, if Daniel does not age, as has been theorized by some here, then it could have been a 1977 version of Daniel, who had not yet met Miles.[/quote]
    ________________________________________-
    Daniel stated long time no see which indicates to me that he also recognized Miles. Even if your absurd theory that it was a “different”version of the Daniel we have seen then Miles would have still recognized him. It wasn’t like he looked different or anything. That was my explanation for the NO SENSE part of my comment. Daniel could have conceivably not known Miles IF he was as you state a pre 1977 version of him who doesn’t age or a pre 2004 version who had yet to meet Miles. The key to it being one and the same Faraday is him saying LONG TIME NO SEE. THis generally means it has been a long time without my seeing you. Something that you would say to someone you had a relationship in the past with not some random dude on a dock when you exit a submarine. There everyone was that both kind and helpful.[/quote]
    ____________________________
    OK so I apologize for misreading jz’s statement (comment #90). I was thinking JZ was pointing out that Faraday knew Miles, not the other way around. I do agree with Duke that Miles should recognize
    Faraday.

    However I think it’s worthwhile to mention that Faraday recognized Miles. Before Faraday said “long time no see”, there was no guarantee that Faraday would have recognized Miles. Because it could have been a “different” version of Faraday. Calling that theory “absurd” is neither kind (as you put it) nor accurate – given all the time travel we’ve seen there’s no telling what version of what character will show up when. Prior to last night’s episode, I don’t think you’d find too many people who’d expect to see 30-year old Miles observe his 3-month old self. So I don’t see how the possibility of a pre-2004 version of Faraday arriving on that sub last night can be considered “absurd”.

  234. Miraks says:

    Question about Miles- maybe someone can answer.

    When we saw Miles yesterday, he seemed to be only able to communicate wuth the dead if the body was nearby
    a. the old guy that “called out” to him when he was a kid
    b. Naomi’s “test” corpse
    c. the dead guy in the back of the van
    previously
    d. dead Danielle and Carl
    e. dead Naomi’s body….
    In fact, when the father with the dead son asked him if his son had known that he was loved, Miles said that he could not communicate with the son because there was no body (ashed had been scatered on the football field). He also seemed to say the same thing to Hurley- that he could only communicate with the dead if there was a dead body to communicate with.
    BUT, when we first saw Miles (last season), when he was doing the “exorcism” for the grandma whose grandson had been shot, there was no corpse anywhere near, yet Miles found out where the money and drugs were hidden in the room- HOW?
    Is this just a mistake/ inconsistency by the writers, or is Miles lying about needing the body there to communicate?

  235. RGS says:

    [quote comment="330103"]Question about Miles- maybe someone can answer.

    When we saw Miles yesterday, he seemed to be only able to communicate wuth the dead if the body was nearby
    a. the old guy that “called out” to him when he was a kid
    b. Naomi’s “test” corpse
    c. the dead guy in the back of the van
    previously
    d. dead Danielle and Carl
    e. dead Naomi’s body….
    In fact, when the father with the dead son asked him if his son had known that he was loved, Miles said that he could not communicate with the son because there was no body (ashed had been scatered on the football field). He also seemed to say the same thing to Hurley- that he could only communicate with the dead if there was a dead body to communicate with.
    BUT, when we first saw Miles (last season), when he was doing the “exorcism” for the grandma whose grandson had been shot, there was no corpse anywhere near, yet Miles found out where the money and drugs were hidden in the room- HOW?
    Is this just a mistake/ inconsistency by the writers, or is Miles lying about needing the body there to communicate?[/quote]

    ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
    I vote continuity error.

  236. LINS says:

    [quote comment="330088"][quote comment="330056"]What lies in the shadow of the statue?

    My two theories:

    1. The Hydrogen Bomb

    2. The top of the shadow, at some specific point in the day, reveals the location of Jacobs cabin.

    I think the question is a password phrase used to identify who has been on the island, and what team they are on.[/quote]
    +++++++
    I like number 2 as a possibility. I’m with the group that thinks there is a answer and it’s not a password.[/quote]

    ************************
    I think it has something to do with being enlightened, I think it is code for something, and I still think it refers to the “losing of innocence” and all that that comes from meeting Smokey.

  237. LINS says:

    About the serial numbers on the hatch…coming from an accounting/auditing background, any time you do an equipment audit, the #1 way that I’ve seen companies/operations track their equipment that they have out in the field is through serial numbers, so that would be a logical way to keep track of the equipment that they installed at the Swan. In the industry I worked in, EVERYTHING had a serial number and it was all tracked. It’s a easy way to know what is where.

    Regarding the kidnapping van dudes, I think they work for “the island”/Alpert. They talked about how Miles wasn’t ready and he didn’t know enough and whatever, it all seemed a little cheesy to me, but it didn’t sound like anything Ben/Widmore would use to motivate someone. It sounded more like the ways that Alpert tried to recruit people, like with Locke – “you’re special”, “we have a special school (or camp, I can’t remember) for you”…

    Anyway, there’s my 2 cents :)

  238. lola says:

    [quote comment="330106"][quote comment="330103"]Question about Miles- maybe someone can answer.

    When we saw Miles yesterday, he seemed to be only able to communicate wuth the dead if the body was nearby
    a. the old guy that “called out” to him when he was a kid
    b. Naomi’s “test” corpse
    c. the dead guy in the back of the van
    previously
    d. dead Danielle and Carl
    e. dead Naomi’s body….
    In fact, when the father with the dead son asked him if his son had known that he was loved, Miles said that he could not communicate with the son because there was no body (ashed had been scatered on the football field). He also seemed to say the same thing to Hurley- that he could only communicate with the dead if there was a dead body to communicate with.
    BUT, when we first saw Miles (last season), when he was doing the “exorcism” for the grandma whose grandson had been shot, there was no corpse anywhere near, yet Miles found out where the money and drugs were hidden in the room- HOW?
    Is this just a mistake/ inconsistency by the writers, or is Miles lying about needing the body there to communicate?[/quote]

    ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
    I vote continuity error.[/quote]
    ***************************************************

    but didn’t he give that woman her money back, or part of it also? maybe he felt bad about it and didn’t want to lie to her?

  239. PJSander says:

    [quote comment="330084"]Where are all teh pieces of the statue that would be littered around the ground when it was destroyed? Was the fot possibly time traveled there because someone was touching it after a turn of the Donkey Wheel?[/quote]

    I always thought the the rest of the 4TS’s body ended up in the water when it fell apart. I think that’s how we’ll finally see the statue’s face – in an underwater swim or something.

    : ) P

  240. Circus Mom says:

    [quote comment="330103"]Question about Miles- maybe someone can answer.

    When we saw Miles yesterday, he seemed to be only able to communicate wuth the dead if the body was nearby
    a. the old guy that “called out” to him when he was a kid
    b. Naomi’s “test” corpse
    c. the dead guy in the back of the van
    previously
    d. dead Danielle and Carl
    e. dead Naomi’s body….
    In fact, when the father with the dead son asked him if his son had known that he was loved, Miles said that he could not communicate with the son because there was no body (ashed had been scatered on the football field). He also seemed to say the same thing to Hurley- that he could only communicate with the dead if there was a dead body to communicate with.
    BUT, when we first saw Miles (last season), when he was doing the “exorcism” for the grandma whose grandson had been shot, there was no corpse anywhere near, yet Miles found out where the money and drugs were hidden in the room- HOW?
    Is this just a mistake/ inconsistency by the writers, or is Miles lying about needing the body there to communicate?[/quote]
    +++
    My answer from another blog.
    I don’t think it was faked when he went into the kids room. He found the money didn’t he? I suppose he could have talked to teh body at the morgue and then went to the house to get it but there would be no reason to do more than run his machine for the moms benefit. He wouldn’t have said “You can go now.” at the end.
    Perhaps he can talk to the dead person in their past surrondings as long as there is a body somewhere. Creamation might be what limits him.

  241. Circus Mom says:

    My senario for the last five minutes of Lost.

    Due to what he has learned Hurley rushes out to the radio tower and broadcasts the numbers, over and over. Full Circle.

  242. LostGrrl says:

    Best part was when Sawyer knocked out that whiny, sneering Phil with one punch. That guy’s been asking for “purge” since we met him.

  243. Rita says:

    [quote comment="330109"][quote comment="330088"][quote comment="330056"]What lies in the shadow of the statue?

    My two theories:

    1. The Hydrogen Bomb

    2. The top of the shadow, at some specific point in the day, reveals the location of Jacobs cabin.

    I think the question is a password phrase used to identify who has been on the island, and what team they are on.[/quote]
    +++++++
    I like number 2 as a possibility. I’m with the group that thinks there is a answer and it’s not a password.[/quote]

    ************************
    I think it has something to do with being enlightened, I think it is code for something, and I still think it refers to the “losing of innocence” and all that that comes from meeting Smokey.[/quote]
    ___________________________________
    At the end of the last thread, Lost Horizon and Gen 24:6 started a discussion about the temple and “what lies in the shadow..” being the Garden of Eden (LOST’s version) – with the trees of the Knowledge of Good and Evil, and of Life (how Ben was healed and LOST his innocence, and how they don’t age and do seem to live forever, etc), and Smokey being the guardian set up to protect the Garden, as well as the statue to mark the place. A & E were banished from the Garden. I’m thinking that we are heading down this road and that Ilana’s group (whomever she works for) is after the Tree of Knowledge and the Tree of Life (Immortality).

  244. Tasha says:

    [quote comment="330119"][quote comment="330084"]Where are all teh pieces of the statue that would be littered around the ground when it was destroyed? Was the fot possibly time traveled there because someone was touching it after a turn of the Donkey Wheel?[/quote]

    I always thought the the rest of the 4TS’s body ended up in the water when it fell apart. I think that’s how we’ll finally see the statue’s face – in an underwater swim or something.

    : ) P[/quote]
    ____________________

    ANother thought I had was at some point of day the shadow wuld be in the water. What if there is something under the water?

  245. FFam5 says:

    [quote comment="330139"][quote comment="330119"][quote comment="330084"]Where are all teh pieces of the statue that would be littered around the ground when it was destroyed? Was the fot possibly time traveled there because someone was touching it after a turn of the Donkey Wheel?[/quote]

    I always thought the the rest of the 4TS’s body ended up in the water when it fell apart. I think that’s how we’ll finally see the statue’s face – in an underwater swim or something.

    : ) P[/quote]
    ____________________

    ANother thought I had was at some point of day the shadow wuld be in the water. What if there is something under the water?[/quote]

    **********

    Or could the Shadow fall on the location of the FDW in the Well / Under the Orchid?

  246. Duke says:

    [quote comment="330084"]RGS I thought it was Widmore in the box because I thought Ilana was working for him. I still think it’s a body, whoever her boss is now.

    Where are all teh pieces of the statue that would be littered around the ground when it was destroyed? Was the fot possibly time traveled there because someone was touching it after a turn of the Donkey Wheel?[/quote]
    ___________________________________
    The statute is on the edge of the water. Chances are that when it got destroyed most of it fell into the sea. IMO.

  247. Duke says:

    [quote comment="330092"][quote comment="330064"][quote comment="330058"]
    ________________________
    Actually, JZ’s comment made perfect sense. We didn’t know which version of Daniel that was that came out of the sub – could have been a time-travelling pre-2004 version of Daniel, who had not yet met Miles. Or, if Daniel does not age, as has been theorized by some here, then it could have been a 1977 version of Daniel, who had not yet met Miles.[/quote]
    ________________________________________-
    Daniel stated long time no see which indicates to me that he also recognized Miles. Even if your absurd theory that it was a “different”version of the Daniel we have seen then Miles would have still recognized him. It wasn’t like he looked different or anything. That was my explanation for the NO SENSE part of my comment. Daniel could have conceivably not known Miles IF he was as you state a pre 1977 version of him who doesn’t age or a pre 2004 version who had yet to meet Miles. The key to it being one and the same Faraday is him saying LONG TIME NO SEE. THis generally means it has been a long time without my seeing you. Something that you would say to someone you had a relationship in the past with not some random dude on a dock when you exit a submarine. There everyone was that both kind and helpful.[/quote]
    ____________________________
    OK so I apologize for misreading jz’s statement (comment #90). I was thinking JZ was pointing out that Faraday knew Miles, not the other way around. I do agree with Duke that Miles should recognize
    Faraday.

    However I think it’s worthwhile to mention that Faraday recognized Miles. Before Faraday said “long time no see”, there was no guarantee that Faraday would have recognized Miles. Because it could have been a “different” version of Faraday. Calling that theory “absurd” is neither kind (as you put it) nor accurate – given all the time travel we’ve seen there’s no telling what version of what character will show up when. Prior to last night’s episode, I don’t think you’d find too many people who’d expect to see 30-year old Miles observe his 3-month old self. So I don’t see how the possibility of a pre-2004 version of Faraday arriving on that sub last night can be considered “absurd”.[/quote]
    ______________________________
    It is absolutely absurd. When Daniel exited the sub he said Hey Miles long time no see. Clearly indicating that he knew him. There is no doubt about it.

  248. wallyp says:

    [quote comment="330126"]My senario for the last five minutes of Lost.

    Due to what he has learned Hurley rushes out to the radio tower and broadcasts the numbers, over and over. Full Circle.[/quote]
    ****************
    Yeah, I think that this is the origin of the numbers, which will soon take on a whole different meaning for the 1977 peeps. This is something I cant wait for, to see Hurley broadcast those numbers and WHY.

    ***********************
    [quote comment="330067"]he said “REPORT HER” (kate)

    NOT

    “PORTER” (Walt’s step dad)

    it was in the CC.[/quote]

    *************
    So no Porter? I was going to go look for it. I thought he said Annie Locke :}

  249. confused says:

    Or he could have just been taking her money like he did to that dad initially.

    [quote comment="330106"][quote comment="330103"]Question about Miles- maybe someone can answer.

    When we saw Miles yesterday, he seemed to be only able to communicate wuth the dead if the body was nearby
    a. the old guy that “called out” to him when he was a kid
    b. Naomi’s “test” corpse
    c. the dead guy in the back of the van
    previously
    d. dead Danielle and Carl
    e. dead Naomi’s body….
    In fact, when the father with the dead son asked him if his son had known that he was loved, Miles said that he could not communicate with the son because there was no body (ashed had been scatered on the football field). He also seemed to say the same thing to Hurley- that he could only communicate with the dead if there was a dead body to communicate with.
    BUT, when we first saw Miles (last season), when he was doing the “exorcism” for the grandma whose grandson had been shot, there was no corpse anywhere near, yet Miles found out where the money and drugs were hidden in the room- HOW?
    Is this just a mistake/ inconsistency by the writers, or is Miles lying about needing the body there to communicate?[/quote]

    ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
    I vote continuity error.[/quote]

  250. Mia says:

    Duke, I don’t think anyone is questioning whether Faraday recognized Miles – we all know he did. Toeknee is just pointing out that if he did not say “hey miles long time no see” then we could not assume he remembers him. Can we drop it now?

  251. confused says:

    sorry i missed this posting. i liked your comment about hurley and the numbers, they probably did start off as a serial number with no particular significance but were made significant by hurley in the past to warn future hurley.

    the frustrating part is why doesn’t anyone remember this when they seem to remember everything that’s happening since the show started. is it because they get hurt at some point and alpert “healed” them and can no longer remember everything that led up to that point.

    [quote comment="330125"][quote comment="330103"]Question about Miles- maybe someone can answer.

    When we saw Miles yesterday, he seemed to be only able to communicate wuth the dead if the body was nearby
    a. the old guy that “called out” to him when he was a kid
    b. Naomi’s “test” corpse
    c. the dead guy in the back of the van
    previously
    d. dead Danielle and Carl
    e. dead Naomi’s body….
    In fact, when the father with the dead son asked him if his son had known that he was loved, Miles said that he could not communicate with the son because there was no body (ashed had been scatered on the football field). He also seemed to say the same thing to Hurley- that he could only communicate with the dead if there was a dead body to communicate with.
    BUT, when we first saw Miles (last season), when he was doing the “exorcism” for the grandma whose grandson had been shot, there was no corpse anywhere near, yet Miles found out where the money and drugs were hidden in the room- HOW?
    Is this just a mistake/ inconsistency by the writers, or is Miles lying about needing the body there to communicate?[/quote]
    +++
    My answer from another blog.
    I don’t think it was faked when he went into the kids room. He found the money didn’t he? I suppose he could have talked to teh body at the morgue and then went to the house to get it but there would be no reason to do more than run his machine for the moms benefit. He wouldn’t have said “You can go now.” at the end.
    Perhaps he can talk to the dead person in their past surrondings as long as there is a body somewhere. Creamation might be what limits him.[/quote]

  252. confused says:

    interesting– i was trying to figure out that scene when miles was temporarily kidnapped and asked if he knew the answer to the question. what was weird is the guy’s response- if you don’t know the answer you arent ready to go there. but how could he know the answer without knowing the statue was there in the first place? i think we are taking it too literally. there has to be another answer that you dont need to go to the island to find the answer, maybe. were the guys that kidnapped him the same ones that came in on the second flight to the island with locke and the gang?

    [quote comment="330137"][quote comment="330109"][quote comment="330088"][quote comment="330056"]What lies in the shadow of the statue?

    My two theories:

    1. The Hydrogen Bomb

    2. The top of the shadow, at some specific point in the day, reveals the location of Jacobs cabin.

    I think the question is a password phrase used to identify who has been on the island, and what team they are on.[/quote]
    +++++++
    I like number 2 as a possibility. I’m with the group that thinks there is a answer and it’s not a password.[/quote]

    ************************
    I think it has something to do with being enlightened, I think it is code for something, and I still think it refers to the “losing of innocence” and all that that comes from meeting Smokey.[/quote]
    ___________________________________
    At the end of the last thread, Lost Horizon and Gen 24:6 started a discussion about the temple and “what lies in the shadow..” being the Garden of Eden (LOST’s version) – with the trees of the Knowledge of Good and Evil, and of Life (how Ben was healed and LOST his innocence, and how they don’t age and do seem to live forever, etc), and Smokey being the guardian set up to protect the Garden, as well as the statue to mark the place. A & E were banished from the Garden. I’m thinking that we are heading down this road and that Ilana’s group (whomever she works for) is after the Tree of Knowledge and the Tree of Life (Immortality).[/quote]

  253. RGS says:

    [quote comment="330148"]
    the frustrating part is why doesn’t anyone remember this when they seem to remember everything that’s happening since the show started. is it because they get hurt at some point and alpert “healed” them and can no longer remember everything that led up to that point.
    [/quote]

    Toeknee has explained this pretty well in other discussions, so when he gets back from cooking up more “absurd” theories he can perhaps direct you to his post.

    Anyway, let’s say you were born in 1979, in Chicago, and lived there your whole life, never travelling anywhere until 2007, where you moved to New York City. So you’re 28 years old living it up in NYC. One day a dude says I want you to check out this room over here it’s a really crazy type of time machine.

    So you go into the room, and voila, it takes you to 1997, Los Angeles…but you’re still 28. Your 17 year old self is still living in Chicago. You could travel to Chicago and see yourself grow from that point if you chose to do so.

    At 18 years old would you remember being in Los Angeles? No, because at 18 you had never been there. Same goes for 19, 20,21…27, and 28 right up until you enter the room.

  254. lost4ever says:

    [quote comment="330045"]
    Hurley has ONLY “talked” to Charlie, Ana Lucia, and Eko. Three people that he previously had contact with not really feeling that he can actually communicate with the dead.[/quote]
    +++++++++++++
    That makes NO SENSE. You state 3 dead people he has “talked” with, then say your not feeling he can communicate with the dead. Talking is communication.

  255. lost4ever says:

    I am guessing the dead guy on the table, when Miles had his “interview” for Naomi, worked for Ben. I think he was the person in the video being kidnapped by Widmore that Ben showed to Locke last year. I think Widmore found out that Ben had the info and killed him. Maybe it also served as proof for Naomi that Miles could do what they needed him to do. Any thoughts?

  256. lola says:

    [quote comment="330151"][quote comment="330045"]
    Hurley has ONLY “talked” to Charlie, Ana Lucia, and Eko. Three people that he previously had contact with not really feeling that he can actually communicate with the dead.[/quote]
    +++++++++++++
    That makes NO SENSE. You state 3 dead people he has “talked” with, then say your not feeling he can communicate with the dead. Talking is communication.[/quote]
    ————————————–

    you’re right, but these people seeked hurley out

  257. Tasha says:

    I was thinking about how this show has flown to the past recently. Maybe The newcomers are leaders from the future. SOmeone hits the FDW and turn it the wrong way and they go back in time. End up off the island and are living out their purpose just like the 815’s. Now they are back on the island coming in a way the 815’s ere trying to return, yet in their own way. Point is, we have Whitmore, from the past. Ben from the past several years. Locke will be the leader now. Someone on Llana’s team is the leader from the future. They are living out their destiny just like everyone else. Any of this make any sense? The newcomers will be known just like Locke was when he flew to the past. Not sure if anyone is following me, kind of hard to explain in fedw words. Point is Llana team= Future islanders.

  258. lola says:

    [quote comment="330155"][quote comment="330151"][quote comment="330045"]
    Hurley has ONLY “talked” to Charlie, Ana Lucia, and Eko. Three people that he previously had contact with not really feeling that he can actually communicate with the dead.[/quote]
    +++++++++++++
    That makes NO SENSE. You state 3 dead people he has “talked” with, then say your not feeling he can communicate with the dead. Talking is communication.[/quote]
    ————————————–

    you’re right, but these people seeked hurley out[/quote]
    —————————–
    make that saught :-)

  259. Tasha says:

    Abraham “Bram” Stoker …..could this be why they chose the name Bram? It’s interesting to see some of the things this guy believed in. Check out beliefs and Philosophy…

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bram_Stoker

  260. Tasha says:

    He was also believed tgo be a part of this…
    He was believed to be part of this…

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hermetic_Order_of_the_Golden_Dawn

    Interesting stuff.

  261. Bobola says:

    ________________________________________
    The guy that saw the video mentioned telling/showing it to Horace and then mentioned someone named Porter. By his tone it seemed like that Porter may be higher up on the Dharma food chain. I do not recall any mention of a Porter before. Found this to be VERY interesting. Any thoughts?[/quote]
    ————-
    No opinion; I tend to dwell on the drama on screen.
    Also gave up on trying to figure out the time; past and present…they are either going to make sense of it all or not at some point. I’m just confused and holding on for the ride.

    Was that a wig Para-chica had on? That was some bad looking hair. Weird that Miles didn’t seem more intrigued by the offer of knowledge by the Van guys. But he saw dollar signs. So, who ARE those guys? Not Widmore guys…working for Ben?
    Really dumb for Miles to tell Hurley anything. He used to be so close lipped too.
    Unbelievable that Hurley would even know who Miles Davis is. A guy who would watch Star Wars 100 times isn’t interested in jazz music. Metallica and video games are more his speed.
    My friend and I were cracking up when Miles started cursing Hurley out…Jeeez; they were right there next to the other workers while Hurley was blabbing on about his secret…if it were me standing there when Hurley wouldn’t shut the fuck up while he was eating his sandwich, he’d be eating a knuckle sandwich.

    Also does not make sense; haven’t the Dharma realized the new crew were not recruited by Dharma at all?

    I’m foggy on this; wasn’t it Alpert who was recruiting Juliet? This must of been discussed but if I missed it…hell I’ve only read about 5,000 so posts here so I’m only human.
    So,….how did Alpert go from Dharma to Hostile?

    What lies in the shaow of the statue?
    Why, Polar bear poop of course.
    Someone asks me…that’s my guess.
    Better to guess than take a rifle butt to the noggin, eh?

    And the word is “sought” lola. lol already.

  262. Bobola says:

    ooops; I mean shadow …not shaow. Bad typist here.

  263. Mia says:

    So if there are 3 Teams – then what do you think about this:

    Team 1 = Island (Jacob, Alpert, Christian)
    Team 2 = Widmore, Abbadon, Naomi, Elsa, Mercenaries
    Team 3 = Ben, Eloise, Bram, Ilana, Men with darts at Safehouse & Hospital

    If you look at Team 2 & 3, you can find a parallel:

    Widmore / Ben (both led the Others)
    Abbadon / Eloise (both appeared in order to guide someone e.g., Locke and Des)
    Naomi / Bram (both approached Miles)
    Elsa / Ilana (both deceived Sayid)
    Mercenaries / Men w/ darts (both carried out orders to kill or kidnap)

    I know, so what? But thought I’d write it out – makes me feel better.

  264. wallyp says:

    I just thought of this now and didn’t see anyone mention it yet. At some point Juliet and Kate are talking, (I think after Roger gets pissed at Kate) and Juliet says something like “Now it starts..” or something. I cant remember exactly, but I think Juliet knows exactly whats going to happen, piece by piece.

    Now I wonder if she is going to rat out on Sawyer. Who knows whats gonna happen but it seems that the crew slipped up quite a bit in this episode. Hurley knowing about the body? That really cant be too good. He’s new. He’s not in the circle of trust! At all!

  265. Duke says:

    [quote comment="330143"][quote comment="330126"]My senario for the last five minutes of Lost.

    Due to what he has learned Hurley rushes out to the radio tower and broadcasts the numbers, over and over. Full Circle.[/quote]
    ****************
    Yeah, I think that this is the origin of the numbers, which will soon take on a whole different meaning for the 1977 peeps. This is something I cant wait for, to see Hurley broadcast those numbers and WHY.

    ***********************
    [quote comment="330067"]he said “REPORT HER” (kate)

    NOT

    “PORTER” (Walt’s step dad)

    it was in the CC.[/quote]

    *************
    So no Porter? I was going to go look for it. I thought he said Annie Locke :}[/quote]
    __________________________
    Yeah closed caption is never wrong. I will wait to see the transcript before commenting further.

  266. Duke says:

    [quote comment="330147"]Duke, I don’t think anyone is questioning whether Faraday recognized Miles – we all know he did. Toeknee is just pointing out that if he did not say “hey miles long time no see” then we could not assume he remembers him. Can we drop it now?[/quote]
    ____________________________
    No we can not. This blog is about discusiing opinions of the show not making stuff up about what didn’t happen. He clearly knew him so why waste time saying well if he din’t know him maybe he was a time travelling Faraday that had yet to meet him. That is why I called it absurd because that is what it was.

  267. Tasha says:

    [quote comment="330167"][quote comment="330143"][quote comment="330126"]My senario for the last five minutes of Lost.

    Due to what he has learned Hurley rushes out to the radio tower and broadcasts the numbers, over and over. Full Circle.[/quote]
    ****************
    Yeah, I think that this is the origin of the numbers, which will soon take on a whole different meaning for the 1977 peeps. This is something I cant wait for, to see Hurley broadcast those numbers and WHY.

    ***********************
    [quote comment="330067"]he said “REPORT HER” (kate)

    NOT

    “PORTER” (Walt’s step dad)

    it was in the CC.[/quote]

    *************
    So no Porter? I was going to go look for it. I thought he said Annie Locke :}[/quote]
    __________________________
    Yeah closed caption is never wrong. I will wait to see the transcript before commenting further.[/quote]
    _______________________

    I watched it again yesterday and I think he said “report her.”

  268. Duke says:

    [quote comment="330151"][quote comment="330045"]
    Hurley has ONLY “talked” to Charlie, Ana Lucia, and Eko. Three people that he previously had contact with not really feeling that he can actually communicate with the dead.[/quote]
    +++++++++++++
    That makes NO SENSE. You state 3 dead people he has “talked” with, then say your not feeling he can communicate with the dead. Talking is communication.[/quote]
    _______________________________
    yeah but ti is different. Hurley only spoke with Ana, Eko, and Charlie. Three people he previously knew who contacted him. He hasn’t shown the abiltity to communicate with ANY dead person. he has also never looked to enhance his “ability” and seek people out to help them in the afterlife. That is my point.

  269. Duke says:

    [quote comment="330162"]________________________________________
    The guy that saw the video mentioned telling/showing it to Horace and then mentioned someone named Porter. By his tone it seemed like that Porter may be higher up on the Dharma food chain. I do not recall any mention of a Porter before. Found this to be VERY interesting. Any thoughts?[/quote]
    ————-
    No opinion; I tend to dwell on the drama on screen.
    Also gave up on trying to figure out the time; past and present…they are either going to make sense of it all or not at some point. I’m just confused and holding on for the ride.

    Was that a wig Para-chica had on? That was some bad looking hair. Weird that Miles didn’t seem more intrigued by the offer of knowledge by the Van guys. But he saw dollar signs. So, who ARE those guys? Not Widmore guys…working for Ben?
    Really dumb for Miles to tell Hurley anything. He used to be so close lipped too.
    Unbelievable that Hurley would even know who Miles Davis is. A guy who would watch Star Wars 100 times isn’t interested in jazz music. Metallica and video games are more his speed.
    My friend and I were cracking up when Miles started cursing Hurley out…Jeeez; they were right there next to the other workers while Hurley was blabbing on about his secret…if it were me standing there when Hurley wouldn’t shut the fuck up while he was eating his sandwich, he’d be eating a knuckle sandwich.

    Also does not make sense; haven’t the Dharma realized the new crew were not recruited by Dharma at all?

    I’m foggy on this; wasn’t it Alpert who was recruiting Juliet? This must of been discussed but if I missed it…hell I’ve only read about 5,000 so posts here so I’m only human.
    So,….how did Alpert go from Dharma to Hostile?

    What lies in the shaow of the statue?
    Why, Polar bear poop of course.
    Someone asks me…that’s my guess.
    Better to guess than take a rifle butt to the noggin, eh?

    And the word is “sought” lola. lol already.[/quote]
    _____________________________
    Alpert recruited Juliette but it was after the purge when the others/hostiles had taken over the Dharma camp.

  270. steve says:

    I don’t think Ben is with Ilana, bram…
    He gave them his name on the beach, and they made no acknowledgment.
    He questions Ilana about helping to move the crate, and she declines.
    They treat Ben like an unfortunate passenger.

    The funny thing is that Ben may be one of the few people who can tell them what lies in the shadow of the statue, but they never ask him.

    Maybe, and only a thought here, but the new faction is the rebirth of the old Dharma faction – Dharma reconstituted.

  271. Duke says:

    [quote comment="330165"]I just thought of this now and didn’t see anyone mention it yet. At some point Juliet and Kate are talking, (I think after Roger gets pissed at Kate) and Juliet says something like “Now it starts..” or something. I cant remember exactly, but I think Juliet knows exactly whats going to happen, piece by piece.

    Now I wonder if she is going to rat out on Sawyer. Who knows whats gonna happen but it seems that the crew slipped up quite a bit in this episode. Hurley knowing about the body? That really cant be too good. He’s new. He’s not in the circle of trust! At all![/quote]
    ___________________________________
    She makes the statement “here we go” to Sawyer after he knocked Phil the fuck out. I took it to mean that after nearly 3 years of living in Dharma bliss there world is about to get fucked up.

  272. PJSander says:

    [quote comment="330149"] were the guys that kidnapped him the same ones that came in on the second flight to the island with locke and the gang?[/quote]

    – – – – – –

    At least one of the people was the same. The big guy who did all the talking in the van (Bram) was Ilana’s henchman from the beach after the A316 flight crashed.

    : ) P

  273. PJSander says:

    [quote comment="330167"]Yeah closed caption is never wrong. I will wait to see the transcript before commenting further.[/quote]

    I imagine that your “closed caption is never wrong” is meant to be facetious, even though you didn’t indicate so. If so, you are correct, CC is regularly riddled with errors.

    However, before you put too much faith in a transcript, they are all done by fans as well. As I understand it, ABC has never released an official transcript of LOST.

    Bottom line: Roger said he was upset about Kate and was going to go to Horace and rePORT hER.

    : ) P

  274. Hammer says:

    [quote comment="329981"]
    P.S. You tap the top of the beer can to push the center of the tab down, so that the end of the tab goes “up” making it easier to open, not to try and keep it from exploding. Kate looks to be a pro.[/quote]
    +++++++++++++++++
    I was refering to the act of tapping on a shaken can of beer to stop it from fizzing over. Don’t know where you are from, but Michiganders have been trying it for year. :)

  275. steve says:

    [quote comment="330172"]I don’t think Ben is with Ilana, bram…
    He gave them his name on the beach, and they made no acknowledgment.
    He questions Ilana about helping to move the crate, and she declines.
    They treat Ben like an unfortunate passenger.

    The funny thing is that Ben may be one of the few people who can tell them what lies in the shadow of the statue, but they never ask him.

    Maybe, and only a thought here, but the new faction is the rebirth of the old Dharma faction – Dharma reconstituted.[/quote]

    ****
    I left something out of the theory above:

    I should have also put in this comment that Ilana references the dead people who “reside” on the island. She knows they are there because of the video from Pierre Chang about the purge and how they are all killed.

  276. DannL75 says:

    [quote comment="330173"][quote comment="330165"]I just thought of this now and didn’t see anyone mention it yet. At some point Juliet and Kate are talking, (I think after Roger gets pissed at Kate) and Juliet says something like “Now it starts..” or something. I cant remember exactly, but I think Juliet knows exactly whats going to happen, piece by piece.

    Now I wonder if she is going to rat out on Sawyer. Who knows whats gonna happen but it seems that the crew slipped up quite a bit in this episode. Hurley knowing about the body? That really cant be too good. He’s new. He’s not in the circle of trust! At all![/quote]
    ___________________________________
    She makes the statement “here we go” to Sawyer after he knocked Phil the fuck out. I took it to mean that after nearly 3 years of living in Dharma bliss there world is about to get fucked up.[/quote]

    Juliet said “Here we go” to Kate right after she told Roger that Ben disappeared while she was gone for 10 minutes. I think she meant here we go with the lie that they need to perpetuate about Ben’s disappearance.

  277. Circus Mom says:

    [quote comment="330165"]I just thought of this now and didn’t see anyone mention it yet. At some point Juliet and Kate are talking, (I think after Roger gets pissed at Kate) and Juliet says something like “Now it starts..” or something. I cant remember exactly, but I think Juliet knows exactly whats going to happen, piece by piece.

    Now I wonder if she is going to rat out on Sawyer. Who knows whats gonna happen but it seems that the crew slipped up quite a bit in this episode. Hurley knowing about the body? That really cant be too good. He’s new. He’s not in the circle of trust! At all![/quote]
    +++++++
    Juliette said “Here we go.” Same basic meaning but less ominus.

  278. Circus Mom says:

    [quote comment="330152"]I am guessing the dead guy on the table, when Miles had his “interview” for Naomi, worked for Ben. I think he was the person in the video being kidnapped by Widmore that Ben showed to Locke last year. I think Widmore found out that Ben had the info and killed him. Maybe it also served as proof for Naomi that Miles could do what they needed him to do. Any thoughts?[/quote]
    ++++++
    When Miles read the guy he said he was bringing those papers to Widmore. Why would he be working for Ben and bringing papers to Widmore. He was working for Widmore. Someone else staged the flight.
    Naomi grabbed Miles to find out what her co-worker was going to tell Widmore and to make sure his ability was real.

  279. Circus Mom says:

    [quote comment="330177"][quote comment="330172"]I don’t think Ben is with Ilana, bram…
    He gave them his name on the beach, and they made no acknowledgment.
    He questions Ilana about helping to move the crate, and she declines.
    They treat Ben like an unfortunate passenger.

    The funny thing is that Ben may be one of the few people who can tell them what lies in the shadow of the statue, but they never ask him.

    Maybe, and only a thought here, but the new faction is the rebirth of the old Dharma faction – Dharma reconstituted.[/quote]

    ****
    I left something out of the theory above:

    I should have also put in this comment that Ilana references the dead people who “reside” on the island. She knows they are there because of the video from Pierre Chang about the purge and how they are all killed.[/quote]
    +++++++
    It was Naomi who mentions the dead people to Miles.

  280. steve says:

    [quote comment="330181"][quote comment="330177"][quote comment="330172"]I don’t think Ben is with Ilana, bram…
    He gave them his name on the beach, and they made no acknowledgment.
    He questions Ilana about helping to move the crate, and she declines.
    They treat Ben like an unfortunate passenger.

    The funny thing is that Ben may be one of the few people who can tell them what lies in the shadow of the statue, but they never ask him.

    Maybe, and only a thought here, but the new faction is the rebirth of the old Dharma faction – Dharma reconstituted.[/quote]

    ****
    I left something out of the theory above:

    I should have also put in this comment that Ilana references the dead people who “reside” on the island. She knows they are there because of the video from Pierre Chang about the purge and how they are all killed.[/quote]
    +++++++
    It was Naomi who mentions the dead people to Miles.[/quote]

    888888

    You are right. I wonder if the theory can still stand up on the other things. I will continue to think this one through.

  281. Hammer says:

    [quote comment="330088"][quote comment="330056"]What lies in the shadow of the statue?

    My two theories:

    1. The Hydrogen Bomb

    2. The top of the shadow, at some specific point in the day, reveals the location of Jacobs cabin.

    I think the question is a password phrase used to identify who has been on the island, and what team they are on.[/quote]
    +++++++
    I like number 2 as a possibility. I’m with the group that thinks there is a answer and it’s not a password.[/quote]
    ++++++++++++
    I am of the belief that it is both, knowing the answer of what REALLY lies in the shadow is also the password.

  282. Rita says:

    [quote comment="329811"][quote comment="329774"][quote comment="329773"]Why the implication that they get off the island to deliver the package? Couldn’t a top Dharma offical be on the island? Candle perhaps?[/quote]

    ****************

    why does this guy use so many different names? anyone shed some light on this? it bothers me and i hope we get some answers on that tonight as well[/quote]
    *****************

    Just a guess… the Dharma recruits would only see one orientation video depending on where they were stationed. Maybe the leaders of Dharma didn’t care that they used the same guy (since they didn’t see each others videos) but used different names in case they talked about their video and that way it would appear they had more orientation leaders…other than that I really don’t know why he has used so many different names either…or why they so closely related in meaning…
    -miss[/quote]
    _______________________________________
    In the Comic Con 08 Dharma Video, Chang starts to use his Marvin Candle name, stops and says “forgive me…no more playing games, my real name is Pierre Chang” (something like that). Doesn’t tell us WHY the multi names, but does confirm that it is one person, and not different versions, as someone suggested. I have been trying to get a translation of Chang – could it mean candle, or wick, and wax, or flame maybe, in Chinese? I haven’t had any luck. I suspect that the reason for the names is that he is being funded with Hanso research grants as 4 people: Dr. Marvin Candle, Dr. Edgar Halliwax, Dr. Mark Wickman, and Dr. Pierre Chang. The “game” he has been playing is that Dharma gets grants and funding for FOUR people – he’s scamming Dharma.

  283. Circus Mom says:

    [quote comment="330182"][quote comment="330181"][quote comment="330177"][quote comment="330172"]I don’t think Ben is with Ilana, bram…
    He gave them his name on the beach, and they made no acknowledgment.
    He questions Ilana about helping to move the crate, and she declines.
    They treat Ben like an unfortunate passenger.

    The funny thing is that Ben may be one of the few people who can tell them what lies in the shadow of the statue, but they never ask him.

    Maybe, and only a thought here, but the new faction is the rebirth of the old Dharma faction – Dharma reconstituted.[/quote]

    ****
    I left something out of the theory above:

    I should have also put in this comment that Ilana references the dead people who “reside” on the island. She knows they are there because of the video from Pierre Chang about the purge and how they are all killed.[/quote]
    +++++++
    It was Naomi who mentions the dead people to Miles.[/quote]

    888888

    You are right. I wonder if the theory can still stand up on the other things.

    I will continue to think this one through.[/quote]
    +++++++
    I agree that Ilana, et al, are not with Ben. Just don’t know if they are Dharma.

  284. wallyp says:

    RE:282 I tried watching the comic con video from work but couldn’t really hear it very well. Is it supposed to be filmed in the present (our time) I thought it was, but I wasn’t sure. Whats up wit this thing? And he says something like “Lafleur what are you doing?” A little help for the peeps who didn’t go to comic con?

  285. Miraks says:

    I am always reminded of Percy Shelley’s OZYMANDIAS poem when the statue comes up
    (I met a traveller from an antique land
    Who said: Two vast and trunkless legs of stone
    Stand in the desert. ..Nothing beside remains: round the decay
    Of that colossal wreck, boundless and bare,
    The lone and level sands stretch far away.) Especially since it refers to Ramses II- and we do seem to have an Egyptian connection.

    https://www.allposters.com/-sp/Ramses-II-Statue-Luxor-Posters_i811506_.htm

    Anyway, many ancient monuments/ statues/ etc. were build to cast shadows in a particular direction and/ or on particular days (like the equanoxes, or solistices). BUT, since the island moves, this would be difficult, since the shadow would not be the same in different locations. PLUS, several characters made comments on the light on the island being “strange” (which could of course also mean that the shadow IS the same no matter how the island moves). My guess is that “shadow of the statue” is more than just a password, but that there is a big clue to the islands origins there somewhere.

  286. Circus Mom says:

    Chang = One who draws a bow.

  287. PJSander says:

    [quote comment="330204"]RE:282 I tried watching the comic con video from work but couldn’t really hear it very well. Is it supposed to be filmed in the present (our time) I thought it was, but I wasn’t sure. Whats up wit this thing? And he says something like “Lafleur what are you doing?” A little help for the peeps who didn’t go to comic con?[/quote]

    I believe that Chang says something about if the pinhole is open long enough, we will be watching the video approximately 30 years in the future. I think it was made in 1977. I suspect that the information he uses to prove he knows about the future, came from Daniel.

    : ) P

  288. dealer says:

    wow…all these posts and no one mentions the fact that hurley eats his own sandwich 20 or 30 years later. LOL…don’t you guys remember?

  289. Rita says:

    [quote comment="330231"]wow…all these posts and no one mentions the fact that hurley eats his own sandwich 20 or 30 years later. LOL…don’t you guys remember?[/quote]
    ____________________________________
    I only remember him eating crackers that were that old, not a sandwich.

  290. JasonS says:

    [quote comment="330217"][quote comment="330204"]RE:282 I tried watching the comic con video from work but couldn’t really hear it very well. Is it supposed to be filmed in the present (our time) I thought it was, but I wasn’t sure. Whats up wit this thing? And he says something like “Lafleur what are you doing?” A little help for the peeps who didn’t go to comic con?[/quote]

    I believe that Chang says something about if the pinhole is open long enough, we will be watching the video approximately 30 years in the future. I think it was made in 1977. I suspect that the information he uses to prove he knows about the future, came from Daniel.

    : ) P[/quote]

    —-

    I’m guessing the use of multiple names is part of Dharma’s psychology experiments, or because the subject watching the instruction videos in each station didn’t need privilege information.

    We can also see that something appears to be going wrong with Chang’s left arm. He’s either in pain or losing feeling. This helps place the video to a specific time. We know that it is immobile in the Swan video (post-incident), but ok now (pre-incident). I’m guessing this transmission was made very close to the incident (before or after).

  291. Rumblestilskin says:

    [quote comment="330231"]wow…all these posts and no one mentions the fact that hurley eats his own sandwich 20 or 30 years later. LOL…don’t you guys remember?[/quote]
    ———————————————–

    Yhea, I 2nd what Rita said.

    Can you please be more specific as to exactly what your talking about?

  292. Duke says:

    [quote comment="330178"][quote comment="330173"][quote comment="330165"]I just thought of this now and didn’t see anyone mention it yet. At some point Juliet and Kate are talking, (I think after Roger gets pissed at Kate) and Juliet says something like “Now it starts..” or something. I cant remember exactly, but I think Juliet knows exactly whats going to happen, piece by piece.

    Now I wonder if she is going to rat out on Sawyer. Who knows whats gonna happen but it seems that the crew slipped up quite a bit in this episode. Hurley knowing about the body? That really cant be too good. He’s new. He’s not in the circle of trust! At all![/quote]
    ___________________________________
    She makes the statement “here we go” to Sawyer after he knocked Phil the fuck out. I took it to mean that after nearly 3 years of living in Dharma bliss there world is about to get fucked up.[/quote]

    Juliet said “Here we go” to Kate right after she told Roger that Ben disappeared while she was gone for 10 minutes. I think she meant here we go with the lie that they need to perpetuate about Ben’s disappearance.[/quote]
    _______________________
    I was mistaken on who Juliet was talking to but my explanation still holds. I do not believe she KNOWS what is going to happen. I think the statement was meant to reflect the fact that the 3 years of peaceful Dharma living that she and Sawyer and built was about ready to explode. Like oh the shit is about to hit the fan. So I was wrong on who she was talking to but my interpretation is still the same.

  293. PJSander says:

    [quote comment="330232"]
    I only remember him eating crackers that were that old, not a sandwich.[/quote]

    Actually, as I remember it, even the crackers weren’t 30 years old. As I recall, Ben says something along the lines, “You know those are fifteen years old, Hugo?”

    : ) P

  294. PJSander says:

    Found it – S4E12 – NPLH Pt.1

    [Locke opens the box and tosses a package to Hurley. Hurley opens it up and and proceeds to begin eating the saltine crackers inside.]

    BEN: May I have that mirror, please?

    [Locke hands him the mirror.]

    BEN: (To Hurley) You know, those are 15 years old.

    : ) P

  295. lola says:

    [quote comment="330171"][quote comment="330162"]________________________________________

    ————-

    And the word is “sought” lola. lol already.[/quote]
    _____________________________
    +++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
    thanks, but i already corrected myself ; (comment 258) :-)

  296. lola says:

    [quote comment="330256"][quote comment="330171"][quote comment="330162"]________________________________________

    ————-

    And the word is “sought” lola. lol already.[/quote]
    _____________________________
    +++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
    thanks, but i already corrected myself ; (comment 258) :-)[/quote]
    ———————————-
    wait duke, u r right-o, not a-hey give me a break, i started drinking a bit early before going to the cubs game, which was an awesome victory for the cubbies btw!

  297. confused says:

    Ok here are my theories:

    1. Time. there is no shadow at noon or night.

    2. Darkness.

    3. There is no shadow for the statue. Didn’t Faraday say something about how light did not reflect off of things properly on the island.

    4. Life or death.

    probably far fetched but as i said, i’m confused.

    [quote comment="330056"]What lies in the shadow of the statue?

    My two theories:

    1. The Hydrogen Bomb

    2. The top of the shadow, at some specific point in the day, reveals the location of Jacobs cabin.

    I think the question is a password phrase used to identify who has been on the island, and what team they are on.[/quote]

  298. Duke says:

    [quote comment="330259"][quote comment="330256"][quote comment="330171"][quote comment="330162"]________________________________________

    ————-

    And the word is “sought” lola. lol already.[/quote]
    _____________________________
    +++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
    thanks, but i already corrected myself ; (comment 258) :-)[/quote]
    ———————————-
    wait duke, u r right-o, not a-hey give me a break, i started drinking a bit early before going to the cubs game, which was an awesome victory for the cubbies btw![/quote]
    __________________________________
    I did not correct you Lola. It was someone else.

  299. FFam5 says:

    [quote comment="330070"]What Dharma logo was Dan wearing when he exited the sub?[/quote]

    *******

    It looked to be the Black Swan Logo

  300. dukes909 says:

    Nope, I just watched it again. She taps the top of the can _before_ opening it, twice. She taps the center of it to be able to pull the tab to open it. Then it fizzes over. The only thing she does when it fizzes over is drink it…like a Canadian pro.

    Cheers.

    [quote comment="330176"][quote comment="329981"]
    +++++++++++++++++
    I was refering to the act of tapping on a shaken can of beer to stop it from fizzing over. Don’t know where you are from, but Michiganders have been trying it for year. :)[/quote]

  301. PJSander says:

    [quote comment="330270"]It looked to be the Black Swan Logo[/quote]

    Yup.

    http://gallery.lost-media.com/displayimage.php?pid=128604&fullsize=1

    : ) P

  302. Rita says:

    [quote comment="330273"][quote comment="330270"]It looked to be the Black Swan Logo[/quote]

    Yup.

    http://gallery.lost-media.com/displayimage.php?pid=128604&fullsize=1

    : ) P[/quote]
    ___________________________________
    Is that a swan with some sort of lightening bolt through it?

  303. Duke says:

    [quote comment="330274"][quote comment="330273"][quote comment="330270"]It looked to be the Black Swan Logo[/quote]

    Yup.

    http://gallery.lost-media.com/displayimage.php?pid=128604&fullsize=1

    : ) P[/quote]
    ___________________________________
    Is that a swan with some sort of lightening bolt through it?[/quote]
    ______________________________
    I think that it says Dharma.

  304. lost says:

    Do you think that when Faraday went off the island, maybe he was in England and maybe he could be Charlotte’s dad? Or that’s when he warned her of the island? He seems to have ties with England.

  305. Rita says:

    [quote comment="330385"]Do you think that when Faraday went off the island, maybe he was in England and maybe he could be Charlotte’s dad? Or that’s when he warned her of the island? He seems to have ties with England.[/quote]
    _____________________________________
    Charlotte was already 3 years old when Daniel saw her in 1974. Unlikely he time traveled back to 1971 to become her dad (JMO). He was a professor at Oxford University in England – probably has other ties as well, but we haven’t been shown them yet. I would guess that he warns Charlotte and Chang at some point soon after his return to the island (see the Comic Con 08 Dharma video).

  306. ShelbyDee says:

    Random thoughts and comments:
    1. “Bram” what is the religious significance of this nickname for Abraham. I like the Bram Stoker tie-in, but since I know these writers like biblical references there must be some nugget there.
    2. At the time Naomi mentioned to Miles “dead people residing on the island”, I thought she just meant people who are presumed dead, ie the 815 survivors. I didn’t think it was any more complicated than that.
    3. Similarly, we know Chang hates making the videos and considers them a lowly nuisance. I think the mulitiple names are just his way of having a little fun with a tedious assignment.
    4. Miles special power to communicate with the dead may have been caused by the proximity of Miles Baby to Miles Adult. A side effect of future and past selves meeting. That would be fun.
    5. I think the shot of Faraday at the Orchid avoiding Chang predates his arrival by sub as an Ann Arbor scientist. Doesn’t it? Wasn’t the filling-through-the-head dead guy laying on the ground in that scene? (I’m confused about where the dead guy came from. If that was him, why are they driving his body around in circles?) That would make Faraday’s appearance at the Orchid as a hard hat worker part of some time flash – but when that flash took place we don’t know.
    6. We only have Miles’ mom’s word that Chang is dead. I wonder if he is still alive and that he and Miles will be reunited “real time” with Chang having all the memories of meeting his adult son back in the Dharma day. That would be fun too.
    7. I’m wondering if the “what lies in the shadow of the statue” question isn’t a way for off-island/on-island Others to find each other OR for Others travelling through time to find each other. I think it is a password in that you must be told what the answer is or it must be revealed to you.

  307. ShelbyDee says:

    Another thing – do we know how Hurley got onto the Ajira plane? He was in jail, out of contact, and then we see him in the airport. Wasn’t that a less than 24 hour turn around for him? In which case, if he bought all the remaining open seats, how does Bram, Ilana, Cesar (any more?) get on the plane unless they had there seats in advance of the Hurley purchases. While it makes sense to me that they are working with Ben, did he have time to pull that off? Eloise could have done it. Not Widmore.

  308. Bobola says:

    [quote comment="330391"]Another thing – do we know how Hurley got onto the Ajira plane? He was in jail, out of contact, and then we see him in the airport. Wasn’t that a less than 24 hour turn around for him? In which case, if he bought all the remaining open seats, how does Bram, Ilana, Cesar (any more?) get on the plane unless they had there seats in advance of the Hurley purchases. While it makes sense to me that they are working with Ben, did he have time to pull that off? Eloise could have done it. Not Widmore.[/quote]

    ———–

    That was covered in the garage scene where Ben meets with a Lawyer telling Ben that since there were witnesses standing up for Hurley …that he was not the killer…that it would be easy now to get Hurley out of jail.

    Too bad though; I really wanted him to get his ass kicked in jail for being such an stupid cry baby.
    God watches over idiots? Ok, Hurley; go watch Star Wars again for the 101st time. You aren’t quite brain dead yet.

    And lola; The word Saught is not sought so no, you didn’t get it right yet. Refrain from guzzlin’ before posting?

  309. Rita says:

    [quote comment="330390"]Random thoughts and comments:
    1. “Bram” what is the religious significance of this nickname for Abraham. I like the Bram Stoker tie-in, but since I know these writers like biblical references there must be some nugget there.

    3. Similarly, we know Chang hates making the videos and considers them a lowly nuisance. I think the mulitiple names are just his way of having a little fun with a tedious assignment.

    4. Miles special power to communicate with the dead may have been caused by the proximity of Miles Baby to Miles Adult. A side effect of future and past selves meeting. That would be fun.

    5. I think the shot of Faraday at the Orchid avoiding Chang predates his arrival by sub as an Ann Arbor scientist. Doesn’t it? Wasn’t the filling-through-the-head dead guy laying on the ground in that scene? (I’m confused about where the dead guy came from. If that was him, why are they driving his body around in circles?) That would make Faraday’s appearance at the Orchid as a hard hat worker part of some time flash – but when that flash took place we don’t know.
    [/quote]
    ______________________________________
    ShelbyDee, I’ll take a stab at a couple of these. :)
    1) I agree that the writers seem to like Biblical references. Abraham in the Bible was told by God to go to a foreign land that God would give to him and to his ancestors. His nephew Lot went with him. At one point, Lot got into trouble and Abraham had to go rescue him and his whole community (who were being dragged off into slavery as spoils). Could be some significance there.

    3) While I agree that Chang seems to be bored with making the orientation videos (he’s MUCH too important for that! :) and could easily be doing the multi names as a private joke, I still think he is scamming the Dharma grant funders to be paid as 4 different people.

    4) Interesting that Miles’ “gift” didn’t seem to manifest itself until he was off island (7 or 8 years old maybe? Does that give us a clue as to when the purge happens and the “women and children” left?) It seems to be something that just started at the moment we saw it.

    5) I am of the opinion that the tunnel scene at the Orchid with Daniel avoiding Chang is AFTER he returns with the AA scientists. I think the scientists are not necessarily there on behalf of the secret projects, but may be there, sort of as a visit from the “corporate suits” so to speak, to check on the regular stuff, like the polar bear poop. :) Therefore, Daniel may not have had a legitimate reason to be in the Orchid tunnels and avoided Chang to avoid having to explain.

    As for “driving the dead guy in circles”, possibly Horace didn’t want to give Miles any more info than necessary (like revealing the real destination of the dead body as being the Orchid) and had Miles bring the body back to Dharmaville, hoping that LaFleur would be back by then and could take it from there. Since he wasn’t, he had to give Miles the rest of the information. JMO *g*

  310. Rita says:

    [quote comment="330391"]Another thing – do we know how Hurley got onto the Ajira plane? He was in jail, out of contact, and then we see him in the airport. Wasn’t that a less than 24 hour turn around for him? In which case, if he bought all the remaining open seats, how does Bram, Ilana, Cesar (any more?) get on the plane unless they had there seats in advance of the Hurley purchases. While it makes sense to me that they are working with Ben, did he have time to pull that off? Eloise could have done it. Not Widmore.[/quote]
    _______________________________________
    I haven’t checked a transcript, but from my very faulty memory, I believe that the scene where Hurley and Miles are talking during the “house arrest”, that Hurley comments that Ben was able to get them all on the plane. We were never told specifically how Hurley was persuaded, but it must have involved Ben. I had been thinking that Charlie visited him and talked him into it somehow, especially since he showed up with the guitar case.

  311. Rita says:

    [quote comment="330397"][quote comment="330391"]Another thing – do we know how Hurley got onto the Ajira plane? He was in jail, out of contact, and then we see him in the airport. Wasn’t that a less than 24 hour turn around for him? In which case, if he bought all the remaining open seats, how does Bram, Ilana, Cesar (any more?) get on the plane unless they had there seats in advance of the Hurley purchases. While it makes sense to me that they are working with Ben, did he have time to pull that off? Eloise could have done it. Not Widmore.[/quote]
    _______________________________________
    I haven’t checked a transcript, but from my very faulty memory, I believe that the scene where Hurley and Miles are talking during the “house arrest”, that Hurley comments that Ben was able to get them all on the plane. We were never told specifically how Hurley was persuaded, but it must have involved Ben. I had been thinking that Charlie visited him and talked him into it somehow, especially since he showed up with the guitar case.[/quote]
    _________________________________________
    OK, found it: from WHH –
    MILES: What the hell are you doing, Tubby?

    HURLEY: Checking to see if I’m disappearing.

    MILES: What?

    HURLEY: “Back to the Future,” man. We came back in time to the island and changed stuff. So if little Ben dies, he’ll never grow up to be big Ben, who’s the one who made us come back here in the first place. Which means we can’t be here. And therefore, dude? We don’t exist.

    I took this as an acknowledgement from Hurley that he came because of something Ben did or said.

  312. PJSander says:

    [quote comment="330395"]4) Interesting that Miles’ “gift” didn’t seem to manifest itself until he was off island (7 or 8 years old maybe? Does that give us a clue as to when the purge happens and the “women and children” left?) It seems to be something that just started at the moment we saw it.
    [/quote]

    It’s funny. I totally didn’t see it that way when I watched. I checked the transcript and there isn’t anything to indicate either way. However, if it did “start at the moment we saw it” it may be only because MilesBoy had never been that close to a dead person before.

    : ) P

  313. Rita says:

    [quote comment="330403"][quote comment="330395"]4) Interesting that Miles’ “gift” didn’t seem to manifest itself until he was off island (7 or 8 years old maybe? Does that give us a clue as to when the purge happens and the “women and children” left?) It seems to be something that just started at the moment we saw it.
    [/quote]

    It’s funny. I totally didn’t see it that way when I watched. I checked the transcript and there isn’t anything to indicate either way. However, if it did “start at the moment we saw it” it may be only because MilesBoy had never been that close to a dead person before.

    : ) P[/quote]
    __________________________________
    Well here I am assuming again, but it seemed to be something new that his mother was not familiar with, something neither of them had experienced before, or she would have just been “oh here we go again” or something when it happened. You could be right though that it may have just been the first time Miles was that near to a dead body, but as in the earlier scene with the mother and the weird machine, he may not need to be all that near in order to “hear”.

  314. PJSander says:

    [quote comment="330405"]Well here I am assuming again, but it seemed to be something new that his mother was not familiar with, something neither of them had experienced before, or she would have just been “oh here we go again” or something when it happened. You could be right though that it may have just been the first time Miles was that near to a dead body, but as in the earlier scene with the mother and the weird machine, he may not need to be all that near in order to “hear”.[/quote]

    I don’t think you were assuming… you just saw it differently than I did!

    I don’t remember an earlier scene with the mother and a weird machine. Please refresh my memory?

    : ) P

  315. DocH says:

    [quote comment="330407"]
    I don’t remember an earlier scene with the mother and a weird machine. Please refresh my memory?
    [/quote]
    Very first time we saw Miles, at the beginning of LAST season, as we were meeting the Freighter Tots… Miles went into the house and went upstairs and found the money. He had an odd/weird machine was a bright shiny metallic ??? It looked kind of like an old-timey dustbuster or something.

  316. PJSander says:

    [quote comment="330410"]Very first time we saw Miles, at the beginning of LAST season, as we were meeting the Freighter Tots… Miles went into the house and went upstairs and found the money. He had an odd/weird machine was a bright shiny metallic ??? It looked kind of like an old-timey dustbuster or something.[/quote]

    Oh THAT earlier scene! LOL. I thought Rita was talking about an earlier scene in SLiH. I always figured the dustbuster was a prop Miles used to make people believe he could talk to the dead.

    : ) P

  317. MIke says:

    My thoughts go back to Widmore saying there will be a war coming and you want to be on the right side…or something to that effect. Could it be that Dharma is returning to the island? That is who the islanders will be battling? It appears that Dharma has tons of money… they were able to build all these stations, have their own beer canned as well as all the other generic food, once kicked off, or “purged” off the island, you would think that they would want to try to return.

  318. PJSander says:

    [quote comment="330415"]My thoughts go back to Widmore saying there will be a war coming and you want to be on the right side…or something to that effect. Could it be that Dharma is returning to the island? That is who the islanders will be battling? It appears that Dharma has tons of money… they were able to build all these stations, have their own beer canned as well as all the other generic food, once kicked off, or “purged” off the island, you would think that they would want to try to return.[/quote]

    Mike, I think you might be on to something here. A couple of people have mentioned DHARMA being the possible “third party” which gave me pause to consider that. This lead me to thoughts of the defunct ARG game this past summer.

    To me, it felt very odd for D&C to just out and out cancel the ARG because of the “economy” especially since, to run the thing really only required a couple of programmers who were probably already on somebody’s payroll.

    Going with the idea that we are supposed to “buy into” the idea of DHARMA being reconstituted. What if that email saying that the ARG was being shut down because of the economy was a big “cover-up” because Dr. Evil (some unknown bad-guy) had taken over the newly reconstituted DHARMA and didn’t want “us” to know about Ilana and Bram and the island takeover?

    I know it sounds a bit far-fetched, but given the way the first part of the ARG was run, it might be heading in a direction that makes some sense.

    : ) P

  319. Circus Mom says:

    [quote comment="330390"]2. At the time Naomi mentioned to Miles “dead people residing on the island”, I thought she just meant people who are presumed dead, ie the 815 survivors. I didn’t think it was any more complicated than that.
    5. I think the shot of Faraday at the Orchid avoiding Chang predates his arrival by sub as an Ann Arbor scientist. Doesn’t it? Wasn’t the filling-through-the-head dead guy laying on the ground in that scene? (I’m confused about where the dead guy came from. If that was him, why are they driving his body around in circles?) That would make Faraday’s appearance at the Orchid as a hard hat worker part of some time flash – but when that flash took place we don’t know.
    quote]

    2. Naomi kept asking Abbadon “what if there are survivers” and he kept saying “there were no survivors.” Just makes me think.

    5. In one of the previous epis I mentioned that the camera stoped on a guy in Dharmaville and I thought he was the guy at Kates trial. I still think that is possible but I do think he is the guy with the filling. The filling killed him while building the Swan and he was taken to the Orchid. If he was on the ground when Daniel walked in wearing the hardhat the it is after he arrived from Ann Arbor and Chang keeping him there is significant. It may mean there is another scientist besides Miles who came on the sub. To deal with the filling guys death, or….

  320. Circus Mom says:

    [quote comment="330429"][quote comment="330415"]My thoughts go back to Widmore saying there will be a war coming and you want to be on the right side…or something to that effect. Could it be that Dharma is returning to the island? That is who the islanders will be battling? It appears that Dharma has tons of money… they were able to build all these stations, have their own beer canned as well as all the other generic food, once kicked off, or “purged” off the island, you would think that they would want to try to return.[/quote]

    Mike, I think you might be on to something here. A couple of people have mentioned DHARMA being the possible “third party” which gave me pause to consider that. This lead me to thoughts of the defunct ARG game this past summer.

    To me, it felt very odd for D&C to just out and out cancel the ARG because of the “economy” especially since, to run the thing really only required a couple of programmers who were probably already on somebody’s payroll.

    Going with the idea that we are supposed to “buy into” the idea of DHARMA being reconstituted. What if that email saying that the ARG was being shut down because of the economy was a big “cover-up” because Dr. Evil (some unknown bad-guy) had taken over the newly reconstituted DHARMA and didn’t want “us” to know about Ilana and Bram and the island takeover?

    I know it sounds a bit far-fetched, but given the way the first part of the ARG was run, it might be heading in a direction that makes some sense.

    : ) P[/quote]
    +++++

    I like where you are going with this.

  321. Steve says:

    [quote comment="330439"][quote comment="330429"][quote comment="330415"]My thoughts go back to Widmore saying there will be a war coming and you want to be on the right side…or something to that effect. Could it be that Dharma is returning to the island? That is who the islanders will be battling? It appears that Dharma has tons of money… they were able to build all these stations, have their own beer canned as well as all the other generic food, once kicked off, or “purged” off the island, you would think that they would want to try to return.[/quote]

    Mike, I think you might be on to something here. A couple of people have mentioned DHARMA being the possible “third party” which gave me pause to consider that. This lead me to thoughts of the defunct ARG game this past summer.

    To me, it felt very odd for D&C to just out and out cancel the ARG because of the “economy” especially since, to run the thing really only required a couple of programmers who were probably already on somebody’s payroll.

    Going with the idea that we are supposed to “buy into” the idea of DHARMA being reconstituted. What if that email saying that the ARG was being shut down because of the economy was a big “cover-up” because Dr. Evil (some unknown bad-guy) had taken over the newly reconstituted DHARMA and didn’t want “us” to know about Ilana and Bram and the island takeover?

    I know it sounds a bit far-fetched, but given the way the first part of the ARG was run, it might be heading in a direction that makes some sense.

    : ) P[/quote]
    +++++

    I like where you are going with this.[/quote]

    *********************
    I like this idea as well. I had put this in comment 270, and I still think this idea has strong legs.

  322. Steve says:

    [quote comment="330407"][quote comment="330405"]Well here I am assuming again, but it seemed to be something new that his mother was not familiar with, something neither of them had experienced before, or she would have just been “oh here we go again” or something when it happened. You could be right though that it may have just been the first time Miles was that near to a dead body, but as in the earlier scene with the mother and the weird machine, he may not need to be all that near in order to “hear”.[/quote]

    I don’t think you were assuming… you just saw it differently than I did!

    I don’t remember an earlier scene with the mother and a weird machine. Please refresh my memory?

    : ) P[/quote]

    ************

    I think the weird machine he was using was a white noise generator.

  323. Duke says:

    [quote comment="330390"]Random thoughts and comments:
    1. “Bram” what is the religious significance of this nickname for Abraham. I like the Bram Stoker tie-in, but since I know these writers like biblical references there must be some nugget there.
    2. At the time Naomi mentioned to Miles “dead people residing on the island”, I thought she just meant people who are presumed dead, ie the 815 survivors. I didn’t think it was any more complicated than that.
    3. Similarly, we know Chang hates making the videos and considers them a lowly nuisance. I think the mulitiple names are just his way of having a little fun with a tedious assignment.
    4. Miles special power to communicate with the dead may have been caused by the proximity of Miles Baby to Miles Adult. A side effect of future and past selves meeting. That would be fun.
    5. I think the shot of Faraday at the Orchid avoiding Chang predates his arrival by sub as an Ann Arbor scientist. Doesn’t it? Wasn’t the filling-through-the-head dead guy laying on the ground in that scene? (I’m confused about where the dead guy came from. If that was him, why are they driving his body around in circles?) That would make Faraday’s appearance at the Orchid as a hard hat worker part of some time flash – but when that flash took place we don’t know.
    6. We only have Miles’ mom’s word that Chang is dead. I wonder if he is still alive and that he and Miles will be reunited “real time” with Chang having all the memories of meeting his adult son back in the Dharma day. That would be fun too.
    7. I’m wondering if the “what lies in the shadow of the statue” question isn’t a way for off-island/on-island Others to find each other OR for Others travelling through time to find each other. I think it is a password in that you must be told what the answer is or it must be revealed to you.[/quote]
    ______________________________________
    Regarding number 5……….I think that the dead guy in the most recent episode was different than the guy from the first episode of the season. The guy Miles picked up was from the sight where Dharma is building the hatch. The guy from the first episode got “injured” during the building of the orchid station. Why would Miles have to pick him up and deliver him to Chang at the orchid if it was the same guy.

  324. roses12 says:

    [quote comment="329868"]When Hurley writes in his note book, the note book has a bar code clearly visible at the front. I wonder when bar codes became common in retail? This is not a clue or anything but probably simply an oversight.[/quote]
    Bruno like wow

    I worked in retail when they first came out and remember the painstankingly inputted the either contents of a DIY shop onto the computer. So I will never forget that barcodes became commonplace in Ireland in ’87 so even assuming our little retail outlet was one of the last to catch the wave it would still make it late 80s. So little continuity error.

    But that took me back (now having flashbacks to the beachboys the store could only afford one album and played it over and over…)

    lol

  325. Circus Mom says:

    [quote comment="330495"]
    ______________________________________
    Regarding number 5……….I think that the dead guy in the most recent episode was different than the guy from the first episode of the season. The guy Miles picked up was from the sight where Dharma is building the hatch. The guy from the first episode got “injured” during the building of the orchid station. Why would Miles have to pick him up and deliver him to Chang at the orchid if it was the same guy.[/quote]
    +++++++
    I rewatched. The guy in the Orchid, when Daniel showed up, didn’t have a beard, and didn’t die. He did have a major nosebleed and was carried out on a stretcher. May have died later.

    I think the guy who died at the Swan was show in Dharmaville in a earlier epi in a night scene when the camera panned the crowd. It lingered on him a bit.

  326. roses12 says:

    [quote comment="329958"][quote comment="329947"]E My other question is, of all the original 815 losties, how many are left?
    ======================
    the main people and rose & bernard. who knows what happened to cindy (the stewardess) and the 2 little kids? also walt’s dog whose name escapes me cuz i’m so freaking tired!
    enough for me-eyes half closed-i’m out
    good night[/quote]
    lola cindy and kids are in the temple with the others. Ben took them there before the freighters turned up to keep them safe.

  327. DocH says:

    [quote comment="329868"]When Hurley writes in his note book, the note book has a bar code clearly visible at the front. I wonder when bar codes became common in retail? This is not a clue or anything but probably simply an oversight.[/quote]
    [quote comment="330515"]
    Bruno like wow….
    So little continuity error.
    [/quote]
    –Simple research/google [[barcode wiki .en]] would tell you that barcoding kicked in during the mid-70s in the US.

    –Common sense would tell you that Hurley had the notebook in the guitar case he has been hauling around since he boarded the Ajira flight three days ago. Maybe he was composing guitar music in the notebook.

  328. roses12 says:

    love hurley stop dishing hurley
    hes back on top form but seems to have found some confidence standing up for himself with miles.

    gutted that the numbers aren’t cursed. better be a good explanation for Jacob, the ashes round the cabin, smokie, the whispers, locke walking, time travel….keeping the faith…d&c will explain all…

  329. PJSander says:

    [quote comment="330525"]–Common sense would tell you that Hurley had the notebook in the guitar case he has been hauling around since he boarded the Ajira flight three days ago. Maybe he was composing guitar music in the notebook.[/quote]

    Possible. But that would require his acquiring a DHARMA sticker to put on the front of the notebook:

    http://gallery.lost-media.com/displayimage.php?pid=128297&fullsize=1

    Speaking of the guitar case, have we seen it since Hurley was hanging onto it in the water?

    : ) P

  330. PJSander says:

    I found an even better screencap of the notebook which more clearly shows the DHARMA logo (with what appears to be an “education” center).

    http://gallery.lost-media.com/displayimage.php?pid=128339&fullsize=1

    : ) P

  331. PJSander says:

    One more note about the notebook *g*

    On the first screencap I provided, it also shows a DHARMA logo to the left of the UPC code. To me, that proves that it was a purposeful addition to the prop and definitively NOT a production error.

    : ) P

  332. Rita says:

    [quote comment="330540"]One more note about the notebook *g*

    On the first screencap I provided, it also shows a DHARMA logo to the left of the UPC code. To me, that proves that it was a purposeful addition to the prop and definitively NOT a production error.

    : ) P[/quote]
    _______________________________________
    Thanks PJ and good points. I had wanted to see a better pic of Hurley’s cook logo also, so thanks for that as well!

  333. DocH says:

    [quote comment="330539"]
    I found an even better screencap of the notebook which more clearly shows the DHARMA logo…
    [/quote]
    And Hurley had three years and millions of dollars to buy all of the Dharma memorabilia he could find on E-Bay…

  334. PJSander says:

    [quote comment="330572"]And Hurley had three years and millions of dollars to buy all of the Dharma memorabilia he could find on E-Bay…[/quote]

    LOL.

    : ) P

  335. wally p says:

    [quote comment="330385"]Do you think that when Faraday went off the island, maybe he was in England and maybe he could be Charlotte’s dad? Or that’s when he warned her of the island? He seems to have ties with England.[/quote]

    Ok, that couldn’t make him Charlottes dad unless he had her in the past. She was already born and was a little girl when they got to 1974. Plus Charlotte told him he was the creepy guy in her memory-

    BUT, I wonder if Faraday ends up getting in contact with Eloise on the island and she is responsible for his(Ann Arbor?..connections?)that get him a higher standing job with Dharma. Based on their encounter in 1954, -he was staring at her trying to see if it was her then, Eloise in 1974 (or is it still Ellie at that point?) might be the one that she(Older) instructed him to contact for help.

    Faraday and Charlotte also were pretty close when we first met them in season 4. She had taken the role as his caretaker right off the bat. I dont think hes her father because he had a thing for her. Although I could see him knocking up Ellie, whats she like 37 now? Shits probably like the new 20 on island time.

  336. steve says:

    [quote comment="330523"][quote comment="329958"][quote comment="329947"]E My other question is, of all the original 815 losties, how many are left?
    ======================
    the main people and rose & bernard. who knows what happened to cindy (the stewardess) and the 2 little kids? also walt’s dog whose name escapes me cuz i’m so freaking tired!
    enough for me-eyes half closed-i’m out
    good night[/quote]
    lola cindy and kids are in the temple with the others. Ben took them there before the freighters turned up to keep them safe.[/quote]

    ********************

    Thats the ones that we know about. remember the flight manifest from 815. Hurley went through the manifest for the names of those that were in the group. They assumed that the taillies were dead, and so were any others that were on the manifest, but not present. In this way Hurley accounts for all but Ethan. What if some of the people on the manifest were not dead, but foomed to another time on the island, say way back in time. Not all passengers are actually accounted for. Just food for thought

  337. Bobola says:

    [quote comment="330415"]My thoughts go back to Widmore saying there will be a war coming and you want to be on the right side…or something to that effect. Could it be that Dharma is returning to the island? That is who the islanders will be battling? It appears that Dharma has tons of money… they were able to build all these stations, have their own beer canned as well as all the other generic food, once kicked off, or “purged” off the island, you would think that they would want to try to return.[/quote]
    —————————–

    Did I miss something?
    Was Widmore in the van?

  338. Miss lost says:

    [quote comment="330631"][quote comment="330415"]My thoughts go back to Widmore saying there will be a war coming and you want to be on the right side…or something to that effect. Could it be that Dharma is returning to the island? That is who the islanders will be battling? It appears that Dharma has tons of money… they were able to build all these stations, have their own beer canned as well as all the other generic food, once kicked off, or “purged” off the island, you would think that they would want to try to return.[/quote]
    —————————–

    Did I miss something?
    Was Widmore in the van?[/quote]
    ********************
    Widmore was not in the van, but he had a conversation with Locke when he visited him in the hospital. This is also when he told him that he had been trying to get back to the island ever since Ben tricked him (just like he tricked you).

  339. ShelbyDee says:

    [quote comment="330518"][quote comment="330495"]
    ______________________________________
    Regarding number 5……….I think that the dead guy in the most recent episode was different than the guy from the first episode of the season. The guy Miles picked up was from the sight where Dharma is building the hatch. The guy from the first episode got “injured” during the building of the orchid station. Why would Miles have to pick him up and deliver him to Chang at the orchid if it was the same guy.[/quote]
    +++++++
    I rewatched. The guy in the Orchid, when Daniel showed up, didn’t have a beard, and didn’t die. He did have a major nosebleed and was carried out on a stretcher. May have died later.

    I think the guy who died at the Swan was show in Dharmaville in a earlier epi in a night scene when the camera panned the crowd. It lingered on him a bit.[/quote]
    ================

    Thank you guys so much for your comments on this – I clearly was mushing things together in my memory.

  340. Duke says:

    [quote comment="330584"][quote comment="330385"]Do you think that when Faraday went off the island, maybe he was in England and maybe he could be Charlotte’s dad? Or that’s when he warned her of the island? He seems to have ties with England.[/quote]

    Ok, that couldn’t make him Charlottes dad unless he had her in the past. She was already born and was a little girl when they got to 1974. Plus Charlotte told him he was the creepy guy in her memory-

    BUT, I wonder if Faraday ends up getting in contact with Eloise on the island and she is responsible for his(Ann Arbor?..connections?)that get him a higher standing job with Dharma. Based on their encounter in 1954, -he was staring at her trying to see if it was her then, Eloise in 1974 (or is it still Ellie at that point?) might be the one that she(Older) instructed him to contact for help.

    Faraday and Charlotte also were pretty close when we first met them in season 4. She had taken the role as his caretaker right off the bat. I dont think hes her father because he had a thing for her. Although I could see him knocking up Ellie, whats she like 37 now? Shits probably like the new 20 on island time.[/quote]
    ______________________________
    But Ellie is his mother (he says sarcastically not really believing what he just said). That would just be gross.

  341. wingman says:

    Ya see this was always 1 of my biggest fears when the end-date got established…Ya see this episode was neither brilliant nor was it bad by any stretch IMO, but when you reduce the number of eps in a season so drastically you sorta sacrifice some of the integrity of the show itself…In a normal 24 ep season, this episode would have been a nice wheel to keep everything churning, but in a 16 ep season every perceived stall, every non-super-important moment will be judged as filler or bad pacing…This episode was sorely needed as to establish Miles as a character, but at what cost?

    Up until the midpoint of this season I woulda said on a stack of Black Rock bibles that Jack was unquestionably the #1 character (for better for worse)…I mean everything in the prior 4 seasons pretty much establishes this (and that’s ignoring that he’s obviously the “everyman” alpha-male extension to the audience)…But this season because that end-date is like a vice around so many character’s neck, he’s stuck erasing chalkboards, giving gossip updates to Sawyer, while Miles and Hurley yuck it up with dead-guys’ stories…I mean that’s how I feel like his character has been treated this season, like some janitor who’s not that important to the story…He’s certainly not the only one, but his lack of credence even this far into the season is perplexing at worse…

    I just get disappointed a bit when I think about how the 2nd half of this series is gonna be so inadequate compared to the first half (Not the end result, but the BEEF)…And people who are counting down every episode like it’s numbers on the Hatch button-clock, are gonna freak out everytime a NORMAL episode (like this one about Miles), doesn’t meet the EXTRAORDINARY expectations that every episode has now because the clock is running out…And unfortunately to me with just 3 hours of season left, I don’t know whose’ side to be on…I did enjoy this episode, but Jack cleaning classrooms as a seemingly whatever type character right now just kinda bothers me…Doing something of merit in the next couple of eps can’t save every characters’ season….

  342. Rumblestilskin says:

    Steve said:

    Thats the ones that we know about. remember the flight manifest from 815. Hurley went through the manifest for the names of those that were in the group. They assumed that the taillies were dead, and so were any others that were on the manifest, but not present. In this way Hurley accounts for all but Ethan. What if some of the people on the manifest were not dead, but foomed to another time on the island, say way back in time. Not all passengers are actually accounted for. Just food for thought
    ———————————————–

    I like that thought. It would be the same thing as Jack and them thinking that Sun, Ben, and LaPinis are dead, when in acuallity, they’re just in a dif time.

    Also, I was thinking:
    That Eloise helped Ben and them get back 2 the island because she’s playing Ben just like Ben plays everyone else. Remember- Ben didnt even know where to find Eloise until Locke told him. Whidmore did though, as he provided Desmond w/her address. I belive that she’s on whidmore’s side.

    Plus: I re-watched episode 501. It may as well have been a pt2 of SLIH. In the 1st scene: Baby miles, Halliwax, and Miles’ Mom. Also Faraday down in the tunnel : )

  343. RGS says:

    [quote comment="330648"]Steve said:

    Thats the ones that we know about. remember the flight manifest from 815. Hurley went through the manifest for the names of those that were in the group. They assumed that the taillies were dead, and so were any others that were on the manifest, but not present. In this way Hurley accounts for all but Ethan. What if some of the people on the manifest were not dead, but foomed to another time on the island, say way back in time. Not all passengers are actually accounted for. Just food for thought
    ———————————————–

    I like that thought. It would be the same thing as Jack and them thinking that Sun, Ben, and LaPinis are dead, when in acuallity, they’re just in a dif time.

    Also, I was thinking:
    That Eloise helped Ben and them get back 2 the island because she’s playing Ben just like Ben plays everyone else. Remember- Ben didnt even know where to find Eloise until Locke told him. Whidmore did though, as he provided Desmond w/her address. I belive that she’s on whidmore’s side.

    Plus: I re-watched episode 501. It may as well have been a pt2 of SLIH. In the 1st scene: Baby miles, Halliwax, and Miles’ Mom. Also Faraday down in the tunnel : )[/quote]

    Why are you calling Frank Lapidus, a french penis?

    I disagree that Ben didn’t know where Faraday’s mother was until Locke told him. It seems like he was already trying to get folks to go back to the island before he murdered Locke. So he already had gotten the directions from Eloise.

  344. wallyp says:

    Ok, Duke…, I have tried not to be so hung up on wether or not Ellie really is Faradays mother or not, theres still room to have some fun with it…If anything I’d say he was adopted by her at some point, for the sole reason that she knows who he is… I think the two have some sort of understanding where as he would refer to her as his mother to other people… SO I have remained to think that she IS the one he is talking about when he says “my mother”, but I don’t think she really is his mother. Any sense? If she WAS really his mother I’m sure there would be some sort of Loraine Baines effect… “when I kiss you, I feel like I’m kissing my brother.”

    Wingman, I try not to think about the time we have left on Lost. This episode did not dissapoint in the slightest for me, if you ask me the only episode I wasn’t thrilled with this whole season would be 316, and that turned out to be a crucial episode. It was oddly put together though as a means to fill in the gaps over an extended period… I think at this point in the show we sometimes forget that old Lost feeling (WTF!!!!!!!!!!—remember that feeling?) Some episodes still play as just warm ups for the next episode. Like “Lafleaur” was to He’s Our You etc. and I am ok with that.

    I still hope when all is said and done, we wrap up neatly satisfied with the ending, and have enough room leftover for some sort of spinoff.

    LOST: Deep Space Nine
    LOST: The Egypt Years… you know? I could geek out on this show forever. But all things must end some time. PS- people always complain somewhere in the line… FYI Nikki and Paulos episode in season 3 may have been the one that really got me hooked in the first place—haven’t missed an ep. since, watched casually before… how weird is that? seems like everyone hates that one…

  345. Rumblestilskin says:

    [quote comment="330663"][quote comment="330648"]Steve said:

    Thats the ones that we know about. remember the flight manifest from 815. Hurley went through the manifest for the names of those that were in the group. They assumed that the taillies were dead, and so were any others that were on the manifest, but not present. In this way Hurley accounts for all but Ethan. What if some of the people on the manifest were not dead, but foomed to another time on the island, say way back in time. Not all passengers are actually accounted for. Just food for thought
    ———————————————–

    I like that thought. It would be the same thing as Jack and them thinking that Sun, Ben, and LaPinis are dead, when in acuallity, they’re just in a dif time.

    Also, I was thinking:
    That Eloise helped Ben and them get back 2 the island because she’s playing Ben just like Ben plays everyone else. Remember- Ben didnt even know where to find Eloise until Locke told him. Whidmore did though, as he provided Desmond w/her address. I belive that she’s on whidmore’s side.

    Plus: I re-watched episode 501. It may as well have been a pt2 of SLIH. In the 1st scene: Baby miles, Halliwax, and Miles’ Mom. Also Faraday down in the tunnel : )[/quote]

    Why are you calling Frank Lapidus, a french penis?

    I disagree that Ben didn’t know where Faraday’s mother was until Locke told him. It seems like he was already trying to get folks to go back to the island before he murdered Locke. So he already had gotten the directions from Eloise.[/quote]
    ———————————————–

    I called him (LaPenis) a french penis because its funny. :D
    Locke was the 1st one that Ben talked to about getting back to the island. He never even suggested it to Sayid, whom had been working 4 him 4 2yrs.
    I think that putting them on flight 316 was done in order to have them there WHEN Eloise wanted them there.
    And SHE doesnt want 2 be there? That seems weird. I suspect that her and Whidmore will show up on the island B4 the S goes down.

  346. RGS says:

    [quote comment="330668"]
    I called him (LaPenis) a french penis because its funny. :D
    Locke was the 1st one that Ben talked to about getting back to the island. He never even suggested it to Sayid, whom had been working 4 him 4 2yrs.
    I think that putting them on flight 316 was done in order to have them there WHEN Eloise wanted them there.
    And SHE doesnt want 2 be there? That seems weird. I suspect that her and Whidmore will show up on the island B4 the S goes down.[/quote]

    Oh ok I get it, kinda like Le Coq Sportif.

    Though Ben hadn’t mentioned it to Sayid as of yet, he did acknowledge that he already knew Faraday’s mother. I guess one could say he was lying, but the reason I don’t buy into that is because I’m making a small assumption that Hawkings is not an easy person to find.

    LOCKE: I know where we go. There’s a woman, here in Los Angeles..
    BEN: A woman?
    LOCKE: I don’t know exactly where, but she shouldn’t be that hard to find. Her name is, is ah, Eloise Hawking.
    BEN: Eloise Hawking? You sure?
    LOCKE: Yeah. Yeah, why, do you know her?
    BEN: Yes, John, I know her.

    (Cut to Ben snapping into a psycho-killer…ok I added this description of his antics but it fits).

  347. Rumblestilskin says:

    Yes, Ben KNEW Eloise, but Charles knew her exact address. Shes not hard 4 HIM 2 find.

  348. wallyp says:

    [quote comment="330672"][quote comment="330668"]
    I called him (LaPenis) a french penis because its funny. :D
    Locke was the 1st one that Ben talked to about getting back to the island. He never even suggested it to Sayid, whom had been working 4 him 4 2yrs.
    I think that putting them on flight 316 was done in order to have them there WHEN Eloise wanted them there.
    And SHE doesnt want 2 be there? That seems weird. I suspect that her and Whidmore will show up on the island B4 the S goes down.[/quote]

    Oh ok I get it, kinda like Le Coq Sportif.

    Though Ben hadn’t mentioned it to Sayid as of yet, he did acknowledge that he already knew Faraday’s mother. I guess one could say he was lying, but the reason I don’t buy into that is because I’m making a small assumption that Hawkings is not an easy person to find.

    LOCKE: I know where we go. There’s a woman, here in Los Angeles..
    BEN: A woman?
    LOCKE: I don’t know exactly where, but she shouldn’t be that hard to find. Her name is, is ah, Eloise Hawking.
    BEN: Eloise Hawking? You sure?
    LOCKE: Yeah. Yeah, why, do you know her?
    BEN: Yes, John, I know her.

    (Cut to Ben snapping into a psycho-killer…ok I added this description of his antics but it fits).[/quote]

    *****************

    The thing with this is that Widmore wasn’t the one who gave John Locke her name… it was Christian who gave him her name. If Widmore was so Hell bent on getting him back to the island, wouldn’t he have just sent him directly to her? Plus, she knew he had to be dead, and Charles Widmore didn’t… he said, “we will do whatever it takes to keep you alive” or something like that. Meanwhile, Ben knew exactly who she was and where to find her, and it seems like he knew a few things about her operation that Widmore didn’t.

    I still say she’s playing them both.

  349. Rumblestilskin says:

    Whidmore gave Desmond Eloise’s address

  350. 815/316 says:

    I am new to posting here. I had a couple of thoughts after watching “Some Like it Hoth”. * What if the guys in the Van are all children of Dharma parents? They looked to be in their late twentys early thirtys. They could have left the Island before the Dharma folks where gased by Ben and the Others.

    * What if they all have powers because like Miles they were born on the island and now they want to avenge the death of the Dharma people?

  351. wallyp says:

    [quote comment="330681"]Whidmore gave Desmond Eloise’s address[/quote]

    Eloise must live in that church. widmore knows she exists, and I think they must communicate on some level, but I think as far as he’s concerned, she has nothing left to do with the island. Thats just the theory I’m going with.

    I had originally liked to think that Widmore sent Desmond there to beat up Ben, but I don’t see why he would do that knowing that Ben would be going to the island… wouldn’t he had just left Desmond in England to keep Penny as far from Ben as possible? Now I think he’s more thinking along the lines of, “let him go see Ellie, find out she knows nothing and be done with the whole thing” for Pennys sake.

  352. im lost says:

    what about time travel… and why are Lock, Ben and Sun in a different time?

    and the smoke monster?

  353. PJSander says:

    [quote comment="330683"]What if they all have powers because like Miles they were born on the island and now they want to avenge the death of the Dharma people?[/quote]

    Powers? Oh gees, I hope not. LOST is so much better than any super-hero wanna be that has ever been on television. I am okay with DHARMA kids having abilities, but if Miles starts bending steel with his bare hands, I think I’ll be done with LOST forever.

    : ) P

  354. Duke says:

    Ellie is the “mother” of time travel, IMO, so this may be why she is Daniel’s mother. He leaves island between 1974-1977 meets up with Hawking who instructs him on how things work and possibly about how things can be changed. When I think of someone being a mother the first way is giving birth which I do not think Hawking did to Faraday. I have this creepy feeling that my insights may turn out to be wrong kinda like the ridiculous “runway” scenerio. With that, in my mind, a runway that would be needed to land a transcontinental airliner would have had to be paved and very, very long so I never bought into Sawyer, Kate, and whoever else actually building a runway. Maybe I should say that I do not believe that Hawkings gave birth to Faraday instead of the blanket statement that she is not his mother. I wouldn’t consider Kate Aaron’s mother either, just for the record.

  355. wingman says:

    wally p SAID:
    Wingman, I try not to think about the time we have left on Lost. This episode did not dissapoint in the slightest for me, if you ask me the only episode I wasn’t thrilled with this whole season would be 316, and that turned out to be a crucial episode. It was oddly put together though as a means to fill in the gaps over an extended period… I think at this point in the show we sometimes forget that old Lost feeling (WTF!!!!!!!!!!—remember that feeling?) Some episodes still play as just warm ups for the next episode. Like “Lafleaur” was to He’s Our You etc. and I am ok with that.
    I still hope when all is said and done, we wrap up neatly satisfied with the ending, and have enough room leftover for some sort of spinoff.

    ———————————
    I didn’t say the ep was disappointing, just that when we got the end-date I KNEW these sorts of issues would be perceived (Bad pacing, Filler-accusations, character marginalizing alla Jack right now)…It’s something that I just can’t ignore either though…

    Not to be too off-topic, but did anyone catch last week’s “Heroes”?? Heroes was more “LOST” last week than LOST was LOST this week…

    Heroes had:

    -A mysterious barracks-like living quarter

    -A group of dead-bodies buried at the site from people who got “purged”

    – Multiple Flashback scenes throughout the episode linking the happenings

    – Doctor in Lab-coat alla Halliwax who was also a part of a Father-Son subplot

    – Close-ups on Spinning records playing folksy tunes

    I swear I thought they killed the Dharma Intiative when I first watched it last night…Even more than I listed here…Weird how much Heroes has fallen to the point it basically rapes like 5 LOST plots and put it in one episode…

  356. NaSty Nate from Half-Baked says:

    [quote comment="329949"][quote comment="329938"]
    Miles was trying to confirm with Ben that he would be on his team for double his fee from team Widmore. Now if Bram worked for Ben, Ben would have understood what Miles meant about 3.2 Mil. Did he? I can’t remember.
    ,[/quote]

    ————————————–

    From the pause below I think we can infer that Ben does know WHY Miles is asking for 3.2 million. Miles asked Bram for the 3.2 in the van and since he knows (or believes) Bram works for Ben he is reminding him of his “fee.”

    MILES: Then you know he’s put a lot of time and energy into finding you. So now I’ve found you. And I can tell him exactly where you are. Or I can lie, and tell him you were already dead. I’d be willing to do that, for 3.2 million dollars.

    BEN: You’ve arranged this meeting so you could blackmail me?

    MILES: (his lips move silently for a moment) It’s extortion if you want to get technical.

    BEN: 3.2? But why not 3.3 or 3.4?

    [MILES stares at BEN, and BEN realizes something.]

    BEN: What makes you think I have access to that kind of money?

    MILES: Do not treat me like I’m one of them! Like I don’t know who you are, or what you can do!

    My best guess is Bram is on Team Ben or (much like Michael) is the inside man…

  357. steve says:

    [quote comment="330714"][quote comment="329949"][quote comment="329938"]
    Miles was trying to confirm with Ben that he would be on his team for double his fee from team Widmore. Now if Bram worked for Ben, Ben would have understood what Miles meant about 3.2 Mil. Did he? I can’t remember.
    ,[/quote]

    ————————————–

    From the pause below I think we can infer that Ben does know WHY Miles is asking for 3.2 million. Miles asked Bram for the 3.2 in the van and since he knows (or believes) Bram works for Ben he is reminding him of his “fee.”

    MILES: Then you know he’s put a lot of time and energy into finding you. So now I’ve found you. And I can tell him exactly where you are. Or I can lie, and tell him you were already dead. I’d be willing to do that, for 3.2 million dollars.

    BEN: You’ve arranged this meeting so you could blackmail me?

    MILES: (his lips move silently for a moment) It’s extortion if you want to get technical.

    BEN: 3.2? But why not 3.3 or 3.4?

    [MILES stares at BEN, and BEN realizes something.]

    BEN: What makes you think I have access to that kind of money?

    MILES: Do not treat me like I’m one of them! Like I don’t know who you are, or what you can do!

    My best guess is Bram is on Team Ben or (much like Michael) is the inside man…[/quote]

    #####################
    I am having a hard time with the association of Bram and Ben. Bram, Illana, and company do not aknowledge Ben on Hydra island, and even treat him like an extra. Ben is an Other, and IMO Bram… are all part of the reconstituted DHARMA.

  358. Lostfan says:

    Three years ago (check lostpedia) we were led to believe that Widmore funded Hanso (DHARMA). This info came from old websites that were put online to keep us all amused for the summer (’05/’06) before Lost returned. Where would that put us now on the whole “three different groups” theory? Also – DHARMA and Widmore existed on the island simultaneously. So was that whole connection a smokescreen – or simply revised as the years have gone on?

  359. wingman says:

    [quote comment="330731"]Three years ago (check lostpedia) we were led to believe that Widmore funded Hanso (DHARMA). This info came from old websites that were put online to keep us all amused for the summer (’05/’06) before Lost returned. Where would that put us now on the whole “three different groups” theory? Also – DHARMA and Widmore existed on the island simultaneously. So was that whole connection a smokescreen – or simply revised as the years have gone on?[/quote]

    Yes^^…

  360. Tasha says:

    [quote comment="330731"]Three years ago (check lostpedia) we were led to believe that Widmore funded Hanso (DHARMA). This info came from old websites that were put online to keep us all amused for the summer (’05/’06) before Lost returned. Where would that put us now on the whole “three different groups” theory? Also – DHARMA and Widmore existed on the island simultaneously. So was that whole connection a smokescreen – or simply revised as the years have gone on?[/quote]
    ___________________________________

    That’s exactly why I have been thinking that Charles funded Dharma. He would have been off the island doing all the business for it. I really don’t have an answer to your question but I understand where you are coming from. I hope someone explains!!!

  361. wallyp says:

    [quote comment="330710"]
    Not to be too off-topic, but did anyone catch last week’s “Heroes”?? Heroes was more “LOST” last week than LOST was LOST this week…

    …[/quote]

    Wingman, its funny you said that because I happened to watch Heroes last night and couldn’t help but notice the same thing! there were at least three MAJOR Lost nods The japanese guy said his head hurt badly and gets a nose bleed when he tries to use his powers… ok… then the villian says something along the lines of you need to have an “anchor” in time when you get “lost” and I was like “you mean a constant?”… right? Then the other guy clearly says “dead is dead” within the same five minute conversation. I was like “whaaaaa?!” cant be coincidence The Heroes writers team must all be Lost fans. I thought maybe it was just because I was sitting there wishing I was watching Lost instead…

    anyway… is there going to be a new thread for this weeks one hour special? Its gonna be one of those clip shows, but I hear its supposed to present a whole new angle to the Oceanic 6 story… anyone know anything about this?

  362. wallyp says:

    [quote comment="330702"]Ellie is the “mother” of time travel, IMO, so this may be why she is Daniel’s mother. He leaves island between 1974-1977 meets up with Hawking who instructs him on how things work and possibly about how things can be changed. When I think of someone being a mother the first way is giving birth which I do not think Hawking did to Faraday. I have this creepy feeling that my insights may turn out to be wrong kinda like the ridiculous “runway” scenerio. With that, in my mind, a runway that would be needed to land a transcontinental airliner would have had to be paved and very, very long so I never bought into Sawyer, Kate, and whoever else actually building a runway. Maybe I should say that I do not believe that Hawkings gave birth to Faraday instead of the blanket statement that she is not his mother. I wouldn’t consider Kate Aaron’s mother either, just for the record.[/quote]

    I can go with that. Aren’t there like church mothers? Like the wisest of the nuns or something? Go see Mother Hawking etc.

  363. Hammer says:

    [quote comment="330731"]Three years ago (check lostpedia) we were led to believe that Widmore funded Hanso (DHARMA). This info came from old websites that were put online to keep us all amused for the summer (’05/’06) before Lost returned. Where would that put us now on the whole “three different groups” theory? Also – DHARMA and Widmore existed on the island simultaneously. So was that whole connection a smokescreen – or simply revised as the years have gone on?[/quote]
    +++++++++++++++++++
    This was my take on it back in the D is D thread:

    Hammer
    Comment 351, posted 1 week, 4 days ago – Quote and reply
    ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
    ++++++++++++++++++++
    I took it as Widmore was leaving the island OFTEN not only because he has a baby with an ‘outsider’, but also was building an empire in the real world AND getting involved with DHARMA, …to exploit and take over the island. IMO, he was discovered as being involved with DHARMA sometime near the purge…may even have been why the purge happened. He was then banished and so far, the island won’t let him back….

  364. Bobola says:

    How come Miles can read dead people but can’t read LIVE people?

  365. Circus Mom says:

    [quote comment="330683"]I am new to posting here. I had a couple of thoughts after watching “Some Like it Hoth”. * What if the guys in the Van are all children of Dharma parents? They looked to be in their late twentys early thirtys. They could have left the Island before the Dharma folks where gased by Ben and the Others.

    * What if they all have powers because like Miles they were born on the island and now they want to avenge the death of the Dharma people?[/quote]
    +++++++
    This got me thinking but Charlotte didn’t seem to have a special power and Locke, Walt and Hurley are special but don’t seem connected with the island as babies.
    Bram and all still could be Dharma babies and looking for revenge I suppose but why didn’t they contact Charlotte and Miles long ago?

  366. wingman says:

    [quote comment="330821"][quote comment="330710"]
    Not to be too off-topic, but did anyone catch last week’s “Heroes”?? Heroes was more “LOST” last week than LOST was LOST this week…

    …[/quote]

    Wingman, its funny you said that because I happened to watch Heroes last night and couldn’t help but notice the same thing! there were at least three MAJOR Lost nods

    The japanese guy said his head hurt badly and gets a nose bleed when he tries to use his powers… ok… then the villian says something along the lines of you need to have an “anchor” in time when you get “lost” and I was like “you mean a constant?”… right? Then the other guy clearly says “dead is dead” within the same five minute conversation. I was like “whaaaaa?!” cant be coincidence The Heroes writers team must all be Lost fans. I thought maybe it was just because I was sitting there wishing I was watching Lost instead…
    [/quote]

    I don’t think the writers are LOST fans as much as they’re LOST period…To think that show was once said to rival LOST based on 1 season…I still watch it because I did really like it at one point, but now it’s just a random mess, with no plot in sight….

  367. wingman says:

    God this site needs some bbcode or some new formatting; this LINEBREAK thing drives me nuts…

    [quote comment="330821"][quote comment="330710"]
    Not to be too off-topic, but did anyone catch last week’s “Heroes”?? Heroes was more “LOST” last week than LOST was LOST this week…

    …[/quote]

    Wingman, its funny you said that because I happened to watch Heroes last night and couldn’t help but notice the same thing! there were at least three MAJOR Lost nods

    The japanese guy said his head hurt badly and gets a nose bleed when he tries to use his powers… ok… then the villian says something along the lines of you need to have an “anchor” in time when you get “lost” and I was like “you mean a constant?”… right? Then the other guy clearly says “dead is dead” within the same five minute conversation. I was like “whaaaaa?!” cant be coincidence The Heroes writers team must all be Lost fans. I thought maybe it was just because I was sitting there wishing I was watching Lost instead…
    [/quote]
    ===================================
    I don’t think the writers are LOST fans as much as they’re LOST period…To think that show was once said to rival LOST based on 1 season…I still watch it because I did really like it at one point, but now it’s just a random mess, with no plot in sight….

  368. NaSty Nate from Half-Baked says:

    [quote comment="330727"][quote comment="330714"][quote comment="329949"][quote comment="329938"]
    Miles was trying to confirm with Ben that he would be on his team for double his fee from team Widmore. Now if Bram worked for Ben, Ben would have understood what Miles meant about 3.2 Mil. Did he? I can’t remember.
    ,[/quote]

    ————————————–

    From the pause below I think we can infer that Ben does know WHY Miles is asking for 3.2 million. Miles asked Bram for the 3.2 in the van and since he knows (or believes) Bram works for Ben he is reminding him of his “fee.”

    MILES: Then you know he’s put a lot of time and energy into finding you. So now I’ve found you. And I can tell him exactly where you are. Or I can lie, and tell him you were already dead. I’d be willing to do that, for 3.2 million dollars.

    BEN: You’ve arranged this meeting so you could blackmail me?

    MILES: (his lips move silently for a moment) It’s extortion if you want to get technical.

    BEN: 3.2? But why not 3.3 or 3.4?

    [MILES stares at BEN, and BEN realizes something.]

    BEN: What makes you think I have access to that kind of money?

    MILES: Do not treat me like I’m one of them! Like I don’t know who you are, or what you can do!

    My best guess is Bram is on Team Ben or (much like Michael) is the inside man…[/quote]

    #####################
    I am having a hard time with the association of Bram and Ben. Bram, Illana, and company do not aknowledge Ben on Hydra island, and even treat him like an extra. Ben is an Other, and IMO Bram… are all part of the reconstituted DHARMA.[/quote]

    %%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%

    My only question now is how do they NOT know about Ben. I think they do they just pretend they don’t. Just something about how Ben acted on that episode.

    He seemed to know exacxtly what was going to happen (cesar having the gun etc) up in to the time he gets hit in the side of the head by Sun. I still think that Ben has gone through this experience various times always trying to change something (the future etc) but never being able to do so. It’s significant Ben did not see Sun’s hit coming or that John was so important that smokey requested Ben adhere to his command… maybe this time Ben will get it right???

  369. roses12 says:

    [quote comment="330403"][quote comment="330395"]4) Interesting that Miles’ “gift” didn’t seem to manifest itself until he was off island (7 or 8 years old maybe? Does that give us a clue as to when the purge happens and the “women and children” left?) It seems to be something that just started at the moment we saw it.
    [/quote]

    It’s funny. I totally didn’t see it that way when I watched. I checked the transcript and there isn’t anything to indicate either way. However, if it did “start at the moment we saw it” it may be only because MilesBoy had never been that close to a dead person before.

    : ) P[/quote]
    but there must have been some egyptian mummies about lol

  370. beardedbillygoat says:

    What if Eloise is behind the guys in the Van and on Hydra ie. Bram and CO? I keep thinking they were in LA same as the rest of the group, were they maybe behind some of the events like the guy who came after Sayid in the hospital – I know we have pegged Ben for a lot it. Perhaps they are into the deeper religious practice of the temple – could that be what that whole foot business and the weapons/crate etc was about. Ben seemed shocked and scared about the temple not that he was comfortable there. They were a triumverate it seems Eli, Charles and depending on your view Richard. I can’t wait for the reveal on this one.

  371. hlcfym says:

    [quote comment="330143"][quote comment="330126"]My senario for the last five minutes of Lost.

    Due to what he has learned Hurley rushes out to the radio tower and broadcasts the numbers, over and over. Full Circle.[/quote]
    ****************
    Yeah, I think that this is the origin of the numbers, which will soon take on a whole different meaning for the 1977 peeps. This is something I cant wait for, to see Hurley broadcast those numbers and WHY.

    ***********************
    Can you help me remember when we hear hurley broadcast the numbers….I just can’t recall.

  372. Adapa1 says:

    There’s no new episode on tommorow right?

  373. wingman says:

    [quote comment="330914"]There’s no new episode on tommorow right?[/quote]
    ——————————
    Not unless you turn the donkey wheel to next week…

    Tomorrow – LOST SPECIAL!!!!! 40 minutes of recaps disguised as new special content^^…

  374. PJSander says:

    [quote comment="330915"]Tomorrow – LOST SPECIAL!!!!! 40 minutes of recaps disguised as new special content^^…[/quote]

    According to the ABC Press Release for the episode, it really seems like we might actually get some new footage. Maybe stuff that was shot, but eventually edited for time? I guess we’ll know this time tomorrow.

    : ) P

  375. Shadow says:

    Ok, so I’ve said this before, and some have told me to wait and be patient, but I can’t get over this. So, why the heck did Locke have to bring the O6 back? He was told that would be the only way to fix everything? What exactly? When Locke went down that well to turn the FDW, Juliette, Jin, Sawyer, and Miles were sure hoping that he would succeed. When Locke turned the wheel that stopped the time travel, but he still had to bring everyone back for some reason, and Sawyer et al waited for their return. Remember when Jin called Sawyer on the phone and said that he found the O6, that they were back? They had been looking for them for 3 years. SO why is it that Sawyer and the rest act like they don’t need the O6, they are wondering why the heck they came back, they act like they’re getting in the way of their life with Dharma…I’m so confused, and this really really bugs me! Any thoughts? Maybe its just me and I’m alone here, but the show took a different turn for me after the O6 came back to the island. Seems like there was no point for Locke to bring them back. That’s how the Dharma Losties act anyway.

  376. wingman says:

    @Shadow –

    When Locke went to bring the 06 back that’s what he BELIEVED was the right thing to do…The mysterious Christian who seems to know so much reinforces this notion in Locke, so as the audience we have no idea the REAL reason the 06 had to come back because the key to that has yet to be revealed…

    As for Sawyer and company, they just got comfortable…If you were sent back in time with no apparent rhyme or reason for why or if you could get back you’d probably adapt…Sawyer has always said the thing that keeps him driven on the island is simply surviving…I’m sure he felt the obligation to Locke’s promise to continue to look for the 06ers for the next 3 years, but it’s pretty apparent that he, Juliette, and Jin were doing the checks moreso as a matter of record…Not like they had completely given up, but there actions as Dharma members and their simple comfortability level(in this new environment) should have told you they weren’t really super-expecting anything…

    As for the rest, WE DON’T KNOW exactly why Christian said they all had to come back, and that’s probably because it’s something to be revealed later on…Locke in-turn did “Fix” the island and save everyone’s life, but he just didn’t know that’s what he had accomplished by turning the wheel…Up until his death he still thought he had to bring everyone back based on Christian strong words…So it’s Christian (alla the Island’s) intention of bringing them all back for a yet to be seen purpose…Locke just didn’t know that bringing them back would serve a purpose BEYOND just saving Saywer and company’s life…

  377. Shadow says:

    Hey Wingman,
    OK, that helps a little, ’cause like I said, its been bugging me ALOT! Maybe you can explain this too then. I know its probably on previous threads, but was Locke gone for three years after he turned the wheel? I mean the Dharma Losties have been living their new life for 3 years, and the O6 folks have been off the island for 3 years. So what about John? That part I’m still confused about.
    Thanks

  378. RGS says:

    JJ Abrams enthusiasts should pick up this month’s WIRED magazine to at least read his funny little article in there about spoilers. In addition just about the entire magazine is some kinda mystery/game.

    I’ve got high expectations for this Star Trek movie coming out.

  379. Steve says:

    [quote comment="330934"]Hey Wingman,
    OK, that helps a little, ’cause like I said, its been bugging me ALOT! Maybe you can explain this too then. I know its probably on previous threads, but was Locke gone for three years after he turned the wheel? I mean the Dharma Losties have been living their new life for 3 years, and the O6 folks have been off the island for 3 years. So what about John? That part I’m still confused about.
    Thanks[/quote]

    ********************************

    It seemed to me that John was off Island for about 2 months. He still had the cast on his leg when he tried to hang himself. I assumed they removed the cast during preparation for burial. I think the time shift for off island travel depends on the way you exit. Ben shifted about 8 months forward, I thing he said Oct 2005 to the Hotel clerk in tunesia, after he turned the FDW. The O6 left by the designated coordinates and were in present time off island. Depending on the time of the last flash before John turned the wheel, he probably ended up about 8 months forward from the island time. That would put the last flash before he turned the FDW at about June of 2007

  380. Rita says:

    [quote comment="330932"]@Shadow –

    When Locke went to bring the 06 back that’s what he BELIEVED was the right thing to do…The mysterious Christian who seems to know so much reinforces this notion in Locke, so as the audience we have no idea the REAL reason the 06 had to come back because the key to that has yet to be revealed…

    As for Sawyer and company, they just got comfortable…If you were sent back in time with no apparent rhyme or reason for why or if you could get back you’d probably adapt…Sawyer has always said the thing that keeps him driven on the island is simply surviving…I’m sure he felt the obligation to Locke’s promise to continue to look for the 06ers for the next 3 years, but it’s pretty apparent that he, Juliette, and Jin were doing the checks moreso as a matter of record…Not like they had completely given up, but there actions as Dharma members and their simple comfortability level(in this new environment) should have told you they weren’t really super-expecting anything…

    As for the rest, WE DON’T KNOW exactly why Christian said they all had to come back, and that’s probably because it’s something to be revealed later on…Locke in-turn did “Fix” the island and save everyone’s life, but he just didn’t know that’s what he had accomplished by turning the wheel…Up until his death he still thought he had to bring everyone back based on Christian strong words…So it’s Christian (alla the Island’s) intention of bringing them all back for a yet to be seen purpose…Locke just didn’t know that bringing them back would serve a purpose BEYOND just saving Saywer and company’s life…[/quote]
    ____________________________________
    I like this wingman, good explanation.

  381. wallyp says:

    [quote comment="330966"][quote comment="330934"]Hey Wingman,
    OK, that helps a little, ’cause like I said, its been bugging me ALOT! Maybe you can explain this too then. I know its probably on previous threads, but was Locke gone for three years after he turned the wheel? I mean the Dharma Losties have been living their new life for 3 years, and the O6 folks have been off the island for 3 years. So what about John? That part I’m still confused about.
    Thanks[/quote]

    ********************************

    It seemed to me that John was off Island for about 2 months. He still had the cast on his leg when he tried to hang himself. I assumed they removed the cast during preparation for burial. I think the time shift for off island travel depends on the way you exit. Ben shifted about 8 months forward, I thing he said Oct 2005 to the Hotel clerk in tunesia, after he turned the FDW. The O6 left by the designated coordinates and were in present time off island. Depending on the time of the last flash before John turned the wheel, he probably ended up about 8 months forward from the island time. That would put the last flash before he turned the FDW at about June of 2007[/quote]
    *************************************
    JOHN ended up THREE years ahead in time from when the O6 come home. It may have taken him two months to die from there, but it was roughly a three year span. We know this because Widmore shows him the newspaper with the O6 and says it was three years old the same night he returns. SO, Locke only experienced about a day while everyone else in 77 and 07 went on for three years.

  382. steve says:

    [quote comment="330972"][quote comment="330966"][quote comment="330934"]Hey Wingman,
    OK, that helps a little, ’cause like I said, its been bugging me ALOT! Maybe you can explain this too then. I know its probably on previous threads, but was Locke gone for three years after he turned the wheel? I mean the Dharma Losties have been living their new life for 3 years, and the O6 folks have been off the island for 3 years. So what about John? That part I’m still confused about.
    Thanks[/quote]

    ********************************

    It seemed to me that John was off Island for about 2 months. He still had the cast on his leg when he tried to hang himself. I assumed they removed the cast during preparation for burial. I think the time shift for off island travel depends on the way you exit. Ben shifted about 8 months forward, I thing he said Oct 2005 to the Hotel clerk in tunesia, after he turned the FDW. The O6 left by the designated coordinates and were in present time off island. Depending on the time of the last flash before John turned the wheel, he probably ended up about 8 months forward from the island time. That would put the last flash before he turned the FDW at about June of 2007[/quote]
    *************************************
    JOHN ended up THREE years ahead in time from when the O6 come home. It may have taken him two months to die from there, but it was roughly a three year span. We know this because Widmore shows him the newspaper with the O6 and says it was three years old the same night he returns. SO, Locke only experienced about a day while everyone else in 77 and 07 went on for three years.[/quote]

    ##########################################

    So we agree!!! For Locke – Arrive off island 8 Months from June of 2007 is February of 2008. 3 years after O6 left.

    For Ben – Arrived Off Island in Tunisia in Oct 2005.

    For O6 – arrive Off island 108 days after crash on Sept 24, 2004 so they arrive off island on Jan 10, 2005, and cruise the ocean with Penny for two weeks.

  383. wingman says:

    @Shadow and whoever else….

    Hmm, I don’t know, I could be wrong but I was under the impression Locke jumped much further in the future from when Ben jumped after turning the donkey wheel…I don’t know how long he stayed in Widmore’s care, but I think it’s clear that by the time he met Jack it had to only be months (not years) before Jack found out he was dead… If we are to believe Jack started growing the fakestache (mustache^^) AFTER he broke up with Kate and that the scene he had with Locke is the point right before he goes insane with Oceanic flights hoping they’d crash, then Locke jumped atleast within a year of them all being recruited by Ben again and going back to the island…Jack’s beard is probably about 3-6 months away from being the horrible shaggy beard he has when he decides to commit suicide or when he went into the pharmacy for oxycontin (In contrast to his beard in the Benthem episode)….

    Since the island time was so drastically in flux when Locke left (because of the skipping) who knows if ending up in Tunisia always jumps you just a few months…Remember even Ben had to ask the hotel receptionist what date it was when he arrived, so it may be completely random or it may have been the events of correcting the donkey wheel that made Locke’s jump so different in time…So in conclusion it appears to me that Locke jumped atleast within a year of them all going back to the island again… How Ben or the funeral parlor, or WHOMEVER kept him from not decomposing all that time or the time between when he actually died and whatever investigation police did before his death was listed in the papers’, is anyone’s guess….

  384. wallyp says:

    Did you guys notice that when Naomi takes Miles to the body, that they are in the back of a restraunt? Might it be the same place that Ben was keeping Lockes body? If not, whats with keeping bodies inside of food establishments?

    Wingman, Shadow and Steve, I was just trying to make sure everyone was clear, that when Locke landed in Tunisia, he was three years ahead of when the O6 went home. I think the question I was answering was what happened to Locke in those three years- he skipped them by turning the wheel. (To me the most interesting part about the whole time travel thing is how the 1977 people experienced the same amount of time that the 2007 people did)

    As far as how far the wheel spins you ahead, I’m not sure. Ben guessed right off that he was in 2005…he could’ve guessed that for any amount of reasons though. I don’t think people turn that wheel everyday… I think though (based on the alignment of time for everyone else) that no matter where Locke was in time when he turned the wheel, would always be the same time according to the wheel (donkey wheel years)

    there still hasn’t been any real consequence that we have seen for Ben turning the wheel instead of Locke… say perhaps that Locke was supposed to end up in 2005 but since he missed the turn, he had to make due with going to 2007 instead? -somebody might have a schedule for that thing, like a train.

  385. steve says:

    [quote comment="330990"]@Shadow and whoever else….

    Hmm, I don’t know, I could be wrong but I was under the impression Locke jumped much further in the future from when Ben jumped after turning the donkey wheel…I don’t know how long he stayed in Widmore’s care, but I think it’s clear that by the time he met Jack it had to only be months (not years) before Jack found out he was dead… If we are to believe Jack started growing the fakestache (mustache^^) AFTER he broke up with Kate and that the scene he had with Locke is the point right before he goes insane with Oceanic flights hoping they’d crash, then Locke jumped atleast within a year of them all being recruited by Ben again and going back to the island…Jack’s beard is probably about 3-6 months away from being the horrible shaggy beard he has when he decides to commit suicide or when he went into the pharmacy for oxycontin (In contrast to his beard in the Benthem episode)….

    Since the island time was so drastically in flux when Locke left (because of the skipping) who knows if ending up in Tunisia always jumps you just a few months…Remember even Ben had to ask the hotel receptionist what date it was when he arrived, so it may be completely random or it may have been the events of correcting the donkey wheel that made Locke’s jump so different in time…So in conclusion it appears to me that Locke jumped atleast within a year of them all going back to the island again… How Ben or the funeral parlor, or WHOMEVER kept him from not decomposing all that time or the time between when he actually died and whatever investigation police did before his death was listed in the papers’, is anyone’s guess….[/quote]

    **********************************************
    I may not have explained my thoughts on the time very well. Let me try again I used the 8 month time because i had a posted theory on the island being shifted in time by eight months thus hiding it – this is how Ben knows the date in Tunisia. if this is assumed for our example…

    For Locke – Arrive off island 8 Months from June of 2007 it would be February of 2008. 3 years after O6 arrived.

    For Ben – Arrived Off Island in Tunisia in Oct 2005. 8 months after O6 arrived, and 2 years 8 months before Locke arrived, and he seeks out Sayid, who works with him for the next two years.

    For O6 – arrive Off island 108 days after crash on Sept 24, 2004 so they arrive off island on Jan 10, 2005, and cruise the ocean with Penny for two to three weeks. They are to meet up with Locke in 3 years.

    Jack tells Ben, circa April 2008 that he last saw John Locke about one month prior – somewhere near beginning of march 2008.

    Mid 2008 – They all board the Ajira 316 flight, and End up back on the island in their respective times. I am not sure if The group on the hydra island is in present time or not because Lapidus, after exclaiming OH NO!, banked the plane in hard right rollover in order to put the plane on the “correct” bearing of 305. As he does this, the plane fly’s through different time periods as evidenced by the flashing of the O4, and the numbers being repeated on the radio. My only problem is that island had been moved, and the old bearing of 305 may not be accurate anymore.

  386. Duke says:

    [quote comment="330994"]Did you guys notice that when Naomi takes Miles to the body, that they are in the back of a restraunt? Might it be the same place that Ben was keeping Lockes body? If not, whats with keeping bodies inside of food establishments?

    Wingman, Shadow and Steve, I was just trying to make sure everyone was clear, that when Locke landed in Tunisia, he was three years ahead of when the O6 went home.

    I think the question I was answering was what happened to Locke in those three years- he skipped them by turning the wheel.

    (To me the most interesting part about the whole time travel thing is how the 1977 people experienced the same amount of time that the 2007 people did)

    As far as how far the wheel spins you ahead, I’m not sure. Ben guessed right off that he was in 2005…he could’ve guessed that for any amount of reasons though. I don’t think people turn that wheel everyday…

    I think though (based on the alignment of time for everyone else) that no matter where Locke was in time when he turned the wheel, would always be the same time according to the wheel (donkey wheel years)

    there still hasn’t been any real consequence that we have seen for Ben turning the wheel instead of Locke… say perhaps that Locke was supposed to end up in 2005 but since he missed the turn, he had to make due with going to 2007 instead? -somebody might have a schedule for that thing, like a train.[/quote]
    ________________________________
    BEn kept Locke’s body in the back of a butcher shop. I suspect that rest./butcher shop is used because they have freezers to help preserve the body.

  387. steve says:

    Wallyp Wrote:
    there still hasn’t been any real consequence that we have seen for Ben turning the wheel instead of Locke… say perhaps that Locke was supposed to end up in 2005 but since he missed the turn, he had to make due with going to 2007 instead? -somebody might have a schedule for that thing, like a train.

    ********************

    This kinda bugs me too!

    So far we know that Ben Moves the FDW and puts it off-axis.

    Charlotte dies in the following time shifts, and gives Daniel Faraday a reason to do what he does from this point forward.

    The Soon to Be Dharmite losties experience the island’s past and get stuck in it.
    After being stuck in 1974 for three years, the O4 return and one of them shoots ben. Maybe they were supposed to come back sooner.

    IMO The reason that the same three years has past both on and off island I think is because the clock in San Dimas is always running (Gratuitous Bill and teds reference from one of my previous posts on the topic) may also be why some of the watches don’t work on the island.

  388. RGS says:

    [quote comment="330997"]
    For Locke – Arrive off island 8 Months from June of 2007 it would be February of 2008. 3 years after O6 arrived.

    Jack tells Ben, circa April 2008 that he last saw John Locke about one month prior – somewhere near beginning of march 2008.

    Mid 2008 – They all board the Ajira 316 flight, and End up back on the island in their respective times. I am not sure if The group on the hydra island is in present time or not because Lapidus, after exclaiming OH NO!, banked the plane in hard right rollover in order to put the plane on the “correct” bearing of 305. As he does this, the plane fly’s through different time periods as evidenced by the flashing of the O4, and the numbers being repeated on the radio. My only problem is that island had been moved, and the old bearing of 305 may not be accurate anymore.[/quote]

    When Locke turned the wheel he likely jumped much more than 8 months because the Statue was fully intact when Locke fell down the well and the rope was stuck into the ground. So They were waaaaay back in time.

  389. steve says:

    [quote comment="331002"][quote comment="330997"]
    For Locke – Arrive off island 8 Months from June of 2007 it would be February of 2008. 3 years after O6 arrived.

    Jack tells Ben, circa April 2008 that he last saw John Locke about one month prior – somewhere near beginning of march 2008.

    Mid 2008 – They all board the Ajira 316 flight, and End up back on the island in their respective times. I am not sure if The group on the hydra island is in present time or not because Lapidus, after exclaiming OH NO!, banked the plane in hard right rollover in order to put the plane on the “correct” bearing of 305. As he does this, the plane fly’s through different time periods as evidenced by the flashing of the O4, and the numbers being repeated on the radio. My only problem is that island had been moved, and the old bearing of 305 may not be accurate anymore.[/quote]

    When Locke turned the wheel he likely jumped much more than 8 months because the Statue was fully intact when Locke fell down the well and the rope was stuck into the ground. So They were waaaaay back in time.[/quote]

    ************************
    I thought the statue was gone after the flash that preceeded locke going down the well. It was after he fell during that flash that Miles pointed at the statue.
    Can anyone else confirm the timing?

  390. steve says:

    [quote comment="331003"][quote comment="331002"][quote comment="330997"]
    For Locke – Arrive off island 8 Months from June of 2007 it would be February of 2008. 3 years after O6 arrived.

    Jack tells Ben, circa April 2008 that he last saw John Locke about one month prior – somewhere near beginning of march 2008.

    Mid 2008 – They all board the Ajira 316 flight, and End up back on the island in their respective times. I am not sure if The group on the hydra island is in present time or not because Lapidus, after exclaiming OH NO!, banked the plane in hard right rollover in order to put the plane on the “correct” bearing of 305. As he does this, the plane fly’s through different time periods as evidenced by the flashing of the O4, and the numbers being repeated on the radio. My only problem is that island had been moved, and the old bearing of 305 may not be accurate anymore.[/quote]

    When Locke turned the wheel he likely jumped much more than 8 months because the Statue was fully intact when Locke fell down the well and the rope was stuck into the ground. So They were waaaaay back in time.[/quote]

    ************************
    I thought the statue was gone after the flash that preceeded locke going down the well. It was after he fell during that flash that Miles pointed at the statue.
    Can anyone else confirm the timing?[/quote]
    **************************
    I am sorry, I misunderstood the premise in your post. I will go back and check the episode to be sure, but I was postulating that Locke turned the wheel when the island landed in or around June 2007. We know when Locke arrives off island in early 2008. Once he turns the FDW the rest that were left behind are now in 1974 island time.

    I will do some more homework and get back.

  391. wingman says:

    @wallyp –
    I’m not sure what you mean when you say: “He was 3 years AHEAD of when the 06 went home” Are you trying to say I’m saying something totally different? I’m basically saying Locke flashed to the future approx between 2 1/3 or 2 ½ and 3 years…The only reason I’m tapering off a few months (or adding a few months) is because Jack’s beard wasn’t even close to as full as it is when Jeremy Benthem was his patient in the hospital…That means all the events of Future Flash S3 Finale happens IMO atleast 3-6 months after Locke flashed (which is less than 3 years)…

    @ wallp and steve – Unless I missed something, Ben (After escaping on the horse of that man he killed) asks the foreign receptionist at the hotel WHAT YEAR IS IT? As in he doesn’t know what year it is…I take that at face value…I suppose he could have known he was in a time-range not ridiculously far in the future, but the fact remains he didn’t know…

    I also think a month is too little time to perceive that Jack has an obsession with crashing on Oceanic flights…Not discounting it, but Jack had atlases, maps and was doing all sorts of research on what flights to catch, so to think he only did this 4-times doesn’t seem as excessive as the storyline makes it to be (As if Jack has been doing this for months and months insanely)…Since he doesn’t see the Jeremy Benthem obituary until after all these flights, I’d say Ben lied when he said he saw Locke a month ago (Can’t remember when he said that, but I’ll take your word for it)…He’d probably been hiding him for months before that especially if he killed Locke right after he left the hospital Jack was working at…Again Jack’s beard in that episode is AT THE VERY LEAST a couple months behind his super-scraggly beard from the first future flash episode or the episode where he meets Ben in the funeral home…Take it from a dude with a beard (albeit it small at the current moment), they take more than a couple of months to get as thick as Jack’s was…

  392. steve says:

    Wingman – wallp and steve – Unless I missed something, Ben (After escaping on the horse of that man he killed) asks the foreign receptionist at the hotel WHAT YEAR IS IT? As in he doesn’t know what year it is…I take that at face value…I suppose he could have known he was in a time-range not ridiculously far in the future, but the fact remains he didn’t know…

    ###############################

    I thought Ben said “2005” and the clerk verified the year. My thoughts revolve around Ben knowing the year, and simply confirming the year with the desk clerk. I will have to check the episode, I think The beard thing started well before Locke came to Jack. If I am wrong, then I am really wrong, but I will have learned new things in the storyline.

    Thanks for Keeping me thinking on my feet Wingman and Wallyp, it is what makes the blog fun.

  393. wallyp says:

    Wingman, Ben asks the receptionist and the receptionist gives him the month and day but not the year. Ben then responds by kinda guessing “2005?”

    Steve, San Dimas time!

    Duke, it seems odd to me that Widmore would be keeping bodies in a restraunt freezer. I dont know why I brought it up, Just a point of note I guess.

    Finally, what I was saying about the time of the wheel (we all know Locke skipped three years, the 77’rs waited three years, three years passed for the 07’rs, it was three years…San Dimas)

    It would only stand to reason that the wheel is a man made device, used to control an earthly power… it also seems that the power in question is one that can shift you to not any point in time, but rather all points in time at once…(unstuck) … I’m saying, what if the wheel doesn’t put you a certain amount of time ahead, but rather to a direct location in time. Say like clicking a view master, its a different date everytime… Ben turned it went to 2005, Locke turned it and went to 2007, …say Daniel turns it next in the seventies, maybe he’ll end up in 2009.

  394. JZ says:

    [quote comment="330073"][quote comment="330064"][quote comment="330058"][quote comment="330051"][quote comment="330041"][quote comment="330033"]Just pointing out that that guy was wrong. Everyone else on here gets to do it why not me? Get off my back. I can give my opinions just like the rest of you idiots.[/quote]

    Of course you can give your opinions.

    The difference is that generally, if someone disagrees with another’s theory, we explain WHY and say we have a different idea. Instead you just told the other poster that s/he made NO SENSE. That’s wasn’t “kind or helpful” at all. If you THINK the post doesn’t make sense, explain why.

    : ) P[/quote]
    __________________________
    I stated that Miles and Faraday came over on the freighter together so why wouldn’t he know him. That is why I said that dude didn’t make sense which he didn’t.[/quote]
    ________________________
    Actually, JZ’s comment made perfect sense. We didn’t know which version of Daniel that was that came out of the sub – could have been a time-travelling pre-2004 version of Daniel, who had not yet met Miles. Or, if Daniel does not age, as has been theorized by some here, then it could have been a 1977 version of Daniel, who had not yet met Miles.[/quote]
    ________________________________________-
    Daniel stated long time no see which indicates to me that he also recognized Miles. Even if your absurd theory that it was a “different”version of the Daniel we have seen then Miles would have still recognized him. It wasn’t like he looked different or anything. That was my explanation for the NO SENSE part of my comment. Daniel could have conceivably not known Miles IF he was as you state a pre 1977 version of him who doesn’t age or a pre 2004 version who had yet to meet Miles. The key to it being one and the same Faraday is him saying LONG TIME NO SEE. THis generally means it has been a long time without my seeing you. Something that you would say to someone you had a relationship in the past with not some random dude on a dock when you exit a submarine. There everyone was that both kind and helpful.[/quote]
    _________________________________
    He also said Hey Miles when he exited the sub so there you go. I guess he did know him.[/quote]

    **************************

    Sorry I missed this whole conversation….I’m glad I raised some eyebrows, but it looks like Duke won that battle….and in a very classy way might I add. Duke-don’t be offended when someone calls you out for having a weak argument off the bat. If you want to sound at all intellectual and be viewed as a smart person by the other people on the blog then simply just explain yourself and not attack anyone in the mean time. Everyone will appreciate you much more.

    IF YOU DON’T CARE-then don’t continue to defend yourself because in that case you clearly do and try to prove AFTER the fact that you didn’t mean harm. It’s lame absent apology that no one will ever care to understand.

    But let me just explain why it was some what of a shock to me that Faraday knew Miles. Yes they came over on the freighter together, but we didn’t see how Faraday got off the island and IMO it was hard to understand at what point on “HIS” timeline he was at. Clearly the TT thing has many theories and people believe many different things. I would appreciate if you didn’t play down the theories that everyone else that has somewhat agreed on or at the very least considered to be reasonable.

  395. wingman says:

    @wallyp- Damn I’m gonna have to watch that ep again then, because I could have sworn Ben asks what year it is (After she tells him the month and day) and the receptionist looks at him like he’s crazy for not knowing what year it is… I’ll rolodex it when I get at home tonight.. I don’t mind either, as “The Shape of Things to Come” is unquestionably one of my top 5 episodes of alltime…But even if ur right and he hopingly suggests it’s 2005, he still wasn’t sure of the year…And when the all-knowing Ben doesn’t know something (Atleast to that point in the show) I figure it’s not something easily figured out…

  396. steve says:

    [quote comment="331011"]Wingman, Ben asks the receptionist and the receptionist gives him the month and day but not the year. Ben then responds by kinda guessing “2005?”

    Steve, San Dimas time!

    Duke, it seems odd to me that Widmore would be keeping bodies in a restraunt freezer. I dont know why I brought it up, Just a point of note I guess.

    Finally, what I was saying about the time of the wheel (we all know Locke skipped three years, the 77’rs waited three years, three years passed for the 07’rs, it was three years…San Dimas)

    It would only stand to reason that the wheel is a man made device, used to control an earthly power… it also seems that the power in question is one that can shift you to not any point in time, but rather all points in time at once…(unstuck) … I’m saying, what if the wheel doesn’t put you a certain amount of time ahead, but rather to a direct location in time.

    Say like clicking a view master, its a different date everytime… Ben turned it went to 2005, Locke turned it and went to 2007, …say Daniel turns it next in the seventies, maybe he’ll end up in 2009.[/quote]

    ********************************
    I like this idea about the FDW. I am going to vote for the FDW puts in present off island time no matter what the time on the island is. We will have to watch and see.

  397. Circus Mom says:

    [quote comment="331012"][quote comment="330073"][quote comment="330064"][quote comment="330058"][quote comment="330051"][quote comment="330041"][quote comment="330033"]Just pointing out that that guy was wrong. Everyone else on here gets to do it why not me? Get off my back. I can give my opinions just like the rest of you idiots.[/quote]

    Of course you can give your opinions.

    The difference is that generally, if someone disagrees with another’s theory, we explain WHY and say we have a different idea. Instead you just told the other poster that s/he made NO SENSE. That’s wasn’t “kind or helpful” at all. If you THINK the post doesn’t make sense, explain why.

    : ) P[/quote]
    __________________________
    I stated that Miles and Faraday came over on the freighter together so why wouldn’t he know him. That is why I said that dude didn’t make sense which he didn’t.[/quote]
    ________________________
    Actually, JZ’s comment made perfect sense. We didn’t know which version of Daniel that was that came out of the sub – could have been a time-travelling pre-2004 version of Daniel, who had not yet met Miles. Or, if Daniel does not age, as has been theorized by some here, then it could have been a 1977 version of Daniel, who had not yet met Miles.[/quote]
    ________________________________________-
    Daniel stated long time no see which indicates to me that he also recognized Miles. Even if your absurd theory that it was a “different”version of the Daniel we have seen then Miles would have still recognized him. It wasn’t like he looked different or anything. That was my explanation for the NO SENSE part of my comment. Daniel could have conceivably not known Miles IF he was as you state a pre 1977 version of him who doesn’t age or a pre 2004 version who had yet to meet Miles. The key to it being one and the same Faraday is him saying LONG TIME NO SEE. THis generally means it has been a long time without my seeing you. Something that you would say to someone you had a relationship in the past with not some random dude on a dock when you exit a submarine. There everyone was that both kind and helpful.[/quote]
    _________________________________
    He also said Hey Miles when he exited the sub so there you go. I guess he did know him.[/quote]

    **************************

    Sorry I missed this whole conversation….I’m glad I raised some eyebrows, but it looks like Duke won that battle….and in a very classy way might I add. Duke-don’t be offended when someone calls you out for having a weak argument off the bat. If you want to sound at all intellectual and be viewed as a smart person by the other people on the blog then simply just explain yourself and not attack anyone in the mean time. Everyone will appreciate you much more.

    IF YOU DON’T CARE-then don’t continue to defend yourself because in that case you clearly do and try to prove AFTER the fact that you didn’t mean harm. It’s lame absent apology that no one will ever care to understand.

    But let me just explain why it was some what of a shock to me that Faraday knew Miles. Yes they came over on the freighter together, but we didn’t see how Faraday got off the island and IMO it was hard to understand at what point on “HIS” timeline he was at. Clearly the TT thing has many theories and people believe many different things. I would appreciate if you didn’t play down the theories that everyone else that has somewhat agreed on or at the very least considered to be reasonable.[/quote]
    ++++++++
    We do know that after time traveling Daniel, Miles, Juliette and Sawyer all ended up in Dharmaville together. Daniel thinks the young redhead he sees is Charlotte and then the alarms go off because RA has arrived. We know Daniele was in Dharmaville w/ Miles in 1974 but not where he went until he arrives back on the sub.

  398. xboxkiller says:

    What happened to Rose and Bernard?

  399. Lola says:

    someone please refresh my memory, remember when Ben summoned the smoke monster that we now know to be the MIB….how did Ben do that?

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